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UnderGround Forums >> Jeff Monson: It's time for a change


1/29/12 4:26 PM
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andre
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stillmatic -
andre -  I respect the fact that he fights for free rather than for profit.

Or does he?

Everyone loves pirating stuff, as long as its not their work that's not getting paid for. Phone Post
Depends what business model you choose to go with.

People pirating stuff in almost all cases wouldn't pay for the product otherwise, at least at the price point that's set.

If you want to go standard route, then you should look at pirating the same way you look at a competitor selling the same product, except it's offered free.  

An alternative route is the Louis CK model.  Put out a comedy special self produced for 170k, sell at 5 bucks a pop with no restrictions on the material.  Wait 12 days and get over 1 million in sales.  Piraters don't want to always get everything for free.  They are very willing to pay for a product they deem worth it's value.


 
Stillmatic, so if there's a girl I can't get because she's "out of my league", should I be able to take her by force?

This whole idea that the price point can be low enough for people not to steal is silly, IMO. Make entire CDs $3 each and people will still download them for free if it's equally as easy. Phone Post
1/29/12 4:39 PM
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andre
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Maybe a better analogy is this:

I may never be able to afford the Patek Phillipe watch I want ($220,000), so I would never buy one, but that doesn't mean I am justified in stealing it if I have the opportunity. Phone Post
1/29/12 5:40 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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andre - Maybe a better analogy is this:

I may never be able to afford the Patek Phillipe watch I want ($220,000), so I would never buy one, but that doesn't mean I am justified in stealing it if I have the opportunity. Phone Post


those things aren't analogous at all because copyright infringement isn't stealing. A better analogy would be to say "if I can't afford a patek phillipe watch I am justified in building and wearing a replica watch?"
1/29/12 6:18 PM
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Haulport
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hubbarocks - Monson is as much of a brain-washed imbecile as he claims others are.
Lol @ the rich paying less as a percent and so the burden falls on the poor and the middle class. The top fucking 10% of the wealthiest in this country pay 68% of the tax revenue to the gov't!!!

http://www.american.com/archive/2007/november-december-magazine-contents/guess-who-really-pays-the-taxes

The reality is that SOCIALISTS like the Bushs, Romney, Obama, McCain, Pelosi, Reid, etc. etc. etc. have created a China-like socialism in this country that has fostered an environment of being free as a company as long as you pay off the right Politician. This is why Hank Paulson saved Goldman Sachs and let their biggest competitor die (Lehman Bros.). This is why certain companies like Solyndra are given half a bill in loans even though their books clearly state they are dead in the water.

This country has become 100 times more SOCIALIST in the past 25 years, not more capitalist. The last thing we need is MORE socialism.
1/29/12 6:25 PM
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LayNprayNINJA
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jakeb -  Lol at the rich paying less than everyone else as a percentage. The "rich" pay the vast majority of taxes in this country. The lower 50% pay zero or very little. Get you facts straight. Phone Post

 The rich pay the lowest as a percentage. That is factual. Of all the "people" who PAY income tax, it is the richest of the rich who pay the lowest %.

Listen people, Jeff may be a little extreme, but there is NOTHING in that video that is not 100% true. This govermnent in America has become nothing but a business. Greed > True Freedom and Liberty
1/29/12 6:28 PM
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LayNprayNINJA
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Kugelfang - look at the American Gini coefficient and its relationship to the income mobility and then tell me again, that a) the American dream still exists and if you factor in tax rates that b) the rich pay their fair share.

It's kinda funny, that Americans tend to not call for higher taxes on the rich because they think that they can make it to the top with hard work and should be rewarded for that afterwards. The problem is, that this isn't the case anymore, there is nearly no other Western country where personal wealth is as dependent on what your parents had than in the US.

Realize that the US was the best country in the world a few decades ago because everyone could make it from zero but this has changed drastically.

I can't believe I'm writing that in an MMA forum ...

... WAR WAND!

 Holy fuck this guy knows the truth.

