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Canada UnderGround >> Membership fee's?


6/30/12 1:01 PM
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club kozak
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sorry, not OJA...OGA
6/30/12 5:23 PM
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aguzzi
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The AGQ is sanctioning NAGA in Montreal on July 14.

www.grapplingquebec.com
7/1/12 6:10 PM
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club kozak
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Nice!
7/4/12 10:25 AM
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dantheman
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I support wiley in his search for answers re: this insurance fee matter for Ontario grappling / BJJ tournaments.

Let's look objectively at this.

The "fee" is paid by the competitor, the competitor receives no subsequent information regarding the insurance, and no contact from the organization nor insurance provider for that matter.

Here is how work place insurance works.

When you are in the work place and the employer has insurance benefits that you pay for from your paycheques, you are given massive brochures to take home, an ID card, and a hotline to call for insurance and claim related questions.

There appears to be no transparency when it comes to Ontario tournaments.
7/4/12 2:38 PM
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trianglegrrl
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I might be wrong, but if I recall correctly all provincial sports organizations are required to offer insurance to their members.
7/4/12 3:05 PM
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Phil999
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engineer - You know what, I talked my fair share of crap about OJA and the membership fee, and while I still don't understand exactly where my money goes, at least you guys put out great tournaments and you are present on facebook and forums like these.

The same cannot be said about OGA. I had to pull out of GQ due to an injury and I'm waiting for exactly one week for someone to inform me how and when I can expect a refund. No words from them at all! So now when I get my money back I will definitely avoid OGA events in the future.


your quite the lurker. 2 posts since 2007.
7/5/12 12:03 AM
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GringoBR
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dantheman : the answer can be found attending the AGM. There are a lot to be done on the OJA , and a lot was done already , there are people working on a better website with lots of information at this time.

BTW when you and other people say you pay for insurance you are giving the wrong information to everyone. You pay to be member of the association. It cost money to do the administration , it cost money to build websites, it cost money to hire a lawyer to go over all the documents the ministry ask us to have AND insurance cost money too.

There is a lot to be done and a few people helping the OJA so hold tied we are building something nice.
7/5/12 8:25 AM
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wiley
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Is the OJA a recognized "provincial sports organization" any more?

What insurance is required to be given to all members? I would love to know the coverage.

So fees help protect/insure the OJA against any claims brought on by the competitor themselves. Odd when almost all competitors think they have some type of insurance coverage when they pay that membership fee.
7/5/12 9:00 AM
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thats g
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ive been to most of these tourneys over the last 5 years and i cant remember a single person getting hurt (knock knock), but there must have been someone, shit happens.
does anyone know of an injury that occured during an event and how the oja/oga was involved?
7/5/12 9:01 AM
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dantheman
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Gringo

Once the date is set for the 2012 AGM, I would be interested in attending.

please keep us all informed

D
7/5/12 9:22 AM
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wiley
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I once saw a guy get his arm broken badly before the OJA even sanctioned events, and it was one of their events in Milton (long, long ago). I believe that competitor has never really returned to mats in the same capacity and is no longer training. I remember the fighter who did the breaking too, as he is a machine and well known BB now (not disrespecting that person).

People are always getting choked out unconscious all the time, people are popping shoulders, injuring their elbows.

Injuries happen and its only a matter of time until someone injured wants to know what their OJA insurance coverage is.

Why cant it be posted here for the community to know? Why must someone go to the AGM to get info? The site has no info about competitor coverage due to injury/death/disfigurement/etc... They advertise their tournies here so then post the coverage competitors get for their dues/fees.

They take time to make threads about tournies, and post here with useless info.

POST some info here in this thread or create an other thread with the info! Copy and Paste the info, provide a pdf link.

Stop giving us bull%^it answers and provide some info right here right now!

7/5/12 9:38 AM
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wiley
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This isnt really meant to be a knock on peoples hard efforts and commitment. Tournies have grown, people are competing, the tournies are more professional, all that was promised long ago.

