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Scott Sonnon >> IOUF progression


1/12/02 10:11 AM
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tysaw
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Edited: 12-Jan-02
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Hi Scott! It has been real slow here lately. I thought I'd ask a couple of questions to get things going. First, is there a priority you keep in mind when attempting throws? What I mean by this is that there are MANY concepts covered in IOUF, is there a hiarchy of strategies that should be accomplished? What needs to be done, in what order? Hope that makes sense. Second, do you start to learn and apply IOUF oriented throwing from a base of "no technique" or do you use some common established throws (tai otoshi, for e.g.) to learn the concepts from BEFORE venturing on to spontaneous innovations? As I have said in the past, the IOUF series has helped me tremendously in being able to learn sweeps, etc. from the ground. I am having trouble throwing from standing positions still, though. I find that the action changes faster than I can mentally keep up. I know a lot of that is because I need HUNDREDS of hours on the mat doing stand up, but while I am fixed on 1 or 2 tasks (obtaining center or keeping up with their triangular point shifting for e.g.) I lose the moment. Any thoughts or suggestions? Thanks. Bruce
1/12/02 10:19 AM
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Crow1981
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Edited: 12-Jan-02
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It's really strange. Believe it or not, I was just thinking about the same points Bruce made about IOUF. And he's right. It is a bit too quiet and slow here. Where's everyone gone? Hmm..... I'll give my lousy opinion on this one. When it comes to priority on which strategy to use, I think it depends on the theatre of conflict. Like say for example, if it's Military CQC, it's different than Civilian Self Defence. I think for Military CQC, the goal is to incapicitate assalaints with the intent to stop them from fighting, wheares in civilian self defense, only nessecary force can be used, taking into account legal considerations. So for BJJ, prioritize the concepts according to the goal...I think. Anyone disagree or agree??? Just my opinion.
1/12/02 12:04 PM
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Crow1981
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Edited: 12-Jan-02
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Bruce, I think the reason why you lose the moment is because you haven't internalised the principles or something similar. It's very hard to explain. Ok, this is just my OPINION again, so I apologise if anything I write conflicts with ROSS approach. First, limit the variables you're working on. Understand the concepts, principles, biomechanics, strategies etc. In this period, before sparring/grappling, train for attribute development. Move slowly first, flowing. This way you can apply the concepts easily. Limit the variables available. Relax. When throwing, exhale. Don't think which throw to apply. instead work with what your partner gives you. When your partner attempts to throw you slowly, you can adjust yourself to counter his move by using the appropiate concepts.Improvise your counter move. This is still when working slowly. You can develop better feel this way. After working a while, add more variables. For example, before only work on body throws, excluding sweeps tec. Now add something else, eg sweeps. This way, you would have gotten better at body throws, so when adding something else, it'll be easier. But before including the sweeps, you need to to develop them in the same way as discussed with the body throws. Having read what I've written, I don't think it makes much sense. I'm not Scott. Sorry Bruce. Just wait for others and Scott's inputs. Good luck
1/12/02 12:18 PM
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Crow1981
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Edited: 12-Jan-02
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Oh yeah, it's all about progression. Understanding the concepts is not enough. You need the attributes to apply the concepts easier. In a lot of schools I've seen , after learning a few techniques, the students usually then do full sparring. They leave the attribute development to chance. They may learn something, but it's almost left to chance. Students feel frustrated afterwards. Instead start simple first then progress to more complex drills until eventually the principles have internalised and the attributes have developed further. Then you can have access to your skills when needed, innovating and improvising better. Communicating through the written medium is quite difficult for me. I hope you understand what I'm trying to say. Damn, I wish I could be articulate *frustration*.
1/12/02 2:42 PM
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tysaw
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WOW! Thanks Scott, NKU, and Crow. As usual, the discussion hit me in the head like a brick. Many "doh" moments in there, as I have experienced some of what you have said. With all the bjj emphasis, especially as it was presented to me early on in my training, stand up skills were de-emphasized. It is a significant gap in my game and I am trying to correct that now. As such, I find that I get eaisly frustrated at my inability to do takedowns and throws in the sport realm. Mentally, I dread working on them because I know that frankly I suck at them! You all have given me much to digest and work on, thanks so much. Scott, I didn't realize you could order the audio performance tape separately, is that the case? I will check the ROSS site for details. Thanks again, I will keep you posted on my progress. If my training goes well, I am going to attempt to compete in the Pan Ams this year. I'll let you know how that goes.
1/12/02 6:23 PM
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tysaw
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Thank you Scott. I will get the performance tape! Thanks for your advice and support, I really appreciate it.
1/14/02 4:04 AM
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Crow1981
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Edited: 14-Jan-02
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*clap, clap* Great to have you back Scott! I mostly post to Otherground threads because they're really easy. But I'm starting to really like posting to this and other Q&As. It makes a really big change.
1/17/02 8:15 AM
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paw
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Edited: 17-Jan-02
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All, Thanks for the honesty in asking and sharing. This is definately one thread I'll be rereading from time to time. With that in mind, I'd like to ask that the thread be archived. Warm Regards, Paul

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