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S&C UnderGround >> 10 Weeks to New PR's


1/22/13 10:40 AM
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LiftStrong
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Well, I'm gearing up for a raw Push/Pull powerlifting competition in April and just laid out a 10 week training program. My bench max right now is 275 and my DL max is 475. Goal is to bump both of them up by 25lbs in the next 10 weeks to hit a 300 bench and 500 deadlift in the 165lb weight class. Also of note, I will be doing my training with a HS football player so a decent bit of programming will be geared towards athleticism, not just lifting heavy shit.

I am going to post my daily lifts here. Feel free to chime in on any thoughts, suggestions, questions or to post some pics of hot chicks lifting weights for inspiration. I will try to post some training vids along the way and finish off with vids from the meet.
1/22/13 10:48 AM
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LiftStrong
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Jan 21 - Speed Lower Day
Tested out my DL 1RM on Saturday and still a little sore. Took it a bit easy.

1. Snatch - singles up to 145lbs
Snatch pulls - 5x5 @ 145lbs

2. Mini band resisted superset x5
a)squats x5
b)jump squats x5
c)step up with high knees x8 (each leg)

3. Speed Box Squat - 8x3 @ 155 + light bands
4. Single leg hip thrust - 3x8 w/ 22lb chain
5. TRX Mountain Climbers - 3x50
1/22/13 10:59 AM
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paw
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Nice thread idea.  Voted up and best of luck!

1/22/13 11:15 AM
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jeremy hamilton
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If I was to do a push/pull with only 10 weeks to prepare, I would copy the program Power to the People almost exactly.

You only have 10 weeks and you already wasted day1.

Practice practice practice.

This is just IMHO though.
1/22/13 11:54 AM
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LiftStrong
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Thanks Paw.
Jeremy - I was hoping yourself and some of the other smart people would chime in. I appreciate the advice. I'm a big fan of Pavel but I wanted to do some of my own programming to see what kind of results I can come out with (I have a lot to learn still). I also need to blend my powerlifting goals with the goals of the football player I am working with, so this wont be focused on PL solely.

And yes, Monday turned into more of a recovery workout than anything. I was pretty beat up from training on the weekend, certainly wasnt what I was planning on!
1/22/13 1:59 PM
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Wiggy
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Jeremy - do you feel that 10 weeks is a good timeframe for something like PTP in this scenario? Of course, it would depend on how far back from your RM you start, but I've always kinda been of the mindset that PTP is more of just a weighted GTG type of program. It will help you become proficient at expressing the strength you have in/toward a particular movement, but never been overly convinced that it will help you put a bunch of weight on your RM.

That said (and I'm not saying I'm necessarily right - just my thoughts), I'd worry that someone would peak too early with something like PTP and end up having to do too many waves in a short period of time right before the competition.

Thoughts on that?

LiftStrong - I like the overall look of the workout you posted as a whole, but it seems like an odd bit of programming for PLing in general. Mind sharing your thought process in designing it? And what's the overall plan/schedule gonna look like going forward?

Wiggy - http://www.workingclassfitness.com

1/22/13 3:03 PM
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jeremy hamilton
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Wiggy- With only 10 weeks to go I don't know of any other better way.

If he had 10 months then I would spend the first 6-8 months building some size and bringing up weaknesses. Then months 8, 9, 10 would be practicing with heavier weights and trying to get complete recovery between training sessions, training with mostly the comp lifts and no variations. Lower volume, higher intensity.

10 Weeks is not a lot of time. Not enough time to build strength through hypertrophy, might as well get good at the comp lifts.

Peaking too early shouldn't be a problem if he's smart about it. If he did peak too early there is nothing wrong with doing a small reset of the numbers.

Also, he wouldn't need to run wave loading. For instance...

Week1 365x5x1set 4xs a week.

Week2 375""

Week3 385""

Week4 395""

Week5 405""

Even if he stayed with 405 for the remainder of his meet cycle(maybe with a short peak in intensity in week 8 and 9, I think he would have a good shot at a 500 pull.

