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Revgear League BJJGround >> Starting your own BJJ Brand. Ask me anything.

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6/23/13 5:03 PM
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yusul
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thanks.
6/26/13 8:45 AM
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Ray Elbe
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Amazing thread Phone Post 3.0
6/26/13 9:02 PM
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On the Mat
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LankyFG - What about NDA's or contracts when dealing with overseas manufacturers (Pakistan or China)? What kind of insurance do you get on shipping? Do you suggest using a customs broker in the beginning?

Thanks! This thread has been gold!

Yes on broker. You can really lower your import costs if they know what they are doing.

NDA in china or Pakistan is a joke but try to make them sign it. See how they react when you ask. Keep in mind china makes a fake Lambo. Google it.
6/26/13 10:15 PM
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JoeHurley
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I have a friend who wants to start a line of chef coats ( he is a cook) and i wanted to know if there's any advice you can pass along about starting up a line like who would he go to to make a design and or prototype, any licensing, patents or other legalities to address, etc. I know its a different field but i am just looking to pass on any help possible. Phone Post
6/26/13 11:19 PM
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BenJay
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LankyFG - What about NDA's or contracts when dealing with overseas manufacturers (Pakistan or China)? What kind of insurance do you get on shipping? Do you suggest using a customs broker in the beginning?

Thanks! This thread has been gold!

Yes on broker. You can really lower your import costs if they know what they are doing.

NDA in china or Pakistan is a joke but try to make them sign it. See how they react when you ask. Keep in mind china makes a fake Lambo. Google it.

Yeah good luck enforcing your NDA penalties in this country.

Also, it is not just Lambos they fake in China, they even make fake rice (plastic), fake eggs (chemicals) and fake milk powder.

I am in China for the time and have been toying with the idea of getting something done here in terms of producing BJJ gear. As I travel a lot for work anyway, I could monitor the manufacturing more closely myself, which would be a plus.

However, my BJJ-related home market (Europe) is still quite small and China itself even smaller, maybe Japan could be another market.

Question: Are you currently selling anything abroad, or are your sales completely US-based?

My idea was to initially establish the brand though T-shirts and Rash-Guards, before even thinking about making a Gi.

I would think the T-shirt business can create volume more quickly, as it is a lower price barrier for the customer and also carries over to non-BJJ use and possibly non-BJJ customers as well, depending on the style.

Question: Is it hard to get a good quality shirt done in China, especially in terms of print? Also, are the margins for shirt too low to use it as a starting point to create some cash flow?

Thanks in advance and keep up the good work!

Ben

6/27/13 3:17 PM
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On the Mat
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JoeHurley -  I have a friend who wants to start a line of chef coats ( he is a cook) and i wanted to know if there's any advice you can pass along about starting up a line like who would he go to to make a design and or prototype, any licensing, patents or other legalities to address, etc. I know its a different field but i am just looking to pass on any help possible. Phone Post

He can design it in illustrator. he will need to find manufactures or a local seamstress to prototype it. I would try to find someone local that can do prototypes. doubt he can patent anything unless he came up with some unreal new type of coat and even if he did it would slow his release down way down. years. not to mention is costs a lot. good luck
6/27/13 3:25 PM
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On the Mat
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BenJay - 
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LankyFG - What about NDA's or contracts when dealing with overseas manufacturers (Pakistan or China)? What kind of insurance do you get on shipping? Do you suggest using a customs broker in the beginning?

Thanks! This thread has been gold!

Yes on broker. You can really lower your import costs if they know what they are doing.

NDA in china or Pakistan is a joke but try to make them sign it. See how they react when you ask. Keep in mind china makes a fake Lambo. Google it.

Yeah good luck enforcing your NDA penalties in this country.

Also, it is not just Lambos they fake in China, they even make fake rice (plastic), fake eggs (chemicals) and fake milk powder.

I am in China for the time and have been toying with the idea of getting something done here in terms of producing BJJ gear. As I travel a lot for work anyway, I could monitor the manufacturing more closely myself, which would be a plus.

However, my BJJ-related home market (Europe) is still quite small and China itself even smaller, maybe Japan could be another market.

Question: Are you currently selling anything abroad, or are your sales completely US-based?

My idea was to initially establish the brand though T-shirts and Rash-Guards, before even thinking about making a Gi.

