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UnderGround Forums >> Let's talk Steroids. Let's keep it real.


11/29/08 8:29 PM
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wyojkd
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 Shilo you post while I typing so I look like a copy cat.

11/29/08 8:29 PM
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Shiloh
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Mark Martin - Even the movie "Bigger, Faster, Stronger" which was pro-steroids admitted that a few people each year die from steroids.

But if you need a name of a famous person, Eddie Guerrero comes to mind. His death certificate says he died of a heart attack caused by long-term use of anabolic steroids.

But if you write that here, the next thing that happens is all the people living in denial say how the coroner lied.


LOLOLOLO post the fucking death certificate that actually says that!

ill wait.
11/29/08 8:30 PM
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Shiloh
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wyojkd -  Shilo you post while I typing so I look like a copy cat.


lol
11/29/08 8:31 PM
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Buffbetty
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Mark Martin - Even the movie "Bigger, Faster, Stronger" which was pro-steroids admitted that a few people each year die from steroids.

But if you need a name of a famous person, Eddie Guerrero comes to mind. His death certificate says he died of a heart attack caused by long-term use of anabolic steroids.

But if you write that here, the next thing that happens is all the people living in denial say how the coroner lied.


Yes, but, it is useless to continue this argument. Everyone has their own views, opinions and experiences. I wonder what Arnold would say about all this? Maybe we should ask Hulk Hogan? There have only been a few pro's who would come forward regarding this subject. We need to hear more from others.
11/29/08 8:37 PM
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Buffbetty
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Edited: 11/29/08 8:40 PM
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Shiloh -
Buffbetty -
Shiloh -
Buffbetty -
Shiloh - "I have seen big, strong, healthy guys die from steroid usage. "

LOL no you have not


Actually, I have. Ever wondered what too much insulin or steroid does to your organs? The pancreas makes insulin and other hormones. Not good to mess with them. As I stated previously, it's because their dumb asses did too much and did it all wrong! Ego's contributed to their demise. That's why it should be regulated, period.

insulin isnt steroids, and you have not ever seen one person die of steroids ever. if you have, you are apparently the only one in history and should let medical researchers know asap, they will be very interested to study the first documented case.



I know it isn't a steroid. That was only part of his cycle. I am not the only one. Go to a bodybuilding convention, like the Olympia, ask around. See if anyone knows of someone who died because of steroids contribution. They don't report that stuff, I'm telling you.

ok well.... steroids and insulin are two entirely different animals. people who fuck with insulin are retarded. that has zero to do with a little test and deca.

again, nobody has ever died from steroids. ever. you are pulling a lyle alzado card here.


Really...? Come on. You think that there haven't been guys who overdosed on Test or Anadrol or Primo? And caused serious damage to their heart, their cholesterol levels, blood pressure, liver, estrogen levels? Please... That is the cause of death on certificates, not listed as death by steriod use. And, premature baldness can be accelerated because of steroids if a guy is already genetically predisposed.
11/29/08 8:37 PM
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wyojkd
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 Eddie Guerro,
Read his book, and his other addictions he spoke about, he was jacked up from way more than AAS. Do you think the other stuff really didn't play a part in it. That is exactly what I am saying people don't look at the whole picture. Did it play a role probably but not the sole contributer I doubt. Cardiac arrest is a side effect of vitamin C also.
Bigger stonger faster, The brother who was an addict and an AAS user had plague on his heart. The younger brother who had done nothing but AAS and his heart showed zero signs of plaque. As did the brother who had done nothing. It in the extra scenes.
He speaks about it in an interview with the fitcast podcast.
11/29/08 8:44 PM
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Buffbetty
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Edited: 11/29/08 8:46 PM
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FYI

What are some of the side effects of steroid use?
A build-up of steroids upsets the body's internal balance, and side effects occur when the body begins to compensate to eliminate the excess steroids or hormones. Steroid abuse can cause stunted growth in adolescents, con-tinuous headaches, bone pain, nausea, and changes in bowel and urinary patterns. An unexpected side effect is that steroid use can weaken the tendons, placing athletes at risk of serious injury.

