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UnderGround Forums >> keenan's family urging him to leave lloyd


1/15/13 12:56 AM
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GIBB0
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HOLLYWOOD-MO -
Brian J DSouza -

Guys, I think Tom Callos and Chloe Cornelius are very brave for the stance they have taken. The legal system and courts will deal with justice, but in the case of Keenan, ask yourself, if he was your son/brother, what would you want of him?

Many people have remained silent, but let's start asking for the Lloyd Irvin members and affiliates who are actively defending Lloyd (who has taken no responsibility nor confirmed or denied his 1990 case) to remain silent until they know the facts about their instructor.

As for Chloe and Tom Callos, they have my support.

I don't think people are saying that Keenan's family shouldn't get involved or advise him of how to proceed. People are saying that they should have advised him behind the scenes and not publicly on Facebook.

There should be no reason that either his sister or dad couldn't pick up the phone and tell then all their thoughts. No need to air it out on FB Phone Post
We don't know the details, though.

Maybe Keenan isn't answering his phone because he doesn't want to be told to leave.

Maybe they have been on his case to leave the team long before this.

Maybe not.

It's impossible to make a claim without knowing the relationship. Phone Post
1/15/13 12:58 AM
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yellow wrkahlc
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LOL@"marlen youre like 13, just stop."

1/15/13 1:00 AM
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Brian J DSouza
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Edited: 01/15/13 11:11 AM
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I dislike the convention of posting private conversations on Facebook tremendously. But it has become the social norm. What's done is done, and people are going to comment on the two separate rape cases on messageboards, the comments section of news stories, Facebook, and many other places.

Also, I'd rather hear what people close to Team Lloyd Irvin have to say, as well as their famillies, rather than watching the facts get hushed up by all parties.

So the Facebook posts are exposing a lot of truth for us to see for ourselves.

 

 

1/15/13 1:01 AM
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LiveFromThe7x7
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GIBB0 - 
HOLLYWOOD-MO -
Brian J DSouza -

Guys, I think Tom Callos and Chloe Cornelius are very brave for the stance they have taken. The legal system and courts will deal with justice, but in the case of Keenan, ask yourself, if he was your son/brother, what would you want of him?

Many people have remained silent, but let's start asking for the Lloyd Irvin members and affiliates who are actively defending Lloyd (who has taken no responsibility nor confirmed or denied his 1990 case) to remain silent until they know the facts about their instructor.

As for Chloe and Tom Callos, they have my support.

I don't think people are saying that Keenan's family shouldn't get involved or advise him of how to proceed. People are saying that they should have advised him behind the scenes and not publicly on Facebook.

There should be no reason that either his sister or dad couldn't pick up the phone and tell then all their thoughts. No need to air it out on FB Phone Post
We don't know the details, though.

Maybe Keenan isn't answering his phone because he doesn't want to be told to leave.

Maybe they have been on his case to leave the team long before this.

Maybe not.

It's impossible to make a claim without knowing the relationship. Phone Post

Maybe they should respect his decision.
1/15/13 1:03 AM
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LiveFromThe7x7
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kying418 - 

I dont think Keenan's sister (and mom and dad) did anything wrong by posting on his FB page.

In the BJJ community, Keenan is a public figure. It was a good platform for them to talk about something they strongly believe in- defending and speaking against rape.

Why is it such a big deal to tell someone to leave their bjj team? It's a frickin sports team - get over it.

If Kobe Bryants sister wrote on his FB that he should leave the Lakers, would Lloyd Irvin's supporters be pissed that she wrote about it in public?

This blind cult like following is disturbing. Thank god not all bjj teams act and behave this way, or I would have quit a long time ago.


Marcello is just a "coach" to you?

You could just stop training with and associating with him, no problem?

You are being extremely disingenuous.

If you want to say Keenan shoudl stop training with TLI, that's fine.

