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UnderGround Forums >> DW: "I just have no respect for Frank Shamrock"


2/9/13 12:10 AM
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rbl
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HeHitsMeBecauseHeLovesMe - I'm not exactly sure if he's being serious. Not taking anything away from frank, but please don't compare Igor Zinoviev & Kevin Jackson to Anderson Silva & Jon Jones, that's laughable at best. Phone Post
Dana is talking up Ronda Rousey as an Olympic silver medallist. Kevin Jackson was a gold medallist. Frank Shamrock arm barred him in 16 seconds. That's pretty good. Phone Post
2/9/13 12:12 AM
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gabemadrid
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Mr.Negative -
yabadaba - 
Mr.Negative - 

lol at some of you mother fuckers on his jock.

he has zero business being in the UFC HOF. ZERO. 

maybe pancrase HOF, but even then, when he left japan and started fighting in the UFC/strikeforce his record was 14-7-1. 


He was 5-0 in the UFC. Nobody is talking about Strikeforce. 


yeah, and? 

is every.single.UFC.champion in the UFC HOF? no, they're not. 

hell, Tim Sylvia defended his title more often than shamrock, had a better record when he left the UFC than shamrock and NOT one person on this forum/thread is will even consider putting Sylvia in the UFC HOF at this time.

riddle me that batman...lol

Tim Sylvia is not liked. He popped for steroids and wasn't a fan favorite. He will probably never be allowed anywhere near the UFC. He could go 10-0 tomorrow and he probably won't go back to the UFC. They don't want him to tarnish the brand let alone be forever part of a HOF. Phone Post
2/9/13 12:13 AM
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Mr.Negative
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frank defended the belt 4 times in 21 months. in that time frame he beat

igor zinoviev via slam (broke his shoulder and probably his biggest win considering he was 4-0 at the time they fought and he had that big win over sperry)

jeremy horn via kneebar (9-3 at the time, fought a bunch of bums in the midwest but did have a few decent fights, but nothing to compare to igor or frank)

lober via tko (lober took this fight literally on 2 weeks notice and barely trained for it. i know this because i was training with him at the time)

tito via tko (tito was 4-1 at the time and imo, not at the level of horn or igor)

out of all of those wins his horn win is imo his most impressive. not his win over igor (got lucky with the slam) or lober (who took the fight on extremely short notice.)

then shortly after Zuffa took over, shamrock took the belt and held it hostage. he sat on the sidelines and never defended it again. so, when Art Davie and Rorion decide to create a Pre-Zuffa UFC HOF, he'll fit right in. until then, he's out.

 

2/9/13 12:14 AM
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yabadaba
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"Where do you think Tito vs Frank belongs in the UFC top 100 fights? What happened there?"

This is a question to Ip Man 81. If you don't know what I'm referring to just ask.

2/9/13 12:16 AM
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Mr.Negative
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BertR - more people should be talking about how the UFC Hall of Fame is stupid outside of a marketing idea for Zuffa. If you want to honor mma fighters you'd promote an mma hall of fame, independent of promotion.

THIS.

a UFC HOF is beyond retarded.

MMA HOF is really what we should have...but even then, if we're only letting in 5-7 guys a year, at what point do you let in frank? do you put him in before Royce? Sak? Vanderlei? Chuck? Randy? Coleman? Frye?

2/9/13 12:17 AM
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Mr.Negative
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gabemadrid - 
Mr.Negative -
yabadaba - 
Mr.Negative - 

lol at some of you mother fuckers on his jock.

he has zero business being in the UFC HOF. ZERO. 

maybe pancrase HOF, but even then, when he left japan and started fighting in the UFC/strikeforce his record was 14-7-1. 


He was 5-0 in the UFC. Nobody is talking about Strikeforce. 


yeah, and? 

is every.single.UFC.champion in the UFC HOF? no, they're not. 

hell, Tim Sylvia defended his title more often than shamrock, had a better record when he left the UFC than shamrock and NOT one person on this forum/thread is will even consider putting Sylvia in the UFC HOF at this time.

riddle me that batman...lol

Tim Sylvia is not liked. He popped for steroids and wasn't a fan favorite. He will probably never be allowed anywhere near the UFC. He could go 10-0 tomorrow and he probably won't go back to the UFC. They don't want him to tarnish the brand let alone be forever part of a HOF. Phone Post

Exactly, so why would Dana and Zuffa allow in Frank when he hasn't been relevant to the UFC in over a fucking decade and has shit on the UFC every chance he's had? 

