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UnderGround Forums >> The Rise & Problems of Zuffa UFC by EatonBeever


3/27/12 4:47 PM
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DamnSevern
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 The question is of no importance.  Did I even pick brock to beat overeem? 
 
What does it matter who I pick?  

I haven't even given it much thought, but I'll let you know when I do


3/27/12 4:48 PM
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D241
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 Just to add to the Zuffa buyout of Sephomore Entertainment Group(SEG) and the questionable "happenings" around the time it wasn't being sanctioned, was bought out, then sanctioned time frame.

First off, if you say that nothing fishy happened, then you must initially take the stance that it is Pure Coincidence that UFC under SEG was failing and going bankrupt and getting it sanctioned was a last ditch effort to save it before eventually having to sell the UFC for what is now a bargain price.

Fact-Lorenzo Fertitta was a longtime board member of the Nevada state athletic comission.

Fact-There was no vote that had to be on record. This means that Bob Merywitz(SEG) claim that a vote was done doesn't mean it didn't happen, it just means there's no recorded proof. You can't prove what Bob is saying is correct, but you cannot dispute it as well.

Fact-UFC under SEG was failing financially and in order to save the company, they needed to get back on ppv, and to be allowed back on ppv, they had to be sanctioned.

UFC under SEG DID try to get sanctioned in Nevada but couldn't. UFC under Zuffa DID try to get sanctioned in Nevada, and did. The timeframe is less than 90 days from when UFC/SEG tried to get sanctioned in Nevada but couldn't, from when Zuffa bought out UFC and was able to get sanctioned.


Regardless if you think that shady tactics were used, I, being in the belief that shadyness occurred, still believe that the Fertitta brothers and that other guy nobody talks about who is part owner(not Dana White), did what they needed to to not only be in position to purchase the UFC, but have used their power to help the sport grow.

Even if Zuffa owners were simply trying to build up the UFC brand, they did help bring the sport up.
3/27/12 4:49 PM
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DamnSevern
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 loves attention  -check
 resorts to calling peoples names  -check
 will shit on a goat to get a point across -check
 holds a grudge forever -check
3/27/12 4:51 PM
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QTyp
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I enjoy EatonBeever's previous work, is this one worth the FRAT?
3/27/12 4:54 PM
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EatonBeever
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DamnSevern -  The question is of no importance.  Did I even pick brock to beat overeem? 
 
What does it matter who I pick?  

I haven't even given it much thought, but I'll let you know when I do

You have no balls and worry about your e-reputation than to give your opinions...  Aren't there a ton of DamnSevern-maniacs on the UG that vote you up ?  Your FANS want to know your opinion.  They log on, not for my silly history threads, but to see what DamnSevern thinks...    You seriously don't have the balls to give your opinion of the fight ?  Because you might be wrong and be called out on it ????   Why you worried what I think.  Who you picking ? 

And lol @ caposa being GOAT of the UG.  That's hilarious.  Subjective, but imo - Whistleblower is GOAT.  I had no fucking clue who caposa was until he started some drama on MY thread and realized he was some dude who gets vote ups for making gifs... 
 
3/27/12 4:57 PM
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EatonBeever
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 I don't care who DamnSevern picks.  His opinion will not conclude wheather or not he is a shill, but I want to see if his pick is correct... I'm curious.  He's noob, but a noob who watches a lot of current MMA.  His opinion might be interesting.
3/27/12 4:58 PM
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UGCTT_Suess
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eaton's meltdown is so fun to watch.
3/27/12 5:01 PM
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KevinMcAllister
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SECOND INTERMISSION
3/27/12 5:02 PM
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chokeyou
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Much love for EatBEAV

No clue why all you clowns are attacking him.

SO many of you defend zuffa like its your child and thats weird.

As a fan of the sport, i love what Zuffa has done and hate it all at the same time. I like it that i can see more fights but a lot of the time hate the fights i see. ALSO, so many fighters don't like how they have been treated and that begs to question their practices...


