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2/5/13 12:13 AM
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FSMA
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Lynchman - You may be right, but all but one of those randomly tested in 2012 came back clean.

I am not saying that many are not cheating, but 90% seems unlikely when Cain, JDS, Bigfoot, Nelson, Carwin and Mir all tested clean. Random tests can't be planned for.

Check out Victor Conte on Rogan's Podcast.

Read The Secret Race by Tyler Hamilton.

Remember Lance lol???

Clean tests don't mean SHIT. Especially with the complete joke of a way they test, ie URINE.
2/5/13 12:15 AM
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Mr Bungle
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bobboburns - 
Sean McCorkle -
TheFapMaster - People that complain about steroids, are the one's that dont have access to them.

exactly
I agree with Sean. I recommend everyone watching the doc called "Bigger, Stronger, Faster." Talks alot about the issues with PEDs in sports. One of the most interesting things I took away from that film is what Tiger Woods was allowed to do. He got laser eye surgery which made his eye sight BETTER than 20/20. In a sport where eye sight and depth perception is very, very important how is this allowed? In my eyes its the same as a NFL or UFC player bumping up there T levels.

Also look up "super cows." Their DNA allows them to build twice the muscle as regular cows. In the future they will do this to humans. Is that going to be considered a PED since its "natural?" Phone Post

Tiger Woods was also linked to some Canadian (forgot who he is, someone here knows who I'm talking about) who got caught bringing in some kind of highly illegal technique of injecting something into certain injured limbs to speed up the process. It was suggested that Tiger and the Canadian met up on several occasions to inject that method into Tigers knee to speed up the healing process. Something to do with platelets, If I remember correctly.
2/5/13 12:17 AM
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Mr Bungle
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HolyHackZack - I think I am the only person that cares if fighters are on steroids or not. And not because of any moral objection, but because this IS a sport about a level playing field. If the rules say both fighters can be on steroids if they want (IE Japan...), then by all means juice yourself up and I wish you the best. If the rules say you both get chainsaws, I don't care as long as you BOTH get chainsaws. What bothers me is when one guy gets really competitive on his own talent and hard work, and the other gets really good at cycling.

Right on. This guy gets it. Either make it all legal and allow everyone to do it, or not. This sport is dangerous enough.
2/5/13 12:19 AM
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Chromium
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Look, the current system aint gonna stop most juicers. It can't. If you blood tested everyone every 2 weeks and tested for everything under the sun you could stop most juicing but that's a pretty insane threshold.

HOWEVER, what the current system does do, is forces 'roiders to be smart about it and it prevents a free-for-all on PEDs like you've seen in pro-wrestling. If you have to be smart about it, while it's true you're still cheating, not only are there limits to the degree you can cheat, but it takes fewer years off your life.

And that being said, wanna know who else penned a column arguing that steroids should be legalized? Andrew "Test" Martin. He's in the video above. He wrote the column less than a year before died of a heart attack watching tv in his home, at the age of 33.

We've already seen what happens when people are allowed to "let the chips fall where they may," and wrestling isn't even a competitive sport, it's just that Vince McMahon likes huge muscular dudes so people juice to improve job security. God knows how many wrestlers were _not_ in that video who died before the age of 50.
2/5/13 12:20 AM
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DonFreedomFrye
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Mr Bungle - 
bobboburns - 
Sean McCorkle -
TheFapMaster - People that complain about steroids, are the one's that dont have access to them.

exactly
I agree with Sean. I recommend everyone watching the doc called "Bigger, Stronger, Faster." Talks alot about the issues with PEDs in sports. One of the most interesting things I took away from that film is what Tiger Woods was allowed to do. He got laser eye surgery which made his eye sight BETTER than 20/20. In a sport where eye sight and depth perception is very, very important how is this allowed? In my eyes its the same as a NFL or UFC player bumping up there T levels.

