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UnderGround Forums >> This board is incredibly misinformed and ignorant.


6/28/11 6:52 PM
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CarlWinslow
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Edited: 08/04/11 3:34 AM
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www.mmamania.com/2011/8/3/2342009/ufc-quick-quote-dennis-hallman-fires-back-at-ignorant-trt-critics



^^^Dennis Hallman tells it like it is^^^^^^ learn some shit and get your fucking heads out of your asses and stop being jealous or whatever your lack of intelligence comes from.





About steroids.... Now it's illegal and it's some how a taboo subject but as with most sports it's a part of it, no matter how much denial or if your 100% for it against it or not sure etc... It's still there and always will be, but just do some google research on the subject, PLEASE!! It's not hard and will take a whole 20 minutes just to get a slight idea instead of just talking misinformed nonsense...



Most of you sound like a 80 year old man talking about marijuana... Yea you people sound like batshit crazy geriatric people talking about a subject that they hear 5th hand at a AARP meeting at the park...

Ya know those people who talk about mma as human cock fighting and it enrages you because there misinformed, 60% of you are those people about peds. Phone Post 
6/28/11 7:00 PM
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wiu81
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You should get off the juice. It's bad for your health. Phone Post
6/28/11 7:02 PM
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CarlWinslow
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wiu81 - You should get off the juice. It's bad for your health. Phone Post
I'm gonna roid rage your ass Phone Post
6/28/11 7:05 PM
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CarlWinslow
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verdum - dude im 20 and in just 40 minutes i found out that 60% of 80 year old men are 100% against steroids. FACT.
60% of the time there against steroids everytime Phone Post
6/28/11 7:06 PM
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wiu81
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CarlWinslow -
wiu81 - You should get off the juice. It's bad for your health. Phone Post
I'm gonna roid rage your ass Phone Post
Dont talk that noise, bring that noise. It's illegal. Get over it! Phone Post
6/28/11 7:14 PM
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wiu81
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Teh Spider - Officer Winslow Phone Post
Lol I'm rolling laughing right now. Phone Post
6/28/11 7:31 PM
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46and2
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Carl, you're completely right and Ive been trying to get this point across also for months and months now.

*MOST* people on this forum who are openly and loudly against any kind of steroid use are as ignorant as a 5th grader on the actual FACTS and SCIENCE behind how they work and what they actually do.

They are getting all worked up and emotional over something they are completely ignorant about, and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense.



Ever stop and think WHY everyone things roids are so bad?

Is it because we have seen people sick/dead/etc. from steroid use? NO

Is it because doctors are constantly saying how horrible they are and have no legit use? NO, Actually, every doctor the Government asked AND THE DEA AND FDA at the time told them NOT to make steroids illegal

Is it because fighters that drop dirty are obviously terrible, horrible people with all kinds of terrible health problems brewing in their bodies because of steroid use? NO

Is it because someone you know ruined someone else's life through their steroid use? NO

Why is it?

It's because the media and government have been on a smear campaign over steroids ever since the steroid control act was thought up.

Any time there's a murder or something terrible happens, that person could have had PCP, Meth, LSD, coke, etc. in their system, ALONG with steroids, and steroids would be blamed for the entire thing. Think about the wrestler Benois (sp?) they tried to blame roids for that whole thing...

You can abuse anything, and you can also most likely use it correctly.

Sure, steroid abuse has some bad effects, just like the abuse of ANYTHING.


MY IDEA:

Doctor supervised hormone supplementation is where we need to go with sports IMO. Allow the use of certain levels (just like they do with TRT patients like Randy and Nate)

Bring everyone into the natural ranges of a healthy 18 year old. At this range, testosterone would not provide performance enhancing effects any more than they would for an actual 18 year old.

Fat loss and increased lean mass will happen, but not at a rate like you see with bodybuilding type doses of steroids. Injuries will happen less often and when they do, they will heal faster.

Fighters will be able to train their asses off and count on their body to heal so they can do it again the next day. Intense training, along with dieting and weight cutting, can KILL your testosterone levels.

These guys really aren't trying to "CHEAT" (FUCK I hate that word, and it's thrown around by all the parrot raping sheep around here every time theres a PED thread) They are trying to stay healthy and make a living and be the best fighter they can.