3/27/12 5:08 PM
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DamnSevern
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DamnSevern -  loves attention  -check
 resorts to calling peoples names  -check
 will shit on a goat to get a point across -check
 holds a grudge forever -check

 do you see how much in common you have with dana?

 is that why you hate him so much?

 I said caposa is one of the goats, whistleblower is too
  
 and all this talk about e-reputation from a guy who judges people based off their join dates on a forum.
3/27/12 5:08 PM
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Chris27
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chokeyou - Much love for EatBEAV

No clue why all you clowns are attacking him.

SO many of you defend zuffa like its your child and thats weird.

As a fan of the sport, i love what Zuffa has done and hate it all at the same time. I like it that i can see more fights but a lot of the time hate the fights i see. ALSO, so many fighters don't like how they have been treated and that begs to question their practices...




Is there a difference between someone who always defends Zuffa like its their child and someone who hates them and bashes them like Zuffa killed their child?

Whats the difference? is one being a shill and the other being a real fan?

What fights are you seeing that you hate? UFC cards have been dam good lately other than the Fox show, recent PPV have been good with good fights and the Fuel and FX cards have also been good. Sure every fight isnt gonna be good and every card wont be great but I dont get hating the fights I see line.


3/27/12 5:11 PM
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DamnSevern
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chokeyou - Much love for EatBEAV

No clue why all you clowns are attacking him.

SO many of you defend zuffa like its your child and thats weird.

 why is he attacking other forum members?

 You're defending him like he's your child
3/27/12 5:16 PM
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wiggum
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EB, you have a curious habit of ignoring my questions on threads. This is, by my count, the third time you've done it. (You still haven't answered my question on the Fedor thread; and there was another one a while back I cannot quite remember where you repeatedly ignored my questions - maybe the one after Frankie lost to Bendo). As such, I am going to put all of my questions in one easy post. I would appreciate answers, as they would help me better understand your opinion.

1. What was wrong with asking questions about how Overeem would fare against a champion wrestler? Had he EVER been tested against a decorated wrestler? I think Chuck was the closest thing to a decorated wrestler he ever fought. So raising questions about how he would deal with that proves that one is a Zuffa shill?

2. I've never asked this question to judge one's bonafides on the UG, but I've got to ask: do you train? If so, do you train with professional fighters?

I ask because it seems to me that you think fighters and promoters have one job: to please 'hardcore fans' (whom you define as anyone who agrees with you and has been watching since the 90s). The sense of entitlement and elitism is mind-blowing.

I'm 23. My brother and I have been watching since UFC 1. MMA has played a crucial part in my life: it got me into wrestling, which, in turn, got me into college. I watch as both a fan and a competitor; a competitor, friend and teammate to many of the fighters I watch on TV.

The sport owes me nothing - I owe it much, though. I owe it more of my blood, more of my sweat. I owe it that I spread it (and wrestling) to younger generations and that I honor it. I am happy when the sport attracts new fans. I think there is something inherently good in combat sports, and the more people turned onto the human drama that is fighting, the better.

Finally, the more fans, the more fighters can reasonably expect to make a living from it.

But it seems you think the fighters fight for you. They don't. And if you trained with professionals, I can't imagine you'd have the same attitude. But I may be wrong.

3. This is why you hate Zuffa, right?

-They have the person who has earned the #1 contender position fight the champion
-They put on too many shows - we see too many fights!
-They have lame music
-They have lame posters
-Frankie Edgar's corner told him, that he had to keep scoring, which meant, "keep punching him in his face.

So you want it to be more like professional wrestling, right?
3/27/12 5:17 PM
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chokeyou
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Chris27 - 
chokeyou - Much love for EatBEAV

No clue why all you clowns are attacking him.

SO many of you defend zuffa like its your child and thats weird.

As a fan of the sport, i love what Zuffa has done and hate it all at the same time. I like it that i can see more fights but a lot of the time hate the fights i see. ALSO, so many fighters don't like how they have been treated and that begs to question their practices...




Is there a difference between someone who always defends Zuffa like its their child and someone who hates them and bashes them like Zuffa killed their child?

Whats the difference? is one being a shill and the other being a real fan?

