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UnderGround Forums >> The greatest MMA fraud of all time.


1/25/13 2:10 AM
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DreamerMMA
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Atkinson - 
DreamerMMA -
DeuceDroppin -  Atkinson how about this....

Let's get a respectable mod (like Dreamer) in on this. You verify to him who you are, and how much you make (by doing this through a mod you can stay anonymous to the rest of us). If you are being truthful and he confirms it, you can change my screen name as many times as you want for the next 6 months. If you can't confirm it, then you take a 6 month ban for lying on the forum. Deal? Phone Post

I don't give a shit how much money anyone here makes, this is a stupid conversation that is derailing a great thread. 

 

Make another thread if you guys want to wave your financial penises at one another.

 

Atkinson:  While you are entitled to your opinion you are not entitled to fighter bash or flame war with a pro fighter. 

 

You are also hijacking this thread.  Yeah, I know, someone asked or questioned your money making so I get you responding and defending yourself but knock it off please, it is completely irrelevent to the this thread.  If it's that important deal with this via PM or make another thread addressing this.

Point taken but mmaguy started with me first. And I'm amazed you condone this thread. Phone Post

I get where you are coming from but you don't understand these threads as well as I do since I've been around since the first ones like this.

 

We have outed over a dozen phony instructors on this site and have a great time doing it.

 

BJJ and MMA are still a small community were reputation is everything.  We don't take kindly to people name dropping for credentials, especially when you do it to make money off of unwary consumers.

 

Nobody would care if this guy was just another instructor even if his credentials were weak so long as it was honest.

 

You can't go around throwing big names out there and charging people to train with you based on those credentials if you don't actually have them.  It's fraud, plain and simple.

 

I do condone these threads but I also offer to delete them if the UG is proven wrong.  As of yet I haven't seen the UG wrong yet.  We usually know a fraud when we see one and it doesn't take long to confirm once we've found one.  The real challenge is getting these clowns to admit it.

 

Also, as of yet, I've not seen any rule put into place that prevents the UG from investigating and discussing the legitimacy of martial arts instructors.  I think it's healthy to discuss these things and if someone sees something fishy they have every right to question it until they get an answer that satisfies them.

 

If the powers that be had a problem with these types of threads they would have deleted the other dozen or so out there or would have informed the mods that these investigations are not allowed.  If Kirik, Chris or Jason showed up on this thread and told me to delete it I would, no problem.  Until that happens though I will continue to support these types of threads and keep them within reason.  I've been a presence on most of the threads like this and I have faith in the integrity of MMAguy30's investigations and results.  I also still make the offer to delete this thread if the questions asked are properly answered.

 

If you don't like these types of threads I understand, don't click on them, or if that's not enough then use vote downs or comment or even appeal to the admins/owners of this site and plead your case.  That is all fine with me.

 

I understand that MMAguy30 instigated it a bit with you but he pulled back and is trying to end it.  I'm asking you to either let it go or deal with it in private or on it's own thread.  I'm not punishing anyone and I don't want to delete a bunch of posts. 

 

 

1/25/13 2:21 AM
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weslionsmith
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Let me make a little point about this argument.  You are arguing with people on a forum about how much money you make.  So doing that is gonna make the money you are making more valuable or more legitimate?  Of course not.  Regardless of what anyone thinks or says you will still have that money and still be able to enjoy it.  I'm doing pretty well financially myself but I see no point bragging about it.  If anyone challenges it I'll give some basic proof just to show I'm not BS.  But if thats not enough I'll just drop it. 

Whether or not they believe me it isn't gonna change the fact that I have it or that I can save, spend, enjoy, etc said money however I like.  You sound like someone I know quite well who likes to constantly look down on others and puff out his chest.  He is financially successful, but he seems to have a desperate need to make everyone within earshot think he is just the most amazing man on the planet.  The results?  You can barely breathe his name without hearing what a piece of shit people think he is.  A friendship I share with a certain man started due to our mutual hatred of the guy in question. 

My point.  Who freaking cares?  If you were truly content with what you have you wouldn't feel the need to cram it down other people's throats.  Just drop it man.  Enjoy your money and let us move on to the original subject at hand.

