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UnderGround Forums >> UFC knew the .9 allowance for GSP was illegal


3/29/13 7:50 PM
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guardbr8kr
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UGCTT_ Lay'n'PrayNINJA - 
guardbr8kr - GSP weighed 170 with his shorts on , fuck sticks.


1. You don't know what GSP's actual weight was on the scale, only what the commission guy announced.

 

2. Those exact shorts weigh around .3lbs.  You and others love to pretend that fighters shorts are made of iron or something.


eat a dick and die you fuck stick. Yes this is an anti-209 post.
3/29/13 8:02 PM
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clown makeup
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The UFC controls the show where ever they may be despite Dana proclaiming they are the most heavily regulated sport in the history of sports.

New Jersey set the course for Unified Rules:

"The rules adopted by the NJSACB have become the de facto standard set of rules for professional mixed martial arts across North America. All state, provincial, & municipal athletic commissions that regulate mixed martial arts have assimilated these rules into their existing  competition rules and statutes. For a promotion to hold mixed martial arts events in a sanctioned venue, the promotion must abide by the commission's body of rules"

What.the UFC touts on its website as being "the rules":

"In non-championship fights, there shall be allowed a 1 pound weigh allowance. In championship fights, the participants must weigh no more than that permitted for the relevant weight division"

in reality amount to a "hill of beans" because as recent as of Tuesday this week the de facto standardizer of "the rules" New Jersey informed thusly:

"In the state of New Jersey, which features another influential athletic commission, common practice includes making exact weight (or less) for championship bouts.

Nick Lembo, counsel for the New Jersey Athletic Control Board, said on Tuesday that his agency “will allow one pound over on a contract weight, unless the promoter denies such allowance. However, the caveat is that most promoters want major title fights to be dead-on weight. Thus, 170 becomes exactly 170 or less.”

In previous UFC events in the state of New Jersey, UFC officials did not request a one-pound allowance for championship bouts, added Lembo"

What that means is, if and when it suits the UFC, they can "bend the rules" and request or better "block" the standard rules i.e. in Montreal if they do stick to the stated rules, the UFC can say for this fight we "deny such allowance".

In the case of GSP vs Diaz in fear of imminent failure owing to GSP being ill and being advised to continue to retain fluids, the UFC approached the Quebec Commission and denied absolute adherence to the Unified Rules and sought application of the rounding down or the over by 1. lbs rule for non-title fights plus the additional hour to reduce the weight normally reserved for non-title fights.

This will be the reason why one sees "the rules" being inconsistantly applied across North America. The UFC has the right as the promoter to deny application of the Unified Rules as they see fit.
 

 
3/29/13 8:08 PM
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slamming
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orcus - 
Hired Gun - Rules are there to protect fighters. If this is true that fight should be ruled a no-contest.

lol

Which rule was broken?


There was DEFINITELY a rule broken....the rule against hitting blatantly after the bell. These MMA Purists that are totally not just blindly crying on behalf of Diaz don't seem to want to discuss that though.
I wondered this too. Diaz doesn't play by the rules himself but is fine accusing everyone 7 ways from Sunday at being a cheat. Phone Post 3.0
3/29/13 8:12 PM
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babbling monkey
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Barbalos - 
babbling monkey - 
Barbalos - 
Winston Wolf - 
Barbalos - 
RampageFitsLikeAGlove - 
Winston Wolf - 
Barbalos - So Nevada does the same thing Quebec did, and that means Quebec is doing something wrong. Ok, nice argument.

paid schill

Is this his internet schtick or something?   What a crybaby.


Only crybaby here is Diaz (and his nut lickers). Everyone else is perfectly fine with what has happened.

GSP is or was my favorite fighter.I have never rooted for either Diaz to win a fight

So what huge dirty secret are you trying to expose here? I don't get it. All of the accusations of impropriety have zero evidence. A couple weird phone calls and such don't prove anything. And what I really don't get is what is the huge deal even if there was something shady going on? A big conspiracy to hide a 0.9 pound weight measurement? Are you fucking kidding me? Is this such a huge deal, as to warrant as this rampant speculation? I don't get it.

0.9lbs > nanograms of metabolites

I agree, the weed stuff is outdated bull, however that is not relevant to this.

Its absolutely relevant. One ac enforces their own rules others don't.
All diaz has is quit smoking
All gsp has do is quit eating ice cream

3/29/13 8:24 PM
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UGCTT_ Lay'n'PrayNINJA
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guardbr8kr - 
UGCTT_ Lay'n'PrayNINJA - 
guardbr8kr - GSP weighed 170 with his shorts on , fuck sticks.