* Cardiovascular System: Enlargement of the heart, a precursor to heart failure; high blood pressure; atherosclerosis or hardening of the arteries, a precursor to coronary heart disease; elevated cholesterol levels; heart palpitations; heart attack; stroke; anaphylactic and septic shock.
* Reproductive System: In males, excess testosterone is converted to the female hormone estrogen which causes the development of female characteristics. For instance, men experience prostate enlargement, sterility, sexual dysfunction, baldness, breast enlargement, and testicular atrophy. Excess testosterone in females has the opposite effect, causing menstrual irregularities, deepening of the voice, baldness, fetal damage, hair growth on other parts of the body, sexual dysfunction, sterility, reduction of breasts, and genital swelling.
* Vital Organs: Prolonged heavy use of steroids can permanently damage the liver, causing cancer, jaundice, bleeding, and hepatitis. Steroids can impair the kidneys leading to kidney stones and kidney disease.

Can steroids cause death?
Yes. Steroid-related fatalities occur as a result of suicide, homicide, liver disease, heart attack, and cancer.

Death from Steroids?

By Todd Ganci
When I was cycling, I used to humor myself by asking "If steroids are so bad, where are the bodies?" At that time I didn't hear stories about too many people that had serious health problems or any that died from steroids. It turns out the problems take years to manifest and many die prematurely, in their 30's, 40's or 50's instead of their 60's, 70's or 80's. The following are but a few of the many:

* Sonny Schmidt died at 46
* Scott Klein died at 30
* Ron Teufel died at 45
* Dan Duchaine died at 48
* Mohammed Benaziza died at 28
* Andreas Munzer died at 30
* Mike Mentzer died at 49
* Ray Mentzer died at 47
* Don Ross died at 55
* Dr. John Tristany died
* Don Peters died
* Ray Raridon died

Steroid Health Risks
* Dennis Newman (leukemia)
* Orville Burke (coma)
* Don Long (kidney failure)
* Tom Prince (kidney failure)
* Flex Wheeler (kidney transplant)
* Tom Prince (kidney failure)
* Ed Corney (stroke)
* Boyer Coe (heart)
* Danny Padilla (heart)
* Pete Grymkowski (heart)
* Mike Martarazzo 39 (triple bypass heart surgery)

I'd love to have a sit down interview with Flex...
11/29/08 8:44 PM
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Shiloh
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Buffbetty - 
Shiloh -
Buffbetty -
Shiloh -
Buffbetty -
Shiloh - "I have seen big, strong, healthy guys die from steroid usage. "

LOL no you have not


Actually, I have. Ever wondered what too much insulin or steroid does to your organs? The pancreas makes insulin and other hormones. Not good to mess with them. As I stated previously, it's because their dumb asses did too much and did it all wrong! Ego's contributed to their demise. That's why it should be regulated, period.

insulin isnt steroids, and you have not ever seen one person die of steroids ever. if you have, you are apparently the only one in history and should let medical researchers know asap, they will be very interested to study the first documented case.



I know it isn't a steroid. That was only part of his cycle. I am not the only one. Go to a bodybuilding convention, like the Olympia, ask around. See if anyone knows of someone who died because of steroids contribution. They don't report that stuff, I'm telling you.

ok well.... steroids and insulin are two entirely different animals. people who fuck with insulin are retarded. that has zero to do with a little test and deca.

again, nobody has ever died from steroids. ever. you are pulling a lyle alzado card here.


Really...? Come on. You think that there haven't been guys who overdosed on Test or Anadrol or Primo? And caused serious damage to their heart, their cholesterol levels, blood pressure, livers, estrogen levels? Please... That is the cause of death on certificates, not listed as death by steriod use. And, premature baldness can be accelerated because of steroids if a guy is already genetically predisposed.

yes, that is what i am saying, nobody has ever 'overdosed' on steroids. l;olol ESPECIALLY primo, thats a girls drug anyway LOL.

now doing damage to their body is another thing. drugs are drugs, they have side effects.

NOBODY HAS EVER DIED FROM STEROIDS. why cant people just be honest and say that? you cant point to one case anywhere because it has never happened, so just be honest and say 'ok, it caused liver damage. combined with drinking alcohol and taking pain meds and high protein diet over the years and hereditary factors contributed to his death.' thats feasible and understandable.

to say you know of a guy who OD's on steroids is hyperbole and undermines your case.
11/29/08 8:46 PM
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Shiloh
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"A build-up of steroids upsets the body's internal balance, and side effects occur when the body begins to compensate to eliminate the excess steroids or hormones."

LOL

Betty, put down the pdr. you are confusing things and its obvious.
11/29/08 8:48 PM
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wyojkd
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Orals = liver damage not from the AAS but the chemicals its bonded to so the AAS can make it through the liver. Liver damage isn't near as promenent as it was when pills was the prominent method of delivery. Topicals and injections have made this more or less a history topic.  

