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S&C UnderGround >> Cardio....first thing in morning.


8/5/12 7:12 AM
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mkou
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True, I'm not training in a fasted state technically.
8/5/12 12:39 PM
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vermonter
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Edited: 08/05/12 12:39 PM
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I think always performing cardio in a post-absorptive (or worse yet, absorptive) state can stunt one's levels of beta-oxidative enzymes.

Practicing fasting is theoreticially a good thing for many reasons. My anecdotal evidence concurs.
8/8/12 4:36 AM
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Ninja mon
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Damn I wish I could wake up early and run. I do my running at night
8/8/12 8:36 AM
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CDarwin
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I do 1 hr walk in the morning every day and 1 hr walk around 4 pm if I have the time.

I do all this in a fasted state, eat some, go to the gym for weights and eat 3000 kcal between 5 pm and 1 am.

(leangains.com)
8/10/12 8:39 AM
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ
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8/10/12 1:05 PM
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LiftStrong
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Work has been hectic, so I havent been training in the morning, but I have experimented the past week with skipping my usual early breakfast. Usually I eat breakfast (eggs and some fruit) between 5-6am. This week I have been holding off on eating anything until 8-9am and for whatever reason I have way more energy (even in the office). Not sure why, but it has definitely been noticable. Just food (or lack thereof) for thought.
8/10/12 2:02 PM
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CDarwin
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LiftStrong - Work has been hectic, so I havent been training in the morning, but I have experimented the past week with skipping my usual early breakfast. Usually I eat breakfast (eggs and some fruit) between 5-6am. This week I have been holding off on eating anything until 8-9am and for whatever reason I have way more energy (even in the office). Not sure why, but it has definitely been noticable. Just food (or lack thereof) for thought.
On leangains.com frontpage there is a long article on cortisol levels during wake up and early breakfasts. I didn't study it in detail since it doesn't apply to me anymore, but maybe you could check it out. Phone Post
8/10/12 10:01 PM
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torquemada
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Since my son was born, I've been doing AM training again mostly to maximize the family time. I go in fasting; I do the same routine, same intensity and same diet as I did before.
In the past 6 weeks, I've dropped 4-5 lbs; I haven't used the calipers or anything, but it appears to be fat loss as I'm visually leaner and more vascular.
Anecdotal but my 2 cents.
8/12/12 8:56 AM
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ArthurKnoqOut
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 there's something very wishy about LeanGains dude...Cannot put my finger on it...yet
8/12/12 9:13 AM
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CDarwin
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ArthurKnoqOut -  there's something very wishy about LeanGains dude...Cannot put my finger on it...yet

The pics of him in a gi had me scratching my head too.
8/12/12 11:44 AM
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ArthurKnoqOut
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CDarwin - 
ArthurKnoqOut -  there's something very wishy about LeanGains dude...Cannot put my finger on it...yet

The pics of him in a gi had me scratching my head too.

  haha yes yes but I mean in as far as to this whole concept being "too good to be true"...I also noticed several people in that article's comment section talking about poor bloodwork and have seen similar comments elsewhere (bodybuilding.com and also in private conversations). I've not, however, heard those complaints with people who practice one day water fasts for example (or 24 hours, not necessarily one "day") 
8/13/12 8:39 PM
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Mihow
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I'm in my 3rd week of Insanity and doing it in the AM makes me tired as shit. Mostly because I hate cardio and besides riding my bike 3-4 hours a week and walking to work I don't get any. Not sure if their was a question, I just wanted to bitch.
8/14/12 7:50 AM
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ArthurKnoqOut
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 "if their was a question" <--- huh?

anyways, on IF people mostly promote either low-volume strength training or high intensity/ sprints/ intervals whatever....

Insanity would be very difficult to do on a fast for some and for others i'm sure they could do it....the problem with Martin and I will be doing a video on this, is that he skirts certain science aside in that Leangains.com article about breakfast (outside of simply stating for heavier/fatter individuals breakfast may work) and also represents certain findings to fit his own agenda....

case in point, cortisol is in fact highest in the morning, nobody would EVER argue, howeeevvvver unless it is a chronic condition, as is in the case of those who (he does mention this briefly but only for the sake of mentioning, not stating what I am saying) work 16 hour days for weeks on end. THAT is the true definition of a stressor. Cortisol is not the "stress response" that your body has when lifting...

http://www.unm.edu/~lkravitz/Article%20folder/growthhormone.html 

scroll down to Table 1...Epinephrine and Norepinephrine.


8/14/12 8:59 AM
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CDarwin
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ArthurKnoqOut -  "if their was a question" <--- huh?

anyways, on IF people mostly promote either low-volume strength training or high intensity/ sprints/ intervals whatever....

