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NBAGround >> Kobe

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1/30/13 2:59 AM
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Jacob Lamb
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Edited: 01/30/13 3:00 AM
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Since Christmas, the Lakers have lost every game that Kobe shoots the ball more than 20 times.

Since Christmas, the Lakers have won every game that Kobe shoots the ball less than 20 times.
1/30/13 11:56 AM
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Out To Lunch
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He seems to be trying to distribute the ball more now.
1/30/13 12:28 PM
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dangerboy12
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I don't know if we should give him credit for finally getting with the program, or if we should scold him for waiting until it's almost too late.
1/30/13 3:56 PM
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Jacob Lamb
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1/31/13 7:24 PM
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HenryO
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LOL so he finally has a great point guard on his team and Kobe thinks its a good idea to dominate the ball even more

What a disaster this Lakers team is and to me kind of represents where Kobe will go down all time. One of the greatest scorers ever and one of the worst teammates ever
2/1/13 10:18 AM
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dangerboy12
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HenryO - LOL so he finally has a great point guard on his team and Kobe thinks its a good idea to dominate the ball even more

What a disaster this Lakers team is and to me kind of represents where Kobe will go down all time. One of the greatest scorers ever and one of the worst teammates ever

I totally agree. Kobe is the only GOAT player who doesn't make his teammates better. In fact, it can be argued he makes the worse.

But, the media won't dare criticize him. When they lost to the Suns the other night, where Bryant clearly went back to his old ways in the 4th, nobody called him out on it. They simply said "the team was playing bad and Kobe was forced to take difficult shots." No, Kobe started playing bad by getting the ball stolen from him, switching off of Beasley to let Pau try to handle him on the perimeter, and giving up on his entire team because World Peace missed a couple of open 3's.

I'll say it again, the Lakers as they are right now would be a lot better if Kobe got injured and missed the rest of the season.
2/1/13 10:35 AM
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dangerboy12 - 
HenryO - LOL so he finally has a great point guard on his team and Kobe thinks its a good idea to dominate the ball even more

What a disaster this Lakers team is and to me kind of represents where Kobe will go down all time. One of the greatest scorers ever and one of the worst teammates ever

I totally agree. Kobe is the only GOAT player who doesn't make his teammates better. In fact, it can be argued he makes the worse.

But, the media won't dare criticize him. When they lost to the Suns the other night, where Bryant clearly went back to his old ways in the 4th, nobody called him out on it. They simply said "the team was playing bad and Kobe was forced to take difficult shots." No, Kobe started playing bad by getting the ball stolen from him, switching off of Beasley to let Pau try to handle him on the perimeter, and giving up on his entire team because World Peace missed a couple of open 3's.

I'll say it again, the Lakers as they are right now would be a lot better if Kobe got injured and missed the rest of the season.

I'm not a Kobe fan, but that is a pretty bold statement. Maybe they could win without him if Howard was healthy.
2/1/13 11:50 AM
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dangerboy12
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Edited: 02/01/13 11:52 AM
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they are 20-26

Nash, Howard, World Peace and Gasol could do better than that with Jodie Meeks at the 2 I am most certain, even with the injuries.
2/1/13 11:54 AM
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dangerboy12 - they are 20-26

Nash, Howard, World Peace and Gasol could do better than that with Jodie Meeks at the 2 I am most certain, even with the injuries.

To be honest, I haven't watched a full Lakers game this season. Maybe a few minutes of the actual game and then the rest I see on Sportscenter.

Have you noticed a pattern when Kobe sits? Does the team seem to play better when he is not on the floor? Last season I think they had a little bit of a run without Kobe, when he was injured. Or maybe that was the season before, but maybe there is something to what you're saying.
2/1/13 12:02 PM
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dangerboy12
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He doesn't sit much, so it's hard to tell. And when he does sit, so does at least one of the other stars on the team on most occasions.
2/3/13 3:11 AM
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PTM2020
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Edited: 02/03/13 3:13 AM
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dangerboy12 - 
HenryO - LOL so he finally has a great point guard on his team and Kobe thinks its a good idea to dominate the ball even more

What a disaster this Lakers team is and to me kind of represents where Kobe will go down all time. One of the greatest scorers ever and one of the worst teammates ever

I totally agree. Kobe is the only GOAT player who doesn't make his teammates better. In fact, it can be argued he makes the worse.