1/22/13 3:48 PM
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LiftStrong
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Wiggy - This certainly wont be a traditional style PL program. I like to use jumps, olympic lifts and sprint/change of direction work at the beginning of my workout to get things fired up. The HS football player who will be training with me has some combine style testing and recruiting events coming up in the spring time, so I want to make sure we are still working on sprint mechanics, jumping and acceleration along the way in addition to building up his strength and size.

Each week I will have 2 upper body, 2 lower body and one technique day rotating between bench and deadlift (eow). The first 4 weeks will be rotating through DE, ME and RE days. Below is a weekly scheudle. I am planning on a deload for the better part of week 6 and again after the 10 weeks are over (the meet is 11 weeks out).

Sun Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri Sat

W1 TechB DE(L) ME(U) OFF RE(L) DE(U) OFF
W2 OFF ME(L) RE(U) OFF DE(L) ME(U) TechD
W3 TechB RE(L) DE(U) OFF ME(L) RE(U) OFF
W4 OFF DE(L) ME(U) OFF RE(L) DE(U) TechD
1/22/13 3:57 PM
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jeremy hamilton
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Way over-complicated plan. Also a week 6 deload is a waste of a training week.

1/23/13 2:52 AM
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Leigh
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I don't have anything like the experience Jeremy does but I think adding more than 10kg to your lifts in 10 weeks when you're doing football training will be tough. I know you're a strong guy and you know what you're doing, just in my experience you should pretty much focus on the lifts you'll be doing when the comp is so close. Phone Post
1/23/13 7:38 AM
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LiftStrong
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<blockquote>jeremy hamilton - Way over-complicated plan. Also a week 6 deload is a waste of a training week.

It is probably a bit overthought, but there were some key things I wanted to get in there. I want to get in a lot of volume in the first 4 weeks, and tapering it down towards the end.

Could you elaborate on why you think deloading in week 6 is a bad idea? My thought was that it would give me a chance to rebuild and recover and then still have 4 weeks to work to hard and heavy. Where would you put it in there or would you just go without?
1/23/13 7:51 AM
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LiftStrong
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Jan 22

Med Ball press 5x5 (30lbs)
Bench 4x1 275lbs
3 board press 5x3 275lbs
Close grip bench 2x6 225lbs
DB Row 5x6 100lbs
Neutral Grip pullup (+25lbs) 3x7
DB pullover 2x8 90lbs
Finished with some external and internal rotation work.
1/23/13 8:08 AM
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LiftStrong
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Leigh -  I don't have anything like the experience Jeremy does but I think adding more than 10kg to your lifts in 10 weeks when you're doing football training will be tough. I know you're a strong guy and you know what you're doing, just in my experience you should pretty much focus on the lifts you'll be doing when the comp is so close. Phone Post

Yeah, certainly less than ideal having the mixed focus on training. At the end of the day though, this is pretty much just a fun competition and I wont be heartbroken if I dont get there. Treating this as a learning experience just as much as a physical challenge.
1/25/13 8:36 AM
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LiftStrong
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Jan 24

Triple hurdle jump - x8
Cluster Deadlift- 15x1 30 sec between reps 405lbs
Front Squat - 3x8 185lbs
Leg Press - 5x10 5 plates

Felt like shit. Going to write it off to a long day at work with not much sleep the night before.
1/28/13 7:58 AM
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LiftStrong
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Jan 25

1a) Depth pushups 5x5
b) Face Pulls 5x12 100lbs

2. Band ast Bench 8x3 345lbs w med band
***Worked out to close to 300 at lockout and 225 at the bottom.

3. Prone Row 5x8 95lbs + mini band.

4. Oscillating defecit pushup 3x20 secs

5. a) Shrug w/ ext rotation 3x10 15lbs
b) Hammer curl 3x20 (each arm) 15lbs
1/28/13 10:23 AM
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vermonter
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Jeremy and I are almost the same from a philosophical standpoint on how to lift for power (with some important differences). Jeremy is also very good at what he does.

