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Jon Jones to Protest Loss


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From: Magnetic 184 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:10 PM
Magnetic Marketing Associates, President
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Well we are doing what we feel is right for Jones.

From: bhamill 2 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:13 PM
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Crazy Zimmerman -  Kak, he threw an UNintentional elbow.  How is that cheating?


Gotta agree the elbows were 100% INTENTIONAL. In the moment he may have somehow "forgotten in the heat of the fight" that 12 to 6 elbows were illegal, but they were definitely intentional. I also didn't like how he was trying to talk the ref into stopping the fight when Hamill was blocking most of his blows and still moving to defend. Do YOUR job and let the ref do his.

As far as what stopped the fight, Hamill may have been unable to continue with the shoulder, but the action was stopped because of the illegal blows splitting open the nose and blinding both eyes with blood, NOT because of the shoulder. Jones can claim that Hamill would have given up because of the shoulder, but he hadn't till that point so its moot.

IMO, Jones should just accept the loss, apologize for the illegal blows and win his next fight. Right now he appears to be seeking to get the NC on a technicality.

From: Shaper108 7 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:17 PM
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bhamill - 
Crazy Zimmerman -  Kak, he threw an UNintentional elbow.  How is that cheating?


Gotta agree the elbows were 100% INTENTIONAL. In the moment he may have somehow "forgotten in the heat of the fight" that 12 to 6 elbows were illegal, but they were definitely intentional. I also didn't like how he was trying to talk the ref into stopping the fight when Hamill was blocking most of his blows and still moving to defend. Do YOUR job and let the ref do his.

As far as what stopped the fight, Hamill may have been unable to continue with the shoulder, but the action was stopped because of the illegal blows splitting open the nose and blinding both eyes with blood, NOT because of the shoulder. Jones can claim that Hamill would have given up because of the shoulder, but he hadn't till that point so its moot.

IMO, Jones should just accept the loss, apologize for the illegal blows and win his next fight. Right now he appears to be seeking to get the NC on a technicality.


Thats a pretty fair assessment.

From: Crazy Zimmerman 278 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:18 PM
Member Since: 1/1/01
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"Matt was non-responsive on the floor in a bloody heap after recieving the (illegal and obviously intentional) elbows to the face."

Matt is deaf and had blood in his eyes.  Which is the whole point.  Mazz should have stood him up, had the blood wiped away and then make the evaluation. 

You can't simply say: Are you done? to a deaf person who can't see your lips moving. 

And as Jason pointed out, Jones' management team is doing this because that's what managers are supposed to do.

From: da Vinci 81 152 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:29 PM
Member Since: 11/24/07
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Kakkarotto_san - 
goku -  good call...hammill wasnt able to continue due to the shoulder, not the elbows...according to the rules, it should not be a DQ



How can you prove that? Hamill, being unable to communicate this to the referee due to being both blind and deaf at that moment, could not have possibly indicated what exactly caused him to be unable to finish.

So what are you basing that off? The reality is that it is a huge assumption and you can't say one way or another.

Isn't that exactly what Hammill said to Rogan in the post-fight interview? That his shoulder was dislocated and that's why he couldn't continue, not because of the elbows?

Seems to me like this is the same as getting punched in the back of the head; the fight is stopped for a point to be taken away and then continues.

From: Gordo1581 463 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:37 PM
Member Since: 8/30/09
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Magnetic - Let's be clear, Jon is not "unhappy" he feels as all things happen for a reason. We are protesting the L because we felt that Jon's opponent could not effectively communicate why he could not continue.

The rules state that an intentional foul and that the fighter cannot continue based on injury sustained from the foul. Hamill could not contnue due to a broken shoulder.

Jon should have been deducted a point for the accidental illegal blow. Matt should have been treated like we treat the Brazilians and given 5 minutes to regroup and offered a translator so the ref could make the right call and understand Matt could not continue due to his shoulder injury not the blow.

This should be a NC for both fighters but not a loss. Hammil continued with an injured Shoulder and only complained once the action was stopped (warrior) but the fight was stopped based on the shoulder injury in our opinion.

Keith Kizer tried to claim that the fight was stopped because of a cut which was caused by the illegal elbows. Which we know is bullshit because we all saw that Mazzagatti stopped the fight after asking a deaf fighter with blood in his eyes "Are you done?"

Do you know if there was an NSAC appointed translator at ringside or did they just expect to rely on Hamill being able to read lips? I know that Hamill had a translator of his own there but, imo, he's considered one of his cornermen.

I think failure to effectively communicate is the key here which was brought to light by Hamill's post-fight interview.