1. You don't know what GSP's actual weight was on the scale, only what the commission guy announced.

 

2. Those exact shorts weigh around .3lbs.  You and others love to pretend that fighters shorts are made of iron or something.


eat a dick and die you fuck stick. Yes this is an anti-209 post.

I can't stand the Diaz brother. Way to fail tard nugget.

3/29/13 9:15 PM
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Rabid Bunyip
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IronShriek - 
This is appalling. Phone Post

 

The faux outrage from Diaz fans is hilarious.  I always imagine it being said in the voice of a Southern Belle.

 

Who then gets fucked brutally. Phone Post
3/29/13 9:19 PM
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irishrottie
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Nick still loses but what went on behind the scenes was strange and needs to be addressed by the brass.

3/29/13 9:27 PM
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UGCTT_ Lay'n'PrayNINJA
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Just to further a point to Orcus:

 

Who was Hopkins fighting when they DID use the decimal and forced him to cut more weight weight when he came in a fraction over????

 

Once you answer that answer this:

 

Where is that boxer from (since age 4)????

3/29/13 9:59 PM
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Anderson's BBC in my Goku
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UGCTT_ Lay'n'PrayNINJA -

Just to further a point to Orcus:

 

Who was Hopkins fighting when they DID use the decimal and forced him to cut more weight weight when he came in a fraction over????

 

Once you answer that answer this:

 

Where is that boxer from (since age 4)????

Nonono. You've got it all wrong u see. There are actually 152 different sets of off the record rules for weighins implemented by the same AC that has the same statutory code. If the fight is a boxing match with one fighter that has a last name that rhymes with popkins, then they count decimals. Perfectly legit.

-orcus Phone Post 3.0
3/30/13 12:41 AM
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orcus
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Edited: 03/30/13 12:55 AM
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UGCTT_ Lay'n'PrayNINJA - 

Just to further a point to Orcus:

 

Who was Hopkins fighting when they DID use the decimal and forced him to cut more weight weight when he came in a fraction over????

 

Once you answer that answer this:

 

Where is that boxer from (since age 4)????

 

Beats me, nor do I care in the slightest. Why are you asking me about what happened in an entirely different sport, and why should I care about your conspiracy theories? It doesn't matter why they went with full decimals in that fight, maybe the promoter requested it, maybe the fighters requested it, maybe the official doing the weighins that day was really stupid and couldn't round in his head.

I actually get a kick out of your nonsense though. You are seriously claiming they used decimals because they somehow knew in advance that Bernard would be a few ounces over.

You know the undercard fighters who weighed in first had their weights given with full decimals too right? Of course you didn't. Why would you actually take the time to know something before spouting off?

"Nonono. You've got it all wrong u see. There are actually 152 different sets of off the record rules for weighins implemented by the same AC that has the same statutory code. If the fight is a boxing match with one fighter that has a last name that rhymes with popkins, then they count decimals. Perfectly legit. -orcus"

Only when you are pretending to be me do you manage to be correct. It is perfectly legit, since it is not against any rule whatsoever. They don't need to use any consistency at all; nor do they even need to inform anyone in advance -- a fighter making the contracted weight on the scale will never have an issue. A fighter determined to milk every ounce out of the weighin as he possibly can is certainly free to ask in advance what amount of rounding an AC will use, but if he cuts to 170 or under he will never have an issue and never have to give it a second thought.

 

3/30/13 1:13 AM
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Asp
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As a long time fan I find this ridiculous. I like Diaz. I also like GSP. If the commission is letting GSP off with this as a home town "favour" then it's totally wrong. How long has this been going on for though? Why is it just now that it has been brought up? Shouldn't one of the other people to have fought there have said something about this by now?
3/30/13 2:34 AM
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Jiu Jitsu doesn't work
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I'm still looking for a thread called "in a streetfight there would be no commission". Phone Post 3.0
3/30/13 3:13 AM
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Winston Wolf
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Hey Orcus being how ur hidding from this thread Ill post it here again ..Dont tell me u are going to defend that slime ball

Jonathan Tweedale, Nick Diaz's lawyer, contacted Bloody Elbow and exclusively provided very interesting text message transcripts from the evening of the weigh in, explaining "Given some of the media coverage, we need to set the record straight on the timing that the issue of the 0.9 was raised by Nick Diaz. The issue was pursued immediately. On the evening of March 15, Mike Mersch and I exchanged the following correspondence (via text message), in which he denied any knowledge of a .9 allowance or ignoring the decimal."

Mersch, again, was the man in the video who informed the camp of the "no decimal" changes.

