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12/3/12 11:51 AM
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Zenoplata
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Drogon has become more and more uncontrollable. He kills innocents and pretty much just causes chaos. Plus we have Euron with his dragon horn - if he is going to take control of one of the dragons it will most certainly be Drogon.

I don't really think it's necessary for Dany to ride in on Drogon and conquer Westeros, I feel like something is goig to go wrong with her plans.

Euron is going to be one of the major players in this. He has the dragon horn, once had a dragon egg he claims he threw in the sea (which could mean any number of things, i.e. his payment to the Faceless men for killing his brother, perhaps he will have his own sea dragon, who knows), and I think most telling is when Tyrion asks Moqorro what he sees in his fires he replies;

"A tall and twisted thing with one black eye and ten long arms, sailing on a sea of blood". Saying he is the most dangerous of all.

12/3/12 11:55 AM
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Zenoplata
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Or if Tommen's cats signify the Lannisters and Balerion is Drogon is might just be that Drogon is going to come wreck them. Ser Pounce didn't kill Balerion, just scared him away - who knows, maybe Balerion comes back and shreds up all three of them.

I don't really buy into the "Balerion is being warged by Bloodraven/Rhaenys/Arya story." I don't think GRRM has too much unecessary warging going on.

12/3/12 11:56 AM
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Mencken
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The horn is how Dany tames Drogon, imo.  The inscription says 'I am Dragonbinder, No Mortal man should sound me and live, Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood"

 

Dany is not a mortal man, and there's even debate about her being mortal, given her going into the flame.  Further, the Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood can clearly be tied to Dany. 

12/3/12 12:10 PM
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Flyers179
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Mencken -

The horn is how Dany tames Drogon, imo.  The inscription says 'I am Dragonbinder, No Mortal man should sound me and live, Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood"

 

Dany is not a mortal man, and there's even debate about her being mortal, given her going into the flame.  Further, the Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood can clearly be tied to Dany. 

She is mortal, even with her ability to withstand flame she can still be hurt (George has even stated explicitly in interviews that her tolerance to flame is not how it is portrayed in the shows ie her hair being burned away). Just look at her at the end of DwD where she is all fucked up as she stumbles upon the Dothraki. Granted this isn't proof that she is not immortal, but GRRM has seemed to imply in his interviews that absolute immortality is a step too far. Phone Post
12/3/12 12:22 PM
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fob
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Mencken - 

The horn is how Dany tames Drogon, imo.  The inscription says 'I am Dragonbinder, No Mortal man should sound me and live, Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood"

 

Dany is not a mortal man, and there's even debate about her being mortal, given her going into the flame.  Further, the Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood can clearly be tied to Dany. 


It's gonna be like LOTR where she's a woman and not a man imo...

12/3/12 1:29 PM
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Mencken
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Flyers179 - 
Mencken -

The horn is how Dany tames Drogon, imo.  The inscription says 'I am Dragonbinder, No Mortal man should sound me and live, Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood"

 

Dany is not a mortal man, and there's even debate about her being mortal, given her going into the flame.  Further, the Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood can clearly be tied to Dany. 

She is mortal, even with her ability to withstand flame she can still be hurt (George has even stated explicitly in interviews that her tolerance to flame is not how it is portrayed in the shows ie her hair being burned away). Just look at her at the end of DwD where she is all fucked up as she stumbles upon the Dothraki. Granted this isn't proof that she is not immortal, but GRRM has seemed to imply in his interviews that absolute immortality is a step too far. Phone Post

I totally agree. I don't actually think she's immortal...but there arguably is the possibility.  Regardless, I think it hinges more on "man" than it does on "mortal"

12/3/12 1:52 PM
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homegrowncone
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Well, to be fair it is Victarion who has the horn now not Euron, and we don't really know if either of them are mortal.

Euron is very mysterious, and in Victarion's POV chapter where he gets his hand fixed it is the only time in the entire series (with the exception of warging) where the POV leaves the character and just kind of floats around outside the cabin like a ghost.

Maybe Victarion's already dead? Or Undead or whatever?

