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UnderGround Forum >> Serious Question for older Martial Artists -
| 1/11/13 10:45 PM | |
csw0101
Member Since: 1/1/01 Posts: 118 |
Great thread. I'm turning 44 this year. Did TMA for 20 yrs and then BJJ and MMA. I do a hard wrestling class once a week with guys half my age and find I can't do a full 2 hr session flat out so have started doing a flat out round of sparring mixed with a technique round (where we both practice takedowns with no resistance) then back to another 100% round. I was finding that if I try and go flat out all the time I keep getting injured and that injuries take months to recover from (instead of a week or 2 like in my 20's). I've started taking ibuprofen before these classes as well and I think they are helping. When training BJJ I don't train with newbies anymore - just experienced people who can go 70% when required when wanting to work specific positions or moves and not trying to tap you out all the time. Loved reading all the suggestions of ways to cope with getting older and keep training! |
| 1/12/13 10:53 AM | |
Master Bater
14 
Member Since: 1/7/11 Posts: 1759 |
Moke - It's likely exactly that...how much sleep and what you've been eating. However, lots of times those kinds of things lag, so you can't say, well I slept good last night therefore I will perform awesome tonight. And inversely, lack of sleep can take time to affect you. You might've have only a few hours sleep the night before and go to class assuming you're going to get smashed, and in fact you perform great. I must admit (and think i have a number of times in this thread already) that my Diet it terrible!!! and its a hard habit to get out of as years ago i would stuff a Big Mac in my mouth and then 3 minutes later fight for an hour non stop.. i REALLY need to get on top of my eating habits. sleep patterns too... but MOSTLY rating habits. I NEED HELP WITH THIS.... ;) something easy to follow to for someone who cant say NO to the good shit :) |
| 1/12/13 11:18 AM | |
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CodeGeek
7
Member Since: 10/11/07 Posts: 48 |
I hate to admit it, but as an older athlete, I've noticed some major differences than when I was young: Cardio. When you're 20, your max heart rate is around 200 beats per minute, but by the time you're 50, your max is down to 170. That fact imposes a drastic difference in your ability to sustain a high output level. If you normally train at 80% of your max, that's 160 bpm for a 20 year old, but only 136 bpm for a 50 year old. Huge, huge difference. Young guys can go harder at a sustained pace. Recovery. In my 20's I could train every day and party all night. These days, I have to be meticulous at monitoring my training volume and intensity, as well as my rest, recovery, and nutrition. Injuries take forever to heal now. A popped elbow, which would have taken a week to heal in my 20's, now takes 6 months to a year. Things just hurt more now. It even hurts to get out of bed. As a side note, I've found that strength training is much more important as you get older. One way to counter-balance the fact that your cardio gets a lot worse as you age is to focus on getting stronger. The benefits of strength training can't be understated for older athletes. |
| 1/12/13 1:29 PM | |
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Master Bater
14
Member Since: 1/7/11 Posts: 1760 |
ttt |
| 1/13/13 9:36 AM | |
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Master Bater
14
Member Since: 1/7/11 Posts: 1764 |
up |
| 1/17/13 10:14 AM | |
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Master Bater
14
Member Since: 1/7/11 Posts: 1771 |
bump |
| 1/17/13 10:39 AM | |
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juszczec
61
Member Since: 2/23/03 Posts: 10537 |
KInd of going to piggyback off of CodeGeek's post on cardio. I've just had this conversation with my physical therapist. She's a lifelong athlete. Played college basketball has been doing TKD for the last 10 years or so. Since she does something similar to the training I do and she's damn near a genius at keeping the body running, I also run questions about anything athletic by her. She tells me in your 40s, where I am, you've got to train cardio differently because your heart beats differently. She wants me to put more of an emphasis on interval training than ever before. My training week will break down to: 3 MA related sessions (standup, grappling sparring and drills) 1 swim (20 laps) at a steady pace 2 swims (20 laps each) with 1 lap as fast as possible, 1 as slow as possible, 1 normal pace 2 sessions body weight exercises I do body weight exercises because they work the stabilizers very well. According to my PT, based on everything I've torn up, THAT is exactly what I need. I have noticed a difference in my endurance - but I figured its because I'm sparring longer with more contact than ever before. It'll be interesting to see what impact the heavier interval based training program has. In the past, its taken about 6 weeks or so for me to notice changes in my training routine - so if anyone's interested I can update at the end of Feb. In the meantime - war old guys! ;-) |
| 1/17/13 3:17 PM | |
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Master Bater
14
Member Since: 1/7/11 Posts: 1775 |
I take it this is per week juszczec? and on what days do you do these sets? i like the sound of this.. i really need to get in the pool. problem is i do more than 3 MA related sessions per week, does this mean i would need t scale back the other activities? ie loose one of the body weight sessions and one of the swimming sessions? |
| 1/17/13 3:23 PM | |