All of you wishing for a more STRICT testing program are unknowingly wishing for this sport to suck major fucking ass.

If that happens, have fun watching all the bad shit that will come from it:

Tons of suspensions (since so many are already using), more injuries, more sick fighters, more out of shape fighters, less exciting fights, more people going against their favorite fighter because they tested dirty, fighters losing sponsors, not being able to train because they can't afford SHIT because they are suspended and can't FIGHT......
6/28/11 8:01 PM
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PoundforPound
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Why could all the old time boxers and baseball players have magnificent careers without steroids, while the current generation of MMA pussies can't?
6/28/11 8:02 PM
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stillmatic
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46and2 - Carl, you're completely right and Ive been trying to get this point across also for months and months now.

*MOST* people on this forum who are openly and loudly against any kind of steroid use are as ignorant as a 5th grader on the actual FACTS and SCIENCE behind how they work and what they actually do.

They are getting all worked up and emotional over something they are completely ignorant about, and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense.



Ever stop and think WHY everyone things roids are so bad?

Is it because we have seen people sick/dead/etc. from steroid use? NO

Is it because doctors are constantly saying how horrible they are and have no legit use? NO, Actually, every doctor the Government asked AND THE DEA AND FDA at the time told them NOT to make steroids illegal

Is it because fighters that drop dirty are obviously terrible, horrible people with all kinds of terrible health problems brewing in their bodies because of steroid use? NO

Is it because someone you know ruined someone else's life through their steroid use? NO

Why is it?

It's because the media and government have been on a smear campaign over steroids ever since the steroid control act was thought up.

Any time there's a murder or something terrible happens, that person could have had PCP, Meth, LSD, coke, etc. in their system, ALONG with steroids, and steroids would be blamed for the entire thing. Think about the wrestler Benois (sp?) they tried to blame roids for that whole thing...

You can abuse anything, and you can also most likely use it correctly.

Sure, steroid abuse has some bad effects, just like the abuse of ANYTHING.


MY IDEA:

Doctor supervised hormone supplementation is where we need to go with sports IMO. Allow the use of certain levels (just like they do with TRT patients like Randy and Nate)

Bring everyone into the natural ranges of a healthy 18 year old. At this range, testosterone would not provide performance enhancing effects any more than they would for an actual 18 year old.

Fat loss and increased lean mass will happen, but not at a rate like you see with bodybuilding type doses of steroids. Injuries will happen less often and when they do, they will heal faster.

Fighters will be able to train their asses off and count on their body to heal so they can do it again the next day. Intense training, along with dieting and weight cutting, can KILL your testosterone levels.

These guys really aren't trying to "CHEAT" (FUCK I hate that word, and it's thrown around by all the parrot raping sheep around here every time theres a PED thread) They are trying to stay healthy and make a living and be the best fighter they can.

All of you wishing for a more STRICT testing program are unknowingly wishing for this sport to suck major fucking ass.

If that happens, have fun watching all the bad shit that will come from it:

Tons of suspensions (since so many are already using), more injuries, more sick fighters, more out of shape fighters, less exciting fights, more people going against their favorite fighter because they tested dirty, fighters losing sponsors, not being able to train because they can't afford SHIT because they are suspended and can't FIGHT......


What about the fighters who don't want to take this stuff? Should they have to risk their own health just so they can compete with those that do?

You're also going down a slippery slope when you start allowing PED's in sport.
6/28/11 8:11 PM
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Gokudamus stole my name
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PoundforPound - Why could all the old time boxers and baseball players have magnificent careers without steroids, while the current generation of MMA pussies can't?


Athletes have used performance enhancers since competitions have existed, ancient romans used to eat bull testicles, amphetamines have been around since the 1800s, before that coca leaves were used, steroids have been around since 1920s, but they never started testing for it until the 1970s and before that they were given as "tonics" by the family doctor to people who were tired or sick

athletes will always use whatever edge they can, from plaster of paris to whatever was in Aaron Pryors waterbottle
6/28/11 8:16 PM
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Bat21
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CarlWinslow - About steroids.... Now it's illegal and it's some how a taboo subject but as with most sports it's a part of it, no matter how much denial or if your 100% for it against it or not sure etc... It's still there and always will be, but just do some google research on the subject, PLEASE!! It's not hard and will take a whole 20 minutes just to get a slight idea instead of just talking misinformed nonsense...