Also look up "super cows." Their DNA allows them to build twice the muscle as regular cows. In the future they will do this to humans. Is that going to be considered a PED since its "natural?" Phone Post

Tiger Woods was also linked to some Canadian (forgot who he is, someone here knows who I'm talking about) who got caught bringing in some kind of highly illegal technique of injecting something into certain injured limbs to speed up the process. It was suggested that Tiger and the Canadian met up on several occasions to inject that method into Tigers knee to speed up the healing process. Something to do with platelets, If I remember correctly.

Is platelet rich plasma (PRP) therapy a "highly illegal technique" in golf?

It's used in the NFL and NBA out in the open.
2/5/13 12:21 AM
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G-Hands
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ok, I did not read the initial post after this line:

If you can buy it at GNC, it's because it doesn't work.


That's because that line is 100% false. Literally 100%

I know people who make some of the substances at GNC & ex-bodybuilders who have used the substances that are legit steroids (when used right).

What they do is engineer the supplements so that it is missing a key component when it's on the shelf (so that it is legal to sell). However, they engineer it so that once it enters the body and is combined with another legal supplement, it's composition changes and it picks up what it was missing and become a legit steroid.

To reiterate, it become 100% steroids and the compounds for it to take effect are sold at GNC.

It's pretty easy to guess which supplements can easily become illegal-- they are the ones sold behind the locked plastic screen.

BTW, the info about the steroids is common info in the bodybuilding communities. so i'd assume it's not too far of a reach for a capable MMA athlete to come across it.
2/5/13 12:21 AM
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orcus
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Great OP by McCorkle.

Whoever your favorite fighter is, he's on banned substances, get over it. Yes, even the fat ones.

2/5/13 12:23 AM
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Mihow
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G-Hands - ok, I did not read the initial post after this line:

If you can buy it at GNC, it's because it doesn't work.


That's because that line is 100% false. Literally 100%

I know people who make some of the substances at GNC & ex-bodybuilders who have used the substances that are legit steroids (when used right).

What they do is engineer the supplements so that it is missing a key component when it's on the shelf (so that it is legal to sell). However, they engineer it so that once it enters the body and is combined with another legal supplement, it's composition changes and it picks up what it was missing and become a legit steroid.

To reiterate, it become 100% steroids and the compounds for it to take effect are sold at GNC.

It's pretty easy to guess which supplements can easily become illegal-- they are the ones sold behind the locked plastic screen.

BTW, the info about the steroids is common info in the bodybuilding communities. so i'd assume it's not too far of a reach for a capable MMA athlete to come across it.

not hating, but this post took a turn past bro science and hit fucking planet Pluto
2/5/13 12:24 AM
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Mihow
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Unless you meant prior to 7-8 years ago when all the 'andro' and such was banned
2/5/13 12:25 AM
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G-Hands
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Edited: 02/05/13 12:25 AM
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Ha. Not kidding tho, Mihow.

I'll get the specifics this week and break it down-- ideally to the specific supplements.
2/5/13 12:25 AM
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Jay Haas
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In Phone Post
2/5/13 12:26 AM
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Mr Bungle
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DonFreedomFrye - 
Mr Bungle - 
bobboburns - 
Sean McCorkle -
TheFapMaster - People that complain about steroids, are the one's that dont have access to them.

exactly
I agree with Sean. I recommend everyone watching the doc called "Bigger, Stronger, Faster." Talks alot about the issues with PEDs in sports. One of the most interesting things I took away from that film is what Tiger Woods was allowed to do. He got laser eye surgery which made his eye sight BETTER than 20/20. In a sport where eye sight and depth perception is very, very important how is this allowed? In my eyes its the same as a NFL or UFC player bumping up there T levels.

Also look up "super cows." Their DNA allows them to build twice the muscle as regular cows. In the future they will do this to humans. Is that going to be considered a PED since its "natural?" Phone Post

Tiger Woods was also linked to some Canadian (forgot who he is, someone here knows who I'm talking about) who got caught bringing in some kind of highly illegal technique of injecting something into certain injured limbs to speed up the process. It was suggested that Tiger and the Canadian met up on several occasions to inject that method into Tigers knee to speed up the healing process. Something to do with platelets, If I remember correctly.

