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UnderGround Forums >> AC responds to Elkins Vs. Omigawa decision


6/14/11 11:48 AM
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Underground News
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The Underground News, Editor
 

When Darren Elkins was given the decision over Michihiro Omigawa, the sport suffered a collective 'WTF' including, by the look on his face. No one was more publicly outraged than UFC President Dana White, who ended up paying Omigawa the win bonus, and otherwise treating him within the organization as the winner.

"It's very frustrating and it's horrible" White said. "It's just getting to the point now where when you see something that's that blatantly wrong... the hard part for me is you're affecting people's lives. It's one thing... listen; my business, you know, people get pissed off... what people are pissed off about is the fighters. How hard these guys train, how hard they work and to have somebody... we even have television monitors in front of these f------ guys now. You're watching a television monitor and you still come up with a 30-27 in these fights? You should never judge another fight as long as you live. You don't deserve to be in the fight business, you're hurting these f------ guys that are out training and working hard. It just absolutely drives me nuts."

Now Jonathan Tweedale, the Commissioner for the Vancouver Athletic Commission, speaks out on the controversial decision at UFC 131 that awarded Darren Elkins the win in his bout with Michihiro Omigawa.in an exclusive interview with SBNation.com

"In the first round, Elkins backed Omigawa up with punches the entire round. He controlled the center of the cage. He was throwing a lot more shots, and landing more -- and in combination. If there is any controversy as to the outcome of the fight it must be because of the second round.

"That was a very challenging round to score. An argument can be made in favour of either fighter. Elkins landed more punches. At one point, when Omigawa came forward, he was stopped dead in his tracks by Elkins' combination punches, and at another point he was slightly buckled.  Due to Omigawa's unusual stance and balance, it was difficult to tell exactly whether he was rocked by some of these shots. However, you could see Omigawa's leg bend, and the control shift to Elkins as he landed the combo, stopping Omigawa in his tracks, taking the center of the cage, and going on the attack again.

"These sequences, as well as the total effective strikes landed, could reasonably warrant awarding the round to Elkins. Elkins didn't land many more than Omigawa, but he did land more.  (The Fightmetric numbers agree.) As to the blood - it represents something, but a cut can be caused by a glancing blow and some fighters just cut more readily than others.

"That's a round about which reasonable people can disagree. Close rounds like Round 2 of Omigawa vs Elkins serve as useful examples for discussion, to assist in refining and evolving the community's understanding of the scoring criteria, generally. And that is a good thing for the sport."

Read entire article...


6/14/11 12:15 PM
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Chimonos Revenge
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Horrible.
6/14/11 12:16 PM
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Chimonos Revenge
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The judging is so bad that you have to wonder sometimes if we have corrupt judges making their decisions for the vegas betting lines.

Kind of like Tim Donaghy in Basketball.
6/14/11 12:26 PM
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thatdude21601
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Great head movement apparently looks like the fighter is getting rocked.
6/14/11 12:29 PM
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MMAFriedRice
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 So let's have the explanation of how one of the judges scored the 1st round to Munoz. Maia clearly won the round and I literally cannot see an explanation for that.
6/14/11 12:31 PM
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ClydeErwinBarret
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Is this his twitter? Can anyone confirm? @jdt599. Although, I had already tweeted at him.
6/14/11 12:32 PM
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Formulate Infinity
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Open mouth, insert foot Phone Post
6/14/11 12:33 PM
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Chris Power
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The fact the ACs basically can argue themselves into correctness without having to answer to anything or anybody beyond that demonstrates that they have no impetus to change anything.

Seriously, who wants to give up the freedom to be wrong at will? For what, so fans get to feel like they're actually watching a sport? Like the judges care about that, it's about keeping their jobs - and you can only do that if everybody's got everybody's back when it comes to fucking up.
6/14/11 12:45 PM
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supersonic
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Just like boxing, shitty and shady judging is unfortunatly part of the sport
6/14/11 12:45 PM
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smth416
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 Kind of ironic but Omigawa was on the winning end of two gift decisions in Japan. One was a total joke.
6/14/11 1:51 PM
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soldierdad5417
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smth416 -  Kind of ironic but Omigawa was on the winning end of two gift decisions in Japan. One was a total joke.

 This! Karma's a bitch.
6/14/11 2:07 PM
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The Samurai
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The fighters should finish the fight to get the W! We don't need judges.
6/14/11 2:56 PM
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PolishConnection
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I think I should qualify my opinion as being potentially biased, as I am a friend and teammate of Darren's. That being said, after watching the fight from cageside and then rewatching it on video I'm having trouble seeing what all the controversy is about in this fight.

ROUND 1- I think the first round was clear cut in Elkin's favor. He threw and landed more punches and pushed the action. Power shots were close in this round, but I think Elkins edged this out as well.

ROUND 2- Again Elkins was the busier fighter landing more punches and pushing the action. Omigawa scored some clean punches in this round when he did land, so I'd score power shots as about even. I scored this round close but in Elkins favor, which I told him in the corner, however watching it on video only strengthed that opinion for me.

ROUND 3- I scored this round to Omigawa both live and after rewatching on video. He scored a takedown and got off with a few good strikes from the top. I think Darren narrowly won the stand-up exchanges in the third, however not enough to steal back the round. I had the Fight 29-28 Elkins.

I think there are three reasons this fight has drawn so much critism. They're as follows:

1. Appearance- Darren's face was bruised and he also had two cuts that bled profusely. Darren's nickname is "The Damage". This is not because he inflicts damage on his opponents, but rather because a stiff breeze opens a cut on him. He cuts and swells easier than any fighter I know. This isn't something he can control and I think it is unfair to score a fight on the basis of supperficial facial damage. I'm likewise a bleeder (Eyebrows and Nose), but I don't think this should be heavily weighted in my fights.