Here is the text conversation between Tweedale (JDT) and Mersch (MM), which starts at 9:24 p.m.:

JDT: "Hi Mike. Nick is curious about the .9 pound allowance at today's weigh-in for his championship bout. He doesn't want to be a nuisance about this, but he's a bit confused. Can you shed any light?"

MM: "I don't know what you're talking about. All parties weighed in appropriately according [to] the Quebec Commission."

JDT: "Of course. You're right, and he knows that. He just wanted to know why the Quebec Commission was okay with a 0.9 pound weight allowance for a championship fight. Nick's not going to make an issue of it, but it's been gnawing at him since it was explained to him at the weigh-ins, on an "off the record" basis or otherwise. I just want him to stop thinking about it, and thought you could provide some insight."

MM: "I have been told everyone made weight so there's nothing to make an issue about. He might want to focus on how he's going to win the fight rather than spending the night making excuses about why he lost."

The correspondence continued at 9:46 p.m.:

JDT: "C'mon Mike you're just going to stonewall on this issue? We're reaching out in a discreet manner, as appropriate in the circumstances. Meet us half-way."

MM: "Huh? The Commission determined both fighters weighed 170 or less. What am I supposed to do about that? I would think Nick would be excited to compete for the UFC Welterweight title. Seems like he's focused on the wrong issue."

JDT: "No one wants you to *do* anything. If the answer is simply "the Quebec Commission permits a promoter to request that .9 pounds be rounded down in a championship fight (unlike, e.g., the Washington commission for Nate's fight), and Zuffa made that request here", then pls confirm. Far better to reach out this way than the uncooperative Twitter/media way."

MM: "How would I know what the Quebec Commission does? I was informed everyone made weight like everyone else at the weigh in. Zuffa made no requests for anything from the Quebec Commission. Good luck to Nick with the fight."

JDT: "Okay. I'll let Nick know that you can't shed any light on why Quebec treats 170.9 as 170 in a championship fight. Disappointing. Thanks for your time and your wish of luck to Nick for the fight."

MM: "Again I have no idea what you're talking about. The Quebec Commission indicated both fighters were 170 or lower."

JDT: "If you don't know then I should be asking someone else. No worries, Mike. Which UFC exec advised Nick and his entourage before the weigh-in that "If you're 170.2, you're 170. If you're 170.9, you're 170...that's a kinda off the record type of thing"?"

MM: "I would think you'd direct that to the source: the Quebec Commission. The UFC has nothing to do with weigh ins in Quebec."

Tweedale explained, "We appreciate that Mr. Mersch was in a difficult position, evidently having been instructed by the Quebec Commission to relay to Mr. Diaz some last-minute, unlawful 'rule changes' to give the hometown fighter a reprieve from his duty to make weight at 170 pounds.
3/30/13 3:31 AM
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Canooke
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Seems like a bunch of dudes in here who just want GSP to have to take his shorts off next time.
3/30/13 8:04 AM
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Standup29
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Winston Wolf - Hey Orcus being how ur hidding from this thread Ill post it here again ..Dont tell me u are going to defend that slime ball

Jonathan Tweedale, Nick Diaz's lawyer, contacted Bloody Elbow and exclusively provided very interesting text message transcripts from the evening of the weigh in, explaining "Given some of the media coverage, we need to set the record straight on the timing that the issue of the 0.9 was raised by Nick Diaz. The issue was pursued immediately. On the evening of March 15, Mike Mersch and I exchanged the following correspondence (via text message), in which he denied any knowledge of a .9 allowance or ignoring the decimal."

Mersch, again, was the man in the video who informed the camp of the "no decimal" changes.

Here is the text conversation between Tweedale (JDT) and Mersch (MM), which starts at 9:24 p.m.:

JDT: "Hi Mike. Nick is curious about the .9 pound allowance at today's weigh-in for his championship bout. He doesn't want to be a nuisance about this, but he's a bit confused. Can you shed any light?"

MM: "I don't know what you're talking about. All parties weighed in appropriately according [to] the Quebec Commission."

JDT: "Of course. You're right, and he knows that. He just wanted to know why the Quebec Commission was okay with a 0.9 pound weight allowance for a championship fight. Nick's not going to make an issue of it, but it's been gnawing at him since it was explained to him at the weigh-ins, on an "off the record" basis or otherwise. I just want him to stop thinking about it, and thought you could provide some insight."

MM: "I have been told everyone made weight so there's nothing to make an issue about. He might want to focus on how he's going to win the fight rather than spending the night making excuses about why he lost."

The correspondence continued at 9:46 p.m.:

JDT: "C'mon Mike you're just going to stonewall on this issue? We're reaching out in a discreet manner, as appropriate in the circumstances. Meet us half-way."