2/9/13 12:18 AM
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yabadaba
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Mr.Negative - 

frank defended the belt 4 times in 21 months. in that time frame he beat

igor zinoviev via slam (broke his shoulder and probably his biggest win considering he was 4-0 at the time they fought and he had that big win over sperry)

jeremy horn via kneebar (9-3 at the time, fought a bunch of bums in the midwest but did have a few decent fights, but nothing to compare to igor or frank)

lober via tko (lober took this fight literally on 2 weeks notice and barely trained for it. i know this because i was training with him at the time)

tito via tko (tito was 4-1 at the time and imo, not at the level of horn or igor)

out of all of those wins his horn win is imo his most impressive. not his win over igor (got lucky with the slam) or lober (who took the fight on extremely short notice.)

then shortly after Zuffa took over, shamrock took the belt and held it hostage. he sat on the sidelines and never defended it again. so, when Art Davie and Rorion decide to create a Pre-Zuffa UFC HOF, he'll fit right in. until then, he's out.

 


The second Shamrock/Lober fight was brutal. If you trained with Lober it's possible that you're a little biased against Frank. Just MHO.

2/9/13 12:20 AM
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MrColdCock
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Ip Man 81 -
big_roy_fan - why does frank deserve to be in the UFC hall of fame?

he had 5 fights in the UFC then he punked out.. look at the track record of the other fights in the HOF.

Royce, Severen, Couture, Liddell, Ortiz, Hughes have all done much more for the UFC then Frank Shamrock, adding him into the UFC HOF would kind of devalue the title of "UFC HOF'er"
Frank Shamrock has no business in the UFC hof. Not that he wasn't a decent fighter, but he just wasn't that high a caliber fighter. Phone Post
Wasn't a high caliber fighter? WTF is this noob shit?

I love when random noobs on the Internet feel the need to educate people on something they clearly don't understand. It takes a special kind if arrogance. Phone Post
2/9/13 12:24 AM
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Galt
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cm81 - 
Ip Man 81 -
big_roy_fan - why does frank deserve to be in the UFC hall of fame?

he had 5 fights in the UFC then he punked out.. look at the track record of the other fights in the HOF.

Royce, Severen, Couture, Liddell, Ortiz, Hughes have all done much more for the UFC then Frank Shamrock, adding him into the UFC HOF would kind of devalue the title of "UFC HOF'er"
Frank Shamrock has no business in the UFC hof. Not that he wasn't a decent fighter, but he just wasn't that high a caliber fighter. Phone Post
Wow.

Let me tell you son, as a 01'er... Back in the day Kevin Jackson and Igor Zinoviev were the Jon Jones and Anderson Silvas and were running over everyone.

Then Frank came along and ended their fighting careers.

So don't tell me about not facing high level caliber fighters. He faced the best of his time and completely destroyed them.

Don't you ever dare to rewrite history. Phone Post

Okay? that still doesn't make him UFC HOF worthy. Look at the guys who are in there. They've all put in work and were on good terms with UFC.
Frank left after winning the belt

And this is why I only post on the Otherground.
You young boys don't realize the difference between NHB and "mma"
2/9/13 12:24 AM
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gabemadrid
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Mr.Negative -
gabemadrid - 
Mr.Negative -
yabadaba - 
Mr.Negative - 

lol at some of you mother fuckers on his jock.

he has zero business being in the UFC HOF. ZERO. 

maybe pancrase HOF, but even then, when he left japan and started fighting in the UFC/strikeforce his record was 14-7-1. 


He was 5-0 in the UFC. Nobody is talking about Strikeforce. 


yeah, and? 

is every.single.UFC.champion in the UFC HOF? no, they're not. 

hell, Tim Sylvia defended his title more often than shamrock, had a better record when he left the UFC than shamrock and NOT one person on this forum/thread is will even consider putting Sylvia in the UFC HOF at this time.

riddle me that batman...lol

Tim Sylvia is not liked. He popped for steroids and wasn't a fan favorite. He will probably never be allowed anywhere near the UFC. He could go 10-0 tomorrow and he probably won't go back to the UFC. They don't want him to tarnish the brand let alone be forever part of a HOF. Phone Post

Exactly, so why would Dana and Zuffa allow in Frank when he hasn't been relevant to the UFC in over a fucking decade and has shit on the UFC every chance he's had? 

