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UnderGround Forums >> Couture: Tactical roles reversed for Silva/Sonnen


6/28/12 12:29 PM
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Underground Blog
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MixedMartialArts.com
 

"It's kind of odd," Couture told MMA Fighting at his Xtreme Couture facility recently in Las Vegas, Nevada. "Normally I would say that the onus is on the guy who won the first fight to anticipate the changes the loser is going to make and get the same outcome."

"If you look at Anderson and Chael, Anderson won by triangle choke with two minutes left. He didn't really win the fight. He got his ass whooped - literally - for four-plus rounds," Couture continued, "but it's almost like he was the guy that won. He wants it to go the same minus the triangle."

read entire article...


6/28/12 12:44 PM
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Wasa-B
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i respect randy's opinion on the game, he usu doesnt troll and is pretty honest imo but a sub is a sub and a ko is a ko.

i feel kinda stupid but im gonna have to address randy the same way we address chael fans - if andy got his ass whooped, chael was left tapping out in mercy and calling the ref to take andy off him.

if there was no ref intervention/stoppage, andy could have literally killed chael where chael the "whooping" gave andy never came close to a fight finish.
6/28/12 1:08 PM
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Yelm
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 Maybe Randy judges ass-whoopings a little differently than I do.  Anderson had barely a mark on him.  Plus he tapped out.
6/28/12 1:09 PM
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MagSlim
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Disagree with Randy.

Chael 'dominated the fight' in terms of winning rounds on MMA rules, but even if Anderson hadn't triangled him he still did more damage to Chael than Chael did to him.

Look at the pics of their faces after the fight. Chael was a bloody mess from Anderson catching him a few times and beating him up from the bottom.

Chael threw pillow punches from the top to avoid a standup. Anderson looked totally fine after "the most punches landed in a UFC fight eva" or whatever. No cuts, no swelling.

Team Quest trollin' y'all.
6/28/12 1:10 PM
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OctagonJitters
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Wasa-B - i respect randy's opinion on the game, he usu doesnt troll and is pretty honest imo but a sub is a sub and a ko is a ko.

i feel kinda stupid but im gonna have to address randy the same way we address chael fans - if andy got his ass whooped, chael was left tapping out in mercy and calling the ref to take andy off him.

if there was no ref intervention/stoppage, andy could have literally killed chael where chael the "whooping" gave andy never came close to a fight finish.


That's all well and good but none of this really applies to what Randy is talking about in the clip. Randy's just saying that normally when there is a rematch the guy who loses is the one who is likely coming in with a different game plan since it didn't work the first time around. In this instance though, Chael's gameplan is basically the same, but just don't get armbarred in the final minutes of the fight. He's not saying it wasn't a valid win for Anderson, just that it's likely Anderson who will be the one looking to have a different sort of fight this time around, not Chael. Which is usally what the guy who lost the first time wants, not the guy who won.
6/28/12 1:11 PM
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ABE FROMAN
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Way to prop up your Team Quest buddy, Randy.


6/28/12 1:11 PM
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jonflesh
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Wasa-B - i respect randy's opinion on the game, he usu doesnt troll and is pretty honest imo but a sub is a sub and a ko is a ko.

i feel kinda stupid but im gonna have to address randy the same way we address chael fans - if andy got his ass whooped, chael was left tapping out in mercy and calling the ref to take andy off him.

if there was no ref intervention/stoppage, andy could have literally killed chael where chael the "whooping" gave andy never came close to a fight finish.
I think Randy's point is usually when u lose a fight, you go back to the drawing board so to speak and try to figure out a new strategy to beat that opponent. Chael doesn't have to do that and will be trying to do the exact same thing this time around he did last time except avoid the submission in the end. It's Anderson who needs the fight to go differently and usually that is not the case for someone who won the fight Phone Post
6/28/12 1:12 PM
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jonflesh
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OctagonJitters -
Wasa-B - i respect randy's opinion on the game, he usu doesnt troll and is pretty honest imo but a sub is a sub and a ko is a ko.

i feel kinda stupid but im gonna have to address randy the same way we address chael fans - if andy got his ass whooped, chael was left tapping out in mercy and calling the ref to take andy off him.

if there was no ref intervention/stoppage, andy could have literally killed chael where chael the "whooping" gave andy never came close to a fight finish.