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juszczec
61
Member Since: 2/23/03 Posts: 10548 |
Master Bater - I take it this is per week juszczec? and on what days do you do these sets? I've got a 6 day training schedule. In general: Sunday - sparring, rolling, standup/grappling drills Monday - BWE Tuesday - lunch: swim 30 min even pace evening: sparring, rolling, standup/grappling drills Wednesday - REST Thursday - lunch: interval swimming evening: BWE Friday - 7 3 min rounds heavy bag Saturday - interval swimming I'd lose one of the swims if something HAD to go. You can also play games like combing a body weight session with striking/grappling drills. I imagine you could condition yourself to mixing BWE and full blown sparring but I truly cannot imagine doing that. |
| 1/17/13 4:05 PM | |
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Stache
13
Member Since: 10/16/10 Posts: 5665 |
Old guy sub. |
| 1/17/13 8:05 PM | |
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Master Bater
14
Member Since: 1/7/11 Posts: 1780 |
juszczec -Master Bater - I take it this is per week juszczec? and on what days do you do these sets? thanks bud, what is the breakdown of your BWE? |
| 1/17/13 8:51 PM | |
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juszczec
61
Member Since: 2/23/03 Posts: 10555 |
Master Bater -juszczec -Master Bater - I take it this is per week juszczec? and on what days do you do these sets? I've been doing BWE for about 2 years and its evolved a bit. I started out doing this: http://www.trainforstrength.com/workout1.shtml It took too long, so I started supersetting the pushups & legs. Dropped some stuff and now it looks like this: 5 sets of: 24 pushups 24 squats 5 sets of: 24 pushups 24 lunges 6 sets of: 100 crunches 30 kicks (front and round) 2 sets of: 6 wide grip pull-ups 6 regular grip pull-ups side planks, 1 min a side back extensions on a swiss ball shoulder raises till failure with 2lbs reverse flies 20 or till failure 2lbs |
| 1/17/13 8:51 PM | |
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juszczec
61
Member Since: 2/23/03 Posts: 10556 |
Master Bater -juszczec -Master Bater - I take it this is per week juszczec? and on what days do you do these sets? I've been doing BWE for about 2 years and its evolved a bit. I started out doing this: http://www.trainforstrength.com/workout1.shtml It took too long, so I started supersetting the pushups & legs. Dropped some stuff and now it looks like this: 5 sets of: 24 pushups 24 squats 5 sets of: 24 pushups 24 lunges 6 sets of: 100 crunches 30 kicks (front and round) 2 sets of: 6 wide grip pull-ups 6 regular grip pull-ups side planks, 1 min a side back extensions on a swiss ball shoulder raises till failure with 2lbs reverse flies 20 or till failure 2lbs |
| 1/18/13 8:17 PM | |
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bhealthy
Member Since: 11/14/06 Posts: 17140 |
TTT |
| 1/18/13 9:19 PM | |
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ShawnTheBadger
91
Member Since: 1/10/13 Posts: 49 |
Old fart here at 48. Glad to see this age-group represented. There sure is a lot of ankle-bitin' youngsters on forums and this damn new-fangled internets contraption. Mouthy little shits...*grumble, grumble* I'm not so much a martial artist, but been lifting weights forever and worked security in clubs from 1983 till 2010. I had plenty of volunteer training partners and no end of folks that needed some special attention on a nightly basis. I was always happy to oblige. ;) Five surgeries to repair stuff, nose, right knee X3, right wrist has a pin and bone-graft holding nicely. Dislocated my right shoulder too many times. Too many concussions and stitches to even keep track. When I retired from the clubs a couple years back I moved to a dilapidated, run-down, overgrown cattle ranch. If you've ever heard about how hard and physically demanding it is working a farm or ranch, they probably under-estimated it. I had no idea. I do tons of stretching. Twice a day usually. Helps tremendously especially with my lower back. Ibuprofen and ice packs for sore stuff. Chiropractor when my C4/5 goes out in my neck. Anybody else like or utilize chiro's? Mine have saved me having to eat a whole lot of pain pills/muscle relaxers (both of which I dislike and only use when absolutely necessary) over the years. I have to pace myself and move at a steady speed when working the ranch. I cannot just tear through shit like I used to. I rotate what jobs I do in what order to make sure I am not doing two days in a row of really hard work. I can't build barb-wire fence two days in a row (freakin' brutal). I still do light dumbbell workouts four times a week. The dumbbells are much easier than a straight bar because you can adjust either side to be more comfortable on that particular joint. In my case my right side wrist and shoulder. Also, agreed with the extra sleep and recovery time. Not to mention diet. Holy crap do I have to watch what I eat. Sigh. Great thread. |
| 1/22/13 6:01 PM | |
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bhealthy
Member Since: 11/14/06 Posts: 17154 |
ttt |
| 1/23/13 7:13 PM | |
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Moke
4
Member Since: 1/1/01 Posts: 33991 |
Chiropractor when my C4/5 goes out in my neck. Anybody else like or utilize chiro's? Mine have saved me having to eat a whole lot of pain pills/muscle relaxers (both of which I dislike and only use when absolutely necessary) over the years. I personally hate chiros...I used to go to them for quite a while for chronic neck pain, weakness, and pinched nerves. After a few years I found out that I had 2 broken vertebrae and two shattered discs. They had been adjusting a broken neck all that time. At that point I got me some insurance and saw me a real doctor and got x-ray'd, MRI'd, then surgerfied. |