1/25/13 2:24 AM
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weslionsmith
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Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?

1/25/13 2:30 AM
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mata_leao
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News flash, Giant Lee posts here.


He's a regular actually. His username is superCalo. Phone Post
1/25/13 2:32 AM
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weslionsmith
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mister3mma -  Dreamer is alpha bad ass Phone Post

Hell yea he is.

I just cast my VTFU for him

1/25/13 2:36 AM
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DreamerMMA
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Atkinson: 

 

I'm not threatening to ban you or erase all your posts.  I'm simply saying I'm not going through this entire thread and deleting the whole argument, I just want it to stop in it's tracks or relocate.

 

 

1/25/13 2:38 AM
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DreamerMMA
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weslionsmith - 

Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?


Sure, what's up?

1/25/13 2:40 AM
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weslionsmith
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mister3mma - 
weslionsmith - 
mister3mma -  Dreamer is alpha bad ass Phone Post

Hell yea he is.

I just cast my VTFU for him


I VTFU'd both of ya.=)


Wow, ty sir.

That's truly a big deal for me.  If you check the Dave Lang thread you will see I originally made myself out to be an utter goofball.  I admit I'm a bit of a dork (lol) but I went over the top and made myself look worse than I really am.

To make my point, I've been hoping to get myself out of the hole I dug and I can't thank you enough for the props.

1/25/13 2:42 AM
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weslionsmith
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DreamerMMA - 
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Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?


Sure, what's up?


Do you have a way of finding out or knowing if the screen name Lion or The Lion is already taken or if it's available. 

That is the screen name I would prefer but I didn't even bother trying as it is already taken in virtually every place on the internet I have even considered trying to claim it.

TY, and major props for all you do.  You are truly one of the UGs and the internet as a whole's greatest moderators.

1/25/13 3:09 AM
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weslionsmith
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Atkinson - 
DreamerMMA -
Atkinson - 
DreamerMMA -
DeuceDroppin -  Atkinson how about this....

Let's get a respectable mod (like Dreamer) in on this. You verify to him who you are, and how much you make (by doing this through a mod you can stay anonymous to the rest of us). If you are being truthful and he confirms it, you can change my screen name as many times as you want for the next 6 months. If you can't confirm it, then you take a 6 month ban for lying on the forum. Deal? Phone Post

I don't give a shit how much money anyone here makes, this is a stupid conversation that is derailing a great thread. 

 

Make another thread if you guys want to wave your financial penises at one another.

 

Atkinson:  While you are entitled to your opinion you are not entitled to fighter bash or flame war with a pro fighter. 

 

You are also hijacking this thread.  Yeah, I know, someone asked or questioned your money making so I get you responding and defending yourself but knock it off please, it is completely irrelevent to the this thread.  If it's that important deal with this via PM or make another thread addressing this.

Point taken but mmaguy started with me first. And I'm amazed you condone this thread. Phone Post

I get where you are coming from but you don't understand these threads as well as I do since I've been around since the first ones like this.

 

We have outed over a dozen phony instructors on this site and have a great time doing it.

 

BJJ and MMA are still a small community were reputation is everything.  We don't take kindly to people name dropping for credentials, especially when you do it to make money off of unwary consumers.

 

Nobody would care if this guy was just another instructor even if his credentials were weak so long as it was honest.

 

You can't go around throwing big names out there and charging people to train with you based on those credentials if you don't actually have them.  It's fraud, plain and simple.

 

I do condone these threads but I also offer to delete them if the UG is proven wrong.  As of yet I haven't seen the UG wrong yet.  We usually know a fraud when we see one and it doesn't take long to confirm once we've found one.  The real challenge is getting these clowns to admit it.

 

Also, as of yet, I've not seen any rule put into place that prevents the UG from investigating and discussing the legitimacy of martial arts instructors.  I think it's healthy to discuss these things and if someone sees something fishy they have every right to question it until they get an answer that satisfies them.