BUt to say, "It's no big deal/it's just a silly team is intellectual dishonesty and shows you aren't being above board and honest.
1/15/13 1:05 AM
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LiveFromThe7x7
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HOLLYWOOD-MO - 
Brian J DSouza -

Guys, I think Tom Callos and Chloe Cornelius are very brave for the stance they have taken. The legal system and courts will deal with justice, but in the case of Keenan, ask yourself, if he was your son/brother, what would you want of him?

Many people have remained silent, but let's start asking for the Lloyd Irvin members and affiliates who are actively defending Lloyd (who has taken no responsibility nor confirmed or denied his 1990 case) to remain silent until they know the facts about their instructor.

As for Chloe and Tom Callos, they have my support.

I don't think people are saying that Keenan's family shouldn't get involved or advise him of how to proceed. People are saying that they should have advised him behind the scenes and not publicly on Facebook.

There should be no reason that either his sister or dad couldn't pick up the phone and tell then all their thoughts. No need to air it out on FB Phone Post

This.

It's not that hard to understand.

My brother is a shit bag who shot his drug dealer. I would put him on blast in a second because he's a POS and I desire no relationship with him.

But when other family members make mistakes, I use discretion and deal with the matter privately. My family gives me the same respect.
1/15/13 1:10 AM
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NorthFromHere
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Just lol at all the drama once again in the BJJ community
1/15/13 1:14 AM
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kying418
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Edited: 01/15/13 1:24 AM
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LiveFromThe7x7 - 
kying418 - 

I dont think Keenan's sister (and mom and dad) did anything wrong by posting on his FB page.

In the BJJ community, Keenan is a public figure. It was a good platform for them to talk about something they strongly believe in- defending and speaking against rape.

Why is it such a big deal to tell someone to leave their bjj team? It's a frickin sports team - get over it.

If Kobe Bryants sister wrote on his FB that he should leave the Lakers, would Lloyd Irvin's supporters be pissed that she wrote about it in public?

This blind cult like following is disturbing. Thank god not all bjj teams act and behave this way, or I would have quit a long time ago.


Marcello is just a "coach" to you?

You could just stop training with and associating with him, no problem?

You are being extremely disingenuous.

If you want to say Keenan shoudl stop training with TLI, that's fine.

BUt to say, "It's no big deal/it's just a silly team is intellectual dishonesty and shows you aren't being above board and honest.


Marcelo is my teacher on the mat, and off the mat, he is one of my closest friends.

If my sister told me on my facebook page that she didnt agree with him and I should quit his team, I wouldnt think anything of it.

Do you know why?

I am a grown man, and can think on my own. I wouldnt need any of my teammates attacking her for her opinions, nor would I think that any of them would blast her for being critical of their teacher.

Marcelo's academy (as well as the majority of schools) doesnt encourage a cult like behaviour.

We don't call him master, we don't seperate students (by pricing levels), and we don't have an "elite" team that is always told that they are better than the other 97% of the bitches (in Lloyd's words) out there.  

And, if my teacher or close friend was involved in a gang rape and never admitted to it, it would most likely be the end of our relationships.

Furthermore, if my teacher or friend used someone else's suffering (ie rape) as a chance to further propel their business, I would certainly voice my objections to them, and would train elsewhere and encourage others to do so.

I would certainly not be blindly supporting him on public forums when it is clear they did some (very) shady things in the past and present.

I guess I'm a crappy friend and student.

1/15/13 1:19 AM
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cheesesteak
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LiveFromThe7x7 - 
HOLLYWOOD-MO - 
Brian J DSouza -

Guys, I think Tom Callos and Chloe Cornelius are very brave for the stance they have taken. The legal system and courts will deal with justice, but in the case of Keenan, ask yourself, if he was your son/brother, what would you want of him?

Many people have remained silent, but let's start asking for the Lloyd Irvin members and affiliates who are actively defending Lloyd (who has taken no responsibility nor confirmed or denied his 1990 case) to remain silent until they know the facts about their instructor.

