UnderGround Forums
 

UnderGround Forums >> Some thoughts about Nate Diaz vs Benson...........


11/29/12 12:53 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 11/29/12 12:54 AM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15996
 
>Vid discusses Benson's use of super low kicks/calf kicks vs Frankie.



Anyway, sure they could both teach me tons. This is a forum, a place to discuss techniques etc.


Just re-watched Diaz/Miller.


Most Fighters like fighting, ya know, like martial arts are cool, and fighting is a cool thing. But the Diaz brothers are psychologically comfortable fighting, taking damage, and dishing out damage on a different level from everyone else. Always doing Damage is the fighting theory. It's like a multi-felon/thug that has done real time vs a typical McDojo student to get my point across. Being ok mentally with violence and damage is huge.



I digress, anyway, Benson for striking will be looking for the right low sweep kick to punches, heavy low left kicks and scooting out, and perhaps major cut across sweeps/cut kicks with his left leg/left arm ala what Cerrone did to Nate. Also, I would use the oblique kick and sidekick to Nate's lead knee along with hit and run tactics ala Condit/Nick. The Lead Sidekick to Nate's inward toed leg could be devastating like we saw at the Strikeforce Rousey/Kaufmann event.




So, mixing up inside low sweep to punches, heavy outside kick and scoot out, and linear kicks to the knee might get Nate lunging in which can help setup up Benson's takedowns. Now, he still has to deal with the long limbs of Nate for chokes on the way down, but Benson has been a Houdini before.



As for Nate, he probably will not change his lead toes pointing in fighting If he could change that to toes forward it would eliminate tons of the few offensive options that him and Nick give by doing so without really any negatives (other than protecting groin shots on the street are better this way Homie-ask Bruce Lee). Of course to the inside thigh kick he should do Knee Destructions pointing his knee with weight behind it into Benson's incoming Shin.


Well, anyway, pointing the knee into left cross/rt hook is the counter to both linear kicks.


He should train pointing the shin/raising up on the ball to CHECK/Destruction of the low inside kick attempts that I think will be big in Benson's Arsenal. That is a fairly easy thing to train and get used to.



As he will probably keep the toes pointing in stance that makes it so hard for the Diaz bros to check outside low kicks, (Just like Nathan M should train for his upcoming Tarrec fight) he should practice bottom of the foot blocks/checks to the outside kicks.

Of course the best defense is really in his pressuring offense. Cerrone kept trying to reset many times to then kick only to be getting blasted while trying to take a breath and re-set/stance his weight. Nate's pressure only let Miller get off like 3 low kicks.


I love the Diaz bros and their fighting I would just make improvements to leg kick defense. I wonder if they or their boxing coach Perez would see that much change or dis-advantages if they changed to Toe forward stance, but their are other counters they can use even if they don't, like the bottom of the foot block to outside kicks.


I got flamed for a similar thread I made before Condit/Diaz and Condit played what I call kick mix up/intercept Move, Fire, Move and Re-acquire just like I thought he would (think Tank battles before fire on the move). Anyway, I made the thread because my thoughts of the upcoming fight were running wild in my head and I couldn't teach/train/film tonight because of stomach flu.


Peace Out Homies :)
11/29/12 12:56 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 15997
A Fun video with some pretty narly body shots and psychological conditioning, it get's really good as it goes on...........
11/29/12 1:55 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Humboldt
56 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/13/08
Posts: 5088
Great post as always Dan. Phone Post
11/29/12 8:49 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16002
thnx, lot of lurkers. Thoughts on the techniques that may be used or counters?

Benson's got kicks and wrestling, he does not want to match up in boxing range for any length of time other than quick hits on way in to takedowns, or inside low sweep kick to two punches then move etc.
11/30/12 8:55 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16015
No one wants to breakdown this fight?

Nate doing a Power Assist Guillotine (McKenzitine/Jones) off a takedown is pretty dangerous, or a Power Guillotine ("like a RNC from the front")

Could Benson slam his way out of a Triangle?
12/3/12 11:05 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16082
Soon, so soon, it is here......

Talked to guy on set today he is excited for Nate fight wants him to win etc.
12/3/12 11:16 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Loser Born Natural
209 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 10/14/10
Posts: 8203
I am very excited for this fight.
My toes cramped reading the op.
Kicks will be prominent from Henderson, and Nate will unload on him.
It's going to be alot of fun to watch.
Good breakdown Dan. Phone Post
12/3/12 11:34 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
RearNakedToke
201 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 9/16/10
Posts: 2
I want Diaz to win. I train with Graciefighter so I hope that belt comes back to Lodi.
12/3/12 11:50 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
UGCTT_zackthewop
242 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/16/10
Posts: 4038
Cool post Phone Post
12/3/12 11:56 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16087
thanks guys,

If you are interested in learning some of the things I speak of, kick counters, knee kick counters etc. DVD's on Sale, package deals at www.TheCombatSystem.com
12/4/12 12:00 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
lormpino
185 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/6/07
Posts: 4534
Good read// Diaz should be fine... New champ Phone Post
12/4/12 12:13 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16090
Diaz could Possibly lose by Kick N Move, Kick n Move, to round stealing takedown decisions...........

A damaging kick to the knee....

or slight possibility of a guillotine but I doubt it.