A case can be made for both to be deserving based on accomplishments. I don't think what people have done professionally in the sport should be downplayed simply because they are not liked. It's entirely the UFCs prerogative to let in whom they choose. But as intelligent MMA fans I think we can understand why they aren't being let in. Phone Post
2/9/13 12:24 AM
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Proteus The Invincible
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Frank's record began to worsen once he left Japan and started fighting in the UFC? Do you mean the organisation where he was never beaten and exclusively involved in championship fights?

 

never beaten in Pancrase? are you fucking retarded? he lost 3 of his last 4 fights in pancrase.

 

 

I find it hard to believe that you have such poor reading skills that you completely misunderstood which organisation I was clearly referring to. I assume that you're not an incompetent reader and that you're actually just pretending to be one. That makes it difficult for me to take your opinions seriously.
2/9/13 12:25 AM
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Emphatik
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Ip Man 81 -
big_roy_fan - why does frank deserve to be in the UFC hall of fame?

he had 5 fights in the UFC then he punked out.. look at the track record of the other fights in the HOF.

Royce, Severen, Couture, Liddell, Ortiz, Hughes have all done much more for the UFC then Frank Shamrock, adding him into the UFC HOF would kind of devalue the title of "UFC HOF'er"
Frank Shamrock has no business in the UFC hof. Not that he wasn't a decent fighter, but he just wasn't that high a caliber fighter. Phone Post
Wasn't a high caliber fighter? WTF is this noob shit?

I love when random noobs on the Internet feel the need to educate people on something they clearly don't understand. It takes a special kind if arrogance. Phone Post

It really does.

Its hard to know whether to be amused, disappointed or annoyed.

Such blatant stupidity trying to educate people who saw it first hand and understand it in context.

Simple fact is that for his era, Frank was as dominant a champ as there has ever been and he walked away unbeaten.
2/9/13 12:30 AM
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Mr.Negative
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MrColdCock - 
Ip Man 81 -
big_roy_fan - why does frank deserve to be in the UFC hall of fame?

he had 5 fights in the UFC then he punked out.. look at the track record of the other fights in the HOF.

Royce, Severen, Couture, Liddell, Ortiz, Hughes have all done much more for the UFC then Frank Shamrock, adding him into the UFC HOF would kind of devalue the title of "UFC HOF'er"
Frank Shamrock has no business in the UFC hof. Not that he wasn't a decent fighter, but he just wasn't that high a caliber fighter. Phone Post
Wasn't a high caliber fighter? WTF is this noob shit?

I love when random noobs on the Internet feel the need to educate people on something they clearly don't understand. It takes a special kind if arrogance. Phone Post

LOL he was 14-7 when he left japan to fight in the UFC losing almost all of his championship fights in Japan. 

After his 5-0 run in the UFC he went 4-3-1 with wins over big names like cesar gracie (0-0 at the time),  Bryan Pardoe (a whopping 15-16 record, awesome) a fucking decision win over elvis sinosic (3-3-1 at the time) and a big win over phil baroni by RNC.

so, no, he isn't some insanely high caliber fighter than ran through all the top guys like a hot knife through butter.

he sat on the sidelines for 6 years taking two fights against guys he had no business being in the ring with.

had he beat sak, royce, rua, vanderlei, chuck, or any of the other killers from 2000-on than MAYBE he can be considered a high-caliber fighter. but leaving japan to fight in a much smaller pool of fighters doesn't make him high caliber.

2/9/13 12:31 AM
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Mr.Negative
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Proteus The Invincible - 
Mr.Negative - 
Proteus The Invincible - 
Frank's record began to worsen once he left Japan and started fighting in the UFC? Do you mean the organisation where he was never beaten and exclusively involved in championship fights?

 

never beaten in Pancrase? are you fucking retarded? he lost 3 of his last 4 fights in pancrase.

 

 

I find it hard to believe that you have such poor reading skills that you completely misunderstood which organisation I was clearly referring to. I assume that you're not an incompetent reader and that you're actually just pretending to be one. That makes it difficult for me to take your opinions seriously.

i'm working and posting at the same time. yeah, i completely misunderstood your post, my bad.

still doesn't make me wrong...lol

2/9/13 12:34 AM
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Dougie
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cm81 - 
Ip Man 81 -
big_roy_fan - why does frank deserve to be in the UFC hall of fame?

he had 5 fights in the UFC then he punked out.. look at the track record of the other fights in the HOF.