As for Chloe and Tom Callos, they have my support.

I don't think people are saying that Keenan's family shouldn't get involved or advise him of how to proceed. People are saying that they should have advised him behind the scenes and not publicly on Facebook.

There should be no reason that either his sister or dad couldn't pick up the phone and tell then all their thoughts. No need to air it out on FB Phone Post

This.

It's not that hard to understand.

My brother is a shit bag who shot his drug dealer. I would put him on blast in a second because he's a POS and I desire no relationship with him.

But when other family members make mistakes, I use discretion and deal with the matter privately. My family gives me the same respect.

Using your very own logic...His family is suggesting Keenan put Lloyd on blast for participating in a gang rape that he weaseled his way out of being found guilty....

Once Keenan found this information out whether it be on a cell phone call, message board, fb or even a telegram he should put Lloyd on blast in a second too and thank his father and sister for pointing out what a POS Lloyd is
1/15/13 1:38 AM
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pelekys
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The way I see it is that Lloyd Irvin made himself a public brand. He chose to promote himself and publicize everything he has achieved to advance himself financially. Now, he is faced with the cost of making himself a public figure - his faults get made public too.

Avellan and Proctor are multiplying the anger connected to those faults. Phone Post
1/15/13 1:44 AM
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cheesesteak
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pelekys -  The way I see it is that Lloyd Irvin made himself a public brand. He chose to promote himself and publicize everything he has achieved to advance himself financially. Now, he is faced with the cost of making himself a public figure - his faults get made public too.

Avellan and Proctor are multiplying the anger connected to those faults. Phone Post

absolutely correct and voted up. It's amazing how some people can't see this.
1/15/13 1:48 AM
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jkd_guy
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For those TLI people who keep saying hes innocent and had his day in court...do they also feel the same way about Casey Anthony?

She was found innocent and had her day in court.
1/15/13 1:56 AM
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PrinceAlbert
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cheesesteak - 
LiveFromThe7x7 - 
HOLLYWOOD-MO - 
Brian J DSouza -

Guys, I think Tom Callos and Chloe Cornelius are very brave for the stance they have taken. The legal system and courts will deal with justice, but in the case of Keenan, ask yourself, if he was your son/brother, what would you want of him?

Many people have remained silent, but let's start asking for the Lloyd Irvin members and affiliates who are actively defending Lloyd (who has taken no responsibility nor confirmed or denied his 1990 case) to remain silent until they know the facts about their instructor.

As for Chloe and Tom Callos, they have my support.

I don't think people are saying that Keenan's family shouldn't get involved or advise him of how to proceed. People are saying that they should have advised him behind the scenes and not publicly on Facebook.

There should be no reason that either his sister or dad couldn't pick up the phone and tell then all their thoughts. No need to air it out on FB Phone Post

This.

It's not that hard to understand.

My brother is a shit bag who shot his drug dealer. I would put him on blast in a second because he's a POS and I desire no relationship with him.

But when other family members make mistakes, I use discretion and deal with the matter privately. My family gives me the same respect.

Using your very own logic...His family is suggesting Keenan put Lloyd on blast for participating in a gang rape that he weaseled his way out of being found guilty....

Once Keenan found this information out whether it be on a cell phone call, message board, fb or even a telegram he should put Lloyd on blast in a second too and thank his father and sister for pointing out what a POS Lloyd is

cheesesteak,

Thank you for you're work, keep it up please! Let's keep Keenan out of this, I don't have a relationship with him but do side with his family. This has nothing to do with him, he is a 20 year old man and stands on his own. This is about Llyod and his minions who lack integrity and character. Keenan seems to be a guy just busting his ass and trying to get the best training in he can. At some point he will get it but it's not about him right now.
1/15/13 2:23 AM
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SOO72
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Jesus Christ that Facebook chain is like something out of Penn State.