MM: "Huh? The Commission determined both fighters weighed 170 or less. What am I supposed to do about that? I would think Nick would be excited to compete for the UFC Welterweight title. Seems like he's focused on the wrong issue."

JDT: "No one wants you to *do* anything. If the answer is simply "the Quebec Commission permits a promoter to request that .9 pounds be rounded down in a championship fight (unlike, e.g., the Washington commission for Nate's fight), and Zuffa made that request here", then pls confirm. Far better to reach out this way than the uncooperative Twitter/media way."

MM: "How would I know what the Quebec Commission does? I was informed everyone made weight like everyone else at the weigh in. Zuffa made no requests for anything from the Quebec Commission. Good luck to Nick with the fight."

JDT: "Okay. I'll let Nick know that you can't shed any light on why Quebec treats 170.9 as 170 in a championship fight. Disappointing. Thanks for your time and your wish of luck to Nick for the fight."

MM: "Again I have no idea what you're talking about. The Quebec Commission indicated both fighters were 170 or lower."

JDT: "If you don't know then I should be asking someone else. No worries, Mike. Which UFC exec advised Nick and his entourage before the weigh-in that "If you're 170.2, you're 170. If you're 170.9, you're 170...that's a kinda off the record type of thing"?"

MM: "I would think you'd direct that to the source: the Quebec Commission. The UFC has nothing to do with weigh ins in Quebec."

Tweedale explained, "We appreciate that Mr. Mersch was in a difficult position, evidently having been instructed by the Quebec Commission to relay to Mr. Diaz some last-minute, unlawful 'rule changes' to give the hometown fighter a reprieve from his duty to make weight at 170 pounds.
Here is a thought.

Was the MM doing Nick a favor letting him know how tha QAC interprets the weigh in rules? Yes. Condider Nate didn't seem to know he didn't get 1 pound. Did the Diaz camp post this video and make it seem "shady"? Yes. Would you want anything to do with anyone from said camp afterwards and would you have an attitude dealing with them further? Exactly.

What you seem to want a response to has very little to do with Orcus stance. I don't often agree with Orcus but he's made valid points that are ignored. Every AC interprets rules in varying manners. Ca allows 6:1 TE while others 4:1. Nevada rounds 170.4 down to 170 and 170.5 to 171. Its not in their rules and regulations yet nobody seems to acknowledge this. The only readin there is an issue is a UFC employee tried to do the Diaz camp a solid and now look where we are.

Shields cleared the hand wraps. Then wanted someone else to look. Sorry but that's not how it works. You think it would be fair to have people from the other camp constantly coming in to "view" the wraps? Come on, flip the coin. Think the Diaz camp would be cool if GSP camp kept trying to view their wraps? It was mind games pure and simple. That's what all of this is. Phone Post
3/30/13 8:47 AM
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JamyS26
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You guys still crying too? Man this is sad Phone Post 3.0
3/30/13 8:48 AM
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Winston Wolf
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Standup29 - 
Winston Wolf - Hey Orcus being how ur hidding from this thread Ill post it here again ..Dont tell me u are going to defend that slime ball

Jonathan Tweedale, Nick Diaz's lawyer, contacted Bloody Elbow and exclusively provided very interesting text message transcripts from the evening of the weigh in, explaining "Given some of the media coverage, we need to set the record straight on the timing that the issue of the 0.9 was raised by Nick Diaz. The issue was pursued immediately. On the evening of March 15, Mike Mersch and I exchanged the following correspondence (via text message), in which he denied any knowledge of a .9 allowance or ignoring the decimal."

Mersch, again, was the man in the video who informed the camp of the "no decimal" changes.

Here is the text conversation between Tweedale (JDT) and Mersch (MM), which starts at 9:24 p.m.:

JDT: "Hi Mike. Nick is curious about the .9 pound allowance at today's weigh-in for his championship bout. He doesn't want to be a nuisance about this, but he's a bit confused. Can you shed any light?"

MM: "I don't know what you're talking about. All parties weighed in appropriately according [to] the Quebec Commission."

JDT: "Of course. You're right, and he knows that. He just wanted to know why the Quebec Commission was okay with a 0.9 pound weight allowance for a championship fight. Nick's not going to make an issue of it, but it's been gnawing at him since it was explained to him at the weigh-ins, on an "off the record" basis or otherwise. I just want him to stop thinking about it, and thought you could provide some insight."

MM: "I have been told everyone made weight so there's nothing to make an issue about. He might want to focus on how he's going to win the fight rather than spending the night making excuses about why he lost."

The correspondence continued at 9:46 p.m.:

JDT: "C'mon Mike you're just going to stonewall on this issue? We're reaching out in a discreet manner, as appropriate in the circumstances. Meet us half-way."

