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UnderGround Forums >> Zuffa Fighter Bashing = BAD FOR BUSINESS


2/3/13 3:54 PM
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Kirik
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Edited: 02/03/13 5:33 PM
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The UnderGround, Mayor

Is your argument that PPV buys over all are down because Dana has offered some harsh words about some elite fighters? I am not trying to be snide or anything, just trying to understand your train of thought.

Also interested in your take on PPV buys and Tito Ortiz when he and Dana were feuding.

2/3/13 5:04 PM
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JeffersonDArcyChoke
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Randy Couture isnt fighting in a ppv anytime soon... but yeah, I agree with the premise of your point.

I think Zuffa made a mistake by not locking Randy down in the booth.  He's a great analyst.  Florian sucks as color man...  Randy was great when he was doing it.

They made a similar mistake with king mo... releasing him when he was already on suspension... what the heck was the point of that?

 


Randy wasnt doing shows though he was just doing the Fox desk and frankly Stann > Randy at the desk.


yeah, he wasnt doing shows and I think that was a mistake.  He should have been given kenny florians job.


Kenny is 5xs the commentator Randy is so why should he have Kenny's job exactly?

 

Cindy

5 times?

I'd say Frank Mir was better than both if I had to pick.

Couture's value was in being Randy.

Just like HBO had when George Foreman called fights.

HBO didn't use George because he was the most eloquent but rather because people loved him.

More people love Randy than Florian.

Having Capt. America, "that man is my hero", star from 'The Expendables' in a booth is more valuable than Florian.

5 times better?

That's your call.

But you can't say Florian is 5X as valuable from Q rating or pure PR.

Let's go Princess. - Randy Couture Phone Post
2/3/13 11:39 PM
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Haulport
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I know I've said this a million times, but if Lorenzo and Dana want to see their PPV numbers increase and they want to see the UFC really grow into the mainstream they need to WAKE UP and stop with all the fighter bashing.

Let's take this newest Randy Couture episode. Regardless of what may or may not go on behind the scenes, even if Randy was a terrible guy, it does not benefit the UFC to raise stars up and then trash them. That's great if you want to sell subscriptions to the National Enquirer, but when your entire business is based on getting fans EXCITED over your product (i.e. fights between FIGHTERS) by creating this cycle of "He's the Best" - - - "He's a real SOB" what you do is make every fan a believer that ALL FIGHTERS or all of your STARS are in fact losers and pieces of garbage. With that belief they will never get particularly excited over anyone because they will always anticipate the inevitable trashing.

You don't want that.

Now I know it gives them leverage over the fighters, control, etc. but that only takes you so far (and we have seen that peak). To go further you MUST transform your stars into SUPERstars and GODS the way every other sport (particluar footbal and soccer) do. Without that, the UFC will never see the true mainstream success they crave...


PPV numbers have increased this year, even with all the trash talking DFW does about his contracted employees. Maybe you should rethink your arguments? There are more eyes on the UFC brand now than ever before.

From what Dave Meltzer is reporting, the UFC did 6.4mm PPV buys in 2011 and 5.7mm PPV buys in 2012 with less shows. The only thing higher is the avg, which doesn't matter. Total revenues are all that matter and PPV total revs for 2011 and then 2012 are down. Two years in a row...

2/3/13 11:52 PM
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Haulport
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Kirik - 

Is your argument that PPV buys over all are down because Dana has offered some harsh words about some elite fighters? I am not trying to be snide or anything, just trying to understand your train of thought.

Also interested in your take on PPV buys and Tito Ortiz when he and Dana were feuding.


That is my argument, absolutely.

The never-ending cycle of Dana denigrating his own product is taking it's toll. There are other factors at play also imo: how they present their product, match-making, etc. but the model of bashing fighters is almost unparalleled in sport and makes fans lose interest in men they see not as "sports gods" but as flawed and probably 2nd rate because of the constant drubbing they take by the organization who is supposed to be promoting them or the expectation of the "inevitable" drubbing.

That sensibility is antithetical to what people look for in sports.

The Tito situation is where it started. Dana and Tito did the whole Stone Cold Steve Austin / Mr. McMahon "rebel fighting his boss" schtick. The issue at play here is not the first instance of this, it is the incessent reoccuring bashing of so many fighters.

No one wants to hear it. It's not fun, it's not cool. The trashing of Cain and of Junior on the first FOX show was a disaster and terribly damaged both fighters in the eyes of casual fans (and may have driven many away). The FOX people knew that and Dana disappeared from the desk after that.

2/3/13 11:53 PM
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Haulport
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Randy Couture isnt fighting in a ppv anytime soon... but yeah, I agree with the premise of your point.

I think Zuffa made a mistake by not locking Randy down in the booth.  He's a great analyst.  Florian sucks as color man...  Randy was great when he was doing it.

