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12/16/12 6:30 PM
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In another must-read piece, MMAJunkie's Ben Fowlkes argues that Roy Nelson being Roy Nelson can get in the way of Roy Nelson's best interests, and those of the sport.

Roy Nelson has become perhaps the sport's most vocal crusader for improved performance-enhancing drug testing – and at a time when MMA needs such a crusader. You just wish he could make it a little easier for people to take him seriously, especially when he's being serious.

The drug testing issue is a perfect example of how "Big Country" sometimes lets his Big Country-ness overshadow his message. Ever since he teamed up with VADA to do exhaustive voluntary testing before each fight, he's used it as much as a tool for self-promotion as a tool for cleaning up the sport. He wields it against opponents like an unspoken accusation. It turns VADA into the thing that Nelson tries to bully other fighters into, rather than a thing they could do together. It makes his fellow heavyweights want to resist it, just as Shane Carwin and Mitrione both did with no small amount of resentment.

"If Roy wants to bring it up to me, why doesn't Roy bring it up to them and then they call me directly?" Mitrione said earlier this week, when explaining why he refused Nelson's offer to participate in the voluntary testing. "Why would Roy call me directly and be like, 'Hey, here's the VADA stuff?' What the f--- kind of a president of a company would say, 'Hey, just go ahead and handle that yourself?' You want to get the attention from it? Want kind of bulls--- is that?"

Mitrione has a point there. But he's objecting to the how instead of the why, which is not so different from White's criticism of Nelson from a promoter's perspective. It's the form rather than the function, yet again. The idea of supplemental voluntary testing is still a good one, whether you think VADA is the right agency to do it or not. Maybe it's just that Nelson has gotten so used to doing things his own way – and so used to ignoring people who tell him he's wrong – he can't let himself work with people. He associates his own brand of stubbornness with independence, and he doesn't see that sometimes his attitude is the problem rather than the solution.

Read entire article...


12/16/12 6:36 PM
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6ULDV8
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Maybe.  The last thing a UFC fighter needs is another hoop to jump through, but Roy gives them just that.

 

Aw come on!  If they're clean they won't mind!  It doesn't take that long!  Just comply and do what they tell you!

 

If you don't, you're probably hiding something.

 

VADA's gay, that's ok, no one likes them anyway.

12/16/12 7:05 PM
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ
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VADA is a joke. Personally attacking fighters and on witch hunts with the shady Victor Conte. Bad mouthing and personal attacks on guys like marquez, mitrione and carwin. Good luck being taken seriously! Phone Post
12/16/12 7:21 PM
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jack_wilshere
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Unless your a fighter with a bad ped record it makes no sense to do VADA.

Why bother yourself with the unnecessary hassle? Phone Post
12/16/12 7:29 PM
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blaznbison24
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I think VADA would catch a ton of people because they actually use CIR testing, instead of the 6:1 ratio, which is a joke to pass.

But Conte doesn't care about cleaning up the sport. He just wants his time in the limelight so he can sell his supplements and get attention.
12/16/12 7:34 PM
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myjawhurts
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ - VADA is a joke. Personally attacking fighters and on witch hunts with the shady Victor Conte. Bad mouthing and personal attacks on guys like marquez, mitrione and carwin. Good luck being taken seriously! Phone Post
Mike, fair comment, but now is the time to clean up MMA, not in 15years like cycling just realised.
Imagine a Lance Armstrong situation surfacing in ten years pulling former champs and people's champs into the dirt. It's unthinkable.
Some attention to detail now will pay off well into the future. Testing will help the sport grow but only if it is Olympic standard and includes multiple random out of competition testing. Otherwise we are just wasting time and money and deceiving the fans that pay good money to see good clean fights. Phone Post
12/16/12 7:43 PM
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stonepony
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Real testing is a good thing. Good for Roy for not hiding behind silly empty excuses to avoid real testing.
12/16/12 7:43 PM
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TuLegit
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Hes the only reason fans even know what VADA is so no... id say hes not. Phone Post
12/16/12 7:50 PM
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alkysmurf
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Great for them as long as he keeps winning Phone Post
12/16/12 9:21 PM
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BshMstr
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myjawhurts - 
MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ - VADA is a joke. Personally attacking fighters and on witch hunts with the shady Victor Conte. Bad mouthing and personal attacks on guys like marquez, mitrione and carwin. Good luck being taken seriously! Phone Post
Mike, fair comment, but now is the time to clean up MMA, not in 15years like cycling just realised.
Imagine a Lance Armstrong situation surfacing in ten years pulling former champs and people's champs into the dirt. It's unthinkable.
Some attention to detail now will pay off well into the future. Testing will help the sport grow but only if it is Olympic standard and includes multiple random out of competition testing. Otherwise we are just wasting time and money and deceiving the fans that pay good money to see good clean fights. Phone Post

yup.
12/16/12 9:23 PM
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Galanis
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Good read. Agree with his points but I don't think Roy will change, and honestly as long as he keeps knocking people out he will ge the exposure of other UFC stars. A lot of people who don't even watch MMA regularly know the "bearded fat dude who knocks people out", because it's a pretty fucking odd thing to see. I say let the guy do what he's doing, but perhaps he should be just a bit less troll like.