MM: "Huh? The Commission determined both fighters weighed 170 or less. What am I supposed to do about that? I would think Nick would be excited to compete for the UFC Welterweight title. Seems like he's focused on the wrong issue."

JDT: "No one wants you to *do* anything. If the answer is simply "the Quebec Commission permits a promoter to request that .9 pounds be rounded down in a championship fight (unlike, e.g., the Washington commission for Nate's fight), and Zuffa made that request here", then pls confirm. Far better to reach out this way than the uncooperative Twitter/media way."

MM: "How would I know what the Quebec Commission does? I was informed everyone made weight like everyone else at the weigh in. Zuffa made no requests for anything from the Quebec Commission. Good luck to Nick with the fight."

JDT: "Okay. I'll let Nick know that you can't shed any light on why Quebec treats 170.9 as 170 in a championship fight. Disappointing. Thanks for your time and your wish of luck to Nick for the fight."

MM: "Again I have no idea what you're talking about. The Quebec Commission indicated both fighters were 170 or lower."

JDT: "If you don't know then I should be asking someone else. No worries, Mike. Which UFC exec advised Nick and his entourage before the weigh-in that "If you're 170.2, you're 170. If you're 170.9, you're 170...that's a kinda off the record type of thing"?"

MM: "I would think you'd direct that to the source: the Quebec Commission. The UFC has nothing to do with weigh ins in Quebec."

Tweedale explained, "We appreciate that Mr. Mersch was in a difficult position, evidently having been instructed by the Quebec Commission to relay to Mr. Diaz some last-minute, unlawful 'rule changes' to give the hometown fighter a reprieve from his duty to make weight at 170 pounds.
Here is a thought.

Was the MM doing Nick a favor letting him know how tha QAC interprets the weigh in rules? Yes. Condider Nate didn't seem to know he didn't get 1 pound. Did the Diaz camp post this video and make it seem "shady"? Yes. Would you want anything to do with anyone from said camp afterwards and would you have an attitude dealing with them further? Exactly.

What you seem to want a response to has very little to do with Orcus stance. I don't often agree with Orcus but he's made valid points that are ignored. Every AC interprets rules in varying manners. Ca allows 6:1 TE while others 4:1. Nevada rounds 170.4 down to 170 and 170.5 to 171. Its not in their rules and regulations yet nobody seems to acknowledge this. The only readin there is an issue is a UFC employee tried to do the Diaz camp a solid and now look where we are.

Shields cleared the hand wraps. Then wanted someone else to look. Sorry but that's not how it works. You think it would be fair to have people from the other camp constantly coming in to "view" the wraps? Come on, flip the coin. Think the Diaz camp would be cool if GSP camp kept trying to view their wraps? It was mind games pure and simple. That's what all of this is. Phone Post

what favor was he doing Nick weighed 169 an already was on weight They could have told him that rule a month ago not an hour before weigh in
3/30/13 9:50 AM
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deadlyonetwo3
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People yelling and screaming, "oh you lost Diaz!" Etc etc are completely missing the point. Don't you get that a champion has apparently missed weight for a title fight (which in boxing would have you automatically stripped of your title) and was given a pound allowance on the scales!!!!!! This is a serious issue in a competitive sport where guys are shedding so much weight etc and this needs to be seriously scrutinized. These commissions can't be allowed to make up rules like this as they go. Missing weight on a title fight is serious and everyone is acting like its all about excuses! It's not! Pay attention to the ISSUE not the fighter making the petition please. Phone Post 3.0
3/30/13 10:03 AM
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Standup29
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Standup29 - 
Winston Wolf - Hey Orcus being how ur hidding from this thread Ill post it here again ..Dont tell me u are going to defend that slime ball

Jonathan Tweedale, Nick Diaz's lawyer, contacted Bloody Elbow and exclusively provided very interesting text message transcripts from the evening of the weigh in, explaining "Given some of the media coverage, we need to set the record straight on the timing that the issue of the 0.9 was raised by Nick Diaz. The issue was pursued immediately. On the evening of March 15, Mike Mersch and I exchanged the following correspondence (via text message), in which he denied any knowledge of a .9 allowance or ignoring the decimal."

Mersch, again, was the man in the video who informed the camp of the "no decimal" changes.

Here is the text conversation between Tweedale (JDT) and Mersch (MM), which starts at 9:24 p.m.:

JDT: "Hi Mike. Nick is curious about the .9 pound allowance at today's weigh-in for his championship bout. He doesn't want to be a nuisance about this, but he's a bit confused. Can you shed any light?"

MM: "I don't know what you're talking about. All parties weighed in appropriately according [to] the Quebec Commission."

