UnderGround Forums
 

UnderGround Forums >> Shallow WMMA talent pool?


11/20/12 10:15 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Son of Neckbone
6 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/18/04
Posts: 3209
 
The idea that there isn't a sufficient talent pool to support it is nonsense.

When the UFC first started, it was an open weight class format, then incrementally added LHW, then MW, then LW, etc. Surely there are enough women fighters to have at least 2 weight classes and put on a single marquee fight per event.

Compared to the 125 pound men's division, off the top of my head I can name Benevidez, Uncle Creepy, MMouse, and Jon Dodson. That is it for name recognition and I watch the fights a lot. Even without UFC exposure I can name 5 times as many female fighters to fill out a roster than men's flyweight produces.

Rousey vs McMann or Cyborg is a marketable, quality main attraction that could carry an event as well or better than Sotiropoulis (sp?) vs Pearson, which is coming up in a few weeks on FX.

Being honest, how many of you are more interested in watching GSot/Pearson than Rousey/Cyborg?
11/20/12 10:18 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
ABE FROMAN
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/15/02
Posts: 69640

Invicta.

That is all.

11/20/12 11:07 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
simonpe
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/26/11
Posts: 563
W-135 is deeper than M-125 Phone Post
11/20/12 2:50 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Son of Neckbone
6 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/18/04
Posts: 3213
simonpe -  W-135 is deeper than M-125 Phone Post

No doubt, and their fights deliver more often than not.

It would be a mistake to open up a 105, 115, 125, 135, 145, HW classes all at the same time, but Pride did just fine with a heavy and "middle" weight classes until the divisions develop to naturally expand out fully over the next decade or so.
11/20/12 3:11 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
crowbar
606 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 11/20/12 3:25 PM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 34739

UFC Flyweight division

Joseph Benavidez
16-3-0
( W-L-D )
5' 4"
( 162 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Chris Cariaso
"Kamikaze"
14-3-0
( W-L-D )
5' 3"
( 160 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

John Dodson
"The Magician"
15-5-0
( W-L-D )
5' 3"
( 160 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Tim Elliott
8-3-1
( W-L-D )
5' 7"
( 170 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Jussier Formiga
14-2-0
( W-L-D )
5' 5"
( 165 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Louis Gaudinot
"Goodnight"
6-2-0
( W-L-D )
5' 3"
( 160 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Ulysses Gomez
"Useless"
9-3-0
( W-L-D )
5' 6"
( 167 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Phil Harris
"Billy"
21-10-0, 1NC
( W-L-D )
5' 4"
( 162 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )


FLYWEIGHT TITLE HOLDER
Demetrious Johnson
"Mighty Mouse"
16-2-1
( W-L-D )
5' 3"
( 160 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

John Lineker
"Hands of Stone"
20-6-0
( W-L-D )
5' 2"
( 157 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Ian McCall
"Uncle Creepy"
11-3-1
( W-L-D )
5' 5"
( 165 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

John Moraga
11-1-0
( W-L-D )
5' 6"
( 167 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Jared Papazian
"The Jackhammer"
14-8-0, 1NC
( W-L-D )
5' 8"
( 172 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Yasuhiro Urushitani
19-6-6
( W-L-D )
5' 5"
( 165 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Darren Uyenoyama
"BC"
8-3-0
( W-L-D )
5' 6"
( 167 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

11/20/12 3:25 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
ABE FROMAN
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/15/02
Posts: 69655
Ryann Von Doom - 
ABE FROMAN - 

Invicta.

That is all.


This. fuck, I accidently voted you down. Will make it right tomorrow. 

 

The 135 division is fucking stacked. people like Mister3mma have no clue since they only care about what Zuffa pushes. Sucks since that divsion is so fucking bad ass. Shayna Baszler, Marloes Coenen, julie kedzie, Meisha Tate, Sarah kaufman, Sara McMann, Sara D'alelio(spelling) just to name a few off the top of my head. Crazy fucking battles ahead and if Invicta keeps gaining steam you'll see the insane battles that have happened and that will be coming. 


LOL, I was wondering what I did wrong...!

11/20/12 3:29 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
crowbar
606 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 34740

I`m calling the OP out on his ability to name 5 times as many females.

 

The clock is ticking....GO!

11/20/12 3:31 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
BruceLeroysLowKick
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/4/12
Posts: 6
Sex sells. Only way women are selling any PPV is if they fight topless in mud. Phone Post
11/20/12 3:36 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
crowbar
606 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 34741

11/20/12 3:42 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
crowbar
606 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 34742

UFC page says there are 15,but you were not the one boasting.

11/20/12 3:44 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
UGCTT_EnderTL
224 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/23/10
Posts: 5991

The talent pool will grow at all levels now that it has a place in the largest organization. Rousey might be the only star right now, but WMMA will grow a lot in the next few years.

