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PoliticalGround >> Obama still spinning on Iraq Surge


9/4/08 5:37 PM
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Jack Carter
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http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/09/04/obama-surge-succeeded-beyond-wildest-dreams/

Obama: Surge Succeeded Beyond ‘Wildest Dreams’


The troop surge in Iraq has been more successful than anyone could have imagined, Barack Obama conceded Thursday in his first-ever interview on FOX News’ “The O’Reilly Factor.”

As recently as July, the Democratic presidential candidate declined to rate the surge a success, but said it had helped reduce violence in the country. On Thursday, Obama acknowledged the 2007 increase in U.S. troops has benefited the Iraqi people.

“I think that the surge has succeeded in ways that nobody anticipated,” Obama said while refusing to retract his initial opposition to the surge. “I’ve already said it’s succeeded beyond our wildest dreams.”



9/4/08 5:41 PM
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Jack Carter
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Edited: 09/04/08 5:41 PM
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"I think that the surge has succeeded in ways that nobody anticipated,"


Bullshit, Obama! Your opponent, John McCain, said the surge would work just how it's panning out right now. YOU were the one who said it would do NOTHING.

Shame on you, Hussein Obama!

"I've already said it's succeeded beyond our wildest dreams."


No, it succeeded beyond YOUR wildest dreams. For guys like McCain and General Petraeus, it succeeded just how they planned on and executed it.

Shame on your Hussein Obama
9/4/08 5:50 PM
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Kip Kinkle
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Good to see he's coming along, finally. He was much quicker to follow McCain's lead on Georgia/Russia.
9/4/08 5:59 PM
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ruger007
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This is going to be goooooood...
9/4/08 6:01 PM
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Kona Silat
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Is it just me, or is Obama is falling from grace.
9/4/08 6:25 PM
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ruger007
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He should have never of done it, he will have the far left blowing a vein!
9/4/08 6:30 PM
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Ethan Crane
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"I don't like to brag but I did argue for years on here we needed a surge and a change of strategy to a more counter-insurgency role. In fact the biggest opponents to a surge on this forum were Jack Carter and Information. Good insight guys."

Prepare to have your words italicized.
9/4/08 6:32 PM
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Fraser
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Shame on Obama for changing his mind? I suppose you would be proud if he continued to deny that the surge worked?

Or do you mean shame on him for opposing the surge at the beginning... in that case, you must feel 10X the shame for everyone who supported the war in the first place. Right?

Or are you selective in your self-righteous indignation? Don't bother to answer that one, it's obvious.
9/4/08 6:41 PM
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jpm995
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He didn't change his mind, he just couldn't deny the obvious any longer in front of the public. Weather your for the war or not it's plain to see it worked. I guess for him to say "i made a mistake" would be to much.
9/4/08 6:44 PM
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Clichy
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http://www.foxnews.com/oreilly/index.html?playerId=oreillyhomeplayer&streamingFormat=FLASH&referralObject=3071963&referralPlaylistId=bbeb11095dff273e354ffbd0dfa4c070c9e8730b&maven_dartZone=undefined&maven_dartSite=undefined

Preview of tonight, Obama looks pretty good here.
9/4/08 6:45 PM
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Kona Silat
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He is playing right into a trap.. how naive can he be.
9/4/08 6:46 PM
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OldSchoolMike
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Some people grow up to be a self-important thing like a "community organizer" others take that even a step further and go the "crossing guard" or "hall monitor" route.
9/4/08 6:47 PM
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Kona Silat
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ruger007 - He should have never of done it, he will have the far left blowing a vein!


no shit. he is shooting himself in the foot.
9/4/08 6:53 PM
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effertime
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What's hard for many Democrats is that they actually believe the war is wrong to begin with. So what are we really saying by proclaiming the "surge" a success?

It's one of the reasons that I can't truly get behind Obama. Sure, he's a much better alternative to the idiots on the right, but he's still essentially claiming that the war in Iraq has some kind of moral justification.

Chomsky sums it up nicely in a recent interview:

*Warning, FRAT*

"But the more fundamental question is, why should we be asking these particular questions? Let's take some enemy, say, Russia and Chechnya. Chechnya doesn't involve the invasion of a separate country, but it's horrible enough. The Russians devastated the country, with nobody knows how many casualties and atrocities. The capital Grozny was basically a pile of rubble. But over the last couple months (in early 2008), American reporters have gone there and say the city is booming, it has electricity, building is going on, businesses are opening, there's little violence. Russians are in the background, but it's basically a Russian client state nominally run by Chechnyans. Their surge was a success. But do we praise Putin for less violence?

But Iraq is much worse. What are we doing there? We just invaded. While the Chinese can claim Tibet is part of China and the Russians can claim Chechnya, we can't say that Iraq is part of the US unless we actually claim that we own the world. We just invaded a completely foreign country.

When we look at what the U.S. has done to Iraq it's an atrocity. What are we doing there? Iraq is much worse than Chechnya. We have gone halfway around the world and destroyed a nation.

