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Cigars, Beer & Poker Ground >> When do you leave the table?

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10/6/09 7:13 PM
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WrestlingSucks
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I left the casino last night after going up and down for a couple of hours and then finally got to a point where I realized that the table was becoming more of a roll the dice with any two cards table.

I took advantage of that and got up three hundred bucks and cashed out.

Would most of you stay, knowing that you're going into most hands with the best hand or would you just get up a little and leave like I did?

Im building a bankroll right now so I didnt want to stay because the hands were getting insane. It was a 1-2 no limit table and I didnt want to get caught in a huge hand and get drawn out on.

It was a dream table for players with a bankroll but I'm not quite there yet. If you raised 20 dollars preflop, you were getting two or three callers every single time.
10/7/09 1:27 AM
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andre
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I leave based on one of three things:

1) The table is too tight. While I can steal the blinds and be profitable against these types of players, it makes for a slow and boring game. I would much rather play against loose and aggressive players.

2) I'm not playing my best and I cant seem to correct it. Sometimes I sit down and feel a bit too casual for the game. I find myself chasing things down and hoping to suck out on a big pot. These days usually happen when Ive had two or three big winning days in a row. I feel invincible. Reality usually smacks me in the face, I leave, and come back later or the next day with a better attitude.

3) My wife calls.
10/11/09 3:44 AM
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BuakawPorFavor
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My grinding today had an abrupt halt because I went with a buddy who played a little too aggressively with his betting and got knocked out on a brutal river. He recognized that he was fully on tilt and sat and watched.

I just won a few hands, got up a couple of hundred bucks and just left so he wouldnt get the urge to keep playing because I was.

I'm consistently leaving up two and three hundred bucks but its taking a good four or five hours before I start really getting any money. I guess I figure that if it was an hourly wage, I would be doing pretty well at the moment.

Its not big money or anything but Ive been really good at keeping pots reasonable so brutal suckouts dont bother me nearly as bad and also it has made it that players are assuming I am so conservative they can bluff me out with all-ins, which is how I am making my money.

Playing good lately, hitting the casino tomorrow to see if I can keep the trend going
10/11/09 6:06 AM
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Ze Dano
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not soon enough tonight apparently...

playing 1/2 NL...up 650 then the table breaks...

get re-seated...dealt A-10 suited (hearts) on the button...UTG raises to 16 bucks..I call

flop is Qh Kh,Js...check to me...bet out 40...get called..

turn is blank..bet out 100...get called...

river is Kh...giving me A high flush..buddy goes all in for about 140 more..I call...he shows pocket K's

ouch.

stuck around for a little while longer and watched my 650 dwindle down to 305.

yes..I can be a donkey at times

sorry for the bad beat story...I should have walked
10/11/09 6:10 AM
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PR
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WrestlingSucks - I realized that the table was becoming more of a roll the dice with any two cards table.


I took advantage of that



Those two statements do not jive sir. At least 1 of those statements can not be true.
10/11/09 6:14 AM
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PR
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I quit when:

1) life gets in the way, I have something non-poker related to do

2) I dont feel like playing

3) the tables are shitty

My second biggest leak in my game is not quitting when playing against good players. It has cost me a lot of money. A LOT. In fact I checked my online stats for the year... I am down -25k in high stakes matches against other pros. Boy seeing those numbers right there in front of me gave me a huge wake-up call. I mean 25k, that's a year's salary for many people.
10/11/09 10:35 AM
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TitoIsBACK
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PR - I quit when:

1) life gets in the way, I have something non-poker related to do

2) I dont feel like playing

3) the tables are shitty

My second biggest leak in my game is not quitting when playing against good players. It has cost me a lot of money. A LOT. In fact I checked my online stats for the year... I am down -25k in high stakes matches against other pros. Boy seeing those numbers right there in front of me gave me a huge wake-up call. I mean 25k, that's a year's salary for many people.



This should make you realize that you are not a good poker player.
10/12/09 12:35 AM
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Ze Dano
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TitoIsBACK - 
PR - I quit when:

1) life gets in the way, I have something non-poker related to do

2) I dont feel like playing

3) the tables are shitty

My second biggest leak in my game is not quitting when playing against good players. It has cost me a lot of money. A LOT. In fact I checked my online stats for the year... I am down -25k in high stakes matches against other pros. Boy seeing those numbers right there in front of me gave me a huge wake-up call. I mean 25k, that's a year's salary for many people.



This should make you realize that you are not a good poker player.



Uh TitoIsBack, maybe you should think before you post. PR (as far as I know) is a professional poker player, and is also very helpful with advice on here, thus making him a pretty cool guy.

He says he is down in high stakes matches against other pros. Maybe he is up 100K in lo/mid games against people like you. Ever thought of that??
10/12/09 4:00 AM
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WrestlingSucks
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PR, I think what I was trying to say is that I was getting called with players with a range so wide that I knew my pocket pair was usually the best hand going into the flop and that if I improved with a draw I was usually crushing the Q-5 guy who called UTG trying to see a flop.

I took advantage by playing tight poker and kept pots small to protect my shitty bank roll but studied the players enough to make the right calls when they tried to bet me off of hands.

I am in no way saying I'm a poker guru. Just saying that thus far in casino games (with my bankroll) this has been the most effective situation for me.

Do you feel like I should be playing more aggressively with premium hands to increase my winnings? I know its a smarter move in the long run but without a big bankroll, I can't afford to get sucked out on too many times if I build pots too far up.

