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4/24/13 12:39 PM
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Ingrained Media
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FrateCart - 
fruhzs - If you separate categories into "FAKE" and "INACTIVE", how come you put all under "FAKE" in a huge percentage on the big Top 5 highlight you put at the end of your article?

Doesn't seem right, if you want to list FAKE to make a big impact, not debating the criteria for fake used in your own article, you should highlight only the FAKE percentage according to what you posted on the article yourself.

Plus, Inactive can't mean the guy isn't reading stuff only. If you have tools to verify what accounts hasn't logged for X while, then one could really call those accounts inactive.



Eduardo Alonso.

http://i.imgur.com/fQrx5fo.jpg

Eduardo the graphic is at the end of the blog, the software used to determine is third party software. We are just reporting what the software gives us. There is no way that you can prove to me or any real advertiser that Demian reaches more than 59,000 of his 285,000 followers.

If you can prove it please do. I run analytics on my guys social channels I am sure you have something similar right?

The spreadsheet is free to visit by anyone. it separates them by "fake" and "inactive" and real.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjMzhkLs9H43dEYtZEFFYkRmdHRnNnNJaVAyNWZuUlE&usp=sharing
4/24/13 12:40 PM
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Matt Phillips
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There are tons of people on Twitter who buy twitter followers and I wouldnt be surprised if most of them are "fake" or otherwise uselss in general. While it might make you look like the big cheese on Twitter, your money is being wasted because you essentially market your stuff to people who wouldnt buy it anyways.

Ive always been a firm believe that 1000 quality (real) followers are better than 10k bought followers.

4/24/13 12:42 PM
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Ingrained Media
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Tat2tillidie - 
Ingrained Media - Tino- I was thinking exactly this (he needs a platform of his own) as I read your email yesterday.
How much does your service cost ? Phone Post 3.0

We are not taking on any new clients right now. I can show Tino how to do it himself. He does not need to pay me or anyone really. He has valuable content and he can convert that content.
4/24/13 12:44 PM
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Ingrained Media
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Matt Phillips - 

There are tons of people on Twitter who buy twitter followers and I wouldnt be surprised if most of them are "fake" or otherwise uselss in general. While it might make you look like the big cheese on Twitter, your money is being wasted because you essentially market your stuff to people who wouldnt buy it anyways.

Ive always been a firm believe that 1000 quality (real) followers are better than 10k bought followers.


Matt - You seem to understand the social aspect of social media. Others on the thread seem to struggle with understanding it. however it is interesting that grown men 18-49 publicly admit that they use Twitter to stalk guys who spend the majority of their careers shirtless.
4/24/13 12:44 PM
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GIBB0
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shaqitup -

how are they fake?

my twitter probably fit into that category.

Yeah, mine too for a while.

I just had about 20 celebrities that followed and read their tweets each day. Never posted. Phone Post 3.0
4/24/13 12:51 PM
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camozzi
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Internettufguy - Fake research is fake. To even call it research is a stretch. It is your OPINION that the accounts are "fake." You provide no quantifiable evidence that proves they are fake. I lurk on Twitter and follow a random group of people; does that mean my account is fake? You are just an attention whore trying to drum up interest in your business, which is obviously fake since I have never had any interaction with it. Phone Post 3.0
No you fall under "inactive" as he has said numerous times.

How is he trying to drum up business? I missed the part where he is trying to sell you anything or profit on this blog?

It's research they did and blogged about. If you disagree, it's OK. Phone Post 3.0
4/24/13 1:15 PM
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ohpossum
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I found it a very interesting article. Don't understand all of the negativity Phone Post 3.0
4/24/13 1:21 PM
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fruhzs
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Ingrained Media - 
FrateCart - 
fruhzs - If you separate categories into "FAKE" and "INACTIVE", how come you put all under "FAKE" in a huge percentage on the big Top 5 highlight you put at the end of your article?

Doesn't seem right, if you want to list FAKE to make a big impact, not debating the criteria for fake used in your own article, you should highlight only the FAKE percentage according to what you posted on the article yourself.