I would think the T-shirt business can create volume more quickly, as it is a lower price barrier for the customer and also carries over to non-BJJ use and possibly non-BJJ customers as well, depending on the style.

Question: Is it hard to get a good quality shirt done in China, especially in terms of print? Also, are the margins for shirt too low to use it as a starting point to create some cash flow?

Thanks in advance and keep up the good work!

Ben


Yes we sell all over the world Europe, Asia, South Africa, and Australia.

Yes you can get a good quality of shirt in China. The margins depend on how many you get, how well you negotiate your costs and how much you charge. How much you charge and how you position yourself. There $5 shirts and i have seen tshirts for $900 in Hong Kong.
6/27/13 6:43 PM
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kying418
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OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?
6/27/13 7:35 PM
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jleung
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AJL19 - 
kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?
Great question. Phone Post 3.0

Agreed, I was always curious about that.
6/28/13 2:37 AM
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On the Mat
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kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?

How the heck would i know that? Sorry no clue. I can tell you lot about making gis but this one i cant touch.
6/28/13 10:50 AM
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jleung
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kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?

How the heck would i know that? Sorry no clue. I can tell you lot about making gis but this one i cant touch.

LOL, at least you're honest.

For the guys trying to get costs down. What kind of advice would you have about buying your own fabric and sending it to the factory?

You ever run into any issues with meeting minimum quantities?I know some of these fabric factories only produce in massive 1/2 ton quantities.

How about dimensions of the fabric? I know the gi tops need to be at least 60" wide so that the top won't require a back seam.

How many meters of fabric does it take make a gi?
6/28/13 12:26 PM
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Easters
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Do any companies make gis in the U.S.? If not, how much do you think they would have to retail to be a profitable company?
6/28/13 12:28 PM
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Easters
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Easters - Do any companies make gis in the U.S.? If not, how much do you think they would have to retail to be a profitable company?

After I posted this I realized I should have just googled. There are a few companies out there it seems
6/28/13 4:39 PM
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jleung
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Easters - 
Easters - Do any companies make gis in the U.S.? If not, how much do you think they would have to retail to be a profitable company?

After I posted this I realized I should have just googled. There are a few companies out there it seems

I think Origin is the only company currently making gis in the US.
6/29/13 12:37 PM
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On the Mat
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jleung - 
Easters - 
Easters - Do any companies make gis in the U.S.? If not, how much do you think they would have to retail to be a profitable company?

After I posted this I realized I should have just googled. There are a few companies out there it seems

I think Origin is the only company currently making gis in the US.

I saw a really cool video they had of their factory in Maine or Vermont? Looks like they put a lot in to it. Hope it does well.

Bear from Shoyoroll siad they were working on a gi factory in LA. I have looked in to it a few times and hadnt really found something I thought would work well.
6/29/13 12:39 PM
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On the Mat
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AJL19 - 
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kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?

How the heck would i know that? Sorry no clue. I can tell you lot about making gis but this one i cant touch.
I thought the question was a good one because it is a question about the size of your market.

Maybe a better question is how many BJJ gis are sold every year in total, worldwide or in the US. Phone Post 3.0

Man it would be cool to try to figure it out. I have over 4700 BJJ schools in our database. Say average its what 60 or 70 guys. 280,000 to 300,000?
6/29/13 2:58 PM
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yusul
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do you know the quality of american cotton vs. pakistani cotton?
6/29/13 6:17 PM
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Hywel Teague
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AJL19 - 
On the Mat -
kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?

How the heck would i know that? Sorry no clue. I can tell you lot about making gis but this one i cant touch.
I thought the question was a good one because it is a question about the size of your market.

Maybe a better question is how many BJJ gis are sold every year in total, worldwide or in the US. Phone Post 3.0

Man it would be cool to try to figure it out. I have over 4700 BJJ schools in our database. Say average its what 60 or 70 guys. 280,000 to 300,000?
Is that US schools or international? Phone Post 3.0
6/30/13 1:36 AM
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On the Mat
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Hywel Teague - 
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AJL19 - 
On the Mat -
kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?

How the heck would i know that? Sorry no clue. I can tell you lot about making gis but this one i cant touch.
I thought the question was a good one because it is a question about the size of your market.