Bunch of Amurican idiots up in here though...
1/29/12 6:42 PM
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LayNprayNINJA
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Haulport - 
Lol @ the rich paying less as a percent and so the burden falls on the poor and the middle class. The top fucking 10% of the wealthiest in this country pay 68% of the tax revenue to the gov't!!!

http://www.american.com/archive/2007/november-december-magazine-contents/guess-who-really-pays-the-taxes

The reality is that SOCIALISTS like the Bushs, Romney, Obama, McCain, Pelosi, Reid, etc. etc. etc. have created a China-like socialism in this country that has fostered an environment of being free as a company as long as you pay off the right Politician. This is why Hank Paulson saved Goldman Sachs and let their biggest competitor die (Lehman Bros.). This is why certain companies like Solyndra are given half a bill in loans even though their books clearly state they are dead in the water.

This country has become 100 times more SOCIALIST in the past 25 years, not more capitalist. The last thing we need is MORE socialism.

 Way to go on a rant about a completely missed concept. 

Jeff was not saying that the rich pay less than the middle class and the poor, as a percentage.

He was saying that the effective tax rate they pay is less.

Or simpler:

The people in the top 1% of income earners pay the lowest percentage. It wasn;t wrded perfectly, but it is pretty obvious what he is getting at- The rich do NOT pay their "fair share". It is disgusting that they (rich fucks) actually respond by saying that the lowest income earners (who earn so little they don't actually end up paying out an income tax) need to start stepping up to the plate. 
1/30/12 6:47 AM
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hockey
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Why the f would anyone take what Monson has to say to heart?!He's a fighter!If Monson in his heart of hearts believes what he thinks:give up the fighting and dedicate your life to activism!
1/30/12 7:21 AM
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dahosse
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Dude, knock it off with the long-winded text walls. The complaint that is being made in your lol did-not-reads is that Obama is trying to re-write the playbook on which things must be vetted by congress. The taxation rates on the affluent have nothing to do with that.

But, referring to the affluent individuals in question- this viewpoint is utter garbage. Even if a man is wealthy, you have no rights to his property. If he is paying more absolute tax, even at a generally lower rate as compared to income, he is paying more money into the system. Every time he buys a luxury good, the sales tax is fed into the system.

If you want to talk about how multinationals aren't paying their fair share, that's another argument also.

Problem with libs is that you sideways argue like women. Phone Post
1/30/12 7:25 AM
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mijo
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^ Agree 200%, and another 15% for the libbies.
1/30/12 10:33 AM
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reasonable_mma
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What solutions as Jeff implemented that other people can follow? Making a you tube vid? What Jeff fails to understand is that there are more ambitious and smarter people than him no matter what society you live in. In socialist Canada there a rich people. Why? because people are willing to work harder and longer than you. What ground breaking info. Corporations don't want to pay taxes, they vote their own in. To act like you can't be more than you are because some evil corp won't let you is just ignorant. Does Jeff volunteer at a homeless shelter? Does he serve meals at a food pantry? Does he do food and clothes drive for the needy? Does he help families find health insurance? No he spray paints in DC and makes conspiracy theory videos. What a fucking movement.
1/30/12 11:51 AM
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SamboMMA
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thedudebro - 
SamboMMA - 
thedudebro - 
SamboMMA - 
thedudebro - 
UGCTT_molsonmuscle360 - 
Hollywood Blonde - I'm liberal, not leftist. Monson's out to lunch.


I'm a socialist and I think Monson is out to lunch. Dude is fucking bonkers. I'm pretty sure now matter how liberal, or left leaning you are, unless you have gone as far as the "anarchist" crowd, you are going to think Monson is fucking crazy.


Lol who says they are a socialist nowadays? Unless you are from a European country or a Fox News nut.


Look. Its an MSNBC tard.


Nope, nice try. You are so close though!

Not.

You are just another little punk who posts two sentences and doesn't contribute anything to the conversation. Go now, your mommy is calling.


You haven't contributed anything to this thread either beyond playing the Fox card. Maybe you should practice what you preach first.


I actually did but since reading is not something butthurt Fox News zombies do well then...

You probably couldn't even name one news source I review on a weekly basis.


