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Judo/Sambo UnderGround >> ROUSEY WINS PRO DEBUT IN 25 SECONDS


4/1/11 1:11 PM
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Judo Scott - Its just you know there are a lot of people who think a bad ass in Judo is automatically synonymous with a bad ass in BJJ.

LOL. What does that even mean? That lowly judo can't compete with bjj unless we're talking about Olympians?
4/1/11 1:17 PM
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Judo Scott
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No need to get butt hurt MGT it means exactly what I said. A bad ass in one doesn't mean you're a bad ass in the other.
4/1/11 1:27 PM
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But that's not what you're implying. You're basically saying the two aren't on equal terms...ie: a badass in bjj > a badass in judo. And we both know that's not true, because skill is skill regardless of style. I mean, look at someone like Koji Komuro, who never really amounted to much in terms of judo, yet he's still able to compete with bjjers on equal terms. And also someone like Megaton, who has done judo forever and could, at least back in the day, compete with national level judoka like Dan Camarillo.

You'd be better off simply saying bjj is more consistent in terms of skill associated with belt ranks.
4/1/11 1:37 PM
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Judo Scott
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Your reading into what I said MGT; I wasn't implying that at all.

They are different sports with a lot of cross over skills. If you don't work at the sport specific skills required you won't succeed esp at a high level. Thats all I'm saying.

You realize I picked "Judo Scott" as my moniker because I love Judo right?
4/1/11 1:50 PM
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Edited: 04/01/11 1:50 PM
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I'm not trying to twist your words, but when you make a rather specific statement like that(as opposed to referencing 'most' or 'average' examples) you're not really being honest in terms of giving judo the respect its due.

You're the same "Judo Scott" who teaches bjj and rarely does any standup for lack of training partners and fear of (re)injury, are you not? Nevertheless, I, too, love and have trained bjj alongside my judo since the beginning, therefore I tend not to make biased/blanket statements unless I'm trolling easy subforum prey. ;)
4/1/11 1:58 PM
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Judo Scott
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yep thats me. My sensei stopped teaching judo after my first year and there aren't any clubs in my area that I can fit in. So I continued at my gym and earned a purple in bjj and started teaching kids bjj. I've been doing more wrestling lately for stand up and that's a lot of fun.

At any rate what I said before is my opinion, take it or leave it. I'd say the same things and ask the same questions about a world level bjj player making the move into Olympic judo.
4/1/11 2:09 PM
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Sure, you're entitled to your opinion and are free to express it here without feeling like I or anyone else is talking down to you, or whatever catch word for undeserved ball-breaking is commonplace now. But at the same time, know that I'm entitled to respond in kind, and as such, when I hear about a 'badass' from either style I tend to imagine someone whose game is balanced in terms of standup and groundwork, giving them the opportunity to be competitive in both sports. And as examples of that abound, I think my definition of badass is a fair statement.
4/1/11 3:09 PM
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gbutts
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Edited: 04/01/11 3:19 PM
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<blockquote>Judo Scott - <blockquote>gbutts - <blockquote>Judo Scott - <blockquote>raleigh - ^^she'd absolutely destroy any division other than brown/black IMO, if shes not fighting that division I'd say don't waste the time</blockquote><br /><br />maybe maybe not.. just a few years ago Rhadi Ferguson said she was blue belt level. Jiu Jitsu and Judo are totally different sports with some cross over. We have no idea how good her guard passing is and she's definitely going to have the guard pulled on her.


Rhadi said that about ronda three or four years ago and he was probably right but i don't think he was talking about her using her throwing and matwork transitions to position and submission. there was alot of things she didn't know or understand a couple of years ago but she has the ability learn things and make the techique better. we would show her something and 15 minutes later she would make the techique cleaner. Remember she is a proffessional, this is her job and her life she doesn't just train hard for the couple months out of the year and go to some tournament. Yeah Gary I'm not downing her obviously she's a bad ass. If she's training BJJ regularly then I'm sure she'll kick ass.Its just you know there are a lot of people who think a bad ass in Judo is automatically synonymous with a bad ass in BJJ.

