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Money, Business and Finance >> Lets talk about gold
| 11/11/05 3:11 AM | |
HELWIG
75 
Edited: 11-Nov-05 Member Since: 05/28/2003 Posts: 16716 |
Heard two quotes today that sounded hardcore enough to make my ass think about finances. "Gold has been the standard of man's wealth for over 5000 years." "People who understand gold, buy gold" So whats the deal with gold? I assume it's low risk and pretty secure to invest in? Do diamonds fall into the same category? Thanks. |
| 12/3/05 12:59 AM | |
|
HELWIG
75
Edited: 03-Dec-05 Member Since: 05/28/2003 Posts: 17045 |
Ok, lets not talk about gold. |
| 12/3/05 1:49 PM | |
|
sea_monkey
Edited: 03-Dec-05 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 2441 |
It'll keep going up. Volatility will increase, but if you're holding bullion (coins) as opposed to futures contracts, this is not a concern. |
| 12/5/05 1:46 PM | |
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kung_pow
54
Edited: 05-Dec-05 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 1767 |
Do you have to buy futures? or is there a call symbol for gold that I can put in my etrade account? Is buying mining stocks that deal with gold mining a good investment in times where gold is increasing in value? Any public companies involved with gold that someone can list for us? |
| 12/6/05 1:22 PM | |
|
sea_monkey
Edited: 06-Dec-05 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 2443 |
If you want to buy gold, but don't want the coins, you probably want the gold ETF. You'll have to google search about it, I really have no use for it so I don't know anything. Futures would be like buying the ETF while borrowing 90% of the money to do so. The problem with gold stocks, is that most have the majority of their operations outside the US -- so they don't benefit from the drop in the US dollar. Look at this way, let's say your currency is currently 1:1 with the US dollar. You've been selling gold for $250 recently. Then the dollar drops by half, and gold goes up to $500 USD. You make $500, and then exchange it back for 250 units of your currency. No gain. |
| 12/6/05 2:01 PM | |
|
e. kaye
Edited: 06-Dec-05 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 10261 |
Diamonds are an artifical market controlled and manipulated by a virtual monopoly. Diamonds are actually incredibly common. |
| 12/6/05 2:18 PM | |
|
poodollar
Edited: 06-Dec-05 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 2497 |
diamonds have no value really. have you ever been to a jewelry store and seen a sign that said, "we are out of diamonds. " also, there are always 2-3 jewelry stores by each other on every floor of the mall. diamonds = the greatest scam ever! |
| 12/6/05 2:23 PM | |
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e. kaye
Edited: 06-Dec-05 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 10262 |
They do have a value in industry. All of the rest is clever marketing. Years ago they were rare, but modern mining technology has made them common rocks. Large high quality stones are the only relatively rare ones. Now there are at least two companies that can make large perfect diamonds in the lab. |
| 12/6/05 4:54 PM | |
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kung_pow
54
Edited: 06-Dec-05 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 1785 |
Sea monkey has just opened my eyes to the sham of paper currency without the gold standard. |
| 12/7/05 1:15 AM | |
|
Sterling Golden
Edited: 07-Dec-05 Member Since: 11/29/2004 Posts: 34 |
"is there a call symbol for gold that I can put in my etrade account." The gold index is symbol: XAU which I think is made up of 10 or so of the biggest mining co's. In theory, they move with gold. I think you can buy it like you do the other indexes if your etrade account allows you to trade the indexes. |
| 12/22/05 12:59 PM | |
|
VigneaultFan
Edited: 22-Dec-05 Member Since: 04/12/2003 Posts: 198 |
There are way better investments than gold out there, and over the long run, likely more profitable. Over time, gold has been more stable, but seen very little appreciation when compared to, say, your average index fund over the same amount of time. Gold should only compose a fraction of an overall investment portfolio. |
| 12/22/05 12:59 PM | |
|
VigneaultFan
Edited: 22-Dec-05 Member Since: 04/12/2003 Posts: 199 |
There are way better investments than gold out there, and over the long run, likely more profitable. Over time, gold has been more stable, but seen very little appreciation when compared to, say, your average index fund over the same amount of time. Gold should only compose a fraction of an overall investment portfolio. |
| 12/22/05 1:28 PM | |
|
dock
Edited: 22-Dec-05 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 1851 |
gold etf=gld ticker symbol |
| 4/10/06 10:38 AM | |
Redneck
28
Edited: 10-Apr-06 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 18853 |
Gold has gone through the roof since you made this thread Helwig. |
| 4/11/06 3:09 PM | |
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Buddhadev
12
Edited: 11-Apr-06 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 1912 |
poodollar has mined the correct. |
| 5/5/06 3:18 AM | |
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BJJStudent2
Edited: 05-May-06 Member Since: 10/13/2002 Posts: 5061 |
Question.... still a good investment now, or is a correction on the way? I'm considering getting in now, albeit a year late. |
| 5/6/06 1:28 AM | |
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JustHappy2SeeU
Edited: 06-May-06 Member Since: 02/21/2005 Posts: 1489 |
VigneaultFan is correct. People like gold now but look at its historical prices. It hasn't been a good investment long term. |
| 5/6/06 10:14 AM | |
Revolver of Reason