I just want to know about fees, insurance, coverage and simply posting that info for your competitors to see. It's being transparent, avocating on their behalf and providing very useful information.

So post some info!
7/5/12 11:47 AM
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thats g
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so this guy with the broken arm did he miss work, did he need rehab, did he have any kind of medical insurance. arent these the things that the tourneys should cover?

gringo- so when you say we are paying only to be member of the association, so there is no insurance?
and the money goes to administration , it cost money to build websites, it cost money to hire a lawyer to go over all the documents the ministry ask us to have AND insurance cost money too.

so correct if im wrong, there is no insurance, if you get hurt your on your own. the money paid allows you to be a member of the association which allows you to compete at an oja event?
7/5/12 2:02 PM
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wiley
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From OJA Policy & Procedue Manual:

B. Member Clubs
2. Upon registration of the Club – the Owner/operator is responsible for registering their current individual members. Only individual registered members are covered under the insurance policy.

"So if someone is not from a registered club but has paid their OJA membership fee there technically arent covered by any OJA insurance?"

7. Once a club membership expires, all individual members (coaches, instructors, athletes, officials, recreational members) are no longer members of the OJA and are no longer covered under the OJA insurance policy. It is the sole responsibility of the club Owner/Operator to communicate to their individual members whenever they are no longer covered by the OJA insurance policy.

"If an individuals club isnt an OJA member but they've paid their membership fee they still arent covered by the OJA because their club isnt a member? "

7/5/12 3:58 PM
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thats g
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so their is insurance, but me and my club need to be registered in order to claim it, didnt know about the club membership thing, why club and individual?
wtf does that mean?
you dont have to belong to any school in order to compete, it happens every tourney. so competitors who are self taught or cant afford to join a club are never insured, that doesnt sound right.
7/5/12 4:28 PM
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GringoBR
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wiley.

calm down bro. I am not hiding any information from you or from people from this forum, I am actually the only one here representing an association trying to explain how it works, so calm down. I never gave a straight answer for the insurance because I don't have the answer. Once I have I will provide, Insurance is a pain in the ass to understand and I am gringo, that makes things even more complicated. I am just a board member and I dont deal with the insurance company and policies. on our next meeting I will bring those question up and get the answers for you. Again, attending the AGM and making those question would be good as well case you have problem waiting for the answers.

AGM dates , this was not set until today, will give more information as soon as I have.

thats g: I never said there is no insurance, I need to get information about this item, I said there are more than just insurance to be paid.
About the club membership , this is valid for club only , not for tournaments, your club can have insurance with the OJA, and if you get hurt training you can use the insurance with the OJA, again , I dont have more details, I am not the person that deals with insurance. All I know is that clubs can have insurance using the OJA policy and all members of the club must be members.
7/5/12 4:57 PM
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thats g
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gringo i appreciate your efforts in trying to clear this up i really do. the way i see it your the face of the oja, you are the one who holds these tourneys, i may be wrong but thats the perception, and if you dont have the answers who does, please invite that person to join in on this thread.
i still have a bunch of questions but it seems wasted putting them here.
7/5/12 6:17 PM
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moemar
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dont forget to ttt. Big Rig Phone Post
7/5/12 7:01 PM
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GringoBR
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thats g.

I don't run all those tournaments, I help all the OJA tournaments , I only run the Ontario Open. But yes you will see me working as hard in all OJA tournament as I work on mine and maybe this gives people the perception that I run them all.

