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UnderGround Forums >> Alan Belcher IMMUNE To Submissions?


4/26/13 9:43 PM
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David Bollea
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krept -  David, thanks for continuing the dialogue. I did not see the earlier post for some reason or I would have responded.

I understand the concept of affiliate marketing and I can't say it wouldn't be nice to share a cut in the sales as you mention in the earlier reply. To further the analogy, if one of the people whose videos I advocte did something bad (oversimplification for sake of brevity) then as uncomfortable as it would seem I would try to make things right and correct the wrong.

I feel that is what we have seen from those previously in Lloyds association in recent months, a couple at least. That is why I and others feel the important first step towards making amends is making a clean break. Short term, this will appear to have mostly a downside, while remaining associated or neutral may seem to be the best course $ wise but we will see how it plays out in the end. I think general rules of thumb do not apply to this due to the breadth and depth of the accusations. Phone Post

I see what you're saying and I agree that if there we're ties to sever then that's the right route for anyone who wants to polarize themselves from that ..even if they are (and not all of them are) doing it for selfish reasons.. thats the right move to sway public perception of themselves

The thing is is that I'm not a member of TLI or MMA Millionaires at all.. so there's no ties to sever

Im not in any of the Masterminds.. Nothing.

For some reason ML just like really helped me out A LOT for no reason

I've only paid to attend one of his events (Its was $197 I believe) and I own the triangle course and grappling game plan from back in like 07ish?

Besides that I've never paid him for anything.. He just helped me out.

Like he literally just helped me for no reason.

And some people will be like he was just buttering you up to get that $197 down the road.. which would have been fine by me because the stuff he taught me/introduced me to made me $10,000's of dollars easily

As far as rape culture I tend to stay away from discussing stuff I dont know anything about .. and when I was in MD I didnt see any of that.

The only stuff Ive seen is the threads on here.. and theres a lot of people staying with TLI and a lot of people leaving..

So like I said earlier Im not the guy to ask about that.. someone from those two groups would know more than me

I only speak about the effectiveness of the marketing and the experiences Ive personally had because that's all i know about

Anything else would be pure speculation on subjects Im not qualified to talk about

It's hard for me to say bad stuff when aside from stuff I've read on line from people with weird screennames the only experiences Ive had with anyone on past or present TLI have been positive ones..
4/26/13 9:49 PM
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David Bollea
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Oh and before anybody misreads or misconstrues what I wrote..

Do I like marketing and mma/bjj and getting money? Yes.

Do I like rape sexual abuse scams or anything else like that? No.

Would I leave a mastermind or a business group if I knew any of that bad stuff was going on? Yes.

But Im not in any Mastermind to stay in or leave
4/26/13 10:17 PM
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PittWrestler
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Don't you need a grey name to run this? Phone Post
4/27/13 12:08 AM
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Zapruder
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David Bollea - 
Zapruder - 
David Bollea - 
vegard - these testimonials for lloyd like crap are all the same.

who me? not me?

I'm just a regular dude talking about something I really like.

I don't have any connection.

Just think it's a great product.

(Insert name) is a great guy. (insert name) was really struggling trying to run a gym (fight) and do what he loves.

Now he can.

I DO really like it..

And I DO have a connection

They're not mutually exclusive of each other

Again that's what the FREE videos are for

So you can see if YOU really like it...

Is the video on the web for all to see? Or must you give something to see the video?

So, once again, FUCK YOU MORAN!

You don't have to do anything..

Nobodys making you

If you choose that you want to see the free videos Alan will email you the free videos

And in exchange for creating free videos and sending them to you hes going to tell you about his dvds

If at any point you want to get the free videos and not hear about the dvds you just click the unsubscribe button at the bottom of the email

Then you got your free videos and didnt have to pay anything or even hear about buying dvds from a guy who made them to sell and is trying to show potential buyers free samples...

You can literally get the free videos and unsubscribe and come on here and call me bad names and live a life of no repercussions

There's nothing to be mad about .. no one making you subscribe.. and no ones being mean to you for being very aggressive online

I'm trying to and I hope I'm doing a good job addressing your concerns despite the way you're coming at me because I'm trying to see things your way and I'm sure you feel what you're doing is valid

Hmm, do you just not know what free means? If you have honest intentions use honest methods or people will continue not to believe you
4/27/13 12:23 AM
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Zapruder
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David Bollea - Oh and before anybody misreads or misconstrues what I wrote..

Do I like marketing and mma/bjj and getting money? Yes.

Do I like rape sexual abuse scams or anything else like that? No.

Would I leave a mastermind or a business group if I knew any of that bad stuff was going on? Yes.

But Im not