Maybe a better question is how many BJJ gis are sold every year in total, worldwide or in the US. Phone Post 3.0

Man it would be cool to try to figure it out. I have over 4700 BJJ schools in our database. Say average its what 60 or 70 guys. 280,000 to 300,000?
Is that US schools or international? Phone Post 3.0

Mostly US but there are some international
6/30/13 1:36 AM
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On the Mat
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yusul - do you know the quality of american cotton vs. pakistani cotton?

answered that long ago. look a few pages back
6/30/13 3:25 PM
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On the Mat
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jleung - 
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kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?

How the heck would i know that? Sorry no clue. I can tell you lot about making gis but this one i cant touch.

LOL, at least you're honest.

For the guys trying to get costs down. What kind of advice would you have about buying your own fabric and sending it to the factory?

You ever run into any issues with meeting minimum quantities?I know some of these fabric factories only produce in massive 1/2 ton quantities.

How about dimensions of the fabric? I know the gi tops need to be at least 60" wide so that the top won't require a back seam.

How many meters of fabric does it take make a gi?

Well I didnt make this tread to lie to people ;)

For guys trying to get the costs down thats simple buy more gis and negotiate. Also here is a tip that has saved me tens of thousands of dollars. Get a GREAT customs broker.

No I dont run in to meeting minimum quantities, we meet those easily. If you are trying to get your own fabric done you need to go directly to the mill. And you need to go back and check your production too. You could get F'd. Ya cant just do this stuff over the internet.

Check this out. Took me 2.5 years to get bamboo fabric for gis. Mill told me it would take 3 months. After 6 I got a sample. Sucked. Another 4 got another sucked. Finally jumpped on a plane for China. Went to mill and factory. Got a good sample. Long story short. To save about .10 a year they cheated me on thread count. Had 1500 pairs of bamboo pants rip. Lost almost a $100K refunding and replacing pants. I got lazy didnt want to fly back to check production. Had an agent thought that was good enough. wasnt.

Moral of the story. If you want to do something new or try to play with the big boys you got to be there yourself making sure shit is done right. or else you'll get F'd mill saved maybe $300. Cost me a ton.

Width of fabric depends on size of gis you want to make. Remember you have to weave 62-64" to get 60" of usable fabric. 60" should get you up to A4 even A5 depending on your cut.

It takes 2 meters of fabric to make a top and 1.25-1.65 for pants.
6/30/13 4:05 PM
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yusul
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yusul - do you know the quality of american cotton vs. pakistani cotton?

answered that long ago. look a few pages back

i can't find it.

i found you mentioning the quality of american rashguards and manufacturing, and also pakistani gis vs. chinese in terms of cotton.

i'll check again.
7/3/13 8:12 PM
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On the Mat
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yusul - 
On the Mat - 
yusul - do you know the quality of american cotton vs. pakistani cotton?

answered that long ago. look a few pages back

i can't find it.

i found you mentioning the quality of american rashguards and manufacturing, and also pakistani gis vs. chinese in terms of cotton.

i'll check again.

Cotton quality can be the same at either place. Pakistan usually has better cotton than China because they grow a lot of the world's cotton. So they dont import. China imports. they een buy from USA.

Pakistan had a flood a few years back that wiped out the bulk of their cotton fields.

This drove the worlds cotton supply way down and price went way up. Because of that quality of cotton you could get for gis was second rate. thats why every brand of gis had pants ripping.

Since then cotton supply has come back but cost has not dropped. So it is still had to get high quality cotton for gis.
7/3/13 9:20 PM
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spider guard
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jleung - 
On the Mat - 
kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?

How the heck would i know that? Sorry no clue. I can tell you lot about making gis but this one i cant touch.

LOL, at least you're honest.

For the guys trying to get costs down. What kind of advice would you have about buying your own fabric and sending it to the factory?

You ever run into any issues with meeting minimum quantities?I know some of these fabric factories only produce in massive 1/2 ton quantities.

How about dimensions of the fabric? I know the gi tops need to be at least 60" wide so that the top won't require a back seam.

How many meters of fabric does it take make a gi?

Well I didnt make this tread to lie to people ;)

For guys trying to get the costs down thats simple buy more gis and negotiate. Also here is a tip that has saved me tens of thousands of dollars. Get a GREAT customs broker.

