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HolyGround >> Need advice re: a friend


12/16/10 7:39 PM
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HELWIG
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 This has been bothering the shit out of me for a while. And its now coming to a head and things wont be the same.

Basically I have two friends. A and B.

A decided he needed to date B's younger sister. For some reason B was fine with this, even though the other friends were against it.

They broke up and one of the sister's friends began throwing herself at B. So an affair began. I dont mean like a relationship, just meeting for no strings attached sex at a set time and place. This woman is 10 years older than my friends and has already been divorced and has a kid.

B then broke it off and the woman started throwing herself at A. A pretended to refuse and then slowly relented. Now A was having an affair with her. B's sister is rightfully appalled that a friend of hers would do this. She breaks off contact and is disgusted with both her brother and her ex.

A then finds out about the previous affair B had had with the woman and flips out. Yet decides to continue seeing her anyway. I attempted to talk sense to him as a genuinely concerned friend. I explained what a horrendous foundation for a relationship this was and how he was being manipulated. He insisted he knew what he was doing.

A year later he comes to me(who was kept up to date all along on these events by both A and B) and tells me he's marrying her. And is invited everyone, including B to the wedding.

Im really at a loss.

I have no interest in participating in this. To this day Ive purposely never met this woman. I dont at all like her behavior of serially throwing herself at the men around B's sister.

Really dont see me going there and pretending to have a good time when Im upset and concerned for my friend's long term well being. And of course I know he'll be deeply hurt by me not going.

Despite my total disgust with this, I want the best for him and hope this all somehow works out. I dont see how, but I hope it does.

Could really use some solid advice/perspective from some of the older members here.



12/17/10 12:16 AM
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Ridgeback
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 In this situation you will never win so you just have to ride it out and watch your friend be an idiot.  
12/17/10 11:24 AM
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jimmy23
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 Be there, wish them well, leave it in gods hands. It is anyway,  and life is easier for us when we recognize that and dont fight it

As disgusted as you are by this womans behavior, it isnt about you, or your feelings. It is about a good friend getting married and wanting you to at least make an appearance.

You dont have to pretend to have a good time. Just show up, and be polite. 

You will be glad that you did later. 
12/17/10 11:51 AM
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HELWIG
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 "You dont have to pretend to have a good time. Just show up, and be polite. 

You will be glad that you did later. "

This is exactly what Im grappling with. Ive literally NEVER met her, by design. He and she both know this. Yet Im invited to the wedding. It would be BEYOND awkward to go and have to stew in my own juices for hours with people I dont even know(most of our other friends are just sending money as they are equally disgusted with the turn of events)

Im honestly dissapointed in myself for having over a year to nip this shit in the bud and being unable to persuade him of how poor an idea this all is. I was downright FRIGHTENED by the look on his face when he attemtped to rationalize the behavior by saying "B SEDUCED HER when she was feeling bad after her divorce"

Im not trying to run anybody's life here but you really cant tell your friends about how some older woman is throwing it at you and then be like "oh now shes my gf" followed by "we're getting married" without expecting some reactions.

Whole situation just sucks. Why do people do shit like this?


12/17/10 7:19 PM
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jimmy23
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 "Im honestly dissapointed in myself for having over a year to nip this shit in the bud and being unable to persuade him of how poor an idea this all is"

man , let that go. He is a grown man and has to follow his own path, mistakes and all.  Sometimes we have to make really bad mistakes to learn life lessons


You are helpless to change his behavior, however much you care for him and can see how he seems to be making a huge mistake.

back to basics, the serenity prayer is appropriate here

"Whole situation just sucks. Why do people do shit like this?"

thats a good question. Excitement, co dependent behaviors, emotional hostage taking, there could be a myriad of reasons. Sometimes, the combination of two particular personalities  just ignite the sickness in each other

is there any way you can go (maybe with a friend who feels like you do) and just be there for a half hour or so? Make an appearance, watch them exchange the vows, then leave?


seriously, try to step back a bit  and not let yourself get so angry - you arent the one who will suffer whatever consequences there are. Again, it isnt about you. It is about your friend, him getting married, and wanting you to be there. 

it will cost you an hour or two of being uncomfortable (which is a wonderful spiritual exercise in itself) if you go, and he will remember for a lifetime that you were there.

Or if you werent.











