UnderGround Forums
 

UnderGround Forums >> Zahabi: Silva should drop to 170 for GSP


11/20/12 4:54 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15078

Franklin said going in that he (Forrest) was going to be a lot bigger than him come fight time.  He said in interviews that he (Rich) would have to work really hard to get into the 220-225 walk around range before the fight.  He had training partners that were bigger than him to emulate Forrest.  He said in an interview that if you saw us standing next to each other you would think we were in two different divisions.

I'll take Rich's word for it and my own eyes that Forrest was much bigger than he was in that fight.

 

11/20/12 5:37 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74282

"He said in an interview that if you saw us standing next to each other you would think we were in two different divisions."

I do see them standing next to each other and I don't think they look like they're in two different divisions at all.

 

 

"I'll take Rich's word for it and my own eyes that Forrest was much bigger than he was in that fight."

 If Rich actually did get up to 220-225 for the fight, then how on earth could Forrest, at 225 himself, be "much bigger"?

But in any case, who cares? So Anderson looked "bigger" next to Forrest than Rich did? So what? Anderson is not fighting GSP at 205 or even 185; nor is how he looks going to be a bigger factor when they put hands on each other than his actual, literal mass. 

11/20/12 5:48 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15079
orcus -

"He said in an interview that if you saw us standing next to each other you would think we were in two different divisions."

I do see them standing next to each other and I don't think they look like they're in two different divisions at all.

 

 

"I'll take Rich's word for it and my own eyes that Forrest was much bigger than he was in that fight."

 If Rich actually did get up to 220-225 for the fight, then how on earth could Forrest, at 225 himself, be "much bigger"?

But in any case, who cares? So Anderson looked "bigger" next to Forrest than Rich did? So what? Anderson is not fighting GSP at 205 or even 185; nor is how he looks going to be a bigger factor when they put hands on each other than his actual, literal mass. 

Well let's see; both fighters agree that one was much larger than the other. I'll take their word for it. Pretty simple. Phone Post
11/20/12 5:50 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15080
It wasn't 220-225 for the fight. It was 220-225 walking around weight. Big difference. Phone Post
11/20/12 5:54 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Immaculata
71 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/14/03
Posts: 21276
GSP gets lumped up and doesn't finish opponents in his regular weight class. Why would he fight at MW against Silva. It makes no sense.
11/20/12 5:56 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74286

So then assuming Rich was back at his regular weight for the fight, we have a 6'1", 215lb Franklin looking smaller in comparison to a 6'3", 225lb Forrest than a 6'2", 206lb Anderson did...I guess I still don't understand the actual significance of this.

11/20/12 6:07 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15081
Hey Orcus; do you believe that there was a significant size difference between them when they fought or not? They both did. Yes or no. If its "no", then we should stop debating it. Phone Post
11/20/12 6:15 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74287

Like I said, I don't remember thinking there was a big difference between them other than height, and looking at the pics, that's what I see as well. I don't have the fight itself on hand to watch. I certainly don't see anything I wouldn't expect given a difference of 1" and 10lb.

11/20/12 6:24 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15083
orcus -

Like I said, I don't remember thinking there was a big difference between them other than height, and looking at the pics, that's what I see as well. I don't have the fight itself on hand to watch. I certainly don't see anything I wouldn't expect given a difference of 1" and 10lb.

Is that "yes" or "no"? Phone Post
11/20/12 6:59 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74293

Like I said, again: Looking at those pics, no.

Now, can you return the favor? What is the significance of how Rich and Anderson looked next to Forrest?

If Anderson weighs in within 5lb or so of GSP, what impact will how big he looks have on the fight?

If Anderson doesn't look significantly smaller than huge LHW Forrest, but doesn't look significantly larger than small MW Maia who is now an average welter, what can we conclude?

Would the 175lb Anderson in the ROTR tournament be considered "far too big" for GSP? If not, why would the 177lb Anderson?

Was Condit far too big for GSP? If not, can we conclude that -- since height and reach are virtually identical -- it must be Anderson's weight that is the problem? Since Carlos used to weigh 185 for his fights, and said he put on weight for this one, does 190 sound reasonable? If Anderson weighed 198 for his last 185 fight, does 190-192 sound unreasonable for his weight for a 177 fight? If Carlos at 6'2", 76" reach, and 190lb is not too big for GSP, is a 6'2", 77" reach, 190-192lb Anderson?

11/20/12 8:59 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15090
orcus -

Like I said, again: Looking at those pics, no.

Now, can you return the favor? What is the significance of how Rich and Anderson looked next to Forrest?

If Anderson weighs in within 5lb or so of GSP, what impact will how big he looks have on the fight?

If Anderson doesn't look significantly smaller than huge LHW Forrest, but doesn't look significantly larger than small MW Maia who is now an average welter, what can we conclude?

Would the 175lb Anderson in the ROTR tournament be considered "far too big" for GSP? If not, why would the 177lb Anderson?

Was Condit far too big for GSP? If not, can we conclude that -- since height and reach are virtually identical -- it must be Anderson's weight that is the problem? Since Carlos used to weigh 185 for his fights, and said he put on weight for this one, does 190 sound reasonable? If Anderson weighed 198 for his last 185 fight, does 190-192 sound unreasonable for his weight for a 177 fight? If Carlos at 6'2", 76" reach, and 190lb is not too big for GSP, is a 6'2", 77" reach, 190-192lb Anderson?