JDT: "Of course. You're right, and he knows that. He just wanted to know why the Quebec Commission was okay with a 0.9 pound weight allowance for a championship fight. Nick's not going to make an issue of it, but it's been gnawing at him since it was explained to him at the weigh-ins, on an "off the record" basis or otherwise. I just want him to stop thinking about it, and thought you could provide some insight."

MM: "I have been told everyone made weight so there's nothing to make an issue about. He might want to focus on how he's going to win the fight rather than spending the night making excuses about why he lost."

The correspondence continued at 9:46 p.m.:

JDT: "C'mon Mike you're just going to stonewall on this issue? We're reaching out in a discreet manner, as appropriate in the circumstances. Meet us half-way."

MM: "Huh? The Commission determined both fighters weighed 170 or less. What am I supposed to do about that? I would think Nick would be excited to compete for the UFC Welterweight title. Seems like he's focused on the wrong issue."

JDT: "No one wants you to *do* anything. If the answer is simply "the Quebec Commission permits a promoter to request that .9 pounds be rounded down in a championship fight (unlike, e.g., the Washington commission for Nate's fight), and Zuffa made that request here", then pls confirm. Far better to reach out this way than the uncooperative Twitter/media way."

MM: "How would I know what the Quebec Commission does? I was informed everyone made weight like everyone else at the weigh in. Zuffa made no requests for anything from the Quebec Commission. Good luck to Nick with the fight."

JDT: "Okay. I'll let Nick know that you can't shed any light on why Quebec treats 170.9 as 170 in a championship fight. Disappointing. Thanks for your time and your wish of luck to Nick for the fight."

MM: "Again I have no idea what you're talking about. The Quebec Commission indicated both fighters were 170 or lower."

JDT: "If you don't know then I should be asking someone else. No worries, Mike. Which UFC exec advised Nick and his entourage before the weigh-in that "If you're 170.2, you're 170. If you're 170.9, you're 170...that's a kinda off the record type of thing"?"

MM: "I would think you'd direct that to the source: the Quebec Commission. The UFC has nothing to do with weigh ins in Quebec."

Tweedale explained, "We appreciate that Mr. Mersch was in a difficult position, evidently having been instructed by the Quebec Commission to relay to Mr. Diaz some last-minute, unlawful 'rule changes' to give the hometown fighter a reprieve from his duty to make weight at 170 pounds.
Here is a thought.

Was the MM doing Nick a favor letting him know how tha QAC interprets the weigh in rules? Yes. Condider Nate didn't seem to know he didn't get 1 pound. Did the Diaz camp post this video and make it seem "shady"? Yes. Would you want anything to do with anyone from said camp afterwards and would you have an attitude dealing with them further? Exactly.

What you seem to want a response to has very little to do with Orcus stance. I don't often agree with Orcus but he's made valid points that are ignored. Every AC interprets rules in varying manners. Ca allows 6:1 TE while others 4:1. Nevada rounds 170.4 down to 170 and 170.5 to 171. Its not in their rules and regulations yet nobody seems to acknowledge this. The only readin there is an issue is a UFC employee tried to do the Diaz camp a solid and now look where we are.

Shields cleared the hand wraps. Then wanted someone else to look. Sorry but that's not how it works. You think it would be fair to have people from the other camp constantly coming in to "view" the wraps? Come on, flip the coin. Think the Diaz camp would be cool if GSP camp kept trying to view their wraps? It was mind games pure and simple. That's what all of this is. Phone Post

what favor was he doing Nick weighed 169 an already was on weight They could have told him that rule a month ago not an hour before weigh in
Well if he was already at weight it would allow him to rehydrate sooner now wouldn't it. Do you know for a fact MM already knew he was at 169 at that point? I seem to remember him asking if it would even be an issue and how his weight was. So either way he absolutely did them a favor unless it the conversation happened AFTER the weigh ins but considering it didn't it was helpful regardless if he was at 171, 170, 169 or whatever as he would either not have to cut as much or he could rehydrate sooner.

I hope that clears things up about how it was helpful. And again he didn't have to say anything. And again I think it's WRONG that he said anything about it. Phone Post
3/30/13 10:08 AM
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Anderson's BBC in my Goku
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You think he's really going to rehydrate sooner so he can get an extra .9 lbs? How easy do u think it is to measure that? Also wouldn't it have been better to tell him before he started cutting? If he was going to tell him, he should have told him then. Phone Post 3.0
3/30/13 10:09 AM
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Standup29
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Winston Wolf - Hey Orcus being how ur hidding from this thread Ill post it here again ..Dont tell me u are going to defend that slime ball

Jonathan Tweedale, Nick Diaz's lawyer, contacted Bloody Elbow and exclusively provided very interesting text message transcripts from the evening of the weigh in, explaining "Given some of the media coverage, we need to set the record straight on the timing that the issue of the 0.9 was raised by Nick Diaz. The issue was pursued immediately. On the evening of March 15, Mike Mersch and I exchanged the following correspondence (via text message), in which he denied any knowledge of a .9 allowance or ignoring the decimal."