No I dont run in to meeting minimum quantities, we meet those easily. If you are trying to get your own fabric done you need to go directly to the mill. And you need to go back and check your production too. You could get F'd. Ya cant just do this stuff over the internet.

Check this out. Took me 2.5 years to get bamboo fabric for gis. Mill told me it would take 3 months. After 6 I got a sample. Sucked. Another 4 got another sucked. Finally jumpped on a plane for China. Went to mill and factory. Got a good sample. Long story short. To save about .10 a year they cheated me on thread count. Had 1500 pairs of bamboo pants rip. Lost almost a $100K refunding and replacing pants. I got lazy didnt want to fly back to check production. Had an agent thought that was good enough. wasnt.

Moral of the story. If you want to do something new or try to play with the big boys you got to be there yourself making sure shit is done right. or else you'll get F'd mill saved maybe $300. Cost me a ton.

Width of fabric depends on size of gis you want to make. Remember you have to weave 62-64" to get 60" of usable fabric. 60" should get you up to A4 even A5 depending on your cut.

It takes 2 meters of fabric to make a top and 1.25-1.65 for pants.

So even with an agent, it still went to crap? How many times did you fly back to get the pants issued corrected and how much time did you spend in China per issue? Do you think the agent and the plant were in connivance to screw you?
7/4/13 9:51 AM
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On the Mat
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spider guard - 
On the Mat - 
jleung - 
On the Mat - 
kying418 - OTM- do you have an estimate as to the number of BJJ practioners in the USA and the world?

How the heck would i know that? Sorry no clue. I can tell you lot about making gis but this one i cant touch.

LOL, at least you're honest.

For the guys trying to get costs down. What kind of advice would you have about buying your own fabric and sending it to the factory?

You ever run into any issues with meeting minimum quantities?I know some of these fabric factories only produce in massive 1/2 ton quantities.

How about dimensions of the fabric? I know the gi tops need to be at least 60" wide so that the top won't require a back seam.

How many meters of fabric does it take make a gi?

Well I didnt make this tread to lie to people ;)

For guys trying to get the costs down thats simple buy more gis and negotiate. Also here is a tip that has saved me tens of thousands of dollars. Get a GREAT customs broker.

No I dont run in to meeting minimum quantities, we meet those easily. If you are trying to get your own fabric done you need to go directly to the mill. And you need to go back and check your production too. You could get F'd. Ya cant just do this stuff over the internet.

Check this out. Took me 2.5 years to get bamboo fabric for gis. Mill told me it would take 3 months. After 6 I got a sample. Sucked. Another 4 got another sucked. Finally jumpped on a plane for China. Went to mill and factory. Got a good sample. Long story short. To save about .10 a year they cheated me on thread count. Had 1500 pairs of bamboo pants rip. Lost almost a $100K refunding and replacing pants. I got lazy didnt want to fly back to check production. Had an agent thought that was good enough. wasnt.

Moral of the story. If you want to do something new or try to play with the big boys you got to be there yourself making sure shit is done right. or else you'll get F'd mill saved maybe $300. Cost me a ton.

Width of fabric depends on size of gis you want to make. Remember you have to weave 62-64" to get 60" of usable fabric. 60" should get you up to A4 even A5 depending on your cut.

It takes 2 meters of fabric to make a top and 1.25-1.65 for pants.

So even with an agent, it still went to crap? How many times did you fly back to get the pants issued corrected and how much time did you spend in China per issue? Do you think the agent and the plant were in connivance to screw you?

Yes even with the Agent I got f'd. The agent got lazy and didnt travel to the factory as he was supposed to.

I didnt fly back to get the pants fixed. I made agent do it or lose his client and commissions.

It took me 2 years and 3 trips to china to get the world first bamboo gis made.

No I dont think the agent and plant were in cahoots. It was the fabric mill that was working with the gi factory directly the screwed me. They are the old ones that saved any money. Agent and factory both lost money. But no one lost more money that i did.

The fabric mill wove the fabric with lighter and less threads than we asked for. Its like a thread count on sheets. You pay for 1000 thread count and you get 700. So they saved like a dime a foot or some crap like that. then all your pants rip and you dont sleep for months.

Then people come on here and bash you and tell you how much you suck. so you can come on your favorite forum for a while w o feeling like shit. lol

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