Royce, Severen, Couture, Liddell, Ortiz, Hughes have all done much more for the UFC then Frank Shamrock, adding him into the UFC HOF would kind of devalue the title of "UFC HOF'er"
Frank Shamrock has no business in the UFC hof. Not that he wasn't a decent fighter, but he just wasn't that high a caliber fighter. Phone Post
Wow.

Let me tell you son, as a 01'er... Back in the day Kevin Jackson and Igor Zinoviev were the Jon Jones and Anderson Silvas and were running over everyone.

Then Frank came along and ended their fighting careers.

So don't tell me about not facing high level caliber fighters. He faced the best of his time and completely destroyed them.

Don't you ever dare to rewrite history. Phone Post

Truth!

2/9/13 12:34 AM
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Ip Man 81
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yabadaba -

"Where do you think Tito vs Frank belongs in the UFC top 100 fights? What happened there?"

This is a question to Ip Man 81. If you don't know what I'm referring to just ask.

You've asked me multiple questions and I have answered all of them till now. I've asked you a few and your not acknowledging any of them except with your own questions... your trying to have a pissing contest on who is more knowledgeable. You still have not responded to my last one asking you why Frank should be in the UFC hof with the wins/opponents he has faced? His name in the UFC hof would be like a sore thumb sticking out, just not right. Yes frank and tito had an epic fight that should probibly be among the top ten UFC fights to this day, but that doesn't earn him a hof spot if that's your point? In some ways he has been screwed but not HOF wise. He killed that chance by not staying in the UFC. Phone Post
2/9/13 12:37 AM
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gabemadrid
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The thread title explains why he will never be a HOFer. Phone Post
2/9/13 12:38 AM
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Ip Man 81
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yabadaba -

"Where do you think Tito vs Frank belongs in the UFC top 100 fights? What happened there?"

This is a question to Ip Man 81. If you don't know what I'm referring to just ask.

And let me guess, you'll throw a shit storm if Lesnar doesn't make the HOF as well right? Phone Post
2/9/13 12:40 AM
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Trane
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I give Frank credit in that he's the only DW nemesis who has never flaked on his stance. That alone deserves some respect.
2/9/13 12:42 AM
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Ip Man 81
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Ip Man 81 -
yabadaba -

"Where do you think Tito vs Frank belongs in the UFC top 100 fights? What happened there?"

This is a question to Ip Man 81. If you don't know what I'm referring to just ask.

And let me guess, you'll throw a shit storm if Lesnar doesn't make the HOF as well right? Phone Post
Your a typical fan boy getting butt hurt cause ur guy didn't make the hof, just like a lot of the lesnar fans when this topic comes up. Phone Post
2/9/13 12:44 AM
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Mr.Negative
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Trane - I give Frank credit in that he's the only DW nemesis who has never flaked on his stance. That alone deserves some respect.

LOL yep.

tito, couture, sylvia, all of them eventually rolled over and played nice.

but not frank. and i respect him for that. 

2/9/13 12:45 AM
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gabemadrid
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Ip Man 81 -
yabadaba -

"Where do you think Tito vs Frank belongs in the UFC top 100 fights? What happened there?"

This is a question to Ip Man 81. If you don't know what I'm referring to just ask.

And let me guess, you'll throw a shit storm if Lesnar doesn't make the HOF as well right? Phone Post
Frank isn't even in a top 100 fight dude is not part of UFC history. He fucked with the UFC and regardless of his accomplishments will never be a HOF not because he sucked or doesn't deserve it but because his mouth and his decisions got himself in trouble with the boss. Phone Post
2/9/13 12:46 AM
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JBASS
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Edited: 02/09/13 12:48 AM
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I might've joined this site after IP man, but even I know that Frank should be in the HOF. Written word does not always give context, there is only so much someone can learn from Wiki without actually knowing about what the state of MMA, the UFC and fighters skill sets were like at the time - ESPECIALLY if they weren't a fan of MMA at the time. 

 

Was he the most dominant champion in the history of the UFC? No, not by a long shot.

But did he do things in the UFC at the time that were considered amazing? Absolutely. 

 

Imagine if this fallout between Randy and the UFC causes them to remove him from the HOF and ten years down the track there new fans of the sport saying "He never belonged in there to begin with!!!" IP man, that's exactly what you sound like right now. 

2/9/13 12:46 AM
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Phisher
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Two down. One to go. Can't wait for the epic Greg Jackson rant.

2/9/13 12:48 AM
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JBASS
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ThatKickDidntHuroooohhhhhhhh - 

No way


I just voted up this post by accident. 

You're welcome lol


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