2. Commentary- It is not uncommon for Joe Rogan to show some bias in commentary. I think commentary was as biased in this bout as I've ever seen. Many combos that Darren obviously won were met with Omigawa praise form the commentators. They focused, perhaps justifiably, on the cut and swelling and also made it very clear Joe felt Omigawa had won round two and three and maybe even one. I think Omigawa's name and reputation have carried a lot of influence on how people have interpreted this bout.

3. 30-27- Lastly I think one of the judges scoring the bout 30-27 aroused many peoples ire. I think the third round was closer than the first, but I definately scored it for Omigawa. I think almost everyone else, Darren included, gave Omigawa the nod in the final round. This doesn't change the bouts outcome, but it has become a focal point of critism.

Just my two cents,

Keith Wisniewski
6/14/11 3:04 PM
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Dawkins
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PolishConnection - I think I should qualify my opinion as being potentially biased, as I am a friend and teammate of Darren's. That being said, after watching the fight from cageside and then rewatching it on video I'm having trouble seeing what all the controversy is about in this fight.

ROUND 1- I think the first round was clear cut in Elkin's favor. He threw and landed more punches and pushed the action. Power shots were close in this round, but I think Elkins edged this out as well.

ROUND 2- Again Elkins was the busier fighter landing more punches and pushing the action. Omigawa scored some clean punches in this round when he did land, so I'd score power shots as about even. I scored this round close but in Elkins favor, which I told him in the corner, however watching it on video only strengthed that opinion for me.

ROUND 3- I scored this round to Omigawa both live and after rewatching on video. He scored a takedown and got off with a few good strikes from the top. I think Darren narrowly won the stand-up exchanges in the third, however not enough to steal back the round. I had the Fight 29-28 Elkins.

I think there are three reasons this fight has drawn so much critism. They're as follows:

1. Appearance- Darren's face was bruised and he also had two cuts that bled profusely. Darren's nickname is "The Damage". This is not because he inflicts damage on his opponents, but rather because a stiff breeze opens a cut on him. He cuts and swells easier than any fighter I know. This isn't something he can control and I think it is unfair to score a fight on the basis of supperficial facial damage. I'm likewise a bleeder (Eyebrows and Nose), but I don't think this should be heavily weighted in my fights.

2. Commentary- It is not uncommon for Joe Rogan to show some bias in commentary. I think commentary was as biased in this bout as I've ever seen. Many combos that Darren obviously won were met with Omigawa praise form the commentators. They focused, perhaps justifiably, on the cut and swelling and also made it very clear Joe felt Omigawa had won round two and three and maybe even one. I think Omigawa's name and reputation have carried a lot of influence on how people have interpreted this bout.

3. 30-27- Lastly I think one of the judges scoring the bout 30-27 aroused many peoples ire. I think the third round was closer than the first, but I definately scored it for Omigawa. I think almost everyone else, Darren included, gave Omigawa the nod in the final round. This doesn't change the bouts outcome, but it has become a focal point of critism.

Just my two cents,

Keith Wisniewski


Even his corner knew he lost the 2nd. The only round that's debatable is the first.
6/14/11 3:04 PM
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iamjohnny
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Omigawa won that fight.
6/14/11 3:19 PM
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TSGIGOR
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6/14/11 3:20 PM
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TSGIGOR
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6/14/11 3:32 PM
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Nuetraman
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Omigawa was intentionally getting with his one knee down after throwing a punch, he wasn't rocked.. Most of Elkins's punches was either hitting the arms and shoulders or totally missing the target.. fuck these judges
6/14/11 3:44 PM
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nni
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"Controlling the center of the cage" should NEVER be used as a way of determining who is winning. Winning striking and grappling exchanges should.
6/14/11 4:02 PM
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smoogy
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 Hilarious to see this commissioner try and justify the crap scorecards when Elkins himself was SHOCKED to learn he had won a decision
6/14/11 4:05 PM
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BJJkilla
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the judge that scored it 30-27 should be fired and never allowed to judge a MMA fight. omigawa was landing the better strikes while elkins kept circling.
6/14/11 9:18 PM
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thai_box84
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 Here is the website for the fight metric. Elkins clearly outstruck Omigowa in rounds 1 & 2.
hosteddb.fightmetric.com/fights/index/3411
6/14/11 9:43 PM
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Dawkins
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Not all those punches landed Thai_box
6/14/11 10:09 PM
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thai_box84
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 he was confident he won until buffer said the judges score of 30-27. Thats the only reason he thought he lost and had such a reaction to his name being called. He knew he won rd1 and knew rd2 was close, and was sure he lost rd3. Dawkins, are you saying your judgement is better than fight metric's? The way i see it, Elkins landed 35 to Omigowa's 19 in round 1, and Elkins landed 37 to Omigowa's 26 in round 2 for total strikes in those rounds
6/14/11 10:10 PM
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PolishConnection
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Edited: 06/14/11 10:10 PM
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motorboater-

When Buffer anounced the third judge scored the bout 30-27 I thought they had scored it for Omigawa as well. I was very sure at the time that Omigawa had won the third round and that was very fresh in my mind. I think Darren had the same reaction when he heard 30-27. That being said you can clearly hear me in the corner between the 1st and 2nd telling him that he won the round. Likewise, you can hear me tell him between the 2nd and 3rd that, while it was closer, that he also probably won that round. You can be sure that I don't instruct a fighter who's coner I'm working that he's up going into the third unless I truely believe it.

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