What fights are you seeing that you hate? UFC cards have been dam good lately other than the Fox show, recent PPV have been good with good fights and the Fuel and FX cards have also been good. Sure every fight isnt gonna be good and every card wont be great but I dont get hating the fights I see line.




I read his entire post and didnt find it overly critical.

I liked Pride better. Its gone. I'll live. I don't love the trend of being excited for 1 maybe 2 fights. And the PPV numbers seem to side with my personal tastes.

Does anyone defend the marketing? The posters he showed (i felt) well represented his position.

Have we de-evolved to place where you aren't allowed to critique at all?
3/27/12 5:18 PM
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chokeyou
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DamnSevern - 
chokeyou - Much love for EatBEAV

No clue why all you clowns are attacking him.

SO many of you defend zuffa like its your child and thats weird.

 why is he attacking other forum members?

 You're defending him like he's your child<br type="_moz" />


LOL

Clearly she's my daughter...
3/27/12 5:19 PM
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UGCTT_LnPninja
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 Epic meltdown is epic




ZOMG you're all n00000000bs!!!! You don't hate Dana/Zuffa and you don't think they ruined MMA!!!!Anyone who does not agree with me is a faggot!!! - EB
3/27/12 5:23 PM
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UGCTT_LnPninja
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Edited: 03/27/12 5:23 PM
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wiggum - 

I'm 23. My brother and I have been watching since UFC 1. 

 Either this is a typo...or you have been watching MMA since you were 4 or 5 years old...?


Other than that great post. I will wager that EB dicktucks your questions all together, or replies to them with lame deflection responses. (likely questions back at you like she normally does)
  
3/27/12 5:24 PM
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wiggum
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UGCTT_LnPninja - 
wiggum - 

I'm 23. My brother and I have been watching since UFC 1. 

 Either this is a typo...or you have been watching MMA since you were 2-4 years old...?


Other than that great post. I will wager that EB dicktucks your questions all together, or replies to them with lame deflection responses. (likely questions back at you like she normally does)<br type="_moz" /> 


Since I was about 5-6. I grew up in a rough home and my brother and I escaped by watching shit like the UFC and WWF. Even at such a young age.
3/27/12 5:26 PM
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Chris27
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UGCTT_LnPninja - 
wiggum - 

I'm 23. My brother and I have been watching since UFC 1. 

 Either this is a typo...or you have been watching MMA since you were 4 or 5 years old...?


Other than that great post. I will wager that EB dicktucks your questions all together, or replies to them with lame deflection responses. (likely questions back at you like she normally does)<br type="_moz" />  


He probably meant he is 33.
3/27/12 5:29 PM
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D241
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 God Damn Wiggum!!!

It's fucking CRAZY that you're only 23. I mean I believe you, but fuck man, usually it's the other way around.

Usually it's a newer join date saying they're older and have been watching for a long time.

You've been watching for a long time, and are still a youngin.

Always appreciate your input and that was when i thought you were my age or older. I'll tell you I damn sure didn't know as much about mma at 23 as you do that's for fucking sure.
3/27/12 5:33 PM
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wiggum
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D241 -  God Damn Wiggum!!!

It's fucking CRAZY that you're only 23. I mean I believe you, but fuck man, usually it's the other way around.

Usually it's a newer join date saying they're older and have been watching for a long time.

You've been watching for a long time, and are still a youngin.

Always appreciate your input and that was when i thought you were my age or older. I'll tell you I damn sure didn't know as much about mma at 23 as you do that's for fucking sure.


Thanks - the feeling is mutual.

I've kept my anonymity on this forum for a couple reasons. Namely, I don't ever want to give the impression that I speak for my coach, my friends, or my teammates.

What I will say is that I've been blessed to wrestle for some of the best coaches on Earth (literally); wrestle with some of the best wrestlers on Earth; be teammates with world champion fighters; and be coached by some of the best MMA coaches on Earth.