Is platelet rich plasma (PRP) therapy a "highly illegal technique" in golf?

It's used in the NFL and NBA out in the open.

Yeah, I don't know what it was or what it was called. For some reason, PRP popped in my head, but now that you reminded what that was, I remember that's not it. There was a huge uproar about it at the time b/c Tiger hadn't lost his shit and got caught receiving those magic blowjobs that kept him on top. Thats the only way you can explain his drop off b/c after his wife found out about his affairs, she beat his ass with a baseball bat and he's never been the same since.

It wasn't that much before all that went down that he was linked to that Canadian Dr/chemist/physician, whatever/whoever he was.
2/5/13 12:28 AM
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Mihow
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G-Hands - Ha. Not kidding tho, Mihow.

I'll get the specifics this week and break it down-- ideally to the specific supplements.

sent PM (in a min in case you check this so quickly)
2/5/13 12:30 AM
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wasssp
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If a lab finds piss in your blood, the phlebotomist is a nasty mf and needs his ass beat.
Unless you've been mainlining urine. In which case, your dealer needs his ass beat for selling powdered piss instead of h.
2/5/13 12:33 AM
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DonFreedomFrye
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Mr Bungle - 
DonFreedomFrye - 
Mr Bungle - 
bobboburns - 
Sean McCorkle -
TheFapMaster - People that complain about steroids, are the one's that dont have access to them.

exactly
I agree with Sean. I recommend everyone watching the doc called "Bigger, Stronger, Faster." Talks alot about the issues with PEDs in sports. One of the most interesting things I took away from that film is what Tiger Woods was allowed to do. He got laser eye surgery which made his eye sight BETTER than 20/20. In a sport where eye sight and depth perception is very, very important how is this allowed? In my eyes its the same as a NFL or UFC player bumping up there T levels.

Also look up "super cows." Their DNA allows them to build twice the muscle as regular cows. In the future they will do this to humans. Is that going to be considered a PED since its "natural?" Phone Post

Tiger Woods was also linked to some Canadian (forgot who he is, someone here knows who I'm talking about) who got caught bringing in some kind of highly illegal technique of injecting something into certain injured limbs to speed up the process. It was suggested that Tiger and the Canadian met up on several occasions to inject that method into Tigers knee to speed up the healing process. Something to do with platelets, If I remember correctly.

Is platelet rich plasma (PRP) therapy a "highly illegal technique" in golf?

It's used in the NFL and NBA out in the open.

Yeah, I don't know what it was or what it was called. For some reason, PRP popped in my head, but now that you reminded what that was, I remember that's not it. There was a huge uproar about it at the time b/c Tiger hadn't lost his shit and got caught receiving those magic blowjobs that kept him on top. Thats the only way you can explain his drop off b/c after his wife found out about his affairs, she beat his ass with a baseball bat and he's never been the same since.

It wasn't that much before all that went down that he was linked to that Canadian Dr/chemist/physician, whatever/whoever he was.

What you described is exactly what a PRP treatment is.

The doctor who was administering the treatment was linked to HGH but the PRP treatments that Tiger claims he was given and the one you described is legal in the U.S. and is allowed by the PGA.
2/5/13 12:36 AM
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sunnyko
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Sean McCorkle - If a pro athlete tested positive for steroids it's because he was taking steroids. And it's not something he bought at GNC and thought it was legal. If you can buy it at GNC, it's because it doesn't work.

And his doctor didn't accidentally prescribe it. And there weren't false positives on the tests.

Do any of you actually believe that 90% of athletes in all professional sports are clean, and 10% that are juicing are the bad apples spoiling the bunch?

The ratio is probably quite the opposite. Are you telling me a 20 year old kid at the NFL scouting combine bench presses 700 lbs naturally? Probably not.

All of your Olympic athletes do too. This isn't an epidemic, it comes with the territory and always has. The UFC gets a bad rap for steroids because of the violence associated with it, but somehow football slides right by.

I have no idea how the NFL's testing policy works. But if any of you believe the whole league isn't gearing up you're crazy. You'd have to just to be able to recover from the weekly damage you incur.