12/16/12 10:05 PM
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shorebreaker420
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I take everythjng Ben Folwkes says as garbage, duckbill that ugly monkey mouthed mother fucker Phone Post
12/16/12 10:36 PM
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Authority Figure
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The lady doth protest too much 

12/16/12 11:07 PM
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ
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Fans pay for clean fights or just fights? I think most fans dont care about that and just want action and finishes by ko or sub. Regardless VADA cant be taken seriously with a guy like Conte involved. What athlete would trust their careers with him when he is making personal attacks. Phone Post
12/16/12 11:13 PM
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Haulport
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There is nothing wrong with the science of VADA's testing. If this sport or any of its athletes were serious about cleaning it up then no one would be saying shit. They'd LINE UP and be like "I'm 100% clean. See? No problems." Instead everyone starts viciuosly attacking strawmen left and right, because the reality is, and BJ and ROy knows this and use it against guys, nearly everyone is using shit in this sport and most other sports.

12/16/12 11:18 PM
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UGCTT_CreepysStacheWax
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ - Fans pay for clean fights or just fights? I think most fans dont care about that and just want action and finishes by ko or sub. Regardless VADA cant be taken seriously with a guy like Conte involved. What athlete would trust their careers with him when he is making personal attacks. Phone Post
Huh? I care if someone cheats. Phone Post
12/17/12 12:14 AM
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MrVivian
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ -  VADA is a joke. Personally attacking fighters and on witch hunts with the shady Victor Conte. Bad mouthing and personal attacks on guys like marquez, mitrione and carwin. Good luck being taken seriously! Phone Post

Hey Mike, I've seen you previously post something about Victor Conte and it seems it is always directed towards a negative frame. Really I could care less what you think of him personally but I have to ask, why such hate for the man? I realize his past and from his words he claims to be an Anti-doping advocate now.

Am I missing some info on this man? I was wondering if you might be able to shed some light.
12/17/12 12:30 AM
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dchi07
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ - VADA is a joke. Personally attacking fighters and on witch hunts with the shady Victor Conte. Bad mouthing and personal attacks on guys like marquez, mitrione and carwin. Good luck being taken seriously! Phone Post
Well marquez showed up in the best shape of his life in his late 30's when he ko'd pac, something that is pretty much impossible. And carwin's manager pretty much admitted carwin was on steroids at one point, "unknowingly" or whatever. So it's not like his accusations are completely baseless. Phone Post
12/17/12 12:38 AM
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DanteHec
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We all know the ugly truth Phone Post
12/17/12 12:50 AM
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ -  Fans pay for clean fights or just fights? I think most fans dont care about that and just want action and finishes by ko or sub. Regardless VADA cant be taken seriously with a guy like Conte involved. What athlete would trust their careers with him when he is making personal attacks. Phone Post

  • Fans don't care about clean fights.
  • VADA can't be trusted. 
Is that a fair recap of your position? 
 
  1. You don't speak for all fans. Especially those of us that have kids that play sports. I can't have my kid looking up to a fighter who gets pops for steroids. Or dies or gets sick from something related to steroid use. I also don't like the idea of one fighter being natural and the other being amped up. Its not fair. I'm a fan. I pay for clean fights.
  2. Name 3 anti-doping/testing bodies that you trust, why, and what sports they police...without Googling it.
12/17/12 12:56 AM
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BshMstr
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MrVivian - 
MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ -  VADA is a joke. Personally attacking fighters and on witch hunts with the shady Victor Conte. Bad mouthing and personal attacks on guys like marquez, mitrione and carwin. Good luck being taken seriously! Phone Post

Hey Mike, I've seen you previously post something about Victor Conte and it seems it is always directed towards a negative frame. Really I could care less what you think of him personally but I have to ask, why such hate for the man? I realize his past and from his words he claims to be an Anti-doping advocate now.

Am I missing some info on this man? I was wondering if you might be able to shed some light.

i'm curious about this as well...

Victor was obviously implicated in the BALCO scandal as the created of "the cream" and "the clear," but he's also the guy who brought us ZMA, and was a kickass bassist in the band Herbie Hancock.
12/17/12 1:48 AM
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dermotfix
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The lady doth protest too much 


In facth, she doth proteth thoo muth

12/17/12 3:05 AM
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SmackyBear
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MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ -  Fans pay for clean fights or just fights? I think most fans dont care about that and just want action and finishes by ko or sub. Regardless VADA cant be taken seriously with a guy like Conte involved. What athlete would trust their careers with him when he is making personal attacks. Phone Post

So do you have any proof of Victor Conte actually being involved in VADA, outside of Dr. Goodman saying he was a consultant?

I'm not trying to be a dick, but in another thread you said you disagreed that he was just consulting and told me not to believe everything I read. So I was wondering what you had heard.

And if Conte were in charge of VADA, why would he release positive results for Andre Berto, a known user of his supplements?
12/17/12 3:21 AM
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4thHorsemen
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I can't speak for all fans but I think it's safe to assume that most fans do care if one person or team is cheating to win, so I'm pretty sure fans do care to pay for clean fights. I know I do so I think that's an invalid assumption on your part to say fans just wanna see fights regardless of whether someone isnt abiding by the rules or not.

Anyway, like someone else said, I don't think Roy is hurting VADA at all considering I would've never heard of VADA if it weren't for Roy being so vocal about it in the first place so I disagree with Ben Fowlkes on this, and on most of the shit that he writes.
12/17/12 6:48 AM
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whoabro
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MrVivian -
MIKE CIESNOLEVICZ -  VADA is a joke. Personally attacking fighters and on witch hunts with the shady Victor Conte. Bad mouthing and personal attacks on guys like marquez, mitrione and carwin. Good luck being taken seriously! Phone Post

Hey Mike, I've seen you previously post something about Victor Conte and it seems it is always directed towards a negative frame. Really I could care less what you think of him personally but I have to ask, why such hate for the man? I realize his past and from his words he claims to be an Anti-doping advocate now.

Am I missing some info on this man? I was wondering if you might be able to shed some light.
Conte talks a LOT of shit. Mike is totally justified to feel the way he does. Phone Post

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