Plus, Inactive can't mean the guy isn't reading stuff only. If you have tools to verify what accounts hasn't logged for X while, then one could really call those accounts inactive.



Eduardo Alonso.

http://i.imgur.com/fQrx5fo.jpg

Eduardo the graphic is at the end of the blog, the software used to determine is third party software. We are just reporting what the software gives us. There is no way that you can prove to me or any real advertiser that Demian reaches more than 59,000 of his 285,000 followers.

If you can prove it please do. I run analytics on my guys social channels I am sure you have something similar right?

The spreadsheet is free to visit by anyone. it separates them by "fake" and "inactive" and real.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjMzhkLs9H43dEYtZEFFYkRmdHRnNnNJaVAyNWZuUlE&usp=sharing

Your answer doesn't change anything I said, and you know it. I'm saying one thing and you're answering another.

I'm not trying to prove you anything, and I'm not even arguing with your numbers. I'm stating a fact with the way the "Graphic" was presented in the end of the article, and it's not right nor it should be this way imo.

The "Board pic" in the end of the article Stands out and it states a full percetange of FAKE, adding Fake and Inactive as one thing but calling it FAKE. how do you think people perceive the word "Fake"?
Will you seriously try to convince anyone that the way this was put in the end has no impact on anything, as people can read the whole thing?

Think about it again. But anyone can act in the way they feel is right.

Eduardo.
4/24/13 1:30 PM
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David Mortensen
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Interesting article.  Thanks for posting.

 

That said....the 'G' in your logo looks uncannily similar to the UG's own Garv's in his logo

 

THE PLOT THICKENS

4/24/13 1:31 PM
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JuniorCallMeMaybe
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I'd like to see Mark Pavelitch's and MFC's twitter stats lol Phone Post 3.0
4/24/13 1:45 PM
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Kick Boxe
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How much did Dana pay you to shit on Roy Nelson?

4/24/13 1:57 PM
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KeyboardTherapy
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Edited: 04/24/13 1:59 PM
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Hi Jason,

Interesting article, thank you for sharing it. My only question is one that has been rolled around in the thread already, and that is how you determine the difference between fake, truly inactive, and "lurker" (i.e. content consumer) Twitter accounts.

I believe you touched on this briefly in an earlier reply (third party software?), but for my own edification and the sake of clarity can you please explain the metrics used for categorizing these account types?

Thanks!

 

P.S.- The link to the original article on mma.tv's front page feature is broken.

 

P.P.S.- As is the, "We have even blogged on the topic," link in said original article.

4/24/13 1:59 PM
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fruhzs
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I'll state my point again,

Not even trying to judge the quality of the criteria or the numbers,
But you can't have three categories: FAKE, INACTIVE, and ACTIVE,

And then put a graphic adding fake and inactive as FAKE, in big letters, just cause you want so.

And actually the graphic is right here at the top of this thread. It doesn't matter if the actual content is inside the article, this is twisting information and creating buzz and impact as you wish. In my press days, it would be what we call here in Brazil "Brown press".

You have a big word FAKE on the graphic saying that 93% of Roy Nelson followers are fake, 79% of Anderson and Demian's, 81% of JDS, etc.

This is just wrong. If there's Fake and Inactive, you shouldn't lay this like this popping on people's eyes.

If you want to use the word "FAKE", use it according to the own criteria you display on the article and whatever criteria and data the software uses.

Ethics are very personal, but what is right is right.

Anyone can have their own opinion, but I think this graphic stated this way is lame. Hope it does you good.

All the best,

Eduardo Alonso.
4/24/13 1:59 PM
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Brian J DSouza
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This is a good study, IMO. Fake twitter followers exist. Only debate is the margin for error in the study.

4/24/13 2:02 PM
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Ingrained Media
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fruhzs - 
Ingrained Media - 
FrateCart - 
fruhzs - If you separate categories into "FAKE" and "INACTIVE", how come you put all under "FAKE" in a huge percentage on the big Top 5 highlight you put at the end of your article?

Doesn't seem right, if you want to list FAKE to make a big impact, not debating the criteria for fake used in your own article, you should highlight only the FAKE percentage according to what you posted on the article yourself.

