UnderGround Forums
 

OtherGround Forums >> Bravo45 Gunfighting Discussion Thread

| Share | Email | Subscribe | Check IPs

3/22/13 7:48 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
IP
63 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 6/22/09
Posts: 4255
Damn, 1300 posts! This thread has done well.
3/22/13 8:03 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
tyronehernandez
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 6/16/12
Posts: 185
"OG Shooter's Improvement Conclave."

I know a BLM spot in the CA desert with our name on it. Just saying.

Seeing that Jack's Dad, who's identity is apparently unknown only to me, sounds old school, does he still shoot the weaver style as cooper taught or has he modernized.

Not to start the iso/weaver debate....
3/22/13 10:00 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2919
Can you bring guns into CA? Phone Post
3/22/13 10:06 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
awilson82
195 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/12/07
Posts: 16737
Yeah CA not exactly a firearm friendly destination lol. Phone Post
3/22/13 10:18 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2920
Adub I'm gonna be back up in your area on the 31st Phone Post
3/22/13 10:19 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
sreiter
31 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 26482
tyronehernandez - "OG Shooter's Improvement Conclave."

I know a BLM spot in the CA desert with our name on it. Just saying.

Seeing that Jack's Dad, who's identity is apparently unknown only to me, sounds old school, does he still shoot the weaver style as cooper taught or has he modernized.

Not to start the iso/weaver debate....

he is constantly evaluating, and evolving. he'll take others classes to see if they're worth while, or watch magpuls dvd's etc.

he teaches iso or a modified version i think. athletic defensive position, like a boxer.. elbows slightly bent not locked out so elbow absorb recoil, not shoulders

i used to shoot modified weaver just because i shot better and he really tried to break me of the habit.

i shoot equally as well using either now..

i cant find it, but there was a great vid on one vs the other... and it really comes down to how each manages recoil...a proper weaver will do equally well, but, it take more of your energy to control it.

btw - 99% of the people out there who think they're doing iso, arent.

the key to why it works is Tony Chin..Toe knee chin all have to be in alignment with each other... that mean leaning fairly forward. When you do that, your body absorbs much more of the recoil and you get very little muzzle flip
3/22/13 10:21 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
sreiter
31 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 26483
Jedburgh1 -  Can you bring guns into CA? Phone Post

nothing good unless its a sanctioned tourney... that said, i live here so the travel is easy :)
3/22/13 10:29 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Rhymenoceros
419 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 14669
sreiter - 
tyronehernandez - "OG Shooter's Improvement Conclave."

I know a BLM spot in the CA desert with our name on it. Just saying.

Seeing that Jack's Dad, who's identity is apparently unknown only to me, sounds old school, does he still shoot the weaver style as cooper taught or has he modernized.

Not to start the iso/weaver debate....

he is constantly evaluating, and evolving. he'll take others classes to see if they're worth while, or watch magpuls dvd's etc.

he teaches iso or a modified version i think. athletic defensive position, like a boxer.. elbows slightly bent not locked out so elbow absorb recoil, not shoulders

i used to shoot modified weaver just because i shot better and he really tried to break me of the habit.

i shoot equally as well using either now..

i cant find it, but there was a great vid on one vs the other... and it really comes down to how each manages recoil...a proper weaver will do equally well, but, it take more of your energy to control it.

btw - 99% of the people out there who think they're doing iso, arent.

the key to why it works is Tony Chin..Toe knee chin all have to be in alignment with each other... that mean leaning fairly forward. When you do that, your body absorbs much more of the recoil and you get very little muzzle flip

I think you're too black and white about this stuff. It's all more dynamic than that. Let's not forget someone might be moving or off balance or peeking around cover or whatever.
3/22/13 10:32 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Rhymenoceros
419 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 14670
Ron Avery describes the difference between Weaver and Iso pretty well here. He's a fucking incredible shooter btw. Even though he's a little older he's a threat to win even at the highest levels.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GewbIC2P8Hw
3/22/13 10:52 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
tyronehernandez
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 6/16/12
Posts: 186
Well CA might not be the best option.....there is always the NV desert which just happens to be situated next to vegas - incase we needed to head into town for "supplies".

So Avery is teaching with Haley now...nice line up over there.



3/22/13 11:37 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2921
severnsmustache is a gun guy. He needs to open a range and invite us all.
3/22/13 11:38 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
sreiter
31 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 26484
Rhymenoceros - Ron Avery describes the difference between Weaver and Iso pretty well here. He's a fucking incredible shooter btw. Even though he's a little older he's a threat to win even at the highest levels.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GewbIC2P8Hw

yes- thats the vid i was talking about

re: above...yeah, typing, i had to make it black and white, or wouldve been type for days, and no one would know what i was saying anyway
3/22/13 11:43 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2922
Wow that was a great video.

As I've always said, the one-two punch of a great instructor is being able to demonstrate, and also articulate.
3/22/13 11:58 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Rhymenoceros
419 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 14671
Jedburgh1 - Wow that was a great video.