But, the media won't dare criticize him. When they lost to the Suns the other night, where Bryant clearly went back to his old ways in the 4th, nobody called him out on it. They simply said "the team was playing bad and Kobe was forced to take difficult shots." No, Kobe started playing bad by getting the ball stolen from him, switching off of Beasley to let Pau try to handle him on the perimeter, and giving up on his entire team because World Peace missed a couple of open 3's.

I'll say it again, the Lakers as they are right now would be a lot better if Kobe got injured and missed the rest of the season.

 

Kobe has just supassed Jordan on assists at relatively the same time in their careers.

 

Additionally Kobe averaged more assists in the triangle than Jordan ever did, yet Kobe is the selfish one?.  Esplain that.

2/3/13 4:33 AM
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HenryO
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dangerboy12 - they are 20-26

Nash, Howard, World Peace and Gasol could do better than that with Jodie Meeks at the 2 I am most certain, even with the injuries.

Wouldnt doubt it. Nash running an offense feeding Gasol and Dwight would be pretty effective.

The defence would still be a nightmare tho
2/3/13 6:28 PM
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Jacob Lamb
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dangerboy12 - 
HenryO - LOL so he finally has a great point guard on his team and Kobe thinks its a good idea to dominate the ball even more

What a disaster this Lakers team is and to me kind of represents where Kobe will go down all time. One of the greatest scorers ever and one of the worst teammates ever

I totally agree. Kobe is the only GOAT player who doesn't make his teammates better. In fact, it can be argued he makes the worse.

But, the media won't dare criticize him. When they lost to the Suns the other night, where Bryant clearly went back to his old ways in the 4th, nobody called him out on it. They simply said "the team was playing bad and Kobe was forced to take difficult shots." No, Kobe started playing bad by getting the ball stolen from him, switching off of Beasley to let Pau try to handle him on the perimeter, and giving up on his entire team because World Peace missed a couple of open 3's.

I'll say it again, the Lakers as they are right now would be a lot better if Kobe got injured and missed the rest of the season.

 

Kobe has just supassed Jordan on assists at relatively the same time in their careers.

 

Additionally Kobe averaged more assists in the triangle than Jordan ever did, yet Kobe is the selfish one?.  Esplain that.


It took Kobe 136 more games to catch Jordan. That's almost two seasons.

Jordan's career assists per game is higher than Kobe's.

Jordan didn't have any bigs that could score.

Kobe had Shaq, Gasol, Bynum, Howard...

Jordan had Cartwright, Perdue, Longley, Wennington...
2/4/13 3:37 AM
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PTM2020
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Edited: 02/04/13 4:29 AM
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It took Kobe 136 more games to catch Jordan. That's almost two seasons.

Kobe didn't even start for his first 2 seasons and averaged about 18 minutes per game for his first 150 games (thanks alot Del Harris) whereas Jordan was an immediate starter and focal point of the Bulls offense from day 1 and throughout 15 seasons.

Factor that in and it actually took 14 less games for Kobe to pass up Jordan in assists.  The other things to consider here are that Kobe didn't become the focal point of the Laker offense till his 9th season.  Whereas Jordan was the focal point from Day 1 and Doug Collins was basically playing him like a Point Guard from 87-89.

Kobe had Shaq, Gasol, Bynum, Howard...

Howard doesn't count yet because he's barely even played 40 games with Kobe.

Bynum only played about half a season every season for 6 years, the other half he spent in the IR & didn't score above 10 ppg till his 3rd year. 

So that was about 4 years with poopoo centers like Chris Mihm, Slava Medvedenko and Kwame Brown, 3 of those years Kobe posted some of his highest assist numbers and about 1 assist per year better than the years with Gasol. So the high scoring big man argument doesn't really hold as much water as you would think.

Again though, under Phil's triangle, a passing distribution based system that won all those titles for the Bulls and the Lakers,  Kobe's assist numbers are better than Jordans during those championship years, this despite Pippin being a better scorer than Gasol.

Under the triangle.  Kobe -5.11 apg.    Jordan - 5.07apg

Jordan and Pippen ran the break together. That's where a lot of Jordan's assists came from.
Kobe ran the break with... uhm..well, nobody.
Shaq was not a catch-and-shoot player, he liked to pound the ball when he received it in the post, so no assist most of the time.

Jordan also had the top 3-point shooter in the league to pass to during both threepeats (Paxson, Kerr).