no offense taken it's all good i was trying to let you know that all of my people strive to be complete grapplers. we compete in very style of grappling and we win 90% of time because we train in all aspects of grappling.
4/1/11 3:27 PM
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gbutts
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btw, i'll be recording the youth judo scholastic matches i have a new cam recorder and 300 hours of cds. i will posted them tommorrow and sunday night. should be some good action these kids are trying to make the cadet world team
4/2/11 4:14 PM
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gbutts - btw, i'll be recording the youth judo scholastic matches i have a new cam recorder and 300 hours of cds. i will posted them tommorrow and sunday night. should be some good action these kids are trying to make the cadet world team

Looking forward to it.

Any chance of posting Crystal's match(es) from the pan ams, or didn't you get a chance to record them before you suffered camera casualties?

Also, I saw the highlight footage of Rousey's fight. Still looks like she needs work re: her striking and (comfort) in transitions to the clinch, but that kouchi was beautiful. And at this point I think I'm convinced she has somekind of interal magnet or something inside her that just brings people's elbows to her on a silver platter against their will. lol
4/2/11 5:15 PM
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gbutts
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Missing Glove Tape - 
gbutts - btw, i'll be recording the youth judo scholastic matches i have a new cam recorder and 300 hours of cds. i will posted them tommorrow and sunday night. should be some good action these kids are trying to make the cadet world team

Looking forward to it.

Any chance of posting Crystal's match(es) from the pan ams, or didn't you get a chance to record them before you suffered camera casualties?

Also, I saw the highlight footage of Rousey's fight. Still looks like she needs work re: her striking and (comfort) in transitions to the clinch, but that kouchi was beautiful. And at this point I think I'm convinced she has somekind of interal magnet or something inside her that just brings people's elbows to her on a silver platter against their will. lol

i only have about 25 seconds of crystal's matches from the pan ams and it only shows her passing the guard into mount,but will post it when i get home.

today's matches were terrible, i am sorry but i have to honest. the refeering was terrible they stop traingle and darce chokes, these guys had no matwork knowlegde. i going to post these matches but they are really bad and display poor techique. hopefully tommorrow's macthes will be better. erin got in a couple of chokes in and then the other girls pull out of the division, but at least this time the coaches told me they don't won't there girls to get hurt because they were only yellow belts.
4/2/11 5:54 PM
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Bummer. I would've loved to have seen the harais you mentioned. But good luck to both Crystal and Erin tomorrow!
4/2/11 7:49 PM
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judoblackbelt
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Gary butts: Sorry I missed you at the Scholastics. I worked all day Friday with the mat set-up and did the (male) weighi-ins from 11-4. Saturday I was there from 9-1 but couldn't find you. I looked all over. Had to leave and couldn't stay for Sunday when Crystal would of been fighting. I will be at the Nationals. Hope to see you then.

MGT- once judo guys x-over to BJJ they fall under the "spell" . Anyone can see Ronda is Brown/Black BJJ worthy with her technique/skills. And I have yet to see a BJJ BB x/over to judo on a world class level. There is only one guy (that I know of) in the US competing in judo that is Damian Ohare (Cranford judo)who is both a black belt in BJJ and judo. I think he is ranked #5 in 100K.
4/2/11 9:24 PM
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judoblackbelt - 

MGT- once judo guys x-over to BJJ they fall under the "spell" . Anyone can see Ronda is Brown/Black BJJ worthy with her technique/skills. And I have yet to see a BJJ BB x/over to judo on a world class level. There is only one guy (that I know of) in the US competing in judo that is Damian Ohare (Cranford judo)who is both a black belt in BJJ and judo. I think he is ranked #5 in 100K.

I certainly don't have all the answers, I just get tired of seeing bjj referred to (either directly or indirectly) as the source of all grappling knowledge, or that bjj belts(especially blackbelts) are the only belts that still mean anything in martial arts. As I said before, I love bjj and give it all the credit in the world for what it brings to the table re: teaching methods and making 'grappling' popular again. But people take things too far and forget too quickly the value and influence of other grappling styles in general, as well as their role in the formation of bjj specifically.

