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UnderGround Forums >> Interesting Article about Marquez & PED's


12/13/12 11:46 AM
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8flat
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Similar argument was made about Barry Bonds, BIg Mac, etc.....roids don't improve your hand-eye coordination, etc. But you can't argue that it doesn't make you hit harder......
12/16/12 3:09 AM
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rundymc
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circa305 - "If you think PEDs had anything to do with Manny catching the hardest right JMM has thrown in 40 rounds right on the chin, you dont know shit about boxing"

LOL at that comment. Re read that and try again you are not making any sense.

You guys do realize that PED allows him throw much faster harder punches right? Hence the results we saw. Of course the PEDs had something to do with him landing that shot and putting Manny out cold.

With all due respect, that is incorrect, and shows you do not know what you are talking about. I would enumerate the reasons so, but I fear it would fly over your head, so I'll leave it there.
12/16/12 3:20 AM
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rundymc
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8flat - Similar argument was made about Barry Bonds, BIg Mac, etc.....roids don't improve your hand-eye coordination, etc. But you can't argue that it doesn't make you hit harder......

Good argument. However swinging a bat is a little different than throwing a punch. A punch has little to no resistance on it. It's a bit further down on the speed/strength curve. If you hang around boxing gyms, you will hear stories of muscle-bound guys who throw soft punches, and small guys with tremendous power.

In other words there's a lot more going on than muscle gain. There's leverages, shoulder girdle stability, technique, that whole kinetic chain thing.

Either way, it doesn't take a lot to KO someone, no matter who they are (Mark Hunt types notwithstanding), and Manny straight up walked into that right. People saying the KO was proof of PED use do not realize that their argument has a built in counter-argument:

-If Marquez and Pac fought 3 times without a KO, something must be off.
-If Marquez and Pac fought 3 times without a KO, it's about time someone got caught.

You will notice a lack of boxers talking about the KO as being indicative of PED use. This is not because they are users themselves. This is because they know such a sentiment is false.
12/16/12 3:54 AM
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Elhoffo
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Here is a old article from last year .....

HOLLYWOOD—It’s a tale of two opponents. One’s coming up for Manny Pacquiao. The other? You wonder if he’ll ever end up facing the Filipino superstar.

On Thursday, Juan Manuel Marquez got some respect from trainer Freddie Roach while Floyd Mayweather Jr.’s camp got dissed by promoter Bob Arum.

Arum mocked reports coming out of Team Mayweather that a May fight date has been reserved for the biggest fight possible, a hint that the undefeated American has finally agreed to step into the ring against Pacquiao.

“Same old bull …,” said Arum.

“They’re just trying to take attention away from Manny,” added the Top Rank chief.

Attempts to forge a Pacquiao-Mayweather duel, arguably the biggest match that could be staged in the sport, had collapsed twice previously due to disputes over drug testing protocols—despite the fighters being penciled to earn at least $50 million each.

Mayweather has constantly batted for Olympic-style drug tests, while Pacquiao, refusing to be bullied into such a condition, said he is willing to undergo tests based on already established boxing norms.

Mayweather is facing libel charges filed by Pacquiao over his claim that the reigning pound-for-pound king has used performance-enhancing drugs.

Marquez is also faced with the same rumors because of his association with Angel Hernandez, who used to work for controversial Balco founder Victor Conte, who now works as Nonito Donaire Jr.’s conditioning coach.

Marquez has denied the accusation, and Roach isn’t lending credence to them either.

“A lot of people want to point fingers and say he [Marquez] is doing bad things,” said Roach. “But I’m not going to do that because I’m tired of that being done to me. It looks like he’s working hard and that’s what he’s supposed to do in this game.

“My guys work hard and that’s why they get good results.”
12/16/12 4:00 AM
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Elhoffo
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Or how about this one??

By Chris Williams: For curious fans wanting to know about whether the November fight between Juan Manuel Marquez and Manny Pacquiao will have Olympic style testing for performance enhancing drugs (PEDS), the answer is no. According to Ricardo Lois at examiner.com, there won’t be any extra testing for Peds by the Nevada Athletic Commission.

Marquez said this about the testing: “I don’t know if he uses them [speaking about Peds] or not. If he did use them, he should feel bad for each victory he had an unfair advantage in…I am not asking for any additional drug tests.”

It’s good that Marquez doesn’t want to rock the boat by attempting to ask for extra testing because he might end up flushing the fight down the toilet if he pushes hard for this. Floyd Mayweather Jr. tried to get extra testing and he saw his negotiations with Pacquiao quickly fall apart with Pacquiao and his promoter Bob Arum moving on to fight one of the Top Rank stable fighters Joshua Clottey instead. That was the last and best chance for a fight between Pacquiao and Mayweather. It would be sad if Marquez were to push for a drug testing for the November Pacquiao fight and end up out in the cold without a fight. This bout is looking to be equivalent of a gold retirement watch for Marquez because he’s simply too old and too light for him to compete at welterweight at this late stage in his career.
12/16/12 1:57 PM
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bknumber1
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AresSmashedPrahjuhdee -
bknumber1 -  Who knows who is on what but the comment about roids not being a potential cause of the KO is off base. PEDs won't help your timing or boxing IQ but they sure as hell will give you more power for a longer time.

JMM always was a slick counter puncher catching Manny clean in every one of their fights. He went from never phasing him with those same shots to a cold KO. With everything else it's enough to raise an eyebrow. Still doesn't change the fact Pac shouldn't have been fighting him in the first place as it is stylistically a bad matchup and he already won three times (draw was a scoring error by one judge in the first dammit!). Phone Post

do PED's give you a better chin too? I hear a couple allude that it does that as well.
Not sure but I doubt it. Although I am of the mind that anyone can be KO'd with the right punch. I remember reading something about stronger neck muscles helping so maybe. Phone Post

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