Kid should listen to his family, they care about him, these other guys care more about their brand which is going down the tubes right now.

He should get out now while he can, you know what they say about mixing five pounds of ice cream with five pounds of shit... you get ten pounds of shit.
1/15/13 2:24 AM
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inf0
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Blood is thicker than water. Listen your family.

 

1/15/13 2:39 AM
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Drugs_Delaney
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jkd_guy - For those TLI people who keep saying hes innocent and had his day in court...do they also feel the same way about Casey Anthony?

She was found innocent and had her day in court.

better yet, ask them about OJ.
1/15/13 2:43 AM
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Virginio
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LiveFromThe7x7 -
2JupitersTooMany - 
LiveFromThe7x7 -
2JupitersTooMany - 
LiveFromThe7x7 - Keenan's sister is using this as an excuse to get on a soap box and cause drama.

That's disgusting.

If she were my sister, I would disown her.
Women have a funny way of not tolerating it when rape victims are silenced and characterized as whores Phone Post

She's putting her brother on blast.

Attention whore is attention whoring.
I'm sure it's a horribly uncomfortable thing for a young man to be thrown into a conflict w his team. But you are misplacing blame. Women get to speak out about rape and be furious about it. Your sympathies are in the wrong place. Other parties caused this mess. Phone Post

Her brother should come first.

This should be a PRIVATE family matter.

If my sister put me on blast for something someone else did, the relationship would be over. Period.
That's probably because you're a child. Phone Post
1/15/13 3:42 AM
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BENDOver 209 Top Team #2
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Its been about an hour.... Someone needs to say blast again Phone Post
1/15/13 4:05 AM
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INDK
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These people need to read the bible.
1/15/13 5:50 AM
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Forrest Gimp
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What a bunch of brainwashed douchebags. What I hear coming out of their mouths is fear of losing a revenue-stream. There's no chance in hell I'd let anyone talk like that to my sister, in spite of what she said.

What I've gathered from Chloe's posts, whether ir's actual facts of not, are:

- victim 20 years ago said LI did rape her
- victim 20 years ago was threatened being thrown off the balcony

That should be from the police reports. A third thing, she did ask something like:

- "did Nick show you the video on his cellphone?"

So, perhaps there's more to come?
1/15/13 6:01 AM
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Caleb R
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He should listen to his family and not associate with this trash. Phone Post
1/15/13 6:23 AM
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bamx2
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Edited: 01/15/13 6:23 AM
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From bloodyelbow - interesting!

 

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2013/1/14/3875126/lloyd-irvin-black-belt-head-instructor-at-wrightson-bjj-calls-1989

1/15/13 6:27 AM
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Rick Young
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I have been a martial artist for 38 years and have seen some messed up things both in and out of the training environment but this whole situation has topped anything I have seen or heard of. The tragic rape of a girl by 2 teammates, the history of their instructor, the cynical use of the internet to not only cover up the situation but to try and make money from, of all things, a rape prevention programe. Then we have the people who are not only defending the actions of those responsible but are now making jokes about it and attacking a fellow teammate’s family. It is beyond belief and is both disgusting and disturbing.
This whole case has nothing to do with martial arts but everything to do with personal codes of conduct, ethics and morality. I am certainly no angel and have made my fair share of mistakes in life, but anyone with a modicum of sensibility and intelligence should see where the blame lies in this situation. Anyone defending those responsible should be ashamed of themselves
1/15/13 6:45 AM
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boooring
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Just knowing Lloyd and TLI from a cursory standpoint my hunch is that Keenan signed a pretty comprehensive legal contract.

After Ryan Hall and Lloyd parted ways after the whole who gets what for some DVD sales (or something to that effect), I don't see Lloyd not trying to implement something legally for guys he's working with now.
1/15/13 6:49 AM
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Acexnz
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Some of Avellan's videos were quite interesting but it is clear after reading his posts that he is an asshole and a moron.

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