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UnderGround Forums >> Stepping on the face/jaw as armbar defense?

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12/1/12 9:25 PM
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Cock and Awe
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So David Rickels was trying to put Jason Fischer in an armbar from the bottom yesterday on Bellator 82, and Fischer's attempt to escape consisted of stepping on his face and jaw.

Rickels admitted that this FORCED him to let go of the armbar.

a) Have we found a weakness in BJJ off of one's back?

or

b) Was there something Rickels could have done better in order to avoid getting his face stepped on or do the armbar better?
12/1/12 9:47 PM
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Ebe5
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Did not see this, is it legal anyways? Phone Post
12/1/12 9:52 PM
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the ridler
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Gif would help decide. Doesn't sound illegal though.
12/1/12 9:56 PM
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Poopyface TomatoNose
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Head stomps are illegal and kicks to the face of a downed opponent are as well so stepping on an opponent's face should be as well. Phone Post
12/1/12 9:57 PM
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the ridler
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It's not really a strike though. I would like to see the gif or video. Does not sound illegal to me.
12/1/12 10:00 PM
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grady
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stepping down and applying pressure isn't considered "stomping" is it?


it's like rubbing your head against your opponent while in guard isn't considered a "butt".
12/1/12 10:02 PM
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Brock Lobster
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People push off with there feet from bottom so I see no problem. As long as there's no "swing" if you will and you are just applying constant pressure then go for it. Phone Post
12/1/12 10:02 PM
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Massa
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There are no weakness in BJJ off your back.

















Unless on lava, or syringes, or concrete...
12/1/12 10:03 PM
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the ridler
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Yea I was thinking its similar to cross facing a guy with your forearm while in his guard, only you are pushing down with your foot not arm here. Hey, whatever works.
12/1/12 10:03 PM
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jar of flies
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12/1/12 10:05 PM
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jmacdoug
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that... shouldn't be legal
12/1/12 10:06 PM
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the ridler
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Thanks jar.. No way is that illegal.
12/1/12 10:09 PM
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parrishmma
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No reason to be illegal. If the top guy was able to push with his hand, it would be fine. So pushing with your foot shouldnt be any different.
12/1/12 10:12 PM
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Andersons_Chin
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I honestly don't know how to feel about this. Phone Post
12/1/12 10:12 PM
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Cock and Awe
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I LOVE MMA BUT IF THEY MAKE THAT ILLEGAL AND YET ANOTHER RULE THEN FUCK THIS SHIT!!!!!
12/1/12 10:13 PM
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Cock and Awe
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Now for the greater question:

In terms of technique - Could he have done something better there as a BJJ'er to not let that foot pressure get to him or happen to begin with?
12/1/12 10:15 PM
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jmacdoug
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parrishmma - No reason to be illegal. If the top guy was able to push with his hand, it would be fine. So pushing with your foot shouldnt be any different.

right, and it's legal for him to strike his opponent's face with his hand, so he should have just stomped his face.

is that seriously your argument?
12/1/12 10:20 PM
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MolsonMuscles
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Smart move. No way that shouldn't be legal.

It's not a foot stomp, just like grinding your head into your opponent's face in the clinch or top position isn't a headbutt.
12/1/12 10:27 PM
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Steve4192
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Nothing illegal about that, just unusual.

 

The more common varient of that defense is to use your knee/shin and stack him up while placing all your weight on his jaw.  Much less likely to get your arm extended that way.

12/1/12 10:34 PM
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parrishmma
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jmacdoug - 
parrishmma - No reason to be illegal. If the top guy was able to push with his hand, it would be fine. So pushing with your foot shouldnt be any different.

right, and it's legal for him to strike his opponent's face with his hand, so he should have just stomped his face.

is that seriously your argument?

Considering that stomping the face is CLEARLY against the rules already and that is not an option, yes. That is my argument. Wow, cant believe you really condone such brutality. Heathen!
12/1/12 10:40 PM
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yellow's Willin
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What if you dropped your shin on the dudes face with full force? Would that be considered a stomp? You could deal some serious damage that way if it's legal. Phone Post
12/1/12 10:41 PM
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Seats Taken
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That's not illegal, though the guy on the bottom would have been fine if he finished the arm bar right or if he has decent BJJ could have easily hit the sweep or transfer to the kneebar from there. If he could have hooked that left leg with his left hand he woulda been gold. Never been put in that position though I bet it sucks Phone Post
12/1/12 10:43 PM
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Immaculata
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Legal. Technical.
12/1/12 10:45 PM
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Authority Figure
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That position has way more force than a forearm or palm. Couldn't you accidently snap someone's neck doing that?

12/1/12 10:48 PM
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SmackyBear
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"18. Stomping of a grounded fighter

Stomping is considered any type of striking action with the feet where the fighter lifts their leg up bending their leg at the knee and initiating a striking action with the bottom of their foot or heel . (Note) Axe kicks are not stomps. Standing foot stops are NOT a foul. As such, this foul does not include stomping the feet of a standing fighter."

http://www.abcboxing.com/unified_mma_rules.html

Stepping on the head doesn't seem to fit the striking action criterion of the stomp rule. Seems legal to me.

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