11/20/12 3:45 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
crowbar
606 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 34743

11/20/12 3:47 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Fernando Alonso
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/8/09
Posts: 8373
Build it they will come... Phone Post
11/20/12 5:23 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Son of Neckbone
6 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/18/04
Posts: 3216
crowbar - 

UFC Flyweight division

Joseph Benavidez
16-3-0
( W-L-D )
5' 4"
( 162 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Chris Cariaso
"Kamikaze"
14-3-0
( W-L-D )
5' 3"
( 160 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

John Dodson
"The Magician"
15-5-0
( W-L-D )
5' 3"
( 160 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Tim Elliott
8-3-1
( W-L-D )
5' 7"
( 170 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Jussier Formiga
14-2-0
( W-L-D )
5' 5"
( 165 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Louis Gaudinot
"Goodnight"
6-2-0
( W-L-D )
5' 3"
( 160 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Ulysses Gomez
"Useless"
9-3-0
( W-L-D )
5' 6"
( 167 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Phil Harris
"Billy"
21-10-0, 1NC
( W-L-D )
5' 4"
( 162 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )


FLYWEIGHT TITLE HOLDER
Demetrious Johnson
"Mighty Mouse"
16-2-1
( W-L-D )
5' 3"
( 160 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

John Lineker
"Hands of Stone"
20-6-0
( W-L-D )
5' 2"
( 157 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Ian McCall
"Uncle Creepy"
11-3-1
( W-L-D )
5' 5"
( 165 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

John Moraga
11-1-0
( W-L-D )
5' 6"
( 167 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Jared Papazian
"The Jackhammer"
14-8-0, 1NC
( W-L-D )
5' 8"
( 172 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Yasuhiro Urushitani
19-6-6
( W-L-D )
5' 5"
( 165 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )

Darren Uyenoyama
"BC"
8-3-0
( W-L-D )
5' 6"
( 167 cm )
125 lbs
( 56 kg )


I'm pretty sure you were trying to disprove my theory, but I don't know who half these guys are. That is my point.

I named the only 4 fighters at 125 that I could think of without going to UFC website, and yes, I can name 20 female MMA'ers that just about everyone on the UG would say have higher name recognition than say, Darren Uyenoyama or Yashuhiro Uriushitani.

Here goes:
UG's own Roxy Modaferri
Rousey
Cyborg
McMann
Girlla Liz Carmouche
UG's own Bec Hyatt
Carano
Megumi Fujii
Kelly Kobold
Kaitlyn Young
Julie Kedzie
Baszler
Marloes Coenen
Tate
Julia Budd
Amanda Nunes
Kaufman
Tara Larosa
Stephanie Frausto
Zoila Gurgel.

That's 20 without a stretch, without copying/pasting the Invicta website, without an internet search, all fighters that are easy to put a name and a face to.

To be fair this across all weight classes, but like I said before the UFC only needs a marquee testing division to start with, likely 135, and the smaller fighters will have to bump up just like the men's divisions did before the wt class expansion.
11/20/12 5:52 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
notsobigmike
36 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/1/08
Posts: 5826
Not only is the overall talent pool thin, but it's still a VERY hard sell to the mainstream.

UFC would be smartest just promoting one-off women's fights when there is a major marketable star or super fight.

Let promotions like Invicta handle the bulk, scoop up the stars for lucrative, promotable matchups.
11/20/12 6:05 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
FOX Force Five
52 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/12/11
Posts: 617
Fernando Alonso -  Build it they will come... Phone Post

Beat me to it!

With the women in the big show, it well may well inspire a whole new generation of female athletes to consider MMA.

Invicta is a great show to bread newer pro talent, the UFC gets to showcase the upper echelon in title / title contention events.

I don't think anyone expects to see a flood of female fights on the main card.
11/20/12 6:09 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
toovie
1 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/21/12
Posts: 346
SavageNationFan - Yeah whatever dude

I'm not paying to watch corn row wearing broads who wish they are men. Even to "toplevel" are sloppy.

Take your Unisex agenda for a long walk bro
You wouldnt say to to rousey or cyborg you would ask for a picture and u would make a fist at the camara and smile Phone Post
11/20/12 6:20 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
dMo
120 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/27/07
Posts: 1879
ABE FROMAN - 

Invicta.

That is all.


This.

I sure hope that the UFC doesnt get a hold of this entertaining org and fuck it up like all the rest they have swallowed up. 

 

Voted up to make up for RVD's shitty mouse.