Most of you sound like a 80 year old man talking about marijuana... Yea you people sound like batshit crazy geriatric people talking about a subject that they hear 5th hand at a AARP meeting at the park...
Ya know those people who talk about mma as human cock fighting and it enrages you because there misinformed, 60% of you are those people about peds. Phone Post

 Wadda ya mean, "you people"?!?
6/28/11 8:42 PM
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CarlWinslow
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Bat21 -
CarlWinslow - About steroids.... Now it's illegal and it's some how a taboo subject but as with most sports it's a part of it, no matter how much denial or if your 100% for it against it or not sure etc... It's still there and always will be, but just do some google research on the subject, PLEASE!! It's not hard and will take a whole 20 minutes just to get a slight idea instead of just talking misinformed nonsense...

Most of you sound like a 80 year old man talking about marijuana... Yea you people sound like batshit crazy geriatric people talking about a subject that they hear 5th hand at a AARP meeting at the park...
Ya know those people who talk about mma as human cock fighting and it enrages you because there misinformed, 60% of you are those people about peds. Phone Post

 Wadda ya mean, "you people"?!?
Especially "you people" Phone Post
6/28/11 8:46 PM
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46and2
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stillmatic - 
46and2 - Carl, you're completely right and Ive been trying to get this point across also for months and months now.

*MOST* people on this forum who are openly and loudly against any kind of steroid use are as ignorant as a 5th grader on the actual FACTS and SCIENCE behind how they work and what they actually do.

They are getting all worked up and emotional over something they are completely ignorant about, and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense.



Ever stop and think WHY everyone things roids are so bad?

Is it because we have seen people sick/dead/etc. from steroid use? NO

Is it because doctors are constantly saying how horrible they are and have no legit use? NO, Actually, every doctor the Government asked AND THE DEA AND FDA at the time told them NOT to make steroids illegal

Is it because fighters that drop dirty are obviously terrible, horrible people with all kinds of terrible health problems brewing in their bodies because of steroid use? NO

Is it because someone you know ruined someone else's life through their steroid use? NO

Why is it?

It's because the media and government have been on a smear campaign over steroids ever since the steroid control act was thought up.

Any time there's a murder or something terrible happens, that person could have had PCP, Meth, LSD, coke, etc. in their system, ALONG with steroids, and steroids would be blamed for the entire thing. Think about the wrestler Benois (sp?) they tried to blame roids for that whole thing...

You can abuse anything, and you can also most likely use it correctly.

Sure, steroid abuse has some bad effects, just like the abuse of ANYTHING.


MY IDEA:

Doctor supervised hormone supplementation is where we need to go with sports IMO. Allow the use of certain levels (just like they do with TRT patients like Randy and Nate)

Bring everyone into the natural ranges of a healthy 18 year old. At this range, testosterone would not provide performance enhancing effects any more than they would for an actual 18 year old.

Fat loss and increased lean mass will happen, but not at a rate like you see with bodybuilding type doses of steroids. Injuries will happen less often and when they do, they will heal faster.

Fighters will be able to train their asses off and count on their body to heal so they can do it again the next day. Intense training, along with dieting and weight cutting, can KILL your testosterone levels.

These guys really aren't trying to "CHEAT" (FUCK I hate that word, and it's thrown around by all the parrot raping sheep around here every time theres a PED thread) They are trying to stay healthy and make a living and be the best fighter they can.

All of you wishing for a more STRICT testing program are unknowingly wishing for this sport to suck major fucking ass.

If that happens, have fun watching all the bad shit that will come from it:

Tons of suspensions (since so many are already using), more injuries, more sick fighters, more out of shape fighters, less exciting fights, more people going against their favorite fighter because they tested dirty, fighters losing sponsors, not being able to train because they can't afford SHIT because they are suspended and can't FIGHT......


What about the fighters who don't want to take this stuff? Should they have to risk their own health just so they can compete with those that do?

You're also going down a slippery slope when you start allowing PED's in sport.


Well, see this is where your lack of knowledge is swaying your opinion.