Estrogens never killed anybody that I know of, they may make you a man chick but that on you.

Cholesterol I will give you, but thats part of the knowledge is power. Cholesterol is easy to control even naturally. Risk to Reward ratio. the better informed you are the better decision you can make.
11/29/08 8:49 PM
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Buffbetty
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Bottom line... Using steroids without proper supervision can lead to damage in your organs, causing death.
11/29/08 8:52 PM
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Buffbetty
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Edited: 11/29/08 8:52 PM
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Shiloh -
Buffbetty -
Shiloh -
Buffbetty -
Shiloh -
Buffbetty -
Shiloh - "I have seen big, strong, healthy guys die from steroid usage. "

LOL no you have not


Actually, I have. Ever wondered what too much insulin or steroid does to your organs? The pancreas makes insulin and other hormones. Not good to mess with them. As I stated previously, it's because their dumb asses did too much and did it all wrong! Ego's contributed to their demise. That's why it should be regulated, period.

insulin isnt steroids, and you have not ever seen one person die of steroids ever. if you have, you are apparently the only one in history and should let medical researchers know asap, they will be very interested to study the first documented case.



I know it isn't a steroid. That was only part of his cycle. I am not the only one. Go to a bodybuilding convention, like the Olympia, ask around. See if anyone knows of someone who died because of steroids contribution. They don't report that stuff, I'm telling you.

ok well.... steroids and insulin are two entirely different animals. people who fuck with insulin are retarded. that has zero to do with a little test and deca.

again, nobody has ever died from steroids. ever. you are pulling a lyle alzado card here.


Really...? Come on. You think that there haven't been guys who overdosed on Test or Anadrol or Primo? And caused serious damage to their heart, their cholesterol levels, blood pressure, livers, estrogen levels? Please... That is the cause of death on certificates, not listed as death by steriod use. And, premature baldness can be accelerated because of steroids if a guy is already genetically predisposed.

yes, that is what i am saying, nobody has ever 'overdosed' on steroids. l;olol ESPECIALLY primo, thats a girls drug anyway LOL.

now doing damage to their body is another thing. drugs are drugs, they have side effects.

NOBODY HAS EVER DIED FROM STEROIDS. why cant people just be honest and say that? you cant point to one case anywhere because it has never happened, so just be honest and say 'ok, it caused liver damage. combined with drinking alcohol and taking pain meds and high protein diet over the years and hereditary factors contributed to his death.' thats feasible and understandable.

to say you know of a guy who OD's on steroids is hyperbole and undermines your case.



It is the side affects of the damn anabolics that is causing these health issues that lead to death! Don't you get what I am saying? It's not due to an overdose of a steroid to cause immediate death, it is abuse of steroids and it cause damage...which in a lot of cases, eventually cause death. If they didn't do the roids wrong, maybe it would be a different story.
11/29/08 8:54 PM
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wyojkd
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 Dan Duchaine on that list just proves how inacurate it is. Dan Duchane was a guro when it comes to AAS among other drug for bodybuilding.
Examiners established Duchaine died Jan 12, 2000, aged 47, due to kidney failure caused by hereditary polycystic kidney disease.
Please note the bold italics, hereditary.............
11/29/08 8:54 PM
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Buffbetty
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Edited: 11/29/08 8:55 PM
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wyojkd - Orals = liver damage not from the AAS but the chemicals its bonded to so the AAS can make it through the liver. Liver damage isn't near as promenent as it was when pills was the prominent method of delivery. Topicals and injections have made this more or less a history topic.

Estrogens never killed anybody that I know of, they may make you a man chick but that on you.

Cholesterol I will give you, but thats part of the knowledge is power. Cholesterol is easy to control even naturally. Risk to Reward ratio. the better informed you are the better decision you can make.



Absolutely correct! Orals have higher damage capacity to your liver. Which is why the pro's do injections. I still doubt it takes away all the damage capability though.
11/29/08 8:56 PM
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Buffbetty
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wyojkd - Dan Duchaine on that list just proves how inacurate it is. Dan Duchane was a guro when it comes to AAS among other drug for bodybuilding.
Examiners established Duchaine died Jan 12, 2000, aged 47, due to kidney failure caused by hereditary polycystic kidney disease.
Please note the bold italics, hereditary.............