I say legalize everything, and let the chips fall where they may. Sports aren't about fair competition. It's entertainment. And what's more entertaining than two chemically enhanced monsters going at each other?

Lastly, the whole TRT debate makes me want to hang myself. People say his ratio was 18:1 and 6:1 is the legal level, so he has 3x the testosterone level of his opponent. Those numbers have nothing to do with how much testerone someone has in their system. It a way of catching synthetic testosterone. IE testosterone you body didn't make. All the guys on TRT will have high ratios, which do not help at all, it's just a side effect. Like if you have piss in your blood, you might have a kidney stone. The piss blood doesn't tell you if it's a bigger or smaller stone.

All that matters on TRT is what your total level is at the time of the test. Normal ranges for men based on age are 450-850. I don't know what the commission allows, but lets say they cap it at 1000. Anyone and everyone should be free then to increase their testosterone to the limit, no different than driving the speed limit. The guys that don't want to, don't have to.

If you don't think it's fair that a fighter can boost his testosterone to a high end of legal using TRT, then I've got some news for you. I don't think it's fair that Cain has the insane God given cardio that he has. I don't think it's fair that Brock was as big, strong, and athletic as he was. I don't think it's fair that Randy could still compete at a high level at age 48.

We all knew what we were getting when Overeem signed. And we all hoped he wouldn't get caught. He is an absolutely terrifying prospect when he's on all the juice. That's what people want. Bigger, stronger, faster.

I'm sure there are long term side effects and risks to many steroids if they are taken long enough. Just like there are with drinking too much alcohol, smoking too many cigarettes, and texting while driving.

I say, get the government out of sports, and back to starting wars with countries that have natural resources we want. Let the UFC, NFL, MLB, whoever police their own fighters however they see fit.

But, hey, I'm an American. Someone who believes in freedom, Jesus, family, and the right to pursue happiness.
Well fuckin said, McCorkle couldn't have said it better himself :) Phone Post
2/5/13 12:37 AM
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G-Hands
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Mihow - 
G-Hands - Ha. Not kidding tho, Mihow.

I'll get the specifics this week and break it down-- ideally to the specific supplements.

sent PM (in a min in case you check this so quickly)

Got your PM & responded.

To those curious-- the short is that Mihow knows what he's talking about and completely doubts what I'm saying due to his background & experience. His expertise is really credible, so I'll have to get the specific info to back my statements.
2/5/13 12:37 AM
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Mr Bungle
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DonFreedomFrye - 
Mr Bungle - 
DonFreedomFrye - 
Mr Bungle - 
bobboburns - 
Sean McCorkle -
TheFapMaster - People that complain about steroids, are the one's that dont have access to them.

exactly
I agree with Sean. I recommend everyone watching the doc called "Bigger, Stronger, Faster." Talks alot about the issues with PEDs in sports. One of the most interesting things I took away from that film is what Tiger Woods was allowed to do. He got laser eye surgery which made his eye sight BETTER than 20/20. In a sport where eye sight and depth perception is very, very important how is this allowed? In my eyes its the same as a NFL or UFC player bumping up there T levels.

Also look up "super cows." Their DNA allows them to build twice the muscle as regular cows. In the future they will do this to humans. Is that going to be considered a PED since its "natural?" Phone Post

Tiger Woods was also linked to some Canadian (forgot who he is, someone here knows who I'm talking about) who got caught bringing in some kind of highly illegal technique of injecting something into certain injured limbs to speed up the process. It was suggested that Tiger and the Canadian met up on several occasions to inject that method into Tigers knee to speed up the healing process. Something to do with platelets, If I remember correctly.

Is platelet rich plasma (PRP) therapy a "highly illegal technique" in golf?

It's used in the NFL and NBA out in the open.

Yeah, I don't know what it was or what it was called. For some reason, PRP popped in my head, but now that you reminded what that was, I remember that's not it. There was a huge uproar about it at the time b/c Tiger hadn't lost his shit and got caught receiving those magic blowjobs that kept him on top. Thats the only way you can explain his drop off b/c after his wife found out about his affairs, she beat his ass with a baseball bat and he's never been the same since.

