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UnderGround Forums >> Kazushi Sakuraba: The Jester of MMA


3/24/13 7:47 PM
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Condit's Face Broke My Hand
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D241 - 
Diesel67 - 
Jack Slack - 

I'm unsure of the point of your post diesel... 

fighters lose? =S


Fighters lose, but this one was DESTROYED by Wandy THREE TIMES. None of them was even close. But his nuthuggers still pretend he's some kind of superman.

I'm disappointed Diesel67 was the guy to bring a negative vibe to this thread. Show some respect 01er.

You obviously do not understand the premise of this thread. It's a Sakuraba appreciation thread and breakdown thread.

 

There are many positive threads about Wanderlei, you wouldn't feel good if someone posted gifs of Vitor blasting him in UFC, or Tito double legging him, or Hunt Atomic butt dropping him, or Mirko lhking him, etc....

 

If you want to big up Wanderlei, create your own thread. I'm sure it will be well recieved because LIKE Sakuraba, Wanderlei is an mma legend, a historic mma figure who helped pave the mma landscape. Wanderlei Silva has respect for Sakuraba.


There are a few 01ers who are constantly bashing and spewing negativity

3/24/13 7:56 PM
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Samoa
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CLINTK9 -
Samoa - 
D241 -

And what validity if any does it bring IF Sakuraba vs Kimo was a work? Sakuraba LOST lol

 

Does that somehow make him great b/c he lost to Kimo, which is why it was a work? Confusing logic is confusing.

 

Now saying a win against Royce was a work, that would at least have substance as that was a fight that really got Sakuraba over the hump with all mma fans.

 

Just watch the fight and speak of where the worked parts take place.

No validity or invalidity at all. A worked fight is meaningless when ranking real fights. Just my belief that it was a work.

Anyone want to take a run at answering my Carlson Gracie BB question? Phone Post

yea, he learned from a mistake. maybe trained harder on it after loss. But NO WAY THAT Could be, HAS To be a WORK! Seriously? Ken shamrock tapped to a choke in his 2nd UFC fight in 3 minutes. He learned. Oleg got pumpled by knees in his 2nd UFC fight, he learned. Because Saku became great later, his early loss in his 1ST fight ever has to be a work? Seriously? I Learned ALOT From 1994 training to 1996. the 1996 me would easily work over the me of 2 years prior. people learn, and especially from mistakes and losses.
Shamrock lost to a GJJ black belt. He had Pancrase experience before the fight. One year later he was not tapping out Black Belts.

Saku goes from getting embarrassed by a blue belt to tapping out black belts the following year.

Sure it's possible. I'm not saying its impossible. I am saying its unlikely and not been done by anyone before or after at the top tier level.

Like I said; I'm a huge Saku fan. Whether or not he did a work has me bearing on how I see him as a fighter or his all time status. I believe the Kimo fight was a work. You don't. We aren't going to change each others minds. I'm ok with that. Peace. Phone Post
3/24/13 8:57 PM
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D241
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Condit's Face Broke my Hand-are you only the strong survive? Are you also saying Diesel67 is known to troll?

 

Samoa-I think it's more reasonable to believe that Sakuraba's biggest weakness in his grappling game throughout his career, was the side choke.  I don't know about you, but I don't recall any Gracie ever getting into position, let alone apply one. I think the fact that only 3 guys, 1 who was noticeably bigger/stronger(against extremely green Sakuraba), and the other 2 happening literally at the very end of his career, is more reasonable to think his first fight wasn't a work than to think it was. You can't explain his later losses of the same technique without calling those a fluke, which would imply that Sakuraba's career inbetween was all a fluke. That'd be crazy.

3/24/13 9:01 PM
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Samoa
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A year later he fights a bigger BJJ fighter who is wearing a black belt, and taps him. He's still green and he's now fighting a bigger FAR more accomplished BJJ fighter; both in NHB and BJJ. Phone Post
3/24/13 9:15 PM
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D241
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Jason Miller isn't as accomplished jiu jitsu fighter as Royce/Royler were, yet he beat Sakuraba. Do you think that fight was a work?

3/24/13 9:21 PM
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Samoa
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D241 -

Jason Miller isn't as accomplished jiu jitsu fighter as Royce/Royler were, yet he beat Sakuraba. Do you think that fight was a work?

One has nothing to do with the other. No.

Why doesn't your "he's green and fighting a big guy"'scenario not even remotely play out against Conan? Phone Post
3/24/13 9:29 PM
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yabadaba
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Diesel67 - 
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I'm unsure of the point of your post diesel... 

fighters lose? =S


Fighters lose, but this one was DESTROYED by Wandy THREE TIMES. None of them was even close. But his nuthuggers still pretend he's some kind of superman.

1) Wandy was also a great fighter

2) These two did not belong in the same weight class

3/24/13 9:41 PM
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Wasa-B
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Diesel67 - 
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I'm unsure of the point of your post diesel... 

fighters lose? =S


Fighters lose, but this one was DESTROYED by Wandy THREE TIMES. None of them was even close. But his nuthuggers still pretend he's some kind of superman.

the 2nd fight was in fact very close. you may have forgotten than Wand was 1-2 weight classes bigger as well.
3/24/13 9:56 PM
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Condit's Face Broke My Hand
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D241 -

Condit's Face Broke my Hand-are you only the strong survive? Are you also saying Diesel67 is known to troll?