Mersch, again, was the man in the video who informed the camp of the "no decimal" changes.

Here is the text conversation between Tweedale (JDT) and Mersch (MM), which starts at 9:24 p.m.:

JDT: "Hi Mike. Nick is curious about the .9 pound allowance at today's weigh-in for his championship bout. He doesn't want to be a nuisance about this, but he's a bit confused. Can you shed any light?"

MM: "I don't know what you're talking about. All parties weighed in appropriately according [to] the Quebec Commission."

JDT: "Of course. You're right, and he knows that. He just wanted to know why the Quebec Commission was okay with a 0.9 pound weight allowance for a championship fight. Nick's not going to make an issue of it, but it's been gnawing at him since it was explained to him at the weigh-ins, on an "off the record" basis or otherwise. I just want him to stop thinking about it, and thought you could provide some insight."

MM: "I have been told everyone made weight so there's nothing to make an issue about. He might want to focus on how he's going to win the fight rather than spending the night making excuses about why he lost."

The correspondence continued at 9:46 p.m.:

JDT: "C'mon Mike you're just going to stonewall on this issue? We're reaching out in a discreet manner, as appropriate in the circumstances. Meet us half-way."

MM: "Huh? The Commission determined both fighters weighed 170 or less. What am I supposed to do about that? I would think Nick would be excited to compete for the UFC Welterweight title. Seems like he's focused on the wrong issue."

JDT: "No one wants you to *do* anything. If the answer is simply "the Quebec Commission permits a promoter to request that .9 pounds be rounded down in a championship fight (unlike, e.g., the Washington commission for Nate's fight), and Zuffa made that request here", then pls confirm. Far better to reach out this way than the uncooperative Twitter/media way."

MM: "How would I know what the Quebec Commission does? I was informed everyone made weight like everyone else at the weigh in. Zuffa made no requests for anything from the Quebec Commission. Good luck to Nick with the fight."

JDT: "Okay. I'll let Nick know that you can't shed any light on why Quebec treats 170.9 as 170 in a championship fight. Disappointing. Thanks for your time and your wish of luck to Nick for the fight."

MM: "Again I have no idea what you're talking about. The Quebec Commission indicated both fighters were 170 or lower."

JDT: "If you don't know then I should be asking someone else. No worries, Mike. Which UFC exec advised Nick and his entourage before the weigh-in that "If you're 170.2, you're 170. If you're 170.9, you're 170...that's a kinda off the record type of thing"?"

MM: "I would think you'd direct that to the source: the Quebec Commission. The UFC has nothing to do with weigh ins in Quebec."

Tweedale explained, "We appreciate that Mr. Mersch was in a difficult position, evidently having been instructed by the Quebec Commission to relay to Mr. Diaz some last-minute, unlawful 'rule changes' to give the hometown fighter a reprieve from his duty to make weight at 170 pounds.
Here is a thought.

Was the MM doing Nick a favor letting him know how tha QAC interprets the weigh in rules? Yes. Condider Nate didn't seem to know he didn't get 1 pound. Did the Diaz camp post this video and make it seem "shady"? Yes. Would you want anything to do with anyone from said camp afterwards and would you have an attitude dealing with them further? Exactly.

What you seem to want a response to has very little to do with Orcus stance. I don't often agree with Orcus but he's made valid points that are ignored. Every AC interprets rules in varying manners. Ca allows 6:1 TE while others 4:1. Nevada rounds 170.4 down to 170 and 170.5 to 171. Its not in their rules and regulations yet nobody seems to acknowledge this. The only readin there is an issue is a UFC employee tried to do the Diaz camp a solid and now look where we are.

Shields cleared the hand wraps. Then wanted someone else to look. Sorry but that's not how it works. You think it would be fair to have people from the other camp constantly coming in to "view" the wraps? Come on, flip the coin. Think the Diaz camp would be cool if GSP camp kept trying to view their wraps? It was mind games pure and simple. That's what all of this is. Phone Post

what favor was he doing Nick weighed 169 an already was on weight They could have told him that rule a month ago not an hour before weigh in
Also it wasn't a rule. There is no rule on how they read the decimal. Neither does the NSAC who also round down 170.4 to 170.0. They also round 170.5 to 171. This is also not in their rules. Its how theu interpret and decide to enforce the rule.