Nate can win by TKO most likely from High Volume Punch Assualt.....or maybe stoppage from cuts even though Bendo looks smooth after his fights

OR a choke off a takedown...be that Traingle or power assist guillotine /Catch Guillotine/Anaconda Guillotine most likely (though his long arms allow D'arce/Anaconda's too) or Triangle
12/4/12 1:14 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
burner22
8 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/17/12
Posts: 383
Interesting read, Dan if you put a few gifs/ pics in with your comments it would be helpful for rookies like me to better understand the points your making... Phone Post
12/4/12 1:23 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
UGCTT_zackthewop
242 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/16/10
Posts: 4042
burner22 - Interesting read, Dan if you put a few gifs/ pics in with your comments it would be helpful for rookies like me to better understand the points your making... Phone Post
Then he wouldn't be able to sell his DVDs (: Phone Post
12/4/12 1:55 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16092
I don't have pics, sorry, but described as best I can. I have vids out showing these various things some available on youtube or my DVD's as mentioned (and some stuff only available on DVD). If I plaster too much peeps give me crap.

Seriously, if I was the trainer of Condit he would have done exactly like he did like it or not. I came super close to getting out of bed and making a post before the fight, seriously that would have described the exact fight to come.

If I was Benson's trainer he will attempt to play Kick N Move, Kick N Move the first 3 minutes of every round. Corner yelling out 2 min and time down from there. And then if a frustrated Nate has to really try to close distance that is when you get a easy takedown to steal the round.
Kick N Run, late round stealing takedowns, Decision is safest most likely way to beat Nate. This, we may see the next strategy to fights that guys like Benson and Jones, guys with kicking ability, movement/distance, and a good shot/wrestling background will use. Ben should only be hitting a couple punches here and there Mixed in With Kicks then moving. Any long in distance exchange Benson will likely lose (shoulders not high enough, his "punch exchanging" between punches not the best for covering etc.)

I like Benson, nothing against him whatsoever.

I tell guys to use the super low calf/sweep kicks.

I've gone a long way (as now has WinkleJohn) to perpetuating the use of the Oblique and Sidekick to knee.

I just feel obligated to perpetuate the counters to these moves as well.

There is a lot more to just checking, which does not favor Heavy weight forward aggressive boxer types like Lytle/Marquedt/Nick/Nate/Manny G etc etc etc.

Knee Destructions are FAR Better for them (and all of us that don't have bad/weakened ligaments and strong bones FYI-at ur own risk-)

And bottom of foot good for guys that used toed in boxing stances.

If I had a few days to work with the Diaz brothers, if they drilled em' no one could play kick n Run on them so well again. If I had a couple days with Vitor, he would NOT HAVE been getting knee kicked so much like I predicted in my thread. (and yes I do make these threads a bit last min but before the fights, and also share pertinent vids w fighers/people associated with the fighters on FB or Twitter before the fight if they so choose to pay attention that is up to them).
12/4/12 1:57 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Ashilles
10 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/28/10
Posts: 782
Great breakdown as always

Love you work.

War Diaz!!! Phone Post
12/4/12 2:08 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 12/04/12 2:14 AM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16094
I would have made a specific vid for you guys for this upcoming fight, but last Wed had horrible stomach flu, tonight had to work, and Wed I've got a line on CSI NY so I don't think I will be able to as those be the days I teach sometimes.
12/4/12 2:28 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16098
P.S. something a lot of HOMIES don't seem to know......

Jon Jones Knee into Rashad foot in I believe the 2nd round messed Hashad up the rest of the fight.

Mighty Mouse's Knee into McCall's foot/ankle messed him up a good bit for their fight.

Now, whether or not these slick Champions train to do that on purpose, or put weight into it like I teach I do not know.....

But I think it is relevant.

Before Diaz/Condit a whole bunch of people gave me crap on a similar thread to this that BLEW UP with the Hatorade and not believing in KNEE DESTRUCTIONS.
12/4/12 3:16 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
armbarseverywhere
56 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 3/18/09
Posts: 474
Nate Diaz by armbar.
12/5/12 11:31 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Card
1911 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/22/05
Posts: 29389

Great breakdown... I'm also thinking Henderson has this with kicks and wrestling.

12/6/12 5:49 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16107
Interesting Win from opening the base with the Super Low inside Sweep Kick/Calf Kick just like I talk about in a few vids I have posted as well as in this thread!!!

He did it once, the oblique kick to the knee, few jabs, then Inside Sweep to 1,2 for the Win
12/7/12 6:44 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16132
No comments on the use of the low sweep kick? this will become more standard like linear kicks to the knee
12/8/12 9:14 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16155
At least 3 fighters have used Super low kick/calf kicks tonight, can't be a coincidence when only 1 fighter has before.

Rogan even commented on Rory using it.

THE CHECK UFC FIGHTERS IS TO LIFT YOUR FOOT UP on BALL OF FOOT AND BLADE YOUR SHIN INTO THEIR INCOMING KICK....A LOW CHECK
12/8/12 10:58 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16159
Was something like 6 or more Super low kicks/sweep, and also 3rd round Benson tried Oblique kick and used hop sidekick to the leg
12/9/12 12:13 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DanTheWolfman
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 12/09/12 12:13 AM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 16165
Well, pretty much was outside kicking game, to in close smother or top game like I thought...no staying in middle distance.

Controlling Distance=winning fights

Did my best to share the info out there where it might get seen...w per-tenant people etc cause would have been a more exciting fight had Nate not taken those and gotten sweaped off his feet

It's like how I called Vitor getting knee kicked being the whole fight, if he can't deal, he can't hang mentally etc.

With so much money and titles on the line, give me a lil chedder and I'll make sure weaknesses get shored up and explain the opponent's most likely game plan

Reply Post

You must log in to post a reply. Click here to login.