As I've always said, the one-two punch of a great instructor is being able to demonstrate, and also articulate.

There's another video with Avery coaching Haley. Haley and Costa get blown up a lot for their pistol skills due to the magpul stuff, but he would be about a B class shooter. There are legit GM special forces guys like Frank Proctor, but the guys who seem to get the most press aren't on the same level when it comes to pistol shooting. I guess that's the way of the world.
3/23/13 12:05 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2923
While this may sound like jealous haterade to some....

Frank serves (or did serve I don't know if he's out now..) in a National Guard SF group.

Which means he has time to be a GM-class pistol shooter. And I respect him for that.
3/23/13 12:06 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Rhymenoceros
419 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 14672
Jedburgh1 - While this may sound like jealous haterade to some....

Frank serves (or did serve I don't know if he's out now..) in a National Guard SF group.

Which means he has time to be a GM-class pistol shooter. And I respect him for that.

Oh snap!

Pat Macnamara is a GM as well I believe. And Vickers I think made it to Master before jumping ship to "found" IDPA.
3/23/13 12:08 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2924
It's unfair to mention anyone coming out of that particular unit.

The entire mechanism exists so that they can hone their shooting every single day.
3/23/13 12:14 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Rhymenoceros
419 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 14673
Jedburgh1 - It's unfair to mention anyone coming out of that particular unit.

The entire mechanism exists so that they can hone their shooting every single day.

The AMU?

JK. Fuck those guys though. How you can join the Army, get paid to shoot full time while conducting some bullshit exercises from time to time, have unlimited ammo and unlimited access to gunsmiths, and then compete as an A or B class shooter at matches is beyond me. Some of those guys are the grossest sandbaggers in the sport.
3/23/13 12:23 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2925
Ah my friend,

You've confused your terms. The AMU is the Army Marksmanship Unit, of which your assessment is spot on.

Those men are from a SMU or special missions unit, which is a horse of a vastly different color. And yet they still find time to be GM class shooters. Truly amazing shooters.
3/23/13 12:27 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Rhymenoceros
419 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 03/23/13 12:30 AM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 14674
<blockquote>Jedburgh1 - Ah my friend, <br /><br />You've confused your terms. The AMU is the Army Marksmanship Unit, of which your assessment is spot on. <br /><br />Those men are from a SMU or special missions unit, which is a horse of a vastly different color. And yet they still find time to be GM class shooters. Truly amazing shooters.</blockquote>

I was kidding, hence the "JK."

I'm aware those guys are/were Delta. I can say that because as a civilian I pay for their ammo or something. And because I don't know shit.
3/23/13 12:32 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2926
It's late and I am spent. Sometimes I don't know how much people understand of the socom heirarchy. My apologies. Phone Post
3/23/13 12:50 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Gforce
72 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 13005
IP - Jed - Cycling the M4 via charging handle

Method you favor, please.


JG uses the charging handle during speed reloads.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kv5epCk5KRY

I've been meaning to ask him his logic--will report back here.

FYI, MNQ is a fantastic drill to see where you are.

Sorry to hijack, but...

Speaking of Jeff, he is auctioning of the prototype TRICON MK6 to benefit Gary Welt, one of his former teammates at SEAL TEAM 4 who was recently diagnosed with ALS.

For those of you who are unfamiliar with it, Lou Gehrig's disease is one of the worst ways to go in existence. Your motor neurons fail progressively. You die from suffocation, when the neurons that move your diaphragm allowing you to breath eventually fail.

Average survival is 2 to 5 years.

Here is Gary Welt's story.

http://sofrep.com/17877/the-sof-community-takes-care-of-a-brother-call-to-action/

Here is the auction.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=333825930

Maybe one of our high rollers like Severnsmustache or even DFW might want to place a bid.

Money will go toward helping retrofit Gary's home for a wheelchair, etc.
3/23/13 1:03 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Jedburgh1
684 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2927
Not a hijack to help a guy in need.

Kyle Lamb advocates the charging handle bolt release for people that don't train extensively. I find the the open hand slap helps keep me in an aggressive mindset to get my mind back in the fight, because the 'oh shit' reload moment definitely gives you the 'record scratch' of high school parties; it's awkward and you need to move past it!

I'm gonna try to go shoot the MNQ tomorrow and film it with timer for you guys. Don't hold it against me if I don't.
3/23/13 2:30 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
tyronehernandez
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 6/16/12
Posts: 187
MNQ is a great drill. 8 inch paper plate makes the perfect target for it.

Also like Kyle Lamb's Zig Zag drill.

You think "Green eyes, black rifle" is worth getting?
3/23/13 2:40 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
sreiter
31 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 26485
"JG uses the charging handle during speed reloads.

I've been meaning to ask him his logic--will report back here."

i'm with jed...hell even sitting a ta bench, i use the ping pong paddle,,,

i wonder if he uses the CH because thats how he'd clear a malfunction, and he just wants muscle memory to do 1 thing always

| Share | Email | Subscribe | Check IPs

Reply Post

You must log in to post a reply. Click here to login.