That's all well and good but none of this really applies to what Randy is talking about in the clip. Randy's just saying that normally when there is a rematch the guy who loses is the one who is likely coming in with a different game plan since it didn't work the first time around. In this instance though, Chael's gameplan is basically the same, but just don't get armbarred in the final minutes of the fight. He's not saying it wasn't a valid win for Anderson, just that it's likely Anderson who will be the one looking to have a different sort of fight this time around, not Chael. Which is usally what the guy who lost the first time wants, not the guy who won.
Beat me to it. Phone Post
6/28/12 1:22 PM
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supersonic
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Silva got close with a few kill shots standing the first fight. They missed slightly and Chael is a durable guy. Andersons gameplan may be pretty much the same as well, but will certailny be more aware of Sonnens charging forward style.

Both guys will try to fight the same fight as last time more or less imo
6/28/12 1:25 PM
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UGCTT_Fillthy
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birdo - Yeah Randy, but in a real fight, there wouldn't have been a referee to keep Chael from going unconscious


And in a real fight there wouldn't have been a referee to stand them up every 5 minutes.

You can't see it, but I'm rolling my eyes at your post.
6/28/12 1:33 PM
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KH Johnsen
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OctagonJitters -
Wasa-B - i respect randy's opinion on the game, he usu doesnt troll and is pretty honest imo but a sub is a sub and a ko is a ko.

i feel kinda stupid but im gonna have to address randy the same way we address chael fans - if andy got his ass whooped, chael was left tapping out in mercy and calling the ref to take andy off him.

if there was no ref intervention/stoppage, andy could have literally killed chael where chael the "whooping" gave andy never came close to a fight finish.


That's all well and good but none of this really applies to what Randy is talking about in the clip. Randy's just saying that normally when there is a rematch the guy who loses is the one who is likely coming in with a different game plan since it didn't work the first time around. In this instance though, Chael's gameplan is basically the same, but just don't get armbarred in the final minutes of the fight. He's not saying it wasn't a valid win for Anderson, just that it's likely Anderson who will be the one looking to have a different sort of fight this time around, not Chael. Which is usally what the guy who lost the first time wants, not the guy who won.
Finally somebody with some common sense and the ability to listen and understand.
Thank you sir. Phone Post
6/28/12 1:37 PM
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The Metal
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birdo - Yeah Randy, but in a real fight, there wouldn't have been a referee to keep Chael from going unconscious
It wasn't a real fight now is it, hate that point because it is irrelevant Phone Post
6/28/12 1:59 PM
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8flat
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You guys are missing his point, he's saying Chael want's this fight to go exactly the same way except not make that one little mistake he made at the end of the last fight. Typically, a loser doesn't want the 2nd fight to go the same way, but this is different since Sonnen dominated 90% of the first fight. Hell, he had 10-8 rounds on the scorecards!
6/28/12 2:06 PM
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mijo
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Randy saying this does not surprise me. Chael is a Team Couture guy!
6/28/12 2:12 PM
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Ansari
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8flat - You guys are missing his point, he's saying Chael want's this fight to go exactly the same way except not make that one little mistake he made at the end of the last fight. Typically, a loser doesn't want the 2nd fight to go the same way, but this is different
6/28/12 2:19 PM
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bemsqua
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Couture talked about this fight objectively.....Sonnen kicked his ass until he got caught. Now, Couture is a troll.......some of you people are unbelievable.


Let the Couture hate continue....
6/28/12 2:26 PM
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Humboldt
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He's right. Not about the ass whooping part, that is just Randy towing the co line.

Silva is going to fight a much different fight this time. This will not be a sport fight, it's going to be an ass whooping. I believe Silva was genuine in his comments, he is going to f*ck Chael up with malicious intent. He won't be looking for the finish, he will be looking to punish this fool.

War Andy! Phone Post
6/28/12 2:32 PM
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Jored1990
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For Anderson to take that punishment and still win he is obviously tough as fuck,haven't seen the fight in awhile but wasn't Chael bouncing Anderson's head off the matt like a basketball at one point.

Can't wait for the rematch be interested to see the outcome this time around since Andersons rib was apparently fucked first time around
6/28/12 2:32 PM
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UGCTT_Fillthy
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MMAFAN695 -
You do know Silva has a vicious up-kick don't you?


lol.