Regarding the crossover of athletes. I dunno, man. I don't know of (m)any world-class judoka(especially on the men's side) who'd be willing to risk their olympic dreams and/or celebrity status(athletes from other countries actually getting paid like professionals) just to compete in bjj to prove a point. Moreover, despite there being some good athletes in bjj nowadays, I don't know of (m)any competitors who have the technical/competitive depth(throws/takedowns) or willingness to sacrifice their bjj careers in favor of putting in the work necessary to pursue judo on a world-class level. I mean, *could* someone like Jacare have done 2-3x the work training and competing in both judo and bjj at a high level from an early age(like Gary's kids! lol) that would've given him a shot to a) develop a balanced, world-class game and b) pursue both mundial and world/olympic titles simulataneously? Sure. Anything's possible, especially when all one has to do is pay an entrance fee to compete in the elite level bjj competitions. But the question is really, *would* he have been willing to do it when success in bjj comes much easier than success in judo at that level? I doubt it. It's kind of like the big fish, small pond discussion we had about Kyra Gracie awhile back. The effort outweighs the reward. It'd be like a world-class judoka or wrestler trying to crossover into either sport with the hopes of achieving similar success. The depth and level of competition is just too tough for it to be a realistic goal for most people. Serving 2 masters is never a good idea.
4/2/11 10:36 PM
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judoblackbelt
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The average BJJer does not understand the committment it takes to compete at the world class judo level. The Elite BJJ athelete I think does. That is why they stick to what they are good at. The elite judo player know his/her future is tied to international competition. From Juniors up thru Seniors. So BJJ is a non event for them. With all the money and "prestige" in BJJ why change what is so successful. Gi's that look like NASCAR drivers and tatoes head to toe is a big marketing success for the sport's image. For every US kid that is a "phenom" there is another kid in Mongolia, France, Germany, Japan, Russia and its surrounding countries,Korea, Brazil, etc.etc, just as good.
4/3/11 6:56 AM
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judoblackbelt
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My ending statement above is referring to judo. Just want to be clear.
4/6/11 12:03 PM
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raleigh
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found some video, starts around 2:10

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SR7Zdz1pHj0
4/6/11 12:18 PM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDQHuJOladQ

^Same footage, minus having to fast-forward. ;)
4/6/11 7:52 PM
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judoblackbelt
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Watched the video, these opponents have no idea what they are in for especially if their skills are developed with local fighters. Ronda has it "all' to be a hugh success in MMA. Glad to see a judoka who has trained so hard have some fun and get paid. The day will come when she gets "rocked" with a punch. Her upright stance invites it. Until then this is fun for her. All the best.
4/14/11 3:56 PM
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NOEL1973
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I would Love to see Ronda Rousey fight Erin Toughill!!
4/14/11 6:48 PM
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Dominicf
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NOEL1973 - I would Love to see Ronda Rousey fight Erin Toughill!!


Ronda would win that fight.

Interestingly, in a recent interview when Ronda was asked who might be next for her, she said it's a girl who's considerably bigger than her and they'd probably fight at catchweight, but she refused to mention a name.

The first girl I thought of was Erin. But I'm probably wrong.
4/14/11 8:58 PM
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judoblackbelt
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Erin is a big girl compared to Ronda. Watched some of her fights. Good all around skills. It would a good fight for both. Is Erin still fighting?
4/15/11 11:16 PM
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gbutts
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Missing Glove Tape - WAR ROUSEY!!!
gbutts - anyway the bjj worlds is coming up and she will be there unless some big money fight comes up.

That's what I like to hear.



well ronda won't be doing the bjj worlds she has a fight june 17th (the opponent has not been name but it is not Erin toughill); however, she will be doing the july grapplersquest in vegas
4/15/11 11:53 PM
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Dominicf
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Thanks for the update.
4/16/11 8:47 AM
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judoblackbelt
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I am disappointed but understandable. The MMA stage is hers for the taking. And she does need these developmental fights that will prepare her for the big fight someday soon.

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