Plus, Inactive can't mean the guy isn't reading stuff only. If you have tools to verify what accounts hasn't logged for X while, then one could really call those accounts inactive.



Eduardo Alonso.

http://i.imgur.com/fQrx5fo.jpg

Eduardo the graphic is at the end of the blog, the software used to determine is third party software. We are just reporting what the software gives us. There is no way that you can prove to me or any real advertiser that Demian reaches more than 59,000 of his 285,000 followers.

If you can prove it please do. I run analytics on my guys social channels I am sure you have something similar right?

The spreadsheet is free to visit by anyone. it separates them by "fake" and "inactive" and real.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjMzhkLs9H43dEYtZEFFYkRmdHRnNnNJaVAyNWZuUlE&usp=sharing

Your answer doesn't change anything I said, and you know it. I'm saying one thing and you're answering another.

I'm not trying to prove you anything, and I'm not even arguing with your numbers. I'm stating a fact with the way the "Graphic" was presented in the end of the article, and it's not right nor it should be this way imo.

The "Board pic" in the end of the article Stands out and it states a full percetange of FAKE, adding Fake and Inactive as one thing but calling it FAKE. how do you think people perceive the word "Fake"?
Will you seriously try to convince anyone that the way this was put in the end has no impact on anything, as people can read the whole thing?

Think about it again. But anyone can act in the way they feel is right.

Eduardo.

I agree with that. The top 5 should say fake/inactive (will fix). The numbers are not mine, we did not make the determination.

As I stated previously the blog and spreadsheet do all of the explaining and the graphic is to interest you into reading those items.

The argument you could likely make is this: The Brazilian connection likely has a lot more to do with user habits then actually being fake or inactive. Most of Brazil uses their cell phone as a primary communication device. SMS is a huge form of communication based on its value. So as a culture the people of Brazil will likely not engage but could in fact be real followers or lurkers.

Again, since it needs to be made clear. We are not accusing any fighter or manager of buying follows. Aside from winning a UFC bonus there is little be gained. I am sure you are like me and have a constant struggle to remind your clients to use Twitter even witht he bonuses being offered. I will adjust the graphic.
4/24/13 2:04 PM
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Ingrained Media
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David Mortensen - 

Interesting article.  Thanks for posting.

 

That said....the 'G' in your logo looks uncannily similar to the UG's own Garv's in his logo

 

THE PLOT THICKENS


The Garv is more og then we are so we would certainly have stolen that from him. I will let the designer know to box up his desk.
4/24/13 2:06 PM
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fruhzs
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Thank you,

I appreciate it. Unfortunately, as we all know, a lot of people won't bother to read the whole thing and look at the data sheet, etc. They'll just do a quick look, and the graphic stands out. Causes impact and that's all she wrote for many.

Thanks for thinking it trough. I don't agree with the exact criteria of the software, and there are many intrinsics to it. Demian has been doing A LOT of media here in Brazil lately, for one year or so (a little more). Mainstream media, as here things changed a lot.
His twitter followers grew a lot in the meantime and we never bought users.
Actually, I think the trend of twitter usage here is slowing down, as if you compare the amount of media he has done lately the twitter followers number grew little.
His last three fights have been on Globo TV, biggest network her (Something truly like being on NBC and CBS at the same time, or even more).
I think Twitter is becoming not so hot anymore in Brazil lately, or there are less fake people being kept. Who knows.

Eduardo.
4/24/13 2:09 PM
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Ingrained Media
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Edited: 04/24/13 2:20 PM
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KeyboardTherapy - 


Hi Jason,



Interesting article, thank you for sharing it. My only question is one that has been rolled around in the thread already, and that is how you determine the difference between fake, truly inactive, and "lurker" (i.e. content consumer) Twitter accounts.



I believe you touched on this briefly in an earlier reply (third party software?), but for my own edification and the sake of clarity can you please explain the metrics used for categorizing these account types?



Thanks!



 



P.S.- The link to the original article on mma.tv's front page feature is broken.



 



P.P.S.- As is the, "We have even blogged on the topic," link in said original article.