From: Jetster 1 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:42 PM
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Magnetic - Let's be clear, Jon is not "unhappy" he feels as all things happen for a reason. We are protesting the L because we felt that Jon's opponent could not effectively communicate why he could not continue.

The rules state that an intentional foul and that the fighter cannot continue based on injury sustained from the foul. Hamill could not contnue due to a broken shoulder.

Jon should have been deducted a point for the accidental illegal blow. Matt should have been treated like we treat the Brazilians and given 5 minutes to regroup and offered a translator so the ref could make the right call and understand Matt could not continue due to his shoulder injury not the blow.

This should be a NC for both fighters but not a loss. Hammil continued with an injured Shoulder and only complained once the action was stopped (warrior) but the fight was stopped based on the shoulder injury in our opinion.


Thanks for coming on here and clearing things up from your point of view.

From: da Vinci 81 152 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:42 PM
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^^ but not BECAUSE of the illegal blow, which is the whole issue

From: BITM Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:44 PM
Member Since: 2/15/09
Posts: 98
 

Commision won't turn it over.

When was the last time they did change a decision?


From: shb 5 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:45 PM
Member Since: 1/25/07
Posts: 336
 
in the sherdog video interview, jones said he was at peace with the loss. he gave all these reasons for why the loss was a good thing, why everything happens for a reason, blah blah blah, all with this stupid satisfied grin on his face. why the change of heart? is it that jones isn't the gracious, mature, honest person that everyone inexplicably insists he is?

From: Crooklyn 698 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:46 PM
Edited: 12/08/09 1:47 PM
TapouT Radio, Redneck Support Team
Member Since: 8/11/07
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Magnetic - Let's be clear, Jon is not "unhappy" he feels as all things happen for a reason. We are protesting the L because we felt that Jon's opponent could not effectively communicate why he could not continue.

The rules state that an intentional foul and that the fighter cannot continue based on injury sustained from the foul. Hamill could not contnue due to a broken shoulder.

Jon should have been deducted a point for the accidental illegal blow. Matt should have been treated like we treat the Brazilians and given 5 minutes to regroup and offered a translator so the ref could make the right call and understand Matt could not continue due to his shoulder injury not the blow.

This should be a NC for both fighters but not a loss. Hammil continued with an injured Shoulder and only complained once the action was stopped (warrior) but the fight was stopped based on the shoulder injury in our opinion.

Jason, I had no idea you were managing him too.  We had Jonny and his other manager, Gary, on last night.  Ryan C. had a prior engagement.  I woulda had you on if I had known.
 

From: Jetster 1 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:47 PM
Member Since: 3/25/02
Posts: 4922
 
ttt

From: da Vinci 81 152 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:47 PM
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Posts: 548
 
The fact is Hammill dislocated his shoulder PRIOR to receiving the illegal blow, and continued to fight on with the injury. He could have tapped out but he chose not too, so the fact he got hit with an illegal elbow after sustaining the fight-ending injury should make this a NC.

It's only because Mazzagatti jumped to conclusions and assumed Matt was hurt from the elbows and not his shoulder that caused this fight to be stopped.

From: Crazy Zimmerman 278 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:47 PM
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shb - in the sherdog video interview, jones said he was at peace with the loss. he gave all these reasons for why the loss was a good thing, why everything happens for a reason, blah blah blah, all with this stupid satisfied grin on his face. why the change of heart? is it that jones isn't the gracious, mature, honest person that everyone inexplicably insists he is?

 No. It's because his management team is doing the right thing by him.  I should have used a different word than unhappy. He's ok either way, but his team will do what they need to do.

From: shb 5 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:49 PM
Member Since: 1/25/07
Posts: 337
 
Crazy Zimmerman - 
shb - in the sherdog video interview, jones said he was at peace with the loss. he gave all these reasons for why the loss was a good thing, why everything happens for a reason, blah blah blah, all with this stupid satisfied grin on his face. why the change of heart? is it that jones isn't the gracious, mature, honest person that everyone inexplicably insists he is?

 No. It's because his management team is doing the right thing by him.  I should have used a different word than unhappy. He's ok either way, but his team will do what they need to do.
if he were actually at peace with it and really believed that everything happened for a reason, his team would be leaving it alone. your team doesn't protest the outcome of a fight if you're okay with it. are they doing it against his will? because if not, it's not just his team, it's him too.