I'd follow his advice if you want to improve your lifts. Fucking around with exercises to improve your sticking points might be alright, and some a few sets of rows/pullups to balance things, but you ought to be doing each of your two comp lifts several times per week at 90% plus of your max and aiming for maybe 20 or 30 reps total in that range.

Find a total reps of work at a weight in one week that guarantees an increase in strength the following week that is predictable, and then you can figure out just about what you'll be hitting come competetion time (with some extra, as comp lifts are generally PRs).
1/28/13 1:44 PM
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LiftStrong
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I appreciate you (and everyone else) chiming in Doug.

I plan on hitting 2-3 bench + DL sessions per week moving forward. As you can probably tell I like using accomodating resistance (a bit too much). It helps me get comfortable handling heavier weight and developing my top end power. I have been planning on using a few different assistance lifts during the first 4-5 weeks. The last 4-5 weeks will be much lower volume and focused solely on competition prep.

Could you help me with 2 things?
1. Could you clarify your last paragraph for me? How would I go about calculating and applying that?
2. Jeremy mentioned that a de-load half way through would be a waste. Do you share those sentiments? De-loads always do me a world of good and I am a bit worried about wear and tear with the amount of heavy reps I will be doing over the next few months.
1/28/13 2:14 PM
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jeremy hamilton
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I think planned deloads are a waste of a training week. It's nearly impossible to predict your performance on any given day, why waste what could be the best training week/day of your life lifting baby weights? You could be skipping a day where you blast through a physical or mental plateau.

For me when I go to the gym and train and I have a day where I only get lets say 3 of the 5 reps that I was shooting for, then thats a deload.

I like the gun to the head theory. If I told you I was going to kill your whole family if you dont add 50lbs to your squat/dead in 6 months what would you do? You probably wouldn't waste training weeks or time by doing exercises that probably do nothing.

The only planned deload I ever have is meet week.

I am sure there are some elite lifters out there that have planned deloads but I don't know of or can't think of any.
1/29/13 6:51 AM
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LiftStrong
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Thanks for the follow up Jeremy. I'll take your advice here and plan on forgoing the deload until the last week before the meet. Once I get a bit closer to the meet, I'd love to get your opinion on what your last week before a competition usually looks like.

Jan 28
1. High box jump - 10 reps on 40" box
2. Deads - 10x1 415lbs > really planned on going higher, but having issues with my hands and losing chunks of skin on the bar...
3. Sumo Deads - 5x5 315lbs
4. a) KB Swing 3x12 60lbs
b) Plate pushes 3x 25yards
1/29/13 6:58 AM
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Leigh
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A deload week is useful if you are doing a load of other stuff. For MMA, I find it vital

When I was powerlifting, no one deloaded. It was unheard of. And they were strong as fuck. Some were juicing, many were not (well, you never know)
1/29/13 12:30 PM
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vermonter
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LiftStrong - I appreciate you (and everyone else) chiming in Doug.

I plan on hitting 2-3 bench + DL sessions per week moving forward. As you can probably tell I like using accomodating resistance (a bit too much). It helps me get comfortable handling heavier weight and developing my top end power. I have been planning on using a few different assistance lifts during the first 4-5 weeks. The last 4-5 weeks will be much lower volume and focused solely on competition prep.

Could you help me with 2 things?
1. Could you clarify your last paragraph for me? How would I go about calculating and applying that?
2. Jeremy mentioned that a de-load half way through would be a waste. Do you share those sentiments? De-loads always do me a world of good and I am a bit worried about wear and tear with the amount of heavy reps I will be doing over the next few months.

There's nothing wrong with accomodating resistance, but think of it as a means of eliminating a weakness. If you're sticking point is near the top, it can teach you to speed up through the lift and make you stronger in that range. However, the bulk of your work should be on the lifts themselves.