If you want to know what is really going on with the surge, one place to look is at The Nation, where there are reports by two reporters who are unusual in that they actually report from Iraq. There are a handful of reporters in the world who actually report from Iraq itself. Patrick Cockburn has been reporting there for years, and Nir Rosen speaks fluent Arabic and can pass for Arab and has been there for five years. They both agree that the U.S. occupation is probably the end of Iraq. They really describe it as a monstrosity. Iraq may never recover. We've destroyed the country. It's like the Mongol invasions in the 13th century.

Most of the educated class has either been killed or fled. The country is an array of militias, of warlords and gangs, of which the US is just the biggest and most powerful militia. They call the Iraqi Army its sub-militia. We've just destroyed the country, and it may never recover. So that's the way that the surge has succeeded. "

http://www.inthesetimes.com/article/3831/
9/4/08 6:56 PM
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Fraser
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 Certainly though, more troops and less violence must be preferable to fewer troops and more violence.

We are trying to stabilize the country so that we can leave. Unfortunately, more troops was the only way to do that.
9/4/08 6:59 PM
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Dark Heap4
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Obama cant make up his mind. He says this but then he says what he really means is this. Am I black or am I white? Obama is just too lame.
9/4/08 7:03 PM
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nagaman
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Truth never breaks.
It took such a long time for Obama to admit this because he knows that he looks like an idiot in the upcoming debate if he keep denying the "FACT"
9/4/08 7:05 PM
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Clichy
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Edited: 09/04/08 7:07 PM
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irondentist - "It's like the Mongol invasions in the 13th century" - effertime.You just lost me right there and made me realize what a lying fucktard you are or an idiot who have no idea what the Mongols did or who Hulaggo was.


The Mongol invasion of Rus' was heralded by the Battle of the Kalka River in 1223 between Subutai's reconnaissance unit and the combined force of several Rus' princes. After fifteen years of peace, it was followed by Batu Khan's full-scale invasion during 1237 to 1240. The invasion, facilitated by the breakup of Kievan Rus' in the 12th century, had incalculable ramifications for the history of Eastern Europe, including the division of the East Slavic people into three separate nations[1] and the rise of the Grand Duchy of Moscow.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongol_Empire



I am sure Noam Chomsky is just a bit more qualified to speak on just about any subject than you.
9/4/08 7:13 PM
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effertime
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irondentist - "It's like the Mongol invasions in the 13th century" - effertime.

You just lost me right there and made me realize what a lying fucktard you are or an idiot who have no idea what the Mongols did or who Hulaggo was.



Haha! Funny coming from a guy who just said on another thread:

"If we preemptively invaded Afghanistan, claiming they were developing weapons of mass destruction, 9-11 would never have happened."

In any case, if you have something to say about the QUOTE that i took from Chomsky where he compares our actions to those in Russia, etc...go ahead and make a point. Say something constructive instead of wetting your pants.
9/4/08 7:15 PM
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Fraser
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nagaman - Truth never breaks.
It took such a long time for Obama to admit this because he knows that he looks like an idiot in the upcoming debate if he keep denying the "FACT"
Yes. The Bush tactic of clinging to the same failed idea in the face of overwhelming incorrectness is SOOOOO much better.
9/4/08 7:21 PM
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bluedragon
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Edited: 09/04/08 7:22 PM
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WhatIsMMA, I have argued that till blue in the face on here.

1. We were paying insurgents to destroy "AQ" at their base in Anbar well before "the surge" took place. They effectively wiped out the "AQ" base in Iraq.

2. Baghdad is now more segregated than ever before. Blast walls separate the different neighborhoods now.

3. Millions of people have moved out of Baghdad

4. Hundreds of thousands have been killed already.

The level of violence and death will automatically go down because of those four factors which outweigh us putting more police, errr...I mean soldiers on patrol.

But, the crusaders have to scream victory and feel good about themselves, for they are insecure at the core and need constant mommy style reinforcement. USA! USA! USA! See, if I scream it louder than you, that means I am more patriotic, which somehow translates into me being of a higher moral authority on EVERY subject, regardless of reality.
9/4/08 8:54 PM
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ThugLife
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urb - "For guys like McCain and General Petraeus, it succeeded just how they planned on and executed it."

I don't like to brag but I did argue for years on here we needed a surge and a change of strategy to a more counter-insurgency role. In fact the biggest opponents to a surge on this forum were Jack Carter and Information. Good insight guys.


Bump or link the threads. id like to see.
9/4/08 10:20 PM
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drjim
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Didn't the opponents of this occupation say that our soldiers would be sitting ducks in the middle of an Iraqi civil war? Is the idea of a civil war off the talking points bulletin?
9/4/08 10:21 PM
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ruger007
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WTF!!!

Is this cut and paste wars?????
9/4/08 11:38 PM
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jettdogg
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The GOP candidate for vice president, Gov. Sarah Palin, may be facing yet another ethics investigation back in her home state of Alaska. An ethics complaint obtained by NBC News was filed Wednesday by the police officers union in Alaska, requesting a probe into possible wrongdoing by the governor or her office. It was brought on behalf of state trooper Mike Wooten, an ex-brother-in-law of Palin who is at the center of the "Troopergate" scandal.

The complaint alleges that the governor or her staff may have have improperly disclosed information from Wooten's personnel records. The complaint alleges "criminal penalties may apply."

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