Insanity would be very difficult to do on a fast for some and for others i'm sure they could do it....the problem with Martin and I will be doing a video on this, is that he skirts certain science aside in that Leangains.com article about breakfast (outside of simply stating for heavier/fatter individuals breakfast may work) and also represents certain findings to fit his own agenda....

case in point, cortisol is in fact highest in the morning, nobody would EVER argue, howeeevvvver unless it is a chronic condition, as is in the case of those who (he does mention this briefly but only for the sake of mentioning, not stating what I am saying) work 16 hour days for weeks on end. THAT is the true definition of a stressor. Cortisol is not the "stress response" that your body has when lifting...

http://www.unm.edu/~lkravitz/Article%20folder/growthhormone.html 

scroll down to Table 1...Epinephrine and Norepinephrine.



Selective use of scientific research is the plague of easy access to it. That's why I rarely buy into anything outside my own expertise (which is nothing that relates to any of this!) on the positive side. Refuting things is much easier, and that type of argument is easier to accept. He does make some strong points debunking several myths imo, but I'm still not sold on the muscle building side of his method.

His (IF) method worked wonders for me in losing body fat, but the jury is out on the muscle gaining...
8/15/12 8:31 AM
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ArthurKnoqOut
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There's an entire class on research/ethics in research, that I had to take, probably one of the best classes of my life. 

This is also why I don't buy into broad/militant approaches. I am myself a vegan mostly yet in my nutrition practice NEVER recommend it to anyone unless they inquire about it and I give them all the tools to try it themselves....anywho, we're straying away from the point...

intense cardio/fasted state - try it for a week. good results? continue, bad results...continue anyway :P (J/K)
8/15/12 10:19 PM
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wdthedream
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It makes me feel better and gets me going in the morning . Eat a granola bar get a lil water in and I'm at it . Phone Post
8/17/12 3:54 AM
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RandomMan
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t
8/17/12 7:13 AM
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CDarwin
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I'm out walking now during lunchbreak. I'll eat in two hours.

I feel great, but my coworker had to break our meeting because he felt he was starving to death. He had breakfast. I didn't.

:) Phone Post
8/17/12 7:59 AM
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ArthurKnoqOut
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 It also depends on what you eat. I realize that Martin didn't write a 12,000 word paper like he first intended too but in all honesty, for scientifically inquiring minds such as myself, I'd rathr read the 12,000 word one. He kept saying post breakfast hunger and "SAD" but what about low insulin secreting breakfasts like oat BRAN (not the meal) and/or eggs (mostly protein and fat). So, it depends on what your mate ate. When I consume a kale/spinach/cucumber shake (virtually zero calories but extremely nutritionally dense) every morning followed by a bit of caffeine, I don't consider that breakfast yet my body feels great and energy levels are through the roof. In fact, I am about to do a kettlebell circuit at 7 am :D 
8/17/12 11:09 AM
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Mudderfaeg
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Does the stomach have to be COMPLETELY EMPTY? Can I take my pre-workout before the workout? Phone Post
8/18/12 10:28 PM
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ChaelPFan
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I get up drink a cup of coffee and run 6 miles, timed, 8 min sometimes sub pace. I love working out on an empty stomach, keeps me really lean and helps meals not sit in me because my metabolism is going from it. Phone Post
8/19/12 7:39 AM
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CDarwin
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Mudderfaeg - Does the stomach have to be COMPLETELY EMPTY? Can I take my pre-workout before the workout? Phone Post
If you are aiming at tapping into the fasted cardio benefits, you can't eat anything before other than BCAA supplement. Phone Post
8/19/12 7:37 PM
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ArthurKnoqOut
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CDarwin - 
Mudderfaeg - Does the stomach have to be COMPLETELY EMPTY? Can I take my pre-workout before the workout? Phone Post
If you are aiming at tapping into the fasted cardio benefits, you can't eat anything before other than BCAA supplement. Phone Post

  or coffee...even Martin from Leangains states that anything very low calorie (especially non-carb that won't trigger "anything more than a tiny bit of insulin") is fine. Fat is actually hormonally "neutral" so if you have some unsweetened almond/nut milk or raw cow milk (maybe a tablespoon) with your coffee it won't matter...

I've seen IF protocols that allow for green powders to be included so that your body has some nutrients for the day, and those protocols definitely have workd (for some as usual) 
8/26/12 9:19 AM
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Mudderfaeg
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ArthurKnoqOut - 
CDarwin - 
Mudderfaeg - Does the stomach have to be COMPLETELY EMPTY? Can I take my pre-workout before the workout? Phone Post
If you are aiming at tapping into the fasted cardio benefits, you can't eat anything before other than BCAA supplement. Phone Post

  or coffee...even Martin from Leangains states that anything very low calorie (especially non-carb that won't trigger "anything more than a tiny bit of insulin") is fine. Fat is actually hormonally "neutral" so if you have some unsweetened almond/nut milk or raw cow milk (maybe a tablespoon) with your coffee it won't matter...

I've seen IF protocols that allow for green powders to be included so that your body has some nutrients for the day, and those protocols definitely have workd (for some as usual) 

So I can't drink water either??
8/26/12 9:55 AM
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CDarwin
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Unless you are Muslim during Ramadan water is good during fast. Phone Post

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