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S&C UnderGround >> Vertical Jump Training


2/11/09 7:20 AM
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Leigh
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^what? do you mean running long jump?
2/11/09 8:34 PM
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ClayM
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614 - Or maybe you naturally have fast twitch muscle.


That is probably an accurate statement. But talent without training is just wasted talent. As with anything put forth effort and you will see results.


Koing--What is Rob's last name and when did he compete. The canadian guys were always awesome and great to be around. There is no shortage of beast on the canadian team.

Devin-Keep it up and focus on tech. You will probably notice a change in body composition as well
2/12/09 7:01 AM
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HeangKoing
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Leigh - ^what? do you mean running long jump?


50/50 touching a 10ft bball rim with a running jump. I'm more consistent with a standing two footed jump.

ClayM -
614 - Or maybe you naturally have fast twitch muscle.


That is probably an accurate statement. But talent without training is just wasted talent. As with anything put forth effort and you will see results.


Koing--What is Rob's last name and when did he compete. The canadian guys were always awesome and great to be around. There is no shortage of beast on the canadian team.

Devin-Keep it up and focus on tech. You will probably notice a change in body composition as well


He has been competiting in the past few years in Bobsleigh and Oly for at least 8yrs now? HIs name is Robert Gray but the stupid link won't load up :(
http://www.google.co.uk/url?q=http://www.bobsleigh.ca/AthleteBio.aspx%3FBiosID%3DuZetc0Jecpg%3D&ei=TQ-USaCIDtm0jAfLjcycCw&sa=X&oi=spellmeleon_result&resnum=1&ct=result&cd=1&usg=AFQjCNGBZ-MAth_P7lJps39KifBgpo2JBQ

Koing
2/12/09 8:47 AM
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ClayM
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The name is familiar, I think he slides with Lyon right now and if that is the case Lacelles Brown is on his team as well. Just by association I am gonna assume your friend is a beast. I may have met him my last season 2003.

On a side note I have never been to Whistler but I hear the party there for the games will be awesome
2/12/09 10:38 AM
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Leigh
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Edited: 02/12/09 10:38 AM
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HeangKoing - 50/50 touching a 10ft bball rim with a running jump. I'm more consistent with a standing two footed jump.


i'm not a jump expert but when i was younger i noticed that a run up made very little difference to the height of my jump. if you look at high jumpers, they don't run fast and i think its only to get forwards momentum to get over the bar, rather than height

as for consistency - practice
2/13/09 12:18 PM
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HeangKoing
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ClayM,yeah that dudes an animal man.

http://www.bobsleigh.ca/BobsleighNationalTeamAthletes.aspx

The websites working now.
Leigh - 
HeangKoing - 50/50 touching a 10ft bball rim with a running jump. I'm more consistent with a standing two footed jump.


i'm not a jump expert but when i was younger i noticed that a run up made very little difference to the height of my jump. if you look at high jumpers, they don't run fast and i think its only to get forwards momentum to get over the bar, rather than height

as for consistency - practice


Most people will have a higher vertical with a running jump. It's easier to convert lateral to horizontal movement then a static vertical jump. My issue is the lack of practice of running and jumping. I do my Olifts two footed and I haven't played bball in years.

It's not the speed of the run, just that most people will jump higher with a run up. Mines poor through lack of practice, but it isn't my thing :P

You were probably the same me then. Not very efficient with a running jump.

Koing
2/16/09 4:38 AM
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Leigh
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Wiggy - Vertical Jump Training Bible.

By Kelly Baggett - one of the best (and, IMO, most under-rated) guys in the game. You simply can't go wrong w/any of his stuff. Tell him Wiggy sent you. ;-)

Wiggy - www.workingclassfitness.com


on his site, there is a vertical jump calculator, which he says is "quite accurate and reliable". it calculates your vert based on bodyweight and squat

however, i think this is a bit hokey. whilst i believe you can double your squat with training, i don't think you can double your vertical jump. strength is something you can increase greatly, but i don't believe explosiveness is. not saying you can't work on it, but i don't think there is the same room for improvement as there is with strength, fitness and flexibility

and tbh, most of the great jumpers look like pretty shitty squatters. so whilst squat training may be good for improving your vert, i don't think the numbers are related
2/17/09 6:43 AM
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HeangKoing
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Leigh, agreed.

In the end it's just a calculator and not 100% accurate for everyone, but probably accurate for most people.

For me:
Oly squat: 396 : most people's Oly squat is not a really deep oly squat
bw: 194lbs : evening weight with shoes Oly shoes on. I may jump higher in the morning say on the morning of an Oly comp, cutting, good weight, rested
vertical: 34.25" ~ 86.99cm

My vertical is ~ 75cm

High catch power snatch ? WTF?! :P 180 : I've PS 95kg but 'high catch' not sure so I put down 180, that would definately be high as it's not that heavy.
bw 194
vert: 36.19

My vert is definately not 36.19"

It's a guideline for people. I somewhat know the dude that wrote the calculator alsoo. CoolColJ. He's on youtube.

Koing
2/17/09 9:50 AM
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Leigh
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my bw is about 155 at the moment. maybe a bit less, but lets be pessimistic. not sure of my squat, right now i KNOW i could do 350lbs. done over 450lbs in the past, so again, its conservative

calculator says 37.87" but my vert is barely 24". it has NEVER been over 3ft, or really any more than it is now, no matter how light i was or how much i could squat. and tbh, my 24" vert, which seems poor compared to many people online, is more than any one else i train with

i'm currently doing the 6 week explosive lower body workout on joel's site, so hoping to add a bit
2/18/09 5:47 AM
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HeangKoing
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Leigh you should definately be able to jump higher with such a big squat. Thats well over 2x on the very conservative side.