 

If the powers that be had a problem with these types of threads they would have deleted the other dozen or so out there or would have informed the mods that these investigations are not allowed.  If Kirik, Chris or Jason showed up on this thread and told me to delete it I would, no problem.  Until that happens though I will continue to support these types of threads and keep them within reason.  I've been a presence on most of the threads like this and I have faith in the integrity of MMAguy30's investigations and results.  I also still make the offer to delete this thread if the questions asked are properly answered.

 

If you don't like these types of threads I understand, don't click on them, or if that's not enough then use vote downs or comment or even appeal to the admins/owners of this site and plead your case.  That is all fine with me.

 

I understand that MMAguy30 instigated it a bit with you but he pulled back and is trying to end it.  I'm asking you to either let it go or deal with it in private or on it's own thread.  I'm not punishing anyone and I don't want to delete a bunch of posts. 

 

 

Well thank you for going to the effort to explain all that. I wholeheartedly understand the points you have made, however I know of people self harming over a lot less than this thread.

Out of the "frauds" the UG has exposed, who can honestly say that they know for a fact those people wouldn't self harm?

Could anyone live with that on their conscience? Considering their crimes generally speaking are fairly harmless.

Just because it doesn't seem to bother these pretenders doesn't mean they aren't feeling a great deal of humiliation, along with a fragile mental state the inevitable will eventually happen.

Obviously the thread and it's dynamics are hugely entertaining, but at what cost? I understand my comments will never change anything, to be honest I just came to stir the stirrers.

Anyway I'm happy to let this go, or just as happy to put my money where my mouth is and prove my words.

For the record I was never boasting about what I earn.. If you do read the initial comment I'm sure you'll see the funny side. Phone Post

Um, Atkinson

It has been posted, again, and again, and again, and again, and again, fuck you get the point...

That claiming such claims leads to or is just another aspect to add to the list of

A: People becoming students of these fakers who don't know shit, which leads to them learning all the wrong things, which then leads to;

injuries they wouldn't have received if trained properly

beatdowns when fighting someone properly trained

spending a great deal of time learning the wrong shit which leads to them having to spend a greater deal of time unlearning all the wrong training then replacing it with correct training, stealing a GREAT amount of their life that they cannot get back

B: SO MANY of these fakers often prove to be;

manipulators

wife, significant other, child...

beaters, molestors, etc.

So you already see there is a huge problem here.  For one, I, or any other rational person, has little regard for someone who is stealing one's money and especially one who will willingly endanger others only to further their own interests.

And in the case of wife or child molestors or beaters, all bets are off.  They are the scum of the fucking earth and their is no limit to the hell they deserve

Catch a clue please.

1/25/13 3:12 AM
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weslionsmith
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And I can understand if you weren't originally trying to brag and just make a joke.  But here's the issue.  You couldn't let it go and went into a major fight with everyone when you were challenged.  If it was a joke, you would have pointed that out early and stopped the argument.  You seem intent on proving yourself.  I'm not saying GTFO.  I'm saying move on to the important points.

1/25/13 3:14 AM
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DreamerMMA
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weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 

Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?


Sure, what's up?


Do you have a way of finding out or knowing if the screen name Lion or The Lion is already taken or if it's available. 

That is the screen name I would prefer but I didn't even bother trying as it is already taken in virtually every place on the internet I have even considered trying to claim it.

TY, and major props for all you do.  You are truly one of the UGs and the internet as a whole's greatest moderators.


The Lionkiller
Scott The Lion Fart Blevins
The Lion
Carlos The Lion
Casey the lion Williams

 

These are the screen names with The Lion in them.

 

 

1/25/13 3:15 AM
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weslionsmith
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Atkinson - 
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Atkinson: 

 

I'm not threatening to ban you or erase all your posts.  I'm simply saying I'm not going through this entire thread and deleting the whole argument, I just want it to stop in it's tracks or relocate.

 

 

Point taken. I appreciate your diplomacy to wield the stick in a fair manner. Phone Post

Clearly a penis went into a vagina, ergo you exist.

It should have been a blowjob with a swallow.

You should have been digested, not born.

1/25/13 3:16 AM
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weslionsmith
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DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 

Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?


Sure, what's up?


