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UnderGround Forums >> Bas Rutten: Fedor is the greatest MMA fighter ever


2/5/13 4:06 PM
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ABE FROMAN
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irishrottie - 
ABE FROMAN - 
irishrottie - 

When Fedor was king of pride Anderson was getting tapped by Takase and Chonan. Perspective my frens.


When Anderson was on a streak unequalled in the UFC, Fedor was getting KO'd by a guy who almost lost to Mike Kyle and a Middleweight that Anderson dispatched in 2.

Perspective.

 


You mean Dan Henderson who is one of the best p4p ever and top 5 HW Bigfoot?


And 2 weight classes below the 'greatest ever'?

If we're trashing Anderson to prop up Fedor then yea, we need to examine all the angles.

2/5/13 4:09 PM
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Jons Forsberg
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"And 2 weight classes below the 'greatest ever'?"

you mean like Takase? but without any of Hendos accolades.
2/5/13 4:14 PM
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maccadamion
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when asked Anderson Silva said

" FEDOR " is the best ever. just sayin.
2/5/13 4:14 PM
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Funaki Masakatsu #1
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Fedor only weighed roughly 16 lbs. more than Dan that night. Compare this to the following notable heavyweight fights: JDS vs. Shane Carwin (15 lb. weight difference), Brock Lesnar vs. Frank Mir (20+ lb. weight difference), Brock Lesnar vs Randy Couture (40 lb. weight difference), JDS vs. Frank Mir (22 lb. weight difference), Bigfoot vs. Cain Velasquez (25+ lb. weight difference).

2/5/13 4:19 PM
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Billyz
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hate all you fucking want, Fedor was the greatest HW plain and simple.
As or Greatest P4P might be debatable.

What other fighter short of Anderson was so revered by so many of his COLLEAGUES not us average weekend/amateur/keyboard warriors.

2/5/13 4:20 PM
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ABE FROMAN
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Jons Forsberg - "And 2 weight classes below the 'greatest ever'?"

you mean like Takase? but without any of Hendos accolades.

You mean in this decade without 10 years worth of knowledge? 10 years later Anderson crushes the guy who crushes your crush.

 

2/5/13 4:22 PM
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ABE FROMAN
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maccadamion - when asked Anderson Silva said

" FEDOR " is the best ever. just sayin.

Before or after he said BJ Penn was better than him?

2/5/13 6:39 PM
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Lazer MMA
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IMO neither fighter (AS or Fedor) EVER lost when they were at their best. The record and standing in the division the opponents of any GOAT candidate lost to (in the division the fight was fought in and including big wins therein) at the time of the fights were fought must be evaluated in a GOAT conversation as well as each fighters overall record. Logically, there is no way out of that.

"Anyway no one will agree, there is much to consider. WTF knows? Each choice has pluses and minuses. Few would argue that any are not great. MUCH fewer than that IMO would bet that they were not!"
2/5/13 6:46 PM
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Doc T
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mygodthisMMA - -10 years undefeated. Modern fighters fight once a year and can't go one year without losing.

-The division he fought in was arguably tougher and deeper.

-He fought and won multiple times in the same night, multiple times.

- 7 and 0 against former UFC champions.

- ***TEN MINUTE FIRST ROUNDS***

- Fought in the ring which eliminated the ability to run from your opponent.

- During his reign he was challenged and always came back to win decisively.

- He should have cut to 205, but never tried so he could prove himself the best at his natural weight.

- Didn't lift weights or strength train for years.

- He trained in a fucking snowy park.

- The most nimble, swift, and clever HW fighter of all time. He blended techniques together like a bantamweight.

- Knees to the head, kicks to the head, no elbows, and no cage. So no ability to just be stronger than his opponent and hold them down.

- Won fights decisively off his back numerous times, as well as being the most feared striker, and ground and pounder in the world. Legitimately the most well rounded fighter we had ever seen at that point in MMA.

- Fuck you you're a noob if you think different.
Word !! Phone Post
2/5/13 7:02 PM
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gabemadrid
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Funaki Masakatsu #1 -

Fedor only weighed roughly 16 lbs. more than Dan that night. Compare this to the following notable heavyweight fights: JDS vs. Shane Carwin (15 lb. weight difference), Brock Lesnar vs. Frank Mir (20+ lb. weight difference), Brock Lesnar vs Randy Couture (40 lb. weight difference), JDS vs. Frank Mir (22 lb. weight difference), Bigfoot vs. Cain Velasquez (25+ lb. weight difference).