Steroids will absolutely FUCK UP your body if you ABUSE them at high doses for LONG peroids of time.

The doses that would be beneficial for a MMA fighter are simply TRT type doses which only put you around the range of a healthy 18 year old male (when your test is highest)

These doses would not only cause damned near ZERO side effects, and I mean ZERO, they would NOT be "performance enhancing" in the sense that most people think of them in (I.E. bodybuilding type doses and results)

So, no, a fighter who didnt want to use wouldn't have to, because there would be no unfair advantages if the acceptable ranges were kept reasonable.

Im only suggesting allowing use in a certain range, which would be damned near side effect free (short and long term)

If this use is allowed like I suggest, you will also do away with fighters risking their life and health in a couple different ways:

1. They won't have to find them (anabolics) illegally, eliminating the whole crime and danger of buying illegal drugs.

2. A doctor will give the shot or teach the person how to do it themselves, eliminating possible death (air bubble in vein), loss of flesh and/or possibly amputation from infection due to poor technique.

3. A doctor will dose the person according to their bloodwork, eliminating the side effects and health problems seen in HIGH DOSED ABUSE.

4. The doctor will be able to teach them about treatments to possibly keep their nuts working some during TRT (HCG, SERMS)
6/28/11 8:56 PM
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46and2
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stillmatic - 

What about the fighters who don't want to take this stuff? Should they have to risk their own health just so they can compete with those that do?

You're also going down a slippery slope when you start allowing PED's in sport.


Sorry, I have to pick on your post one more time.

Another common misconception about steroids is that they will make you a better fighter. Your statement there you asked "just so they can compete with those that do?"

Steroids aren't some miracle in a bottle that give you athletic talent, teach you how to punch hard, throw, do a submission, etc. A sucky fighter on roids is still a sucky fighter.

The performance enhancing effects of *smart* roid use by an MMA athlete will come more in the form of possibly being in better shape come fight time (due to the fact that they were able to TRAIN HARDER because they could recover better from their workouts) than what most people think (more in shape = more exciting!). Also, a huge benefit would be quicker recovery from an injury (less canceled fights, sweet!)

I sometimes wonder what "you people" think steroids actually do to a person. I'd love to hear some of the crazy shit you guys believe. LMAO

Im just saying that guys who never touch the shit can very well be better than guys who juice all they want. Look at some of the blatantly obvious juicers from back in the day in MMA (not gonna name names but you all know). Now, look at their records. After you do that, tell me how unfair it was that they juiced all those years while other people beat them up LOLOL.
6/28/11 8:57 PM
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PoundforPound
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^Or fighters can just fight clean, that seems much simpler.
6/28/11 9:08 PM
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46and2
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PoundforPound - ^Or fighters can just fight clean, that seems much simpler.


The testing methods will always fail and you will ALWAYS have people using. Therefore, the testing methods are actually what's creating the uneven playing field.

The only even playing field is one where they allow the use.
6/28/11 9:14 PM
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PoundforPound
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How is it an even playing field for the fighters who don't want to use?
6/28/11 9:56 PM
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TYCOONSLAUGHTER
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46and2 - 
stillmatic - 

What about the fighters who don't want to take this stuff? Should they have to risk their own health just so they can compete with those that do?

You're also going down a slippery slope when you start allowing PED's in sport.


Sorry, I have to pick on your post one more time.

Another common misconception about steroids is that they will make you a better fighter. Your statement there you asked "just so they can compete with those that do?"

Steroids aren't some miracle in a bottle that give you athletic talent, teach you how to punch hard, throw, do a submission, etc. A sucky fighter on roids is still a sucky fighter.

The performance enhancing effects of *smart* roid use by an MMA athlete will come more in the form of possibly being in better shape come fight time (due to the fact that they were able to TRAIN HARDER because they could recover better from their workouts) than what most people think (more in shape = more exciting!). Also, a huge benefit would be quicker recovery from an injury (less canceled fights, sweet!)