Do you have a way of finding out or knowing if the screen name Lion or The Lion is already taken or if it's available. 

That is the screen name I would prefer but I didn't even bother trying as it is already taken in virtually every place on the internet I have even considered trying to claim it.

TY, and major props for all you do.  You are truly one of the UGs and the internet as a whole's greatest moderators.


The Lionkiller
Scott The Lion Fart Blevins
The Lion
Carlos The Lion
Casey the lion Williams

 

These are the screen names with The Lion in them.

 

 


So Lion is free???!!!!!!!

You are the MAN!!!!!!

Any way I can claim that and transfer my bluenamer with it without paying 29.95 again? LOL

1/25/13 3:19 AM
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Mister Collins
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Wauw, is this thread still active? I followed it till page 30 or so. A quick update please, did the guy ever came to the UG to explain himself?
1/25/13 3:21 AM
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Rear Naked Chode
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Lol, dreamer owning.
1/25/13 3:24 AM
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DreamerMMA
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Atkinson - 
DreamerMMA -

Atkinson: 

 

I'm not threatening to ban you or erase all your posts.  I'm simply saying I'm not going through this entire thread and deleting the whole argument, I just want it to stop in it's tracks or relocate.

 

 

Point taken. I appreciate your diplomacy to wield the stick in a fair manner. Phone Post

No worries.

 

As for your concerns about people offing themselves because of one of these investigations all I can say is I hope they don't do something that drastic but if someone's entire life is based on lies and they can't survive the house of cards collapsing that is their fault and I don't feel that we should handle frauds with kids gloves simply because they are dorks with fragile ego's.

 

They are thieves and liars.

1/25/13 3:25 AM
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weslionsmith
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Atkinson - 
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Atkinson -
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Atkinson: 

 

I'm not threatening to ban you or erase all your posts.  I'm simply saying I'm not going through this entire thread and deleting the whole argument, I just want it to stop in it's tracks or relocate.

 

 

Point taken. I appreciate your diplomacy to wield the stick in a fair manner. Phone Post
Mod told you to back off and you still feel the need to thread hijack? SMH you are a sad man Phone Post
What?

Must have been the adult humour that has you confused my boy. Phone Post

Responses like this are making it clear.

Troll job to derail the thread.

There is an easy way to starve trolls to death.

We have an ignore button.

I implore everyone to use it.

The troll will then starve to death.

Situation solved.

1/25/13 3:29 AM
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weslionsmith
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Edited: 01/25/13 3:37 AM
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Atkinson - 
weslionsmith -
Atkinson - 
DreamerMMA -

Atkinson: 

 

I'm not threatening to ban you or erase all your posts.  I'm simply saying I'm not going through this entire thread and deleting the whole argument, I just want it to stop in it's tracks or relocate.

 

 

Point taken. I appreciate your diplomacy to wield the stick in a fair manner. Phone Post

Clearly a penis went into a vagina, ergo you exist.

It should have been a blowjob with a swallow.

You should have been digested, not born.

Lol ok you seriously don't get my polite humour.

Must be an adult only concept. Phone Post

 


Nice try, I'm a 32 year old adult successfully raising 2 beautiful children and sharing my life with a gorgeous, wonderful, affectionate wife. 

 

I'll give you a second chance as I once made an ass of myself and asked for a second chance and it was given.

EXACTLY what are you trying to do.

I may be a dork

But I am very intelligent and very educated.

I won't have any problem understanding if you make your point clear and concise.

Explain in detail what you are trying to do.

If legitimate I will apologize and give you the proper respect

If not, what I'm shooting your way currently will continue.

Oh, and also, generally true, mature adults don't try proving themselves and disrespecting others by pointing out that they are adults and insinuating others are children.

Did your parents point out you were a child every time you made a mistake?

If so I feel sorry for you.

1/25/13 3:37 AM
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DreamerMMA
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weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 

Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?


Sure, what's up?


Do you have a way of finding out or knowing if the screen name Lion or The Lion is already taken or if it's available. 

That is the screen name I would prefer but I didn't even bother trying as it is already taken in virtually every place on the internet I have even considered trying to claim it.