The OJA was a traditional Jiu JItsu (japanese) before the ministry asked we BJJ to join them to make it only one association, before there were 2 (OJA and BJJO). We join and today we deal with people from japanese JJ to make this martial art / sport more organized and to have the recognition of the ministry. Since we joined them a lot have changed , you can see the change on how much the tournaments got better. There are a lot to be done yet, but we are doing slowly. We are only a few volunteers doing everything.

the insurance is a black box for me as well.

the insurance seems to be what people are more concerned and i will find the answer, what is important to say is that when u pay $25 per year is to keep the association working , yes , insurance is one part of it, but there is all other items that any other 'company' need to pay as well.
7/6/12 8:38 AM
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Dougie
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 I don't pay for a membership in any club that doesn't give me a cool patch to put on my gi.

I simply won't. That's how I roll.
7/6/12 9:37 AM
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wiley
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This was never meant as a personal attack on the few who are working hard to improve BJJ in Ontario. Things have definetly chnaged for the better.

This is info that should be shared, or provided to members prior to competition.

People have emial address', Facebook, Tumblr, Goggle+, there's this forum, there pamphlets etc...

Once the info is available, make it available to us.

In the words of a famous song sung by Johnny Cash & June Carter Cash, "Times a Wastin"

I've been asking for this type of info since the dawn of the OJA taking over long, long ago.......
7/6/12 9:52 AM
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wiley
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OJA "Policy & Procedure"
I. Program Polices
A. Provincial Sporting Organization (PSO)

8. The PSO is required to conduct annual general meetings (AGM) each year within 60 days of the end of the calendar year.

So the OJA is 4 months behind on having their AGM. AGM by these Policies & Procedures was to have taken place in Jan or Feb.

7/6/12 12:14 PM
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bjjfighter19
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Wow, Hi Jason I see you are up to no good again :)

For those of you who don’t know Wiley is Jason, a brown belt that trains at Joslin`s. Has been around a looong time , and has been through the bad times of the BJJ scene (pre 2003), but has also not competed in quite a long time due to some unfortunate injuries, which leaves me to wonder ….. why so interested in an insurance policy you have no plans to use or benefit from as you are not a member ?

I agree, all members should have access to the policy for their viewing. Like an earlier post said “ you work for a company, they have benefits which are made available to you at work or online”, but not on some underground forum. The members who have inquired about this issue have been given a copy of the policy via email. The amount of people that have inquired about this is small but they have been answered. I competed under this association last March, yet I myself can’t be bothered to look through it as it is in lawyer language and like Fernando, I cannot fully understand it, Lol.

Your claim that the policy only covers the tournament organizers against lawsuits from injured competitors is totally not true. Each member is covered equally and from each other. As for paying your wages while you are off work, you are on your own in this regard. You chose to compete, nobody dragged you there to do so, shoulder some responsibility in this regard.

The AGM is scheduled for some time in January each year and is open to members only. When an actual date is set, I will be happy to post it here. But I can tell you that I have been going to the AGM for the last 8yrs now, and can count on 1 hand the amount of people from the BJJ community that has shown up to help with setting of the rules, administration issues, spending of funds, voting members to the board etc. On many occasions I have tried to encourage members to go and have failed, so I have given up trying so I kind of chuckle when I see threads like this and usually don’t bother to post. But when you said the insurance only covers the promoter’s ass, I felt I had to correct that statement. Many years later we have a great group of BJJ people currently on the board and due to this, the events are top notch now. The association is not perfect but if you have something to add to help improve what we are doing the AGM is the place to express your point …… if you’re serious that is.

Now it is only fair if I put Jason`s name out there, I should finish with mine

Tony Isaacs, but in the famous words of Alberto Del Rio “ you already know that ” :)


7/6/12 12:28 PM
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bjjfighter19
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"They take time to make threads about tournies"

to be clear, the events are sanctioned by the association not run, getting people to come and support you event is the promoters responsibility not the associations..... so where do you expect the event organizer to post their event.???

I dont see NAGA, GQ , IBJJF, Abu Dhabi, OGA insurance policies on here, all of which run events here.



7/6/12 12:29 PM
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bjjfighter19
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" I don't pay for a membership in any club that doesn't give me a cool patch to put on my gi."

- working on your request Dougie !

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