In 1-2 NL, I usually raise it in the range of 6-12 dollars preflop with premium hands. Ive found so far that I'll get out the lesser hands and the guys that do call are the same guys that will make the same call when someone raises it to 20 dollars preflop.
10/12/09 8:44 AM
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TitoIsBACK
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Ze Dano - 
TitoIsBACK - 
PR - I quit when:

1) life gets in the way, I have something non-poker related to do

2) I dont feel like playing

3) the tables are shitty

My second biggest leak in my game is not quitting when playing against good players. It has cost me a lot of money. A LOT. In fact I checked my online stats for the year... I am down -25k in high stakes matches against other pros. Boy seeing those numbers right there in front of me gave me a huge wake-up call. I mean 25k, that's a year's salary for many people.



This should make you realize that you are not a good poker player.



Uh TitoIsBack, maybe you should think before you post. PR (as far as I know) is a professional poker player, and is also very helpful with advice on here, thus making him a pretty cool guy.

He says he is down in high stakes matches against other pros. Maybe he is up 100K in lo/mid games against people like you. Ever thought of that??



Doubtful seeing as I'm a professional poker player myself.
10/12/09 2:24 PM
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slam1523
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you shouldn't be playing poker with a small bank roll. if you do, just play the nuts; you won't hurt yourself and you may make some money. pretty simple.
10/12/09 10:05 PM
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PR
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WrestlingSucks - In 1-2 NL, I usually raise it in the range of 6-12 dollars preflop with premium hands. Ive found so far that I'll get out the lesser hands and the guys that do call are the same guys that will make the same call when someone raises it to 20 dollars preflop.


So why not raise to $20 pre-flop then? Or to whatever is the highest amount that the fish at the table will still likely call.

As for the rest of your post (which I deleted), sounds like you've got the right things going... yeah you gotta protect your small bankroll. But you are leaving money on the table to do it though. Thats why a proper large bankroll can make you more money.
10/12/09 10:06 PM
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PR
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TitoIsBACK - 
PR - I quit when:

1) life gets in the way, I have something non-poker related to do

2) I dont feel like playing

3) the tables are shitty

My second biggest leak in my game is not quitting when playing against good players. It has cost me a lot of money. A LOT. In fact I checked my online stats for the year... I am down -25k in high stakes matches against other pros. Boy seeing those numbers right there in front of me gave me a huge wake-up call. I mean 25k, that's a year's salary for many people.



This should make you realize that you are not a good poker player.



Thanks for the tip!
10/12/09 10:44 PM
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WrestlingSucks
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Yeah, I realize I "shouldn't" be playing without a bankroll but its not like I'm playing with rent money either. I'm just starting very small and trying to build it through poker and adding money here and there myself.

Going to the casino and losing my buyin right now would be a situation where I'd likely be going home rather than rebuying with my minimal bankroll but it doesn't make it a ramen noodle week either.

I'm getting better at reading my situations and at the moment I haven't been at the casino enough to be recognized for any particular style of play by regulars so I think I can still play and be effective with a smaller bankroll for now and hopefully in a month or so it will be in the 1500 dollar range and I can start building pots more with premium hands as PR suggested.
10/13/09 2:31 AM
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WrestlingSucks
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Also, I don't raise to 20 dollars with the premium hands because it usually puts me to a decision for all my chips post flop on that hand if I get two callers. If I raise with QQ, raise it up to $20 bucks, get two callers, there is probably about 65-70 dollars in the pot. If the flop shows an ace, flush, or king and somebody pushes I'm fucked and can't even afford to find out if I'm good.

I'd raise to 20 dollars with AA or KK but I kind of think people would notice my sudden aggression preflop and think the better of calling. I'd think even the weakest players would notice that.
10/13/09 3:34 AM
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PR
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Dont fall into the trap of giving bad players too much credit for making correct plays and good reads.

You should be creating situations where bad players can make huge mistakes. Thats how you maximise profits.
10/13/09 12:37 PM
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slam1523
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WrestlingSucks -
I'd raise to 20 dollars with AA or KK but I kind of think people would notice my sudden aggression preflop and think the better of calling. I'd think even the weakest players would notice that.


Nah. Even with the tightest image, you'll probably get someone to play with you. There are players whose sole purpose is to crack other people.

Anyway, you cannot risk losing your buy-in. By playing AA or KK relatively light, you are contradicting your main strategy. Strategy over tactics. Always.
10/15/09 10:58 AM
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billid
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 Raising the maximum the fish will call at the table takes a lot of discipline and the rare ability to put your ego to the side while playing.   You're going to create big pots where you have to fold but remember you're now playing with bigger pots so when you win they are big too.

I play 50NL regularly and some 100NL as I transition up.  Online it causes a lot of headaches for others at the table because they just cannot handle somebody raising 6-10bb(depending on what they'll call) preflop instead of 3.5 or pot regularly.  I cannot say I continued to play like this because after a couple days of success I had a bad run of cards and found myself trying to bluff rather than fold with big pots, I had issues with creating a big pot then just letting go so many times over and over when being played into.

I don't know how this would work live but I know it has instant results (good or bad) online because of what people are so used to online. You stick out like a sore thumb and you you'll be trading stacks more often... raising even 7bb preflop can easily put you all in on the river without a reraise while betting 3/4 pot flop, 3/4 pot turn, 1/2 pot river.  10bb you're only left with about 40bb to bet on the river. 

It changes the dynamics of the game quite a bit and you'll be second guessing your reads that would be easy to stick with while playing your regular game but it always helps to change it up once in a while and test what else is out there to create the best game that works for you. 

I have moves I make regularly in my game today that I would have never done 6 months ago, so it is healthy to try new things here and there to expand your arsenal.
10/18/09 3:17 AM
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DaveFu
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When I am playing a game that I can't beat, or I am making mistakes that are costing me money. Or when I start chasing with one pair. That is probably my most obvious red flag.

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