TY, and major props for all you do.  You are truly one of the UGs and the internet as a whole's greatest moderators.


The Lionkiller
Scott The Lion Fart Blevins
The Lion
Carlos The Lion
Casey the lion Williams

 

These are the screen names with The Lion in them.

 

 


So Lion is free???!!!!!!!

You are the MAN!!!!!!

Any way I can claim that and transfer my bluenamer with it without paying 29.95 again? LOL


PM Sagiv Lapkin or Jason with your name change request and they'll simply change it for you.  I don't have name changing powers.

1/25/13 3:39 AM
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weslionsmith
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DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 

Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?


Sure, what's up?


Do you have a way of finding out or knowing if the screen name Lion or The Lion is already taken or if it's available. 

That is the screen name I would prefer but I didn't even bother trying as it is already taken in virtually every place on the internet I have even considered trying to claim it.

TY, and major props for all you do.  You are truly one of the UGs and the internet as a whole's greatest moderators.


The Lionkiller
Scott The Lion Fart Blevins
The Lion
Carlos The Lion
Casey the lion Williams

 

These are the screen names with The Lion in them.

 

 


So Lion is free???!!!!!!!

You are the MAN!!!!!!

Any way I can claim that and transfer my bluenamer with it without paying 29.95 again? LOL


PM Sagiv Lapkin or Jason with your name change request and they'll simply change it for you.  I don't have name changing powers.


TY a million times Dreamer.

Are those their full screen names?  I'm brand new to this site.

1/25/13 3:42 AM
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DreamerMMA
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weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 

Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?


Sure, what's up?


Do you have a way of finding out or knowing if the screen name Lion or The Lion is already taken or if it's available. 

That is the screen name I would prefer but I didn't even bother trying as it is already taken in virtually every place on the internet I have even considered trying to claim it.

TY, and major props for all you do.  You are truly one of the UGs and the internet as a whole's greatest moderators.


The Lionkiller
Scott The Lion Fart Blevins
The Lion
Carlos The Lion
Casey the lion Williams

 

These are the screen names with The Lion in them.

 

 


So Lion is free???!!!!!!!

You are the MAN!!!!!!

Any way I can claim that and transfer my bluenamer with it without paying 29.95 again? LOL


PM Sagiv Lapkin or Jason with your name change request and they'll simply change it for you.  I don't have name changing powers.


TY a million times Dreamer.

Are those their full screen names?  I'm brand new to this site.


Yeah, those are their full screen names.

 

Do me a favor and cease fire with Atkinson.  He's agreed to not hijack with a money argument so don't troll him into a flame war with you.  If you guys wan't to make your point about the topic of this thread that's fine but enough of the insults and silly arguments, it's annoying to read when people want to focus on the topic at hand.

 

 

1/25/13 3:48 AM
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weslionsmith
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Edited: 01/25/13 3:51 AM
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Atkinson - 
weslionsmith -
Atkinson - 
weslionsmith -
Atkinson - 
DreamerMMA -

Atkinson: 

 

I'm not threatening to ban you or erase all your posts.  I'm simply saying I'm not going through this entire thread and deleting the whole argument, I just want it to stop in it's tracks or relocate.

 

 

Point taken. I appreciate your diplomacy to wield the stick in a fair manner. Phone Post

Clearly a penis went into a vagina, ergo you exist.

It should have been a blowjob with a swallow.

You should have been digested, not born.

Lol ok you seriously don't get my polite humour.

Must be an adult only concept. Phone Post

 

 


Nice try, I'm a 32 year old adult successfully raising 2 beautiful children and sharing my life with a gorgeous, wonderful, affectionate wife. 

 

 

I'll give you a second chance as I once made an ass of myself and asked for a second chance and it was given.

EXACTLY what are you trying to do.

I may be a dork

But I am very intelligent and very educated.

I won't have any problem understanding if you make your point clear and concise.

Explain in detail what you are trying to do.

If legitimate I will apologize and give you the proper respect

If not, what I'm shooting your way currently will continue.

Oh, and also, generally true, mature adults don't try proving themselves and disrespecting others by pointing out that they are adults and insinuating others are children.