From: Shaper108 7 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:51 PM
Member Since: 9/5/05
Posts: 820
 
da Vinci 81 - 
Kakkarotto_san - 
goku -  good call...hammill wasnt able to continue due to the shoulder, not the elbows...according to the rules, it should not be a DQ



How can you prove that? Hamill, being unable to communicate this to the referee due to being both blind and deaf at that moment, could not have possibly indicated what exactly caused him to be unable to finish.

So what are you basing that off? The reality is that it is a huge assumption and you can't say one way or another.

Isn't that exactly what Hammill said to Rogan in the post-fight interview? That his shoulder was dislocated and that's why he couldn't continue, not because of the elbows?

Seems to me like this is the same as getting punched in the back of the head; the fight is stopped for a point to be taken away and then continues.


Maybe more like one point for each illegal elbow thrown?

From: BabyZeus 1 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:51 PM
Member Since: 10/23/07
Posts: 1162
 
Regardless of the outcome, hope to see a lot more of Jones.

Super talented fighter who will only get better.

From: goku Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:52 PM
Member Since: 8/6/08
Posts: 6700
 
Kakkarotto_san - 
goku -  good call...hammill wasnt able to continue due to the shoulder, not the elbows...according to the rules, it should not be a DQ



How can you prove that? Hamill, being unable to communicate this to the referee due to being both blind and deaf at that moment, could not have possibly indicated what exactly caused him to be unable to finish.

So what are you basing that off? The reality is that it is a huge assumption and you can't say one way or another.
on the fact that he was not KOd and he was holding his shoulder when they waived it off...oh, and also the fact that matt himself said so...oh and because of his dislocated shoulder

thats all
 

From: Crazy Zimmerman 278 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:53 PM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 52884
 
shb - 
Crazy Zimmerman - 
shb - in the sherdog video interview, jones said he was at peace with the loss. he gave all these reasons for why the loss was a good thing, why everything happens for a reason, blah blah blah, all with this stupid satisfied grin on his face. why the change of heart? is it that jones isn't the gracious, mature, honest person that everyone inexplicably insists he is?

 No. It's because his management team is doing the right thing by him.  I should have used a different word than unhappy. He's ok either way, but his team will do what they need to do.
if he were actually at peace with it and really believed that everything happened for a reason, his team would be leaving it alone. your team doesn't protest the outcome of a fight if you're okay with it. are they doing it against his will? because if not, it's not just his team, it's him too.

 Do you think any fighter wants an L on his record?  I think just from reading this thread there seems to be enough contraversy to question the loss. 

Should Jones beat up his managers for trying to get the L removed?

I'm sure he will graciously accept any ruling.  Let's let the process decide.

From: Tom Lawlor 473 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:54 PM
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Posts: 1683
 
Crazy Zimmerman -  Kak, he threw an UNintentional elbow.  How is that cheating?


How was that UNintentional? Did he go to throw a punch and a pixie accidentally grabbed his hand, moved it upwards, then thrust his elbow down at Hamill 12-6?

I see the argument about it being a NC or W for Bones because of Hamill's shoulder....

but to say that it was an unintentional elbow is ridiculous

From: punchdrunkMMA 8 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:56 PM
Member Since: 6/29/09
Posts: 555
 
 All you have to do is get Hamill to testify as to whether or not the elbows resulted in him being unable to continue or if his shoulder prohibited him from doing so the minute it dislocated.

From: Crazy Zimmerman 278 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:56 PM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 52886
 
Tom Lawlor - 
Crazy Zimmerman -  Kak, he threw an UNintentional elbow.  How is that cheating?


How was that UNintentional? Did he go to throw a punch and a pixie accidentally grabbed his hand, moved it upwards, then thrust his elbow down at Hamill 12-6?

I see the argument about it being a NC or W for Bones because of Hamill's shoulder....

but to say that it was an unintentional elbow is ridiculous

 What, you don't believe in pixies?

From: biggator 40 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:59 PM
Member Since: 4/22/09
Posts: 799
 
dun datta - jon jones made his bed, now he has to lay in it

laws are there for a reason, if you smoke pot or throw an illegal elbow, you need to accept consequences of your actions and take responsibility for your choices

I hope AC tells him to get lost

 ooooooooooo throwi his own bullshit back in his face i  see what u did there.

karmas a bitch, shitch.

From: Crooklyn 698 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 1:59 PM
TapouT Radio, Redneck Support Team
Member Since: 8/11/07
Posts: 32005
 
Garv, is it ok if I put up our interview with Jonny from last night?

From: 39 Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile
Posted: 12/8/09 2:02 PM
Member Since: 6/24/08
Posts: 1219
 
he tried to arc the elbows at the end, you can see on a replay, that's how they are unintentional, you bitches

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