11/20/12 6:25 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
MahatmaPetey
268 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 3/13/02
Posts: 6537
Lots of divisions start off pretty shallow, but grow over time. Don't forget the first ever 185lbs title fight in the UFC was Dave Menne vs. Gil Castillo (underrated fight, btw). But with Strikeforce, Invicta, and to a lesser extent Bellator, UFC will have a solid base to start from. Eventually we'll even start to see mid-level bantamweight men getting sex changes to add even more depth to the women's roster. Imagine Rousey vs Faber in a couple years. That PPV will be huge. Phone Post
11/20/12 6:58 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
dMo
120 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/27/07
Posts: 1880

Fightmatrix current top 15 bantamweight females. 9 are currently with Invicta.

 

 

 

Rank ↑ ↓ Fighter  (Age) Record 
1  
Ronda Rousey  (25) 6-0-0

Last Fight: 8/18/2012 [Strike Force] vs  [#3 W135] Sarah Kaufman

2  
Miesha Tate  (26) 13-3-0

Last Fight: 8/18/2012 [Strike Force] vs  [NR] Julie Kedzie

3  
Sarah Kaufman  (27) 15-2-0

Last Fight: 8/18/2012 [Strike Force] vs  [#1 W135] Ronda Rousey

4  
Alexis Davis  (28) 12-5-0

Last Fight: 7/28/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [#11 W135] Hitomi Akano
Next Fight: 1/05/2013 [Invicta FC] vs [#7 W135] Shayna Baszler
5  
Sara McMann  (32) 6-0-0

Last Fight: 7/28/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [#7 W135] Shayna Baszler

6  
Cat Zingano  (30) 7-0-0

Last Fight: 10/06/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [NR] Raquel Pennington

7  
Shayna Baszler  (32) 15-7-0

Last Fight: 10/06/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [#14 W135] Sarah DAlelio
Next Fight: 1/05/2013 [Invicta FC] vs [#4 W135] Alexis Davis
8  
Rin Nakai  (26) 12-0-1

Last Fight: 9/01/2012 [Pancrase] vs  [NR] Mayumi Aoki
Next Fight: 12/01/2012 [Pancrase] vs [NR] Danielle West
9  
Liz Carmouche  (28) 7-2-0

Last Fight: 7/28/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [NR] Kaitlin Young

10  
Amanda Nunes  (24) 7-2-0

Last Fight: 7/28/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [NR] Raquel Paaluhi

11  
Hitomi Akano  (38) 18-10-0

Last Fight: 7/28/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [#4 W135] Alexis Davis

12  
Leslie Smith  (30) 4-2-1

Last Fight: 10/06/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [NR] Kaitlin Young

13  
Holly Holm  (31) 2-0-0

Last Fight: 9/09/2011 [Fresquez Productions] vs  [NR] Jan Finney

14  
Sarah DAlelio  (31) 6-3-0

Last Fight: 10/06/2012 [Invicta FC] vs  [#7 W135] Shayna Baszler

15  
Shana Nelson  (31) 5-2-0

Last Fight: 2/18/2012 [CageFX] vs Unranked Opponent

11/21/12 1:44 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Son of Neckbone
6 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/18/04
Posts: 3217
Billytk - Sorry but just because the 125lb mens division has no interest doesn't mean that WMMA is any better. The womans division IS way too shallow for it to go anywhere, there is Cyborg then rousey then a gap in talent then Meisha and that's it, Caranno has been retired for ever which shows how weak the division is that someone trying to defend wmma still has to use her name.

I don't think Carano is even 30 yet, and she retired as the consensus #2 in the world.

She was also scheduled to fight on the Reem/Werdum undercard in 2011 but failed her prefight physical for an undisclosed reason.

Doesn't sound like someone that "has been retired forever" and we will likely see her again, particularly if there is a huge paycheck and a fuckload of publicity for being the first WMMA main in the UFC vs someone polarizing like Rousey.
11/21/12 4:26 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
CHILLITACO
691 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/10/10
Posts: 2351
ABE FROMAN -

Invicta.

That is all.

Invicta for the feeder :)
Start slow...

Personally I'm looking forward to the sots v Pearson card. Phone Post
11/21/12 4:30 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
MMALOGIC
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/17/08
Posts: 7069

I think Dana is hedging incase there's a backlash and if for some reason it doesnt work in the UFC.

11/21/12 5:53 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DreamerMMA
384 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/19/05
Posts: 17602

WMMA is still in it's pioneer stage.

 

It's really not fair to expect them to have the same talent pool as the men at this stage.

 

Give them some time to develop and attract more sponsors and money.

 

Starting off with baby steps in the UFC is a good idea. 

11/21/12 6:01 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
RowdyBec
434 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 6/21/12
Posts: 171
BruceLeroysLowKick -  Sex sells. Only way women are selling any PPV is if they fight topless in mud. Phone Post

Yup... because us females don't have two arms, two legs & a heart beat like any male fighter does ;)


Reply Post

You must log in to post a reply. Click here to login.