The significance is that Anderson can move weight classes far easier than most fighters and has a far larger frame than GSP. He would then have a significant advantage with an opponent who has never fought outside of his division and is moving up to fight him (Anderson).

Just like Forrest had against Rich who was smaller framed and moving up divisions. Don't take my word for it though; Forrest and Rich both say the same thing even though you seem to want to disagree with the two fighters who fought each other.

A catch weight would diminish the size difference, but there would still be a size difference. Phone Post
11/20/12 9:10 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 11/20/12 9:16 PM
Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74303

You ignored nearly every question, so I guess I'll let it go.

P.S. Rich claimed Forrest was 240lb, which would make a 25-30lb weight difference. Not exactly what logic would lead one to expect in a catchweight fight between GSP and Silva, who were only 14lb apart in their last fights at 170 and 205, respectively. Even then, Rich said that while he felt a size difference when Forrest was on top of him, it was not a case of saying (quote) "'Holy crap, that guy was way stronger than me; I should not be at 205 because I'm not strong enough,'" and he felt he won 2 out of 3 rounds. 

11/20/12 9:19 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15093
No, I answered your first one. Phone Post
11/20/12 9:20 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15094
So in your PS you admit that there was a big difference in size in that fight. Got it. Phone Post
11/20/12 9:25 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74304

I admit that there was a significant difference in weight, which I never denied, and which there would not be between GSP and Anderson; and that even so, Rich apparently did not think size was a determining factor in the fight. 

So we agree that Rich vs Forrest is in no way suggestive of or relevant to GSP vs Anderson, except that GSP, like Rich, might "look smaller"?

11/20/12 10:58 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Samoa
245 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15096
orcus -

I admit that there was a significant difference in weight, which I never denied, and which there would not be between GSP and Anderson; and that even so, Rich apparently did not think size was a determining factor in the fight. 

So we agree that Rich vs Forrest is in no way suggestive of or relevant to GSP vs Anderson, except that GSP, like Rich, might "look smaller"?

Your words:

There's a significant height difference. I don't otherwise see a significant difference in "size", no. If you guys just mean height, I don't know why you can't just say "taller" rather than "bigger".

---------------------

Youre completely backpedaling now. First you said "only height difference" now you are saying that you never denied a weight difference. "Only height" and "no other significant difference" means that you WERE denying a weight difference.

Anyway, we are just going around in circles at this point. I'm ok with "we don't agree". Peace. Phone Post
11/21/12 1:14 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74315

 I thought we were talking about appearance? You said Forrest looked much bigger than Rich.  I said all I could see was that he was taller; he didn't look like he had bigger muscles, for example, imo. We already knew he was heavier.

I assumed weight difference was out of the conversation since everyone dismisses it entirely when it's pointed out that there is no logical reason to think there will be a significant weight difference between Anderson and GSP at 177. It's also dismissed in your beloved Anderson/Forrest/Bonnar comparison -- we know Anderson was 20+lb lighter than those guys, but since you can't "see" it, it is seemingly irrelevant to you. 

Why on earth would you use the weight difference between Rich and Forrest as a "significant difference" but when Anderson and those guys "look" similar in your opinion, the fact that we KNOW Anderson was 20+lb lighter is not an issue?

11/21/12 1:27 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Tolstolobic
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/19/12
Posts: 415
Jsp should just say " we are friends " thing like everyone else who doesn't fight certain " friends " Phone Post
11/21/12 1:42 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74325

He should just say he is only interested in defending his welterweight title, and if Anderson wants to try and take it, he will be happy to oblige.

11/21/12 1:50 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
suess
60 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/1/10
Posts: 14734

or he could just do whatever the fuck he wants, because who gives a shit what the internet thinks about him ducking or not fucking a guy not in his weight class.

11/21/12 2:42 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
KingOfFighters
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 6697
Gsp- i a scarre of anderson riddimz Phone Post
11/21/12 2:49 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74338
suess - 

or he could just do whatever the fuck he wants, because who gives a shit what the internet thinks about him ducking or not fucking a guy not in his weight class.


Well we've got 9000 threads about what the internet thinks about Anderson wanting to fight him, so if GSP just said he doesn't want the fight, we could put it to bed.

11/21/12 2:52 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
suess
60 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/1/10
Posts: 14740
orcus - 
suess - 

or he could just do whatever the fuck he wants, because who gives a shit what the internet thinks about him ducking or not fucking a guy not in his weight class.


Well we've got 9000 threads about what the internet thinks about Anderson wanting to fight him, so if GSP just said he doesn't want the fight, we could put it to bed.


yeah, because the internet, and more specifically the UG, work like that.  you know better.  

11/21/12 3:51 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
orcus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/03
Posts: 74341

Just as people wonder aloud why Anderson keeps pushing for this fight against a guy who "doesn't want it" (despite his trainer saying he DID say he wanted it just weeks ago), some of us will wonder aloud why GSP doesn't just say he doesn't want it.

11/21/12 6:49 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Megatherium
71 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/18/11
Posts: 4054
If this fight does happen my money is on the little fella!

Reply Post

You must log in to post a reply. Click here to login.