And those extra 16 pounds weren't muscle. I hate when people act like Fedor was this huge HW. He could've cut to MW if he wanted to. He was rocking about 15-20 pounds of fat. When I met the HWs at the SF Grand Prix I was shocked at the size difference of all the other dudes and Fedor. Phone Post
2/5/13 7:04 PM
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Mufasatheking
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mygodthisMMA - -10 years undefeated. Modern fighters fight once a year and can't go one year without losing.

-The division he fought in was arguably tougher and deeper.

-He fought and won multiple times in the same night, multiple times.

- 7 and 0 against former UFC champions.

- ***TEN MINUTE FIRST ROUNDS***

- Fought in the ring which eliminated the ability to run from your opponent.

- During his reign he was challenged and always came back to win decisively.

- He should have cut to 205, but never tried so he could prove himself the best at his natural weight.

- Didn't lift weights or strength train for years.

- He trained in a fucking snowy park.

- The most nimble, swift, and clever HW fighter of all time. He blended techniques together like a bantamweight.

- Knees to the head, kicks to the head, no elbows, and no cage. So no ability to just be stronger than his opponent and hold them down.

- Won fights decisively off his back numerous times, as well as being the most feared striker, and ground and pounder in the world. Legitimately the most well rounded fighter we had ever seen at that point in MMA.

- Fuck you you're a noob if you think different.

Anderson and Fedor have spent the same amount of time with their belt (andersons at 8 year undefeated if you dont count the Okami DQ, whereas Fedor was 9.5, hes catching up).

He only fought twice in one night twice and one of the times ended prematurely.

SEG era champs + rematches.

Anderson started off at 165.

Of course he strength trained, he just did it the russian way with sledge hammers, kettlebells, body weight etc.

Anderson trains on a beach.

"like a bantamweight is hyperbole" he was smooth though.

He won twice off his back against the same guy and once against HMC lol, plus its harder to work off your back with elbows so Andersons triangles are more impressive. Anderson is more feared as a striker then Fedor ever was.

Fuck you im waiting for TUF to come on.
2/5/13 7:08 PM
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Jons Forsberg
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ABE FROMAN - 
Jons Forsberg - "And 2 weight classes below the 'greatest ever'?"

you mean like Takase? but without any of Hendos accolades.

You mean in this decade without 10 years worth of knowledge? 10 years later Anderson crushes the guy who crushes your crush.

 


the whole career counts, we're talking about all time greatest not current greatest.
2/5/13 7:08 PM
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MagSlim
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2/5/13 7:11 PM
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Forrest Spliffn
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A fedor goat thread.

This will obviously end the debate for good as the UG will reach a general consensus on the matter

Or

Trolls bout to burn this thread down



I wonder which will happen Phone Post
2/5/13 7:13 PM
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D241
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Mufasatheking -  plus its harder to work off your back with elbows so Andersons triangles are more impressive. 
 

Fedor fought where elbows to the body are allowed, but more importantly, knees to the head while on the ground was allowed, something not allowed in UFC. That is subjective in terms of more impressive off their back.
 

 


 
Mufasatheking -  Anderson is more feared as a striker then Fedor ever was.
 

Who do you have as Anderson's 2 most credible opponent whose strength is striking? What are those fighters credentials in striking?

 

Who do you have as Fedor's 2 most credible opponent whose strength is striking? What are those fighters credentials?

 
2/5/13 7:19 PM
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ABE FROMAN
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Edited: 02/05/13 7:19 PM
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Jons Forsberg - 
ABE FROMAN - 
Jons Forsberg - "And 2 weight classes below the 'greatest ever'?"

you mean like Takase? but without any of Hendos accolades.

You mean in this decade without 10 years worth of knowledge? 10 years later Anderson crushes the guy who crushes your crush.

 


the whole career counts, we're talking about all time greatest not current greatest.

Ok? So Anderson has losses EARLY in his career when he wasn't as good of a fighter. Fedor has losses in his early 30's, a time he should've been in his prime.

Nobody begrudges Fedor, the problem is that you want to work off of Anderson's back in order to prove that Fedor is the King. I'm just showing that 2 can play that game.