Blog is here: http://www.ingrainedmedia.com/as-real-as-it-gets-except-on-twitter/

The spreadsheet is viewable here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjMzhkLs9H43dEYtZEFFYkRmdHRnNnNJaVAyNWZuUlE&usp=sharing

The software we used is Klout.com for the Klout scores. They are a trusted third party who measures influence and reach of social channels. We used Status People for the fake and inactive research http://fakers.statuspeople.com/

We have no affiliation with these. We learned of Staus People through Social sites we visit and learn from.
4/24/13 2:20 PM
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Ingrained Media
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crossfire - Since you admitted that there is no way for you to determine if the account is fake or inactive , all you have accomplished is to devalue the said fighters marketing status which i guess the whole point of this "article" ? Pretty shitty thing to do IMO. Phone Post 3.0

Delusional much?
4/24/13 2:26 PM
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Matt Phillips
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My klout score is 56 :(

4/24/13 2:29 PM
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Ingrained Media
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Matt,

We are 2% fake 18% inactive and 80% real according to the same system

We have 3841 followers and follow 3,539

Our Klout is at 54
4/24/13 2:29 PM
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NomoRomophobia
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People do not give Jason credit.
He is really fucking smart, and in touch.

And yes, people buy fake twitter followers. Phone Post 3.0
4/24/13 2:33 PM
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BobD
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Edited: 04/24/13 2:47 PM
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crossfire - 
Ingrained Media -
crossfire - Since you admitted that there is no way for you to determine if the account is fake or inactive , all you have accomplished is to devalue the said fighters marketing status which i guess the whole point of this "article" ? Pretty shitty thing to do IMO. Phone Post 3.0

Delusional much?
Then please enlighten me on how you separate a fake account from a inactive one ?

As many other already pointed out my account has no tweets no followers and rarely use it. Phone Post 3.0

 

From the FAQ of the software used to do the research

 

We take a sample of your follower data. Up to 1,000 records depending on how 'popular' you are and assess them against a number of simple spam criteria.

On a very basic level spam accounts tend to have few or no followers and few or no tweets. But in contrast they tend to follow a lot of other accounts.

For those of you with 50,000* followers or less we believe our tool will provide a very accurate insight into how many inactive and fake followers you have.

There are two reasons. First it's important for you to be sure when you communicate on Twitter that you are communicating with real and active followers. Because the more active your follower base the more likely they are to share your content.

The second reason is there are a growing number of Fakers out there. People who buy followers in a vain attempt to build legitimacy. "Look at me I have 20,000 followers, I must know my..." They are essentially trying to game the system and it's important for you to be able to spot them, and steer clear of them. Because ultimately if you're willing to lie about how many friends you have you are not a very trustworthy individual.

 

4/24/13 2:37 PM
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Ingrained Media
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crossfire - 
Ingrained Media -
crossfire - Since you admitted that there is no way for you to determine if the account is fake or inactive , all you have accomplished is to devalue the said fighters marketing status which i guess the whole point of this "article" ? Pretty shitty thing to do IMO. Phone Post 3.0

Delusional much?
Then please enlighten me on how you separate a fake account from a inactive one ?

As many other already pointed out my account has no tweets no followers and rarely use it. Phone Post 3.0

This is a third party software that does the measurement. We used Status People (same system used by Yahoo News) and then to add some point of reference we added in KLOUT for the top 10. Dana may have a lot of fake or inactives but he has a high Klout score and I seriously doubt you would find one endemic brand that would not pay him for a tweet.

As a company that handles brands social media and marketing/sponsorship budgets we employ a lot of tools to measure the value of the spend. I use Nielson ratings in many of my pitches. However I know that the ratings are not spot on accurate but they are the industry standard. The third party software used was not written by us. We used what others in the industry use to gauge. Our mistake would be the in the Inforgraphic not being specific that the top 5 are made up of Fake and Inactive. The #1 athlete does have 82% fake and only 11 inactive..
4/24/13 2:38 PM
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Ingrained Media
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Inforgraohic has been removed until it can be updated. it was clearly not accurate.

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