You do know that Chael trains with Yushin Okami?
And that he grew up on the mean streets of West Linn?

:)

Obviously you get the point that it's a fight game, and not a fight. Respect.

Back on topic, I can't believe all the Andy nut-huggers bashing on Randy for providing objective insight into the mental perspective of the fighters.
6/28/12 2:39 PM
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bemsqua
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From an Anderson Silva fan's perspective, Bradley won every round of the Pacman fight, Condit dominated every aspect of the Diaz fight, Silva beat Sonnen convincingly and Silva looked magnificent in the Maia fight.

If you have the nerve to even think otherwise.....you be trolling.
6/28/12 2:59 PM
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prodigypenn
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MagSlim - Disagree with Randy.

Chael 'dominated the fight' in terms of winning rounds on MMA rules, but even if Anderson hadn't triangled him he still did more damage to Chael than Chael did to him.

Look at the pics of their faces after the fight. Chael was a bloody mess from Anderson catching him a few times and beating him up from the bottom.

Chael threw pillow punches from the top to avoid a standup. Anderson looked totally fine after "the most punches landed in a UFC fight eva" or whatever. No cuts, no swelling.

Team Quest trollin' y'all.



Just a small point some fighters, dependant on their skin and complexion simply cut,bruise or swell easier than others. Just saying.
6/28/12 3:20 PM
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UGCTT_FryedTakayama
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Ansari -
8flat - You guys are missing his point, he's saying Chael want's this fight to go exactly the same way except not make that one little mistake he made at the end of the last fight. Typically, a loser doesn't want the 2nd fight to go the same way, but this is different
. Phone Post
6/28/12 4:00 PM
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kevsh
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I have this feeling this fight is going to be over quick, as in less-than-a-minute quick.

I think Chael's going to charge in like last time, eat a knee, elbow, whatever, stumble back into the cage and Silva tees off on him, showboats a little, then watches Sonnen slump to the mat a bloodied and bruised mess.

I've been wrong before, in fact I don't think I've ever been right, but boldly I stand by this prediction.
6/28/12 4:28 PM
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12SixElbow
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Wasa-B - i respect randy's opinion on the game, he usu doesnt troll and is pretty honest imo but a sub is a sub and a ko is a ko.

i feel kinda stupid but im gonna have to address randy the same way we address chael fans - if andy got his ass whooped, chael was left tapping out in mercy and calling the ref to take andy off him.

if there was no ref intervention/stoppage, andy could have literally killed chael where chael the "whooping" gave andy never came close to a fight finish.

 All he was saying is that Anderson would rather NOT get beat up for 20 minutes,
Anderson would rather beat Sonnen up the whole time to punish him.


6/28/12 4:55 PM
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Chiron
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So tired of that ignorant "he didn't win the fight" attitude. Just goes to show much these messed up rules, ingorant judges, and lame pointfighters have distorted the perception of a fight. Yes, Anderson did win the fight. It's a fact. If that fight were happening outside the cage Anderson could've let Chael pass out and then killed him if he wanted to. Not being able to finish will usually cost you the victory sooner or later.

Yes, Anderson was LOSING most of the fight before the fight was over, but in the end he did come back and WIN. That's the funny thing about fighting, no matter how badly you losing, as long as there's still fight in you, with one strong move you can come back and end it to take the victory. Anderson finished Chael. That is the only true form of winning. It doesn't matter who was WINNING or LOSING because the task was not complete at that point. It isn't complete until someone has WINS or LOSES. The only real way to do that is to finish the opponent. Any true martial artist/fighter should understand that.

People are saying things like "Well, the triangle was an anomally and Chael should be able to beat Anderson up for 5 rounds next time." Well how do we know that Chael being able to go 5 rounds wasn't the anomally since he usually can't even go 3 against a BJJ black belt without getting submitted? People look too much at time and not enough at the substance of meaningful threatening actions.

Add to that the fact that Chael cheated so even if he won it would've been overruled. Randy's clearly just playing favorites for the wrestler here.

Ya, Anderson should work more on staying off the mat, but Chael has to work on his BJJ defense because he has to take it 5 rounds to win. Anderson only needs 1 second.

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