2/5/13 7:24 PM
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JimmersonzGlove
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Pro Ice - 

Come on guys Fedor WAS NOT KO'd by Big Foot.

No doubt Fedor was beat up but a testament to his heart he was ready to come out for the 3rd...the doctor had to stop the fight!

And nobody can say for sure what would've happened if there was a 3rd round


+1

Fedor = GOAT
2/5/13 7:26 PM
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Mufasatheking
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D241 - 

 


 
Mufasatheking -  plus its harder to work off your back with elbows so Andersons triangles are more impressive. 
 

Fedor fought where elbows to the body are allowed, but more importantly, knees to the head while on the ground was allowed, something not allowed in UFC. That is subjective in terms of more impressive off their back.
 

 


 
Mufasatheking -  Anderson is more feared as a striker then Fedor ever was.
 

Who do you have as Anderson's 2 most credible opponent whose strength is striking? What are those fighters credentials in striking?

 

Who do you have as Fedor's 2 most credible opponent whose strength is striking? What are those fighters credentials?

 

k1 striking is overrated, mirko got KO'd in a minute by randleman and Gonzaga, plus got outstruck by Wand in their first fight. Schilt only had one k1 fight when he fought Fedor and 90% of that fight was on the ground anyway. And the Hunt fight went to the ground in about 20 seconds.

In terms of "striking accomplishment" in mma, Andersons wins over Vitor, Hendo, Sakurai and Franklin were impressive.

Plus its not just the fact that he won, the way he completely tooled his opponents is much more impressive then Fedor beating Mirko on the feet, but not totally destroying him.
2/5/13 7:33 PM
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D241
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The fact that you tried to minimize the resume of the fighters before you even mentioned the fighters says all you need to.

 

Anderson is a worthy Goat, so no problems if you got him above Fedor. Not me though.

There's plenty of ways to big up Anderson and make a case for him as being Goat.

But do me a favor, outside of the UG in the real world, don't compare Anderson's striking opponents with those of Fedor's. It wouldn't get your point across like you want to.

2/5/13 7:46 PM
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D241
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Without having the need to "explain" things, just put it in order like this, and see if it looks right without the need for any explanation.

 

Fedor:

Mirko

Hunt

Shilt

Arvloski

 

Anderson:

Vitor

Sakurai

Henderson

Franklin

 

(personally I would've chosen Lee Murray or Alex Steibling over Sakurai in terms of striking)

 

2/5/13 7:48 PM
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Mufasatheking
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D241 - 

The fact that you tried to minimize the resume of the fighters before you even mentioned the fighters says all you need to.

 

Anderson is a worthy Goat, so no problems if you got him above Fedor. Not me though.

There's plenty of ways to big up Anderson and make a case for him as being Goat.

But do me a favor, outside of the UG in the real world, don't compare Anderson's striking opponents with those of Fedor's. It wouldn't get your point across like you want to.


Disagree with your last point, I geniunely dont see why Mirko is considered a better MMA striker then Vitor, when their accomplishments are fairly similar.

Credentials in other sports shouldnt carry over.
2/5/13 7:49 PM
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timmyboy1233
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Sub Phone Post
2/5/13 7:56 PM
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D241
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Edited: 02/05/13 7:57 PM
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Mufasatheking - 

Credentials in other sports shouldnt carry over.

 

I don't think they need to when comparing the striking of Fedor's toughest strikers vs Anderson's toughest strikers.
 
However I do think it would be relevent. For instance if we're doing the opposite, Travis Lutter is great at jiu jitsu, more accomplished outside of mma than in mma, but Anderson beating him by triangle is still impressive, you don't agree?
 
Also impressive is triangle choking Dan Henderson. It's arguable Dan's wrestling accomlishments outside of mma are equal to his grappling skills shown in mma, but taking into consideration of both, that's very impressive to submit Dan on the ground like that, you don't agree?
2/5/13 9:31 PM
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sparkuri
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"Credentials in other sports shouldn't carry over"

If it were ping pong, I'd tend to agree.

It's a combat sport though. A Martial Art.
Actually, Vitor and Cro Cop are two of the best "fast muscle/twitch/fiber" (or whatever) fighters in mma history.
Very comparable in that way. Phone Post
2/5/13 9:31 PM
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sparkuri
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I'll bet they'd make great ping pong players ;-) Phone Post

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