They made a similar mistake with king mo... releasing him when he was already on suspension... what the heck was the point of that?

 


Randy wasnt doing shows though he was just doing the Fox desk and frankly Stann > Randy at the desk.


yeah, he wasnt doing shows and I think that was a mistake.  He should have been given kenny florians job.


Kenny is 5xs the commentator Randy is so why should he have Kenny's job exactly?

 

Cindy

5 times?

I'd say Frank Mir was better than both if I had to pick.

Couture's value was in being Randy.

Just like HBO had when George Foreman called fights.

HBO didn't use George because he was the most eloquent but rather because people loved him.

More people love Randy than Florian.

Having Capt. America, "that man is my hero", star from 'The Expendables' in a booth is more valuable than Florian.

5 times better?

That's your call.

But you can't say Florian is 5X as valuable from Q rating or pure PR.

Let's go Princess. - Randy Couture Phone Post

I couldn't agree more...

2/4/13 12:52 AM
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Master Tang
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Haulport - 

I know I've said this a million times, but if Lorenzo and Dana want to see their PPV numbers increase and they want to see the UFC really grow into the mainstream they need to WAKE UP and stop with all the fighter bashing.

Let's take this newest Randy Couture episode. Regardless of what may or may not go on behind the scenes, even if Randy was a terrible guy, it does not benefit the UFC to raise stars up and then trash them. That's great if you want to sell subscriptions to the National Enquirer, but when your entire business is based on getting fans EXCITED over your product (i.e. fights between FIGHTERS) by creating this cycle of "He's the Best" - - - "He's a real SOB" what you do is make every fan a believer that ALL FIGHTERS or all of your STARS are in fact losers and pieces of garbage. With that belief they will never get particularly excited over anyone because they will always anticipate the inevitable trashing.

You don't want that.

Now I know it gives them leverage over the fighters, control, etc. but that only takes you so far (and we have seen that peak). To go further you MUST transform your stars into SUPERstars and GODS the way every other sport (particluar footbal and soccer) do. Without that, the UFC will never see the true mainstream success they crave...


Please, Dana's Meglomaniac "act" sells tons of more tickets and PPV's than the retired Handy, as honorable and respectable as Mr. Couture is.

You gotta keep in mind that Mr. White is the guy thought putting a failed politician to fight the best fighting on the planet in Anderson Silva to save a UFC PPV, then when that didn't happen and the UFC didn't have the "main event" that that wanted - TOTALLY FUCKED ALL THE FANS AND ESPECIALLY THOSE WHO BOUGHT TICKETS.

Stop over-reacting and just wait until the Fertitta Brothers find another Ringmaster for their Eight Ring Circus.
2/4/13 3:02 AM
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Haulport
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I know I've said this a million times, but if Lorenzo and Dana want to see their PPV numbers increase and they want to see the UFC really grow into the mainstream they need to WAKE UP and stop with all the fighter bashing.

Let's take this newest Randy Couture episode. Regardless of what may or may not go on behind the scenes, even if Randy was a terrible guy, it does not benefit the UFC to raise stars up and then trash them. That's great if you want to sell subscriptions to the National Enquirer, but when your entire business is based on getting fans EXCITED over your product (i.e. fights between FIGHTERS) by creating this cycle of "He's the Best" - - - "He's a real SOB" what you do is make every fan a believer that ALL FIGHTERS or all of your STARS are in fact losers and pieces of garbage. With that belief they will never get particularly excited over anyone because they will always anticipate the inevitable trashing.

You don't want that.

Now I know it gives them leverage over the fighters, control, etc. but that only takes you so far (and we have seen that peak). To go further you MUST transform your stars into SUPERstars and GODS the way every other sport (particluar footbal and soccer) do. Without that, the UFC will never see the true mainstream success they crave...


Please, Dana's Meglomaniac "act" sells tons of more tickets and PPV's than the retired Handy, as honorable and respectable as Mr. Couture is.

You gotta keep in mind that Mr. White is the guy thought putting a failed politician to fight the best fighting on the planet in Anderson Silva to save a UFC PPV, then when that didn't happen and the UFC didn't have the "main event" that that wanted - TOTALLY FUCKED ALL THE FANS AND ESPECIALLY THOSE WHO BOUGHT TICKETS.

Stop over-reacting and just wait until the Fertitta Brothers find another Ringmaster for their Eight Ring Circus.

Sifu, I am concerned about your state of mind tonight............

2/4/13 1:49 PM
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Haulport
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ttt

2/4/13 2:17 PM
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Funaki Masakatsu #1
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ttt

2/4/13 2:18 PM
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Authority Figure
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2/5/13 2:27 PM
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Haulport
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