12/3/12 2:03 PM
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Zenoplata
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Or... perhaps it means that someone who is already dead has to blow the horn.

What is dead may never died. Perhaps Euron's lips are not just blue from the Shade of the Evening.

12/3/12 2:05 PM
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Mencken
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Why would Euron have his crew member blow the horn, knowing he'd die, when Euron could blow it freely himself?  I realize Euron is pretty uncaring about life, but that seems like a pretty silly waste of a guy that has been along for the crazy travels. 

12/3/12 2:07 PM
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10er4life
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How long until book 6 comes out?

Or how long until it is announced book 6 will actually be broken into two parts like aFfC and aDwD? Phone Post
12/3/12 2:08 PM
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Mencken
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10er4life -  How long until book 6 comes out?

Or how long until it is announced book 6 will actually be broken into two parts like aFfC and aDwD? Phone Post

Probably 2016 at teh rate he goes.  2014 is overly ambitious

12/3/12 2:11 PM
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Flyers179
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Mencken - 
Flyers179 - 
Mencken -

The horn is how Dany tames Drogon, imo.  The inscription says 'I am Dragonbinder, No Mortal man should sound me and live, Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood"

 

Dany is not a mortal man, and there's even debate about her being mortal, given her going into the flame.  Further, the Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood can clearly be tied to Dany. 

She is mortal, even with her ability to withstand flame she can still be hurt (George has even stated explicitly in interviews that her tolerance to flame is not how it is portrayed in the shows ie her hair being burned away). Just look at her at the end of DwD where she is all fucked up as she stumbles upon the Dothraki. Granted this isn't proof that she is not immortal, but GRRM has seemed to imply in his interviews that absolute immortality is a step too far. Phone Post

I totally agree. I don't actually think she's immortal...but there arguably is the possibility.  Regardless, I think it hinges more on "man" than it does on "mortal"


My mistake, and an interesting interpretation.

Martin always goes on about how 'The devil's in the details'.
12/3/12 2:14 PM
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dizz
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Mencken - 
Flyers179 - 
Mencken -

The horn is how Dany tames Drogon, imo.  The inscription says 'I am Dragonbinder, No Mortal man should sound me and live, Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood"

 

Dany is not a mortal man, and there's even debate about her being mortal, given her going into the flame.  Further, the Blood for Fire, Fire for Blood can clearly be tied to Dany. 

She is mortal, even with her ability to withstand flame she can still be hurt (George has even stated explicitly in interviews that her tolerance to flame is not how it is portrayed in the shows ie her hair being burned away). Just look at her at the end of DwD where she is all fucked up as she stumbles upon the Dothraki. Granted this isn't proof that she is not immortal, but GRRM has seemed to imply in his interviews that absolute immortality is a step too far. Phone Post

I totally agree. I don't actually think she's immortal...but there arguably is the possibility.  Regardless, I think it hinges more on "man" than it does on "mortal"


That'd be a nice little hat tip to the LOTR

12/3/12 2:36 PM
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Zenoplata
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Maybe Euron is unaware that he is the one that must blow the horn?

12/4/12 1:53 AM
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Zenoplata
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There is a passage where Tommen describes how Lady Whiskers stole a mouse Ser Pounce had caught. This furthermore makes me believe they are intended to symbolize Cersei and Jaime. Cersei ends up stealing Jaime's right to Castle Rock - in fact when Tommen tells the story she tells him how the strong take advantage of the weak. Once Jaime returned with his hand severed she is constantly describing him as weak and how she will use him etc.

I was also thinking, what if this is a more direct allusion to something? Varys use to describe his "little birds" as "little mice", there is a character named The Mad Mouse, and I believe Arya has been described as little mouse. It could be possible something happens where Arya comes to kill Cersei, Jaime catches her and intends to send her back to Winterfell before Cersei steals her from him.

Could be something else of course, but I think the kittens are a very intriguing symbol in the books.

12/4/12 2:02 AM
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Zenoplata
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Another thought I had.

The Direwolves represent the Stark children.