That list was obtained from anabolics mall
11/29/08 8:59 PM
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Shiloh
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"It is the side affects of the damn anabolics that is causing these health issues that lead to death! Don't you get what I am saying? It's not due to an overdose of a steroid to cause immediate death, it is abuse of steroids and it cause damage...which in a lot of cases, eventually cause death. If they didn't do the roids wrong, maybe it would be a different story."

so now its maybe. gotcha. and not only that, its maybe if they didnt do them wrong, implying if they did them responsibly its ok.

maybe you should just change your statement to "steroids, if abused, can damage your body". how about that?

:)
11/29/08 9:00 PM
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Shiloh
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duchaine was basically the man. that guy was a smart fuck.

he also died of a hereditary problem, not steroids. not even close.
11/29/08 9:01 PM
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wyojkd
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 Mike Mentzer - Mentzer began using amphetamines to improve performance and deal with a hectic lifestyle . Possible contributer, amphetaminse screw with the heart also.

Ray Mentzer - Ray also died in his sleep after complications from his long battle with Berger's disease.

I dont care where the list is from it has weak relationships to it.
11/29/08 9:02 PM
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Lynn Marie
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Jason, are you blaming steroids for you not knowing the difference between "your" and you're"? Are steroids why you unnecessarily capitalize random words? If so, I'm also for random testing.
11/29/08 9:03 PM
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Buffbetty
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Edited: 11/29/08 9:06 PM
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Shiloh - "It is the side affects of the damn anabolics that is causing these health issues that lead to death! Don't you get what I am saying? It's not due to an overdose of a steroid to cause immediate death, it is abuse of steroids and it cause damage...which in a lot of cases, eventually cause death. If they didn't do the roids wrong, maybe it would be a different story."

so now its maybe. gotcha. and not only that, its maybe if they didnt do them wrong, implying if they did them responsibly its ok.

maybe you should just change your statement to "steroids, if abused, can damage your body". how about that?

:)


I already said they should be regulated and they come with a warning. Go back a few pages... Maybe it would be different for them if they had done it under supervision...I didn't say no one should do them. I am saying that they are dangerous and there are side affects, etc. It should be regulated and it isn't fair for one opponent to be juiced and the other not.
11/29/08 9:04 PM
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Shiloh
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LOL@that fucking list

i could go through and tear that up. jesus. fucking benaziza and munzer didnt die from steroids at ALL. not even close. dennis newman was my roomate right before he got leukemia. he had very expensice specialists working on him, NOT ONE said it was from steroids. he was predisposed to it and it got accellerated possibly from HGH. his own doctors PUT HIM ON STEROIDS as part of his recovery.

im out of here, this is too easy.
11/29/08 9:04 PM
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Buffbetty
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Edited: 11/29/08 9:04 PM
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Buffbetty -
Shiloh - "It is the side affects of the damn anabolics that is causing these health issues that lead to death! Don't you get what I am saying? It's not due to an overdose of a steroid to cause immediate death, it is abuse of steroids and it cause damage...which in a lot of cases, eventually cause death. If they didn't do the roids wrong, maybe it would be a different story."

so now its maybe. gotcha. and not only that, its maybe if they didnt do them wrong, implying if they did them responsibly its ok.

maybe you should just change your statement to "steroids, if abused, can damage your body". how about that?

:)


I already said they should be regulated and they come with a warning. Go back a few pages... Maybe it would be different for them if they had done it under supervision...I didn't say no one should do them. I am saying that they are dangerous and there are side affects, etc. It should be regulated and it isn't fair for one opponent to be juiced and the other not.
11/29/08 9:09 PM
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Buffbetty
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Edited: 11/29/08 9:09 PM
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It's just amazing to me all the reasons for denial in this thread. I know what I have seen, I know what people I know have gone through, the damage that ABUSING steroids has done. It needs to be regulated. And yes, as I stated prior, steroids are helpful in a doctors care.

Good luck to you Jason.
11/29/08 9:13 PM
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Shiloh
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its amazing to me people will just talk out their ass.

again, if you cant be honest to make your point, have you really made one?
11/29/08 9:15 PM
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wyojkd
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I dont like regulated as the term, specialized doctor supervision would be better. I associate Goverment with the term regulate and Uncle Sam cant regulate its ass out of wet toilet paper without scewing it up. I think if a guy wants to AAS and whatever he does it for is not breaking the rules. He should be under the supervision of a doctor that knows the science of it.

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