Did your parents point out you were a child every time you made a mistake?

If so I feel sorry for you.

No idea what your highly intelligent point is.. What exactly did I say in the text you highlighted that warranted your stupid comment? Phone Post

 


Well back to the main point, which you are already ducking, what are YOU TRYING TO DO?

 

I asked first.

Answer me and I'll answer you.

Or keep playing the troll game.

Your move

Also I didn't say my point was highly intelligent, I said I am.

I wasn't making a point, I was asking a question.

Answer it or quit wasting everyone's time.

 

1/25/13 3:57 AM
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weslionsmith
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DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 
DreamerMMA - 
weslionsmith - 

Dreamer, since you are here can I ask you a quick question?


Sure, what's up?


Do you have a way of finding out or knowing if the screen name Lion or The Lion is already taken or if it's available. 

That is the screen name I would prefer but I didn't even bother trying as it is already taken in virtually every place on the internet I have even considered trying to claim it.

TY, and major props for all you do.  You are truly one of the UGs and the internet as a whole's greatest moderators.


The Lionkiller
Scott The Lion Fart Blevins
The Lion
Carlos The Lion
Casey the lion Williams

 

These are the screen names with The Lion in them.

 

 


So Lion is free???!!!!!!!

You are the MAN!!!!!!

Any way I can claim that and transfer my bluenamer with it without paying 29.95 again? LOL


PM Sagiv Lapkin or Jason with your name change request and they'll simply change it for you.  I don't have name changing powers.


TY a million times Dreamer.

Are those their full screen names?  I'm brand new to this site.


Yeah, those are their full screen names.

 

Do me a favor and cease fire with Atkinson.  He's agreed to not hijack with a money argument so don't troll him into a flame war with you.  If you guys wan't to make your point about the topic of this thread that's fine but enough of the insults and silly arguments, it's annoying to read when people want to focus on the topic at hand.

 

 


Don't worry or doubt me too much Dreamer.

I don't drag stupid arguments way too far.  This is his last chance with me.  If he doesn't answer my question after my post before this one, I'm hitting the ignore button on him.  Plain and simple.

1/25/13 4:00 AM
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weslionsmith
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Atkinson: 

 

I'm not threatening to ban you or erase all your posts.  I'm simply saying I'm not going through this entire thread and deleting the whole argument, I just want it to stop in it's tracks or relocate.

 

 

Point taken. I appreciate your diplomacy to wield the stick in a fair manner. Phone Post

Clearly a penis went into a vagina, ergo you exist.

It should have been a blowjob with a swallow.

You should have been digested, not born.

Lol ok you seriously don't get my polite humour.

Must be an adult only concept. Phone Post

 

 


Nice try, I'm a 32 year old adult successfully raising 2 beautiful children and sharing my life with a gorgeous, wonderful, affectionate wife. 

 

 

I'll give you a second chance as I once made an ass of myself and asked for a second chance and it was given.

EXACTLY what are you trying to do.

I may be a dork

But I am very intelligent and very educated.

I won't have any problem understanding if you make your point clear and concise.

Explain in detail what you are trying to do.

If legitimate I will apologize and give you the proper respect

If not, what I'm shooting your way currently will continue.

Oh, and also, generally true, mature adults don't try proving themselves and disrespecting others by pointing out that they are adults and insinuating others are children.

Did your parents point out you were a child every time you made a mistake?

If so I feel sorry for you.

No idea what your highly intelligent point is.. What exactly did I say in the text you highlighted that warranted your stupid comment? Phone Post

 


Well back to the main point, which you are already ducking, what are YOU TRYING TO DO?

 

I asked first.

Answer me and I'll answer you.

Or keep playing the troll game.

Your move

Also I didn't say my point was highly intelligent, I said I am.

I wasn't making a point, I was asking a question.

Answer it or quit wasting everyone's time.

 

A cease fire has been called Mr "highly intelligent".. So let us now respect the wishes of the man rightfully put in power. Phone Post

You put a lot of effort into avoiding a simple question.  This last response to you is simply to make sure you know why I won't respond to another thing you say after this.  Ignore buttons are here for a reason.


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