"Kobe was the best playmaker I've ever coached." -Phil Jackson

 

2/4/13 12:30 PM
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dangerboy12
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dangerboy12 - 
HenryO - LOL so he finally has a great point guard on his team and Kobe thinks its a good idea to dominate the ball even more

What a disaster this Lakers team is and to me kind of represents where Kobe will go down all time. One of the greatest scorers ever and one of the worst teammates ever

I totally agree. Kobe is the only GOAT player who doesn't make his teammates better. In fact, it can be argued he makes the worse.

But, the media won't dare criticize him. When they lost to the Suns the other night, where Bryant clearly went back to his old ways in the 4th, nobody called him out on it. They simply said "the team was playing bad and Kobe was forced to take difficult shots." No, Kobe started playing bad by getting the ball stolen from him, switching off of Beasley to let Pau try to handle him on the perimeter, and giving up on his entire team because World Peace missed a couple of open 3's.

I'll say it again, the Lakers as they are right now would be a lot better if Kobe got injured and missed the rest of the season.

 

Kobe has just supassed Jordan on assists at relatively the same time in their careers.

 

Additionally Kobe averaged more assists in the triangle than Jordan ever did, yet Kobe is the selfish one?.  Esplain that.


Yeah I'd say Kobe and MJ are about the same when it comes to assists. What does that mean?
2/5/13 7:18 PM
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HenryO
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Ya how did this turn into a debate about assists from my original point that Kobe is a terrible teammate? Is anyone willing to argue that?

So quick to compare Kobe to Jordan when that wasnt brought up at all.

How about comparing Kobe to someone from the same generation in Lebron, whose level Kobe is clearly not on
2/9/13 8:27 AM
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PTM2020
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Yeah, until Bron accomplishes anything close to what Kobe's accomplished, then he's nowhere near his level.

Just sayin,  everyone harps on Kobe for supposedly being a bad team  mate when they're so quick to give Jordan a pass.  Yet Kobe was the better assist man on those championship years.

Jordan didn't make anybody much better than Kobe did.  Pretty much all of Kobe's teammates on those championship years have nothing but great praise for him.  Even Shaq has backed off a little bit.

Kobe rode Pau into becoming a champion.  Pau straight taxed that ass on Dwight, Amare,  Kenyon & others during the back to back title run.  He's never played at that level ever.  At  the onset people gave Kobe shit for riding him so hard to play at a higher level, same as their doing right now for him riding Dwight.

Lakers are all about winning championships and Kobe has always been 100% committed to that.  If his team mates aren't on the same page, they will get called out on it and get rode on till they understand.  period.

2/9/13 5:11 PM
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HenryO
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LEbrons prime is already better then Kobes accomplishments aside, to me prime vs prime is how you compare players. LEbrons prime is guranteed 60 wins on just about any team in the league, Kobe could never carry a team like that. But thats aside from the original argument too.
2/17/13 5:06 AM
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spliffmood
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This team has had the harshest run of bad luck.
Also, They play better without Howard TBH.
4/13/13 2:48 AM
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EKPOGI
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Edited: 04/13/13 2:48 AM
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dangerboy12 - I'll say it again, the Lakers as they are right now would be a lot better if Kobe got injured and missed the rest of the season.


^injured now

4/13/13 9:20 AM
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dangerboy12
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They will win the rest of their games, especially if they continue to have the refs in their back pocket.

They shot 50 ft's last night. Golden State shot 16.
4/13/13 10:32 PM
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HenryO
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One things for sure Kobes a fucking warrior. I bet he comes back strong from this and plays a key part on some sort of championship contending LAkers team following 2014 summer

Imagine Dwight leaves LA for Dallas or something, then Lakers trade Gasol and with Kobe hurt they pretty much throw the 2013-14 year to set themselves up for Wiggins.
4/18/13 12:36 PM
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dangerboy12
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They won the rest of their games lol.

I hope to god they get swept by the Spurs, but I do feel they have a much better chance without Kobe, and honestly, I wouldn't be all that upset if they manage to beat the Spurs, even though I like the Spurs a lot more than I like the Lakers.

Seeing the team do well without Kobe would be great.
4/18/13 2:43 PM
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EKPOGI
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^yupt they won the rest of their games(2). it's not like they were winning the last couple of weeks with Kobe.
4/18/13 3:14 PM
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dangerboy12
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Yeah they were doing fine

I just think the team would be better without Kobe, but we will never really know, unless they do well without Kobe in the playoffs.

I think their chances are better now than before. I think they would have gotten swept first rd with Kobe against SA. They would have had a better chance against OKC with Kobe playing, regardless of what the talking heads on TNT and ESPN want you to think. Without Kobe, SA becomes the more favorable match up.

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