Practice makes perfect. It's my mantra, and Jeremy said it above too. In this time frame, precise practice will yield the best results. Over a longer time, other methods could help as well, but for now, the lifts should be your goal. Pretend each weak that you are in a contest to see who can bench/dead 250/425 the most times in a weak without ever doing more than 1 rep sets at that weight or without ever resting less than 5 minutes between sets and always being fully recovered. If that's really your mentality, everything else you do in the gym or elsewhere is either a warm up or a waste of energy. And if that's really how you do it, you will be able to perform a shocking amount of work in the top ten percent of your strength on a weekly basis without over training.

And what's another word for that? Practice.

For your questions:

1. Take what i wrote just here in this post. Now lets say in your contest you hit 30 total reps at those weights I listed this week. You find in doing so that you can increase your weights next week by 10 lbs without trouble, and try again. Maybe 30 is the number, or maybe it's 20 or maybe 40.

Here's the general idea: If you practice with those weights as i mention above enough times in a given week, you will have spent enough time with the bar to have gotten stronger. Maybe that's 10 lbs stronger. This will take time to figure out, but you can essentially determine how much practice you can withstand and how much is needed to increase by a predictable degree over time. Pop it in a spreadsheet and you'll see that in your ten weeks time you can up your lifts by the 25 lbs that you want.

Because of the short time frame, you're best served by doing the reverse of forecasting your strength gains. Plug your goals into a spreadsheet, and determine the gain needed each week (2.5 lbs). Then it will tell you what you need to lift each week to achieve that goal, and the practice the lifts as i mention above, and figure out how much practice you need to get relatively 2.5 lbs stronger each week. Have a column for what you need, and a column for where you are, and then your data will tell you where you are at any point in time relative to your goal.

Jeremy basically wrote this out above with 10 lbs per week in the deadlift.

2. I love that I planned to write something and then jeremy went ahead and said what I wanted to. Very vindicating.

I was going to say that in this time frame it probably isn't necessary, however experienced lifters like Jeremy and Leigh are in tune with how they feel on lifting day. If things don't feel 100% they back off. So the most apt answer is to not plan a de-load, but to let it happen naturally by feel. In my opinion weekly goals are more important than daily ones for strength training anyway, so if today isn't the best day to hit the bench, or you only hit it a few times, then wait a day or two and try again.

The nice thing about this of training is that the volume is low enough that, as long as you avoid failure and pushing your limits too often like the plague, you won't actually experience much in the way of wear and tear.
1/29/13 12:39 PM
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vermonter
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Example:

Bench Press

Week, goal, actual

1. 275

2. 277.5

3. 280

4. 282.5

5. 285

6. 287.5

7. 290

8. 292.5

9. 295

10 (competition). 300+

In the third column, put what weight you actually did. Maybe a fourth column where you list how many reps you achieved for your future records to figure out what you need for practice. As long as you can stay at, or ahead of those numbers each week, you will hit your goal or more.
1/30/13 9:31 AM
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LiftStrong
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PRACTICE?!?!?! Yeah, definitely still need a lot more of that. And thanks for the clarification on the tracking, good idea.

Jan 29

Was a good day on the bench. New gym PR for myself (285) and also for the WR I'm training (255).

Bench - worked up to 285 2x1
3-board press - 5x3 285lbs
Wide grip pullup 5x6
Suitcase shrug - 3x12
Added in a few sets of ab/stability work.

2/2/13 8:09 AM
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LiftStrong
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Edited: 02/02/13 8:14 AM
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Jan 31
Hands still torn up, saving deads for the weekend. Just worked on some sprint mechanics, did some light sprinting and some zercher squats and lateral lunges.

Feb 1
Bench 4x1 285lbs
Tricep Death - 5 reps w/ 0-2-3-5-3-2-0 boards - 35 reps total.
1 set with 135 and 1 set with 95
Horizontal Rows - 3x8 BW + 22lb chain
Finished up with some boxing. Held mitts for 3 rounds and worked defence for 3 rounds (aka let my training partner tee up and beat the shit out of me until he gets tired!)
2/2/13 9:52 AM
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vermonter
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Edited: 02/02/13 9:52 AM
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I would avoid anything with "death" as a part of the name.

Something named "stronger triceps" would be a better program for your goals.

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