Edited: 06-May-06 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 32189 |
it's not a good investment long-term, but that's because the dollar has been relatively stable. right now, with the huge debt the U.S. has, and the printing presses still humming, we may be headed for serious problems. you can't make fiat gold yet. |
| 5/10/06 9:15 AM | |
|
Redskins fan
Edited: 10-May-06 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 7462 |
I usually don't agree with RoR, but in this case, I do. |
| 5/21/06 2:03 AM | |
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Revolver of Reason
Edited: 21-May-06 02:17 AM Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 32785 |
there's nothing magic about gold. mostly, the virtue of gold as an investment is tied to the fact it is a real commodity with a certain degree of scarcity historically. e-gold.com, for instance, which offers the ability to buy a certificate of ownership in many precious metals in a form which can be traded or exchanged on-line, or exchanged for the real article (directly by the e-gold company) or fiat currency (via third-party market makers), trades in several precious metals besides gold, like platinum, for instance. gold just happens to be a particularly time-honored commodity of exchange, with lots of ornamental (read: people like the shiny) and industrial uses. paper currency is made from renewable resources like paper, shredded cloth, wood pulp, etc. it's relatively easy to raise more cotton, or cut down more trees, to make more paper money. in the modern era, most of our "paper" currency is virtual - just flipping bits on database balance sheets. What could be easier to modify? "you own what the computer says you own" - tip' o the hat to the "Stealing the Network" peeps. gold is relatively hard to get, especially since most of the easy places to get gold - like rivers and streambeds that have lots of gold nuggets/dust lying around - have been throughly inspected and extracted. also, gold is a basic chemical element (Au) that is not in abundant supply on Earth, although it's quite possible we'll run into localized large deposits when exploring space in the future - paper money is created from organic compounds that are relatively abundant. in theory, gold can be created via nuclear reactions from more abundant/cheaper elements - but currently, the only forms of gold known to be produced by those mechanisms are short-lived (revert to their basic element shortly, hence no longer being gold) and highly radioactive while they exist in the form of gold, making them mostly worthless. getting gold now mostly requires hard work - mining and such. since being de-linked from any commodity by most world governments, paper currency can be created much much easier, and "virtual" paper currency even easier than that! governments have historically printed large amounts of paper money to finance wars or other forms of financial overextension... this devalues your existing currency and punishes those who have large holdings or investments denominated in that paper currency. this could all change, however. if a large, easy to access deposit of gold was discovered, say equal to half the world's gold supply, in someplace like Siberia which is relatively unexplored, gold would have the bottom drop out of it quickly. that's because someone is essentially "minting new gold" by discovering and extracting it at a low cost. if someone ever discovered an efficent method for creating real, non-radioactive gold from nuclear reactions, gold as a medium of exchange would be worth quite a bit less. so, gold isn't magic. But it can be a useful tool. gold benefits when paper currency is in question. the U.S. dollar has been the financial standard for the last 60 years... now, the U.S. government is getting quite funky with the way it manages it, so people worried about that are looking for an escape hatch. other large currencies, like the Euro, may have good management, but don't have the historical record of the dollar, which makes some people just as nervous about them in the long-term. gold has the best record as an investment in times of uncertainty about paper fiat curreny, as it can limit your potential losses... unlike paper money in so many cases around the world (e.g. destruction of the German mark post-WWI during the Weimar Era), gold may lose substantial amounts of it's value, but will likely never become as completely worthless as paper money can. U.S. military pilots are given small chits of gold for exchange with locals in the case that they are shot down in enemy territory and need to purchase help in escaping.. a paper currency may or may not be worth something somewhere, but gold almost always is. |
| 5/21/06 2:30 AM | |
|
Revolver of Reason
Edited: 21-May-06 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 32787 |
oh yeah, FRATTY FRAT FRAT |
| 6/14/06 9:37 PM | |
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JustHappy2SeeU
Edited: 14-Jun-06 Member Since: 02/21/2005 Posts: 1621 |
how is that gold working for ya? |
| 6/14/06 11:24 PM | |
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Buddhadev
12
Edited: 14-Jun-06 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 2222 |
Still up on the year. |
| 6/28/06 1:59 PM | |
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iblis73
Edited: 28-Jun-06 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 2180 |
USAA has a precious metal and minerals fund. There are a variety of funds that track metal/minerals. |
| 7/2/06 1:35 PM | |
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Buddhadev
12
Edited: 02-Jul-06 Member Since: 01/01/2001 Posts: 2249 |
JustHappy: It looks like your establishmentarian views are going to be all wet again. Back up to 613--massively up on the year. |
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