Grey Wind shared the same fate as Robb. Ghost and Jon Snow are linked in many ways, Lady's death represented Sansa's rise from a naive wannabe-princess to a legitimate player in the game, Shaggy Dog is wild and ill-tempered like Rickon and Summer acts similar to Bran.

So where is Nymeria? She was forced to flee in order to escape death - just as Arya was. But what happened after Nymeria fled? She slowly rose in power over the other wolves, gathering a horde of them to prowl the forests. if Arya is on her way back to Westeros, is it possible that she is the one that rallies the North as some sort of Joan of Arc type figure? There is always the possibility that she leads the wolves directly.

12/4/12 10:56 AM
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Mencken
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Zenoplata - 

Another thought I had.

The Direwolves represent the Stark children.

Grey Wind shared the same fate as Robb. Ghost and Jon Snow are linked in many ways, Lady's death represented Sansa's rise from a naive wannabe-princess to a legitimate player in the game, Shaggy Dog is wild and ill-tempered like Rickon and Summer acts similar to Bran.

So where is Nymeria? She was forced to flee in order to escape death - just as Arya was. But what happened after Nymeria fled? She slowly rose in power over the other wolves, gathering a horde of them to prowl the forests. if Arya is on her way back to Westeros, is it possible that she is the one that rallies the North as some sort of Joan of Arc type figure? There is always the possibility that she leads the wolves directly.


It's pretty clear that the wolves and the Stark children are linked.  Ghost, who is white and different, but still part of the pack, is representative of Jon. 

I don't see her being a Joan of Arc type figure...especially given the training she's getting now.  I see her being a major force in whatever role she takes, but I think it's more as an assassin than leading an army.  Everything about her is independent and faceless.  I'm not sure she would flip it 180 degrees.  Nymeria remains in the shadows and on the fringes, but still apparently wreaking death.  We know of her, but we don't ever see her.  Admittedly, that's how GRRM writes a lot of his shit, but it's still Nymeria killing from the shadows.

I think Lady's death is also representative of Sansa being severed from the north.  She will be a player in the game of thrones, but grew blind to teh merits of the north.  She couldn't wait to leave it behind.  She happily gave up the north for the pageantry and splendor of the south.  Lady paid for that, and so did she. 

12/4/12 10:56 AM
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Mencken
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I do agree that Arya having a wolf army would be fucking badass though haha

12/4/12 12:11 PM
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Zenoplata
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I feel like Arya has been fighting the "faceless" aspect of it, for instance she has kept Needle the whole time.

12/4/12 1:46 PM
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shootfighterbull
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I get the feeling that Sansa is distancing herself so much from her past life that i could see her doing harm to her familia. Phone Post
12/4/12 2:00 PM
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Papa BUrgandy
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shootfighterbull -  I get the feeling that Sansa is distancing herself so much from her past life that i could see her doing harm to her familia. Phone Post

But who
Ned = Dead
Cat = Undead
Robb = Dead
Jon = ?? may-be Azor azi
Arya = faceless man (may-be here)
Bran = tree
Rickon = ?? (may-be here)
12/4/12 2:03 PM
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Mencken
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Papa BUrgandy - 
shootfighterbull -  I get the feeling that Sansa is distancing herself so much from her past life that i could see her doing harm to her familia. Phone Post

But who
Ned = Dead
Cat = Undead
Robb = Dead
Jon = ?? may-be Azor azi
Arya = faceless man (may-be here)
Bran = tree
Rickon = ?? (may-be here)

Sansa is heir to the north, I believe, though I'm not sure whether it goes by seniority or by senior male

12/4/12 2:09 PM
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Papa BUrgandy
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I belive in the North its senior male.

But with Bran and Rickon "dead", I am not sure how that works.
12/4/12 2:10 PM
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dizz
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For some reason I thought she was only heir to the North when everyone believed Bran and Rickon to be dead. Since they aren't, I'm thinking Bran is.

Could be wrong though, I'm not sure.

12/4/12 2:11 PM
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Mencken
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Bran is marrying a tree, so he won't be eligible


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