It wasn't that much before all that went down that he was linked to that Canadian Dr/chemist/physician, whatever/whoever he was.

What you described is exactly what a PRP treatment is.

The doctor who was administering the treatment was linked to HGH but the PRP treatments that Tiger claims he was given and the one you described is legal in the U.S. and is allowed by the PGA.

I guess my memory is worse off than I thought. You're right. It was more of the fact that Tiger was associating with a doctor linked to HGH (and possibly getting caught crossing the border with HGH) than the treatment itself. Maybe that treatment was a cover for his HGH use. Speculation on my part. Thanks for helping me clear that up.
2/5/13 12:38 AM
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Drewout
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Sean your summary is not exactly true. You can legally buy Pro-hormones on the internet and at some nutrition stores that will make you fail a test.
2/5/13 12:38 AM
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DonFreedomFrye
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If anyone wants to know, PRP is a procedure where doctors draw blood and put it in a centrifuge to separate the blood's plasma (which contains platelets) from the red blood cells and then inject the solution back into the patient's injury.
2/5/13 12:42 AM
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Mr Bungle
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DonFreedomFrye - If anyone wants to know, PRP is a procedure where doctors draw blood and put it in a centrifuge to separate the blood's plasma (which contains platelets) from the red blood cells and then inject the solution back into the patient's injury.

And with Sean's logic (which I'm not saying is wrong) means that procedure should be illegal as it makes recovery faster than icebags and heating pads.
2/5/13 12:51 AM
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LastRowCarl
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mijo - i think the Commission gives enough tolerance already. Set a limit, and if you fail, then you get punished. In order to make the punishment more harsh. You give 1 year suspension on the 1st failed test, and after that 2 year suspension. 3 strikes and you're out!
If you ever felt the fatigue and pain of injury and then actually used say test e and how fast it went in and out of you system, saying you would be banned from making a living is utterly redonkulous Phone Post
2/5/13 12:52 AM
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bknumber1
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fapout -
G-Hands - ok, I did not read the initial post after this line:

If you can buy it at GNC, it's because it doesn't work.


That's because that line is 100% false. Literally 100%

I know people who make some of the substances at GNC & ex-bodybuilders who have used the substances that are legit steroids (when used right).

What they do is engineer the supplements so that it is missing a key component when it's on the shelf (so that it is legal to sell). However, they engineer it so that once it enters the body and is combined with another legal supplement, it's composition changes and it picks up what it was missing and become a legit steroid.

To reiterate, it become 100% steroids and the compounds for it to take effect are sold at GNC.

It's pretty easy to guess which supplements can easily become illegal-- they are the ones sold behind the locked plastic screen.

BTW, the info about the steroids is common info in the bodybuilding communities. so i'd assume it's not too far of a reach for a capable MMA athlete to come across it.

I remember when GNC sold androgel and andro in pill form..
Me too. Always wondered why I was pissed off all the time and fighting at the bars! Fucking GNC.... Phone Post
2/5/13 4:14 AM
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FullyLoadedFists
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G-Hands -
Mihow - 
G-Hands - Ha. Not kidding tho, Mihow.

I'll get the specifics this week and break it down-- ideally to the specific supplements.

sent PM (in a min in case you check this so quickly)

Got your PM & responded.

To those curious-- the short is that Mihow knows what he's talking about and completely doubts what I'm saying due to his background & experience. His expertise is really credible, so I'll have to get the specific info to back my statements.
Would you be so kind enough as to tell us of a specific combination of supplements that are presently on the market that we could combine to make some good vitamin s Phone Post
2/5/13 4:33 AM
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Mister Collins
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Edited: 02/05/13 4:33 AM
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Sean is probably trolling, but if not: I only respect athletes that use their own talents and capabilities. I admire dedication and determination. If success comes through injections or pills or whatever, it's cheating, taking the easy way to victory. Simple as that. It has nothing to do with freedom, it just shows no respect for the sport.

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