12/19/10 12:14 PM
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zealot66
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Ridgeback -  In this situation you will never win so you just have to ride it out and watch your friend be an idiot.  

 this
1/4/11 9:39 AM
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CJJScout
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I generally don't got to weddings that I don't approve of unless there is going to be great food.

I kick and scream and pout and generally act like a two year old til my wife doesn't want to fight with me about it any more.

Not the most mature thing, but seems to work for me.

I hate weddings, that's why we eloped.
1/4/11 12:23 PM
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HELWIG
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 I actually love weddings, and have several coming up this year.

Im just genuinely troubled by what I feel is an older lady using my crew of friends as a MEAT MARKET and it working.

Its like Henry the 8th shit but without any obvious upside for the guys that I can see.

Oh and the kicker: the other friend "B" she was having an affair with will be at the wedding.


1/5/11 3:57 AM
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jimmy23
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 hopefully there will be no beheadings....
1/6/11 9:35 AM
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JudOWNED
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Send a gift.

Seriously, no joke. Don't go, for all the reasons you've listed. But don't be a jerk about it either. Politely decline and send a gift.

Also, seems like you're being awful judgmental on this gal. Maybe she just had low self esteem and was lonely. So, like lots of girls she found herself just throwing it out there, if you know what I mean. Lots of people like that, that aren't necessarily bad people, just broken ones.
1/6/11 11:53 AM
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Grakman
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 One of the hardest lessons I've had to learn is to let go of trying to control people and trying to steer them into 'what's best for them.' Once you've had your say one time and said what you think about a situation, to let go and let people do their own thing.

If you really don't want to go, you can be honest with your friend and just say 'Bro, I don't approve, I can't go.' Or for the sake of your friendship, you can make an appearance. It depends on what you think you want with to do with your friendship with A from here on out. If you don't intend to ever socialize with him and his new wife, why bother prolonging it by going to the wedding? When people get married things change and from what I'm reading it looks like your friendship with him is going to be one of them.

It may hurt but being honest is often the best way to go.

But you really need to take a step back and see if your evaluation of this event isn't being colored too much by your personal beliefs. You have to consider if this lady is lonely, maybe her and A have talked all this out and decided it's worth it to them to go forward despite their past.  Maybe they're hoping everyone can forgive and forget? Or maybe they're just crass and don't realize what they're doing but some folks are just ignorant that way.
 

1/6/11 12:00 PM
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Grakman
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 One more thing, other than your personal moral objections, is there anything else going on? Is anyone being physically abused? Do you know how they treat each other? 
1/6/11 12:23 PM
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HELWIG
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 Thanks again for the replies.

  "One more thing, other than your personal moral objections, is there anything else going on? Is anyone being physically abused? Do you know how they treat each other?"

As far as anything else going on, A and the girl occassionally hang out with B and somehow that works itself out I guess.

The sister no longer speaks with A or the girl, only with B her brother.

No physical abuse. The majority of A's friends think this is a terrible idea and arent going to the wedding, yet B who had sex with the bride numerous times will be there. And no I didnt say anything about not going to the other friends, they were like "out of the question" when the issue first arose.

Sucks because I have great relationships with just about every girlfriend and wife of my close personal friends.But its really strange to be on hand from the start of a deviant oddysey like this and have your buddy coming to you with all the details and then one day the endcap is "so yeah, it'll be a winter wedding!" 

1/6/11 3:10 PM
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Ridgeback
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 I almost never agree with my best friend's relationship choices (except his current marriage) and we have been friends for 25 years.   Some day it may be very important for him to know that you are his friend regardless of what is going on with her.  If he winds up divorced and you are still his friend that is going to mean a lot to him.
1/6/11 5:52 PM
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Grakman
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In support of what Ridge said:

One of the things about being a real friend is being a friend through thick and thin, through good choices and bad... his marriage to her isn't putting anyone's life in danger or at risk of incarceration. Other than sleeping with someone else in the same circle of friends, there are no other issues. I think in your shoes (I've been in somewhat similar) I'd reconcile and support my friend, especially if friend B doesn't have a problem with it.

I know they say a leopard never changes it's spots but I know people who've made dramatic changes in their lives, and hopefully these two can make it work.

Although the thought did just occur to me... is she pregnant? Shotgun wedding?


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