I sometimes wonder what "you people" think steroids actually do to a person. I'd love to hear some of the crazy shit you guys believe. LMAO

Im just saying that guys who never touch the shit can very well be better than guys who juice all they want. Look at some of the blatantly obvious juicers from back in the day in MMA (not gonna name names but you all know). Now, look at their records. After you do that, tell me how unfair it was that they juiced all those years while other people beat them up LOLOL.
No matter what you say. Using steroids is cheating. The fighters that use them are trying to gain an advantage somehow. Either it be by recovering quicker or training harder its still cheating.
6/28/11 10:14 PM
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CarlWinslow
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thedoom - I heard roids make ur peepee fall off
At least this man knows what's up... Phone Post
6/28/11 10:42 PM
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46and2
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PoundforPound - How is it an even playing field for the fighters who don't want to use?


LOL



I give up.
6/28/11 10:51 PM
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46and2
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Edited: 06/28/11 10:51 PM
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TYCOONSLAUGHTER - 
46and2 - 
stillmatic - 

What about the fighters who don't want to take this stuff? Should they have to risk their own health just so they can compete with those that do?

You're also going down a slippery slope when you start allowing PED's in sport.


Sorry, I have to pick on your post one more time.

Another common misconception about steroids is that they will make you a better fighter. Your statement there you asked "just so they can compete with those that do?"

Steroids aren't some miracle in a bottle that give you athletic talent, teach you how to punch hard, throw, do a submission, etc. A sucky fighter on roids is still a sucky fighter.

The performance enhancing effects of *smart* roid use by an MMA athlete will come more in the form of possibly being in better shape come fight time (due to the fact that they were able to TRAIN HARDER because they could recover better from their workouts) than what most people think (more in shape = more exciting!). Also, a huge benefit would be quicker recovery from an injury (less canceled fights, sweet!)

I sometimes wonder what "you people" think steroids actually do to a person. I'd love to hear some of the crazy shit you guys believe. LMAO

Im just saying that guys who never touch the shit can very well be better than guys who juice all they want. Look at some of the blatantly obvious juicers from back in the day in MMA (not gonna name names but you all know). Now, look at their records. After you do that, tell me how unfair it was that they juiced all those years while other people beat them up LOLOL.
No matter what you say. Using steroids is cheating. The fighters that use them are trying to gain an advantage somehow. Either it be by recovering quicker or training harder its still cheating.


Then no matter what YOU say, by your superior logic, supplements are cheating, too.

The ONLY reason one can call steroids "cheating" is because it's against the rules (meaning not everyone can do it). Changing the rules to allow supervised use would fix that real quick.





What, exactly, makes supplements different that they should be allowed, yet guys shouldn't be allowed to supplement their testosterone to accepted levels? What about D-aspartic acid which boosts testosterone naturally, ban that too?

Vitamin D can increase testosterone, lets fucking get all those cheaters using Vitamin D.

In fact, lets just cut all the fighters nuts off so they will all have the EXACT same testosterone level (ZERO!)

These guys are trying to gain an advantage any way they can, next up will be performance enhancing surgeries. That shit is fucked up, though.
6/28/11 10:54 PM
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46and2
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Deuce77 - Steroids should be legal. Those that get caught are simply taking one for the team as I firmly believe most atheletes take some form of performance enhancing drugs.


The fact that steroids are illegal in this country makes me sick.

Check this out:

I could go to a doctor and get a sex change. Nuts cut clean OFF, dick cut off and tucked back up in me to make some sort of vagina. Then I could go on estrogen therapy for the rest of my life and get breast implants, etc.

I can do all that shit, but I can't go to my doctor and say "hey, Ive been lifting and not making progress and I'd like to gain a little bit more muscle, will you help me out with a cycle?"

Nope, can't do that! But, I can be mutilated into a girl and given as much estrogen as I want.

Sweet fucking logic there.
6/28/11 10:54 PM
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Humphrey
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46and2 - 
TYCOONSLAUGHTER - 
46and2 - 
stillmatic - 

What about the fighters who don't want to take this stuff? Should they have to risk their own health just so they can compete with those that do?

You're also going down a slippery slope when you start allowing PED's in sport.


Sorry, I have to pick on your post one more time.

Another common misconception about steroids is that they will make you a better fighter. Your statement there you asked "just so they can compete with those that do?"

Steroids aren't some miracle in a bottle that give you athletic talent, teach you how to punch hard, throw, do a submission, etc. A sucky fighter on roids is still a sucky fighter.