Why is nobody understanding this. It is a common practice to round decimals at weigh ins. Some go about it differently but it's the norm. I just don't think any go to the extreme that QAC does.

The only issue I have is with MM informing the Diaz camp how they interpret the decimal. And unless the GSP camp askes to know how it worked then whoever told them was wrong to do so as well. Everything else is just speculation and pointless. Phone Post
3/30/13 10:15 AM
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Standup29
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The UFC controls the show where ever they may be despite Dana proclaiming they are the most heavily regulated sport in the history of sports.

New Jersey set the course for Unified Rules:

"The rules adopted by the NJSACB have become the de facto standard set of rules for professional mixed martial arts across North America. All state, provincial, & municipal athletic commissions that regulate mixed martial arts have assimilated these rules into their existing  competition rules and statutes. For a promotion to hold mixed martial arts events in a sanctioned venue, the promotion must abide by the commission's body of rules"

What.the UFC touts on its website as being "the rules":

"In non-championship fights, there shall be allowed a 1 pound weigh allowance. In championship fights, the participants must weigh no more than that permitted for the relevant weight division"

in reality amount to a "hill of beans" because as recent as of Tuesday this week the de facto standardizer of "the rules" New Jersey informed thusly:

"In the state of New Jersey, which features another influential athletic commission, common practice includes making exact weight (or less) for championship bouts.

Nick Lembo, counsel for the New Jersey Athletic Control Board, said on Tuesday that his agency “will allow one pound over on a contract weight, unless the promoter denies such allowance. However, the caveat is that most promoters want major title fights to be dead-on weight. Thus, 170 becomes exactly 170 or less.”

In previous UFC events in the state of New Jersey, UFC officials did not request a one-pound allowance for championship bouts, added Lembo"

What that means is, if and when it suits the UFC, they can "bend the rules" and request or better "block" the standard rules i.e. in Montreal if they do stick to the stated rules, the UFC can say for this fight we "deny such allowance".

In the case of GSP vs Diaz in fear of imminent failure owing to GSP being ill and being advised to continue to retain fluids, the UFC approached the Quebec Commission and denied absolute adherence to the Unified Rules and sought application of the rounding down or the over by 1. lbs rule for non-title fights plus the additional hour to reduce the weight normally reserved for non-title fights.

This will be the reason why one sees "the rules" being inconsistantly applied across North America. The UFC has the right as the promoter to deny application of the Unified Rules as they see fit.
 

 

This is spot on. Lets see Orcus troll his way out of this. This is the main reason the UFC is avoiding this topic like the plague, because they are to blame.
What is the source for the states the UFC requested this to happen? This is news to me and if true is wrong.

When looking at the facts that are present (withstanding this if true) there is absolutely nothing wrong with the stance of Orcus and many others including myself.

As for the NJSAC they have the right to enforce their interpretation of the decimal however they wish. The NSAC rounds 170.4 to 170.0 and 170.5 to 171. These are facts. Not speculation. It is also not listed in ther rules and regulations. Phone Post
3/30/13 10:21 AM
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Standup29
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deadlyonetwo3 - People yelling and screaming, "oh you lost Diaz!" Etc etc are completely missing the point. Don't you get that a champion has apparently missed weight for a title fight (which in boxing would have you automatically stripped of your title) and was given a pound allowance on the scales!!!!!! This is a serious issue in a competitive sport where guys are shedding so much weight etc and this needs to be seriously scrutinized. These commissions can't be allowed to make up rules like this as they go. Missing weight on a title fight is serious and everyone is acting like its all about excuses! It's not! Pay attention to the ISSUE not the fighter making the petition please. Phone Post 3.0
But the issue is GSP did make weight. Because it is possi to weigh 170.9 and still technically make weight does not mean GSP in fact did weigh in at that. We don't know what he weighed in at and honestly if they were this concerned why didn't they ask to see the scale while he weighed in. Wouldn't that have been the smart thing to do? Especially if they thought he would be .9 pounds over.

Can we not admit the Diaz camp should have asked to view the scale during the weigh in or ask an unbiased person to view it or ask for the camera to record what it was for review immediately after the official weigh ins? Phone Post
3/30/13 10:25 AM
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UGCTT_ Lay'n'PrayNINJA
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Edited: 03/30/13 10:41 AM
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Not a single school or defender of what went on has been able to answer this:

If there was absolutely nothing suspect/shady going on, why did the UFC official LIE and flat out deny that he said anything at all to Diaz camp in those text messages?????

3/30/13 10:26 AM
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UGCTT_ Lay'n'PrayNINJA
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Shill* not school Phone Post

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