The libtard is still libtarding.
1/30/12 12:44 PM
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andre
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Jesus Quintana -
andre - Maybe a better analogy is this:

I may never be able to afford the Patek Phillipe watch I want ($220,000), so I would never buy one, but that doesn't mean I am justified in stealing it if I have the opportunity. Phone Post


those things aren't analogous at all because copyright infringement isn't stealing. A better analogy would be to say "if I can't afford a patek phillipe watch I am justified in building and wearing a replica watch?"
Create something. Work really hard at it and invest your time and money into making it, then watch replicas be made of it and given away for free on the Internet.

Let me ask you this: let's assume that NO laws exist to prevent pirating. Technology and the lack of restrictions then makes it easy enough for everyone to download whatever they want--for free--as easily as they turn on their computer.

Who would make content worth watching in an environment in which they couldn't get paid to do so? Phone Post
1/30/12 12:59 PM
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CaptainBurma
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4 laterz
1/30/12 1:16 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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andre - 
Jesus Quintana -
andre - Maybe a better analogy is this:

I may never be able to afford the Patek Phillipe watch I want ($220,000), so I would never buy one, but that doesn't mean I am justified in stealing it if I have the opportunity. Phone Post


those things aren't analogous at all because copyright infringement isn't stealing. A better analogy would be to say "if I can't afford a patek phillipe watch I am justified in building and wearing a replica watch?"
Create something. Work really hard at it and invest your time and money into making it, then watch replicas be made of it and given away for free on the Internet.

Let me ask you this: let's assume that NO laws exist to prevent pirating. Technology and the lack of restrictions then makes it easy enough for everyone to download whatever they want--for free--as easily as they turn on their computer.

Who would make content worth watching in an environment in which they couldn't get paid to do so? Phone Post


You are making the assumption that in an environment where there are no safeguards against piracy there would be no way to make money off of content, which is demonstrably false.

Vice gives away all of its content for free online and offline. If piracy was 100% legal it would have zero impact on their company. Has downloading made music get worse? no, it hasn't and in fact it is easier to find new music than it ever has been.

Media companies need to embrace change and find new ways to monetize rather than fighting a futile battle against technology and progress.
1/30/12 1:40 PM
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andre
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Jesus Quintana -
andre - 
Jesus Quintana -
andre - Maybe a better analogy is this:

I may never be able to afford the Patek Phillipe watch I want ($220,000), so I would never buy one, but that doesn't mean I am justified in stealing it if I have the opportunity. Phone Post


those things aren't analogous at all because copyright infringement isn't stealing. A better analogy would be to say "if I can't afford a patek phillipe watch I am justified in building and wearing a replica watch?"
Create something. Work really hard at it and invest your time and money into making it, then watch replicas be made of it and given away for free on the Internet.

Let me ask you this: let's assume that NO laws exist to prevent pirating. Technology and the lack of restrictions then makes it easy enough for everyone to download whatever they want--for free--as easily as they turn on their computer.

Who would make content worth watching in an environment in which they couldn't get paid to do so? Phone Post


You are making the assumption that in an environment where there are no safeguards against piracy there would be no way to make money off of content, which is demonstrably false.

Vice gives away all of its content for free online and offline. If piracy was 100% legal it would have zero impact on their company. Has downloading made music get worse? no, it hasn't and in fact it is easier to find new music than it ever has been.

Media companies need to embrace change and find new ways to monetize rather than fighting a futile battle against technology and progress.
I write the Godfather, pay all production costs, and create a masterpiece. How do I get paid if I put the movie out there for free? Phone Post
1/30/12 1:59 PM
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Louisvillain
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Delusional dipshit.
Too bad his visit to mother Russia was'nt permanent. Phone Post
1/30/12 2:02 PM
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stlnl2
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Kugelfang - look at the American Gini coefficient and its relationship to the income mobility and then tell me again, that a) the American dream still exists and if you factor in tax rates that b) the rich pay their fair share.

It's kinda funny, that Americans tend to not call for higher taxes on the rich because they think that they can make it to the top with hard work and should be rewarded for that afterwards. The problem is, that this isn't the case anymore, there is nearly no other Western country where personal wealth is as dependent on what your parents had than in the US.

Realize that the US was the best country in the world a few decades ago because everyone could make it from zero but this has changed drastically.

I can't believe I'm writing that in an MMA forum ...

... WAR WAND!


It has not changed drastically, what HAS changed drastically is anyone telling you that you can make it. I think the biggest reason folks end up making what their parents make is they get certain financial comfort levels "hard wired" into their brains and a system of education that teaches people to fit into a machine instead of trying to do their own thing.
1/30/12 2:03 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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1) people won't own a theater and will go to the theater to get the theater experience. Thus paying you.

2) It is already possible to watch any movie for free.

3) You could finance the movie by crowdsourced funding and having fans pay $5 in advance of the movie being created, and produce the movie once you have met your fundraising goals.
1/30/12 4:51 PM
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Haulport
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LayNprayNINJA - 
Haulport - 
<b>Lol @ the rich paying less as a percent and so the burden falls on the poor and the middle class. The top fucking 10% of the wealthiest in this country pay 68% of the tax revenue to the gov't!!!</b>

http://www.american.com/archive/2007/november-december-magazine-contents/guess-who-really-pays-the-taxes

The reality is that SOCIALISTS like the Bushs, Romney, Obama, McCain, Pelosi, Reid, etc. etc. etc. have created a China-like socialism in this country that has fostered an environment of being free as a company as long as you pay off the right Politician. This is why Hank Paulson saved Goldman Sachs and let their biggest competitor die (Lehman Bros.). This is why certain companies like Solyndra are given half a bill in loans even though their books clearly state they are dead in the water.

This country has become 100 times more SOCIALIST in the past 25 years, not more capitalist. The last thing we need is MORE socialism.

 Way to go on a rant about a completely missed concept. 

Jeff was not saying that the rich pay less than the middle class and the poor, as a percentage.

He was saying that the effective tax rate they pay is less.

Or simpler:

The people in the top 1% of income earners <b>pay the lowest percentage</b>. It wasn;t wrded perfectly, but it is pretty obvious what he is getting at- The rich do NOT pay their "fair share". It is disgusting that they (rich fucks) actually respond by saying that the lowest income earners (who earn so little they don't actually end up paying out an income tax) need to start stepping up to the plate. <br type="_moz" />
I went on a rant about EXACTLY why he was saying that. He and people like you, word shit exactly like that so that you can confuse people into thinking that "rich fucks" (very objective of you btw) don't pay their fair share because the % of income paid is less. That is just some sorry-ass misdirection. The wealthiest 10% of this country shoulder nearly the entire tax burden of a Socialist gov't that simply steals people's money so they can give it to their friends and pocket the rest.

What needs to be asked is why does ANYONE have to pay more than 15% of their income to the gov't? That's more than a fair share and it shouldn't be that the "rich fucks" need to pay MORE it should be that the "99%" should pay LESS.

There is no amount of money in the world that can pay off the debt that has been created by a socialistic, thieving, political class that is using people like YOU my fren to advance their control of all our money. They wish to enslave us all and are nearly their will YOUR help...
1/30/12 4:55 PM
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Haulport
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And BTW: 50% of people sending in a tax return pay NO taxes. Are they the people "who earn so little they don't actually end up paying out an income tax"? Are HALF of the working class that poor?

Get your facts straight.
1/31/12 10:08 PM
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ufcman187
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Where is Patrick Miletich when we need him ? lol
1/31/12 10:50 PM
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OsotoGary
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Isn't this the same guy who also destroys collectively owned public property? Did they actually make him sand blast that statue he vandalized?
1/31/12 10:56 PM
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TheVileOne
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We got a "change" in 2008. His name is Obama. And despite the "hope" he inspired . . . it didn't work out all that great.
1/31/12 11:17 PM
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bhealthy
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i'm also for change, but let's start with something small, like eradicating mma of teams that have a consistent pattern of producing mma-players that piss hot.

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