That experience has widened my vision, for sure.
3/27/12 5:45 PM
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sparkuri
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chokeyou - 
sparkuri - 
chokeyou - 
sparkuri - 
overEZ - EATON - amazing analysis. Thank you for keeping this forum worth visiting!

my favorite part is when you discuss the difference between 'Credible fighters' and 'Superstars'.

QUESTION:

Do you think Chael Sonnen is the UFC's biggest Superstar, and if not who is? What has the UFC done or not done to create the Chael Sonnen we know today, and where does he fit into the UFC business model?

 I'd like to field this question.

The UFC's biggest superstar is Dana White, followed way, way back by Anderson Silva, George St.Pierre, Brock Lesnar(still) and then maybe Chael Sonnen.
The Chael Sonnen of today has been created by Chael Sonnen, on Chael Sonnen's night, on Chael Sonnen's mic, on Chael Sonnen's channel...........interviewed by Chael.
How does he fit into the business model ???
However TF he wants.


If he were a real star TUF numbers wouldn't be so poor.


 Without him, they'd be.....
..<img width="425" height="425" id="il_fi" style="padding-top: 8px; padding-right: 8px; padding-bottom: 8px;" src="http://www.partysuppliesuk.co.uk/images/T/A1374401.jpg" alt="" />


I was a fan before Zuffa bought it, so i have to disagree.



 I was referring to TUF numbers : )
3/27/12 5:48 PM
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CindyO
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Edited: 03/27/12 6:11 PM
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mrwhipple - 
RJJH - 
Howard Liu - Great write up EatonBeever! I have just a couple of things to add to your tome that the newer MMA/UFC fan may not be aware of.

1.) The dark or banned from cable tv ppv years for the UFC and MMA was orchestrated clandestinely by organized Boxing via Senator John McCain. At that time, Boxing's biggest American sponsor and benefactor was Anheuser Busch (Budweiser), and Senator John McCain's wife's family was/is the biggest Anheuser Busch distributer in Arizona. Feeling that the upstart UFC was a threat to it's popularity, organized Boxing, through it's biggest corporate sponsor "encouraged" Senator John McCain to get on his soap box to discredit the UFC and MMA as "human cock-fighting", and pressured the major domestic cable companies to ban the broadcasting of MMA events. Only satelite tv carried them and at that time, most households had cable, not satelite.

2.) The sale of the UFC from SEG to ZUFFA was a very ugly episode that foretold how the new owners really operated. Once the cable ban was lifted, SEG tried to get the UFC legitimate in the eyes of the sporting mainstream. The best way to do this was to get sanctioned in Nevada, where Boxing settled in many decades ago. <b>The Nevada State Athletic Commission denied SEG a license to operate there. One of the Commissioner's that voted against SEG was......LORENZO FERTITA. Without sanctioning, SEG UFC was dead in the water, and put up for sale. Immediately Lorenzo Fertita and Mark Keizer resigned as Nevada State Athletic Commissioners.</b>

Once Zuffa finalized the purchase of the UFC, the new owners hired Mark Keizer as a consultant.  Zuffa UFC then re-applied for sanctioning in Nevada. And everybody knows the rest of the story.
I didnt know this. wow, thats shady shit.

That's actually not accurate. It's already been covered that their never was a vote against the UFC by Lorenzo. The vote was delayed and they entered an exploratory phase. Still, there is a lot of suspicious stuff there. Lorenzo resigned from the commission in early fall of 2000, the UFC went on sale, bought it in early 2001 and in three months had the NSAC agreeing to sanction it, and it was fully sanctioned by Summer of 2001. That's a pretty fast past when before it took them two years just to look into it. Throw in the fact that they hired Marc Ratner, a fellow commission member shortly thereafter is even more suspicious. Lets just say a former state official making decisions on a company that it will purchase and then have the decisions made about the future of that company by his old commission buddies is a serious conflict of interest.

There's a lot I dislike about the way Zuffa runs thing. Their contracts are heavily tilted in their favor. They push Dana and the brand over the fighters. They use their power to bully sponsors, fighters, and managers. And yet, look at all the other promotions - Pride, Dream, M-1 - just as bad if not much worse. The fight biz is just really dirty and while Zuffa isn't clean I'll admit they've done a lot more for building up the UFC then I ever would have expected.