| 1/23/13 7:45 PM | |
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juszczec
61
Member Since: 2/23/03 Posts: 10639 |
ShawnTheBadger You work your own ranch? Daaaaaaammmnnnnnn. That's some hard work. I never got hooked up with a chiro. When I a few months shy of graduating college I tore up my back doing judo. I just happened to wind up at a Sports Medicine dr who recommended physical therapy. He just happened to have a physical therapist next door and lucky me, there was a damn genius working there. She fixed my back in about 6 weeks and has been putting me back together ever since. At this stage of the game, after 20 years, she's like the mechanic who's worked on the same car and could put it back together while asleep or drunk or both. |
| 1/24/13 1:42 PM | |
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Master Bater
14
Member Since: 1/7/11 Posts: 1787 |
in for OFTT Logo... and nothing else... come on you talented bunch WHERE'S OUR LOGO???? |
| 1/24/13 1:59 PM | |
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ShawnTheBadger
91
Member Since: 1/10/13 Posts: 77 |
juszczec - ShawnTheBadger 44-acres that had not been touched since 1989 when my grand-father-in-law passed. Fencelines, roofs, electrical, plumbing, roads, ponds, levees, nothing had been tended to. It was a nightmare mess. I still have a very long way to go. I have always stayed in pretty good shape, athletic, strong, not scared of physical labor. Yet I had NO idea how hard (and dangerous) it was to work a cattle ranch. None. As for Moke and chiropractors, you were seeing some lame-ass chiros. How the hell they did not do an exam and x-rays is beyond me (?!?) All of my chiros started with x-rays. A Sports Medicine clinic is in fact where I first got hooked up with a chiro after a car accident. The chiro is the guy at the clinic who got me back to healthy and fully mobile. |
| 1/24/13 6:16 PM | |
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Moke
4
Member Since: 1/1/01 Posts: 34006 |
As for Moke and chiropractors, you were seeing some lame-ass chiros. How the hell they did not do an exam and x-rays is beyond me (?!?) All of my chiros started with x-rays. The guy I saw for the majority of the time was famous. He is the biggest chiro in Hollywood and all the biggest movie stars, athletes, and musicians endorse him. However, because of this, the vast majority of his clientele gets treated in a assembly line sort of way I suppose. They had indeed taken x-rays, and one day when I complained that I'm not getting any improvement, they whipped out my x-ray and started giving me the standard spiel about my current neck curvature and how they will eventually work it into this more desirable curvature. It all sounded like a pedestrian sale pitch to me. Then I noticed something in the x-ray...two floating pieces of bone, not attached to anything. I asked him, "Is this supposed to be like this?" And he suddenly got wide eyed and exclaimed, "I can't believe my technician missed this!" I was thinking um right...I can't believe YOU missed it. In fact I'm surprised they even used my actual x-ray, as opposed to some generic x-ray they use on everybody. That's when I walked out never to return. Haven't been to a chiro since. Besides, even when I was going and felt relief, that relief was over the moment I left the office and hunched over to get into my car, whereupon I would hear a bunch of cracking and everything would be undone. |
| 1/24/13 8:21 PM | |
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Victor Parlati
Member Since: 5/16/04 Posts: 1967 |
Train once a day instead of twice. Your body now needs more time to recuperate than ever before. I'm 62, have been doing wing chun for the last 38 years, and have been teaching it for the last 28 years...and started doing catch wrestling 12 years ago, and boxing for the last 7 years. (Now do a mix of all three arts). Granted that you're 20 years younger than me, but you STILL need more time to recup than ever before, imo. Sounds like your trainnig schedule is pretty full - and your goin' with guys much younger than you. Think about it. |
| 1/24/13 8:25 PM | |
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Moke
4
Member Since: 1/1/01 Posts: 34009 |
Holy shit Victor, we have a bona fide wing chun master in the house! Let me ask you, since you've been doing it consistently this whole time, have you lost any speed or snap? I always wondered if people lost this sort of thing due to inactivity as they get older, or if it happens anyway. |
| 1/24/13 8:50 PM | |
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Victor Parlati
Edited: 01/25/13 12:41 AM Member Since: 5/16/04 Posts: 1968 |
If you don't train regularly you will lose speed, reflexes, cardio endurance, flexibility and range of motion, and of course, you'll lose power in your strikes, kicks, etc. No doubt about it. I see that happening whenever I start to go too long without a serious regimen. And then I've got to seriously work at it to get it back. And the regimen I then put in place consists of trampoline for cardio (it's the best possible cardio workout that protects your knees)...working the heavy bag and the wooden dummy and some wing chun drills (ie.- sticking hands) at least twice a week, and competitively spar and roll at least once a week. There's no stopping the aging process. But what a regimen like I just described will do is SLOW DOWN the aging process significantly. |
| 1/28/13 8:08 PM | |
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Master Bater
14
Member Since: 1/7/11 Posts: 1804 |
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