Hows your sprint like?

The power training should definately help your vertical mate.

Koing
2/18/09 8:17 AM
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Dogmeat 1
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Leigh, were you squatting Olympic style or using a wide stance powerlifter style? and was it raw or with gear? The guy who came up with the formula posts a bit on T-nation and has stated that the formula is only intended for deep Olympic style squats and wide stance squats and/or gear throw the formula off a lot.

The calculator is intended to show you relatively where your vertical should be and what you should be focusing on. If your vertical is lower then you need to work on technique and explosiveness, if it's higher then bringing up your squat will help. In addition height also plays a part. Shorter guys need relatively higher squats while taller guys can get away with lower ones.
2/18/09 8:33 AM
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Leigh
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HeangKoing, i haven't sprinted for ages, its probably pretty poor. but i used to be quick and would compete for my town in triple jump and pole fault. occasionally had a go at 100m and long jump but couldn't really cut it with the taller, quicker guys. i think the plyos would be more beneficial

Dogmeat 1, the 450 was with powerlifting gear and below parallel but not olympic style. I can do 350 raw and low pretty comfortably

the calcultor says that for my weight and VJ, i should be able to squat 222lbs. i'll rep that on the bench. i could squat down with that, duck walk around and then pop back up, probably getting some air. actually, thinking about that, it might be a bit of an exaggeration, but you get my point

i simply don't think squat performance is related to vertical jump performance, or powerlifters would hold world records in high jump, rather than the skinny guys who do. i agree that SOME strength is required, but after a certain point, it becomes irrelevent
2/18/09 12:40 PM
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antoniomontana
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I noticed Benedikt Magnusson seems to jump very high for such a big guy. This is in celebration after he deadlifts over 1000lbs
2/18/09 5:18 PM
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jeremy hamilton
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^^^^^^^^ I was just going to say that. Although it was not 1000, it was around 970 or so.
2/18/09 5:32 PM
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antoniomontana
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He has done 1100 now mate. Its on youtube. The vid on youtube actually doesn't give a good view of his jump. I seen it on eurosport, and was nearly as impressed by his vertical as the lift!
2/18/09 5:50 PM
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ClayM
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Leigh- Olympic style squating does correlate to vert. That is actually how they determine who should be a weighlifter in China. Check out Marc "the Kangaroo" Huster. From my own experience my vert was at its highest when I was Oly lifting only and I was about 270. Check out youtube for the football player jumping out of a pool in 3 feet of water. My lifting friends and I used to do that(albeit on bets normally).

I agree powerlifting does not since the movement is much slower.
2/18/09 6:06 PM
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jeremy hamilton
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antoniomontana - He has done 1100 now mate. Its on youtube. The vid on youtube actually doesn't give a good view of his jump. I seen it on eurosport, and was nearly as impressed by his vertical as the lift!


That was the hummer tire deadlift, not a powerlifting comp deadlift. Sorry, I just assumed thats what you meant. Nobody has pulled 1100 in comp, not even close.
2/19/09 1:01 AM
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DevinS
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My understanding is there's a very high correlation between jumping height and squatting ability, although its just as important to be able to do the movement fast, not just strong. if Leigh is squatting that much at his bodyweight and only has a 24'' vertical, then his plyometric abilities must need some serious work, at least by that logic.
2/19/09 3:50 AM
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Leigh
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ok, well i'm in week 3 of the workout, so we'll see if i meet my potential by the end of it. but somehow, i don't think i'll suddenly double my vertical
2/22/09 8:19 AM
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antoniomontana
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jeremy hamilton - antoniomontana - He has done 1100 now mate. Its on youtube. The vid on youtube actually doesn't give a good view of his jump. I seen it on eurosport, and was nearly as impressed by his vertical as the lift!"

That was the hummer tire deadlift, not a powerlifting comp deadlift. Sorry, I just assumed thats what you meant. Nobody has pulled 1100 in comp, not even close."



Is it the bar that makes the tire deadlift easier?
2/22/09 10:41 AM
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jeremy hamilton
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Its about 5 inches high of a regular deadlift. Also, the bar is longer and gets a ton of bend before the weight actually leaves the ground. He is also wearing straps for the lift. IMO his 970 is more impressive.
3/11/13 1:57 PM
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DeuceDroppin
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TTT to read from phone
3/11/13 4:16 PM
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Taku
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As in most things, there are two main compnents to improve your jumping ability.

1. Get as strong as possible.

2. Practice the exact type of jumping you want to be better at. If you want to jump on boxes, then practice jumping on boxes. If you want to dunk, practice dunking.

I often use jump testing (along with other measures) when testing my athletes. I have had a great deal of success increasing the vertical, and horizontal jump(s) of my athletes while doing no specific pliometrics etc. Just safe, efficient strength training. 

TAKU

P.S. I know nothing about Kelly B. other than Wiggy thinks very highly of him. However, the fact that He (Kelly) can jump high is totally irrelevent to how well his training recommendations may impact others.

3/12/13 6:45 AM
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LiftStrong
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Right on Taku.

Getting strong and perfecting your technique go a long way. I can usually get an extra 1-2" out of someones vertical the first time I work with them just by cleaning up their movement pattern.

I do however like using plyo's with more advanced guys. Even if I just throw in a few sets of box jumps to get primed up before a heavy lower body session.
3/12/13 10:25 AM
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Taku
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Hey L.S.,

Agreed, not saying a I never use them (plio's), just that they are not always required for success.

TAKU


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