 

Samoa-I think it's more reasonable to believe that Sakuraba's biggest weakness in his grappling game throughout his career, was the side choke.  I don't know about you, but I don't recall any Gracie ever getting into position, let alone apply one. I think the fact that only 3 guys, 1 who was noticeably bigger/stronger(against extremely green Sakuraba), and the other 2 happening literally at the very end of his career, is more reasonable to think his first fight wasn't a work than to think it was. You can't explain his later losses of the same technique without calling those a fluke, which would imply that Sakuraba's career inbetween was all a fluke. That'd be crazy.

1. Yes

2. I don't know about him, I've just have noticed a lot of 01ers don't seem to have any respect and are really negative. Basically the opposite of what you'd expect. It makes me wonder how many of the 01 accounts are legit, especially when they don't have high post counts. Phone Post
3/24/13 10:03 PM
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D241
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there's only 2 01ers who I recognize as negative contributers, auspicht I figured out on my own over time, and kingoffighters came about recently and I heard so many people calling him a troll. I thought it was b/c of one strong opinion on one fight, but turns out that dude HATES GSP with a passion. 

Other than those 2, most other 01ers are respectable and have insight or something interesting to say.

 

 

PS-sucks you lost. If I make screen name bets, I have a stipulation that if it goes to judges decision, the bet is off. That would've been better for you b/c that fight was bullshit no way either of those guys showed broken spirit or dwindling will power.

3/24/13 10:29 PM
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whoabro
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Diesel67 -
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I'm unsure of the point of your post diesel... 

fighters lose? =S


Fighters lose, but this one was DESTROYED by Wandy THREE TIMES. None of them was even close. But his nuthuggers still pretend he's some kind of superman.
Hughes got tapped by hallman. It happens. Doesnt invalidate his achievements. Phone Post
3/24/13 10:30 PM
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whoabro
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Also, saku seems like the kind of guy who would admit the kimo fight was a work if that was the case. Hes never had a big ego and clearly gives zero fucks. Dont see any reason to doubt him. Phone Post
3/24/13 11:36 PM
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YVES JOCKSTRAP
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Ttt Phone Post
3/25/13 12:45 AM
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WOOFticket
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In Phone Post
3/25/13 4:52 AM
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INDK
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D241 -

Jason Miller isn't as accomplished jiu jitsu fighter as Royce/Royler were, yet he beat Sakuraba. Do you think that fight was a work?

•face palm• Phone Post
3/25/13 6:53 AM
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Jack Slack
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Diesel67 - 
Jack Slack - 

I'm unsure of the point of your post diesel... 

fighters lose? =S


Fighters lose, but this one was DESTROYED by Wandy THREE TIMES. None of them was even close. But his nuthuggers still pretend he's some kind of superman.

So losing to the best 205er on the planet at the time, when Sakuraba himself should have been in a lower weightclass is embarassing?

Styles make fights and Wandy was a bad match up for Saku. How can you have been here since 2001 and not understand that?

3/25/13 4:16 PM
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Wasa-B
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ttt
3/25/13 4:35 PM
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Haulport
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nice!
3/25/13 7:48 PM
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AvAMajestic
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The OP mentioned buying Sakuraba merchandise. Other than ebay, I haven't found much. Does anyone have any suggestions for where an english-speaker can purchase it online?

Have a mate's 30th coming up and he's a huge fan.
3/25/13 8:24 PM
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Jack Slack
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AvAMajestic - The OP mentioned buying Sakuraba merchandise. Other than ebay, I haven't found much. Does anyone have any suggestions for where an english-speaker can purchase it online?

Have a mate's 30th coming up and he's a huge fan.

Everything I have either came from random shops in Tokyo or ebay I'm afraid =/

3/25/13 10:09 PM
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jacktripper
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Has there ever been a fighter more pushed by his promotion?

Takada was literally the pride figurehead and sak was thei premiere fighter from takada dojo (not to mention all the fixed fights takada was involved in) Phone Post
3/25/13 10:13 PM
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D241
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INDK - 
D241 -

Jason Miller isn't as accomplished jiu jitsu fighter as Royce/Royler were, yet he beat Sakuraba. Do you think that fight was a work?

•face palm• Phone Post

Why the face palm? I was trying to make a point that Sakuraba/Jason Miller was NOT a work.

 

 

Samoa-One more point I wanted to make was that you are taking one instance that isn't even rare, and using just the rare occurence of it as a work instead of any visual evidence.

There was a jiu jitsu fighter, I can't remember his name, a lower weight class. Anyways, he got submitted I think via triangle by a guy who was much lower level jits than he was. It was a huge upset in terms of the grappler getting submitted. That would be a work in your eyes b/c you're not basing it on how the fight played out, but rather the result of it.

3/25/13 10:31 PM
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Jack Slack
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Edited: 03/25/13 10:31 PM
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jacktripper -  Has there ever been a fighter more pushed by his promotion?

Takada was literally the pride figurehead and sak was thei premiere fighter from takada dojo (not to mention all the fixed fights takada was involved in) Phone Post

 

Sure there has... 

 

Nick Diaz by Strikeforce, Kimbo by EliteXC - they were spoon fed tailor made opponents.

Until quite recently Michael Bisping by the UFC, also Belfort to a degree.

3/25/13 10:32 PM
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Ponyboy
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People forget that Sak dropped Silva in thier first fight and ran in to follow up which got him caught.
3/25/13 10:36 PM
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cantuna4u
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#1. GOAT. Period. . Phone Post

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