The performance enhancing effects of *smart* roid use by an MMA athlete will come more in the form of possibly being in better shape come fight time (due to the fact that they were able to TRAIN HARDER because they could recover better from their workouts) than what most people think (more in shape = more exciting!). Also, a huge benefit would be quicker recovery from an injury (less canceled fights, sweet!)

I sometimes wonder what "you people" think steroids actually do to a person. I'd love to hear some of the crazy shit you guys believe. LMAO

Im just saying that guys who never touch the shit can very well be better than guys who juice all they want. Look at some of the blatantly obvious juicers from back in the day in MMA (not gonna name names but you all know). Now, look at their records. After you do that, tell me how unfair it was that they juiced all those years while other people beat them up LOLOL.
No matter what you say. Using steroids is cheating. The fighters that use them are trying to gain an advantage somehow. Either it be by recovering quicker or training harder its still cheating.


Then no matter what YOU say, by your superior logic, supplements are cheating, too.

The ONLY reason one can call steroids "cheating" is because it's against the rules (meaning not everyone can do it). Changing the rules to allow supervised use would fix that real quick.





What, exactly, makes supplements different that they should be allowed, yet guys shouldn't be allowed to supplement their testosterone to accepted levels? What about D-aspartic acid which boosts testosterone naturally, ban that too?

Vitamin D can increase testosterone, lets fucking get all those cheaters using Vitamin D.

In fact, lets just cut all the fighters nuts off so they will all have the EXACT same testosterone level (ZERO!)

These guys are trying to gain an advantage any way they can, next up will be performance enhancing surgeries. That shit is fucked up, though.


wow your'e dense... REALLY dense.
6/28/11 10:55 PM
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46and2
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Oh, and thanks for everyone being cool on this thread. I know I get worked up about this topic and I don't mean to insult anyone really, so sorry if I sound like a dick.
6/28/11 10:56 PM
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46and2
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Humphrey - 
46and2 - 
TYCOONSLAUGHTER - 
46and2 - 
stillmatic - 

What about the fighters who don't want to take this stuff? Should they have to risk their own health just so they can compete with those that do?

You're also going down a slippery slope when you start allowing PED's in sport.


Sorry, I have to pick on your post one more time.

Another common misconception about steroids is that they will make you a better fighter. Your statement there you asked "just so they can compete with those that do?"

Steroids aren't some miracle in a bottle that give you athletic talent, teach you how to punch hard, throw, do a submission, etc. A sucky fighter on roids is still a sucky fighter.

The performance enhancing effects of *smart* roid use by an MMA athlete will come more in the form of possibly being in better shape come fight time (due to the fact that they were able to TRAIN HARDER because they could recover better from their workouts) than what most people think (more in shape = more exciting!). Also, a huge benefit would be quicker recovery from an injury (less canceled fights, sweet!)

I sometimes wonder what "you people" think steroids actually do to a person. I'd love to hear some of the crazy shit you guys believe. LMAO

Im just saying that guys who never touch the shit can very well be better than guys who juice all they want. Look at some of the blatantly obvious juicers from back in the day in MMA (not gonna name names but you all know). Now, look at their records. After you do that, tell me how unfair it was that they juiced all those years while other people beat them up LOLOL.
No matter what you say. Using steroids is cheating. The fighters that use them are trying to gain an advantage somehow. Either it be by recovering quicker or training harder its still cheating.


Then no matter what YOU say, by your superior logic, supplements are cheating, too.

The ONLY reason one can call steroids "cheating" is because it's against the rules (meaning not everyone can do it). Changing the rules to allow supervised use would fix that real quick.





What, exactly, makes supplements different that they should be allowed, yet guys shouldn't be allowed to supplement their testosterone to accepted levels? What about D-aspartic acid which boosts testosterone naturally, ban that too?

Vitamin D can increase testosterone, lets fucking get all those cheaters using Vitamin D.

In fact, lets just cut all the fighters nuts off so they will all have the EXACT same testosterone level (ZERO!)

These guys are trying to gain an advantage any way they can, next up will be performance enhancing surgeries. That shit is fucked up, though.


wow your'e dense... REALLY dense.


How am I dense? Pick me apart then, lets have it.....

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