 That's actually not accurate. It's already been covered that their never was a vote against the UFC by Lorenzo. The vote was delayed and they entered an exploratory phase.

There was never a vote scheduled. It was the first time the UFC had been introduced to the NSAC. It's laughable that folks would believe a sanctioning body would approve a foreign sport (to them) with very few rules when two men climb into a cage to beat the crap out of each other, no questions asked.

Still, there is a lot of suspicious stuff there. Lorenzo resigned from the commission in early fall of 2000, the UFC went on sale, bought it in early 2001 and in three months had the NSAC agreeing to sanction it, and it was fully sanctioned by Summer of 2001.

Lorenzo left the commission while Meyrowitz was still holding events and before M ever decided he wanted to sell the UFC. Zuffa got it because they were the highest bidders. Lorenzo left because he became President of Station Casinos.

And the UFC under Zuffa had to run 3 shows on their own before Nevada would sanction them. They bought it in 1/01 and the first NV event was in September (8 months, not 3).

That's a pretty fast past when before it took them two years just to look into it.

Meyrowitz met with the commission in April 1999. The NSAC formed a committee to research the UFC and the sport of MMA and Lorenzo was on the team. They watched hours and hours of footage, attended live events (UFC shows and some smaller ones) familiarized themselves with the rules, injuries, scoring, necessary training for commission personnel, budgeting, etc. None of this was completed before Lorenzo left the commission in the fall of 2000 or before Meyrowitz decided to sell it in December 2000. It took until September 2001 before NV sanctioned it. See page 6 for sources and links.

Throw in the fact that they hired Marc Ratner, a fellow commission member shortly thereafter is even more suspicious.

Zuffa bought the UFC in January 2000. They hired Marc Ratner in May of 2006. How is 6 years suspicious?

Lets just say a former state official making decisions on a company that it will purchase and then have the decisions made about the future of that company by his old commission buddies is a serious conflict of interest.

But since it didn't happen there isn't a conflict of interest, right?

There's a lot I dislike about the way Zuffa runs thing. Their contracts are heavily tilted in their favor. They push Dana and the brand over the fighters. They use their power to bully sponsors, fighters, and managers. And yet, look at all the other promotions - Pride, Dream, M-1 - just as bad if not much worse. The fight biz is just really dirty and while Zuffa isn't clean I'll admit they've done a lot more for building up the UFC then I ever would have expected.

Me too! I thought they would fold... whew!


Cindy 
3/27/12 5:51 PM
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dudefromisrael
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Eaton, DS is great. Relax a little
3/27/12 5:55 PM
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chokeyou
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sparkuri - 
chokeyou - 
sparkuri - 
chokeyou - 
sparkuri - 
overEZ - EATON - amazing analysis. Thank you for keeping this forum worth visiting!

my favorite part is when you discuss the difference between 'Credible fighters' and 'Superstars'.

QUESTION:

Do you think Chael Sonnen is the UFC's biggest Superstar, and if not who is? What has the UFC done or not done to create the Chael Sonnen we know today, and where does he fit into the UFC business model?

 I'd like to field this question.

The UFC's biggest superstar is Dana White, followed way, way back by Anderson Silva, George St.Pierre, Brock Lesnar(still) and then maybe Chael Sonnen.
The Chael Sonnen of today has been created by Chael Sonnen, on Chael Sonnen's night, on Chael Sonnen's mic, on Chael Sonnen's channel...........interviewed by Chael.
How does he fit into the business model ???
However TF he wants.


If he were a real star TUF numbers wouldn't be so poor.


 Without him, they'd be.....
..<img width="425" height="425" id="il_fi" style="padding-top: 8px; padding-right: 8px; padding-bottom: 8px;" src="http://www.partysuppliesuk.co.uk/images/T/A1374401.jpg" alt="" />


I was a fan before Zuffa bought it, so i have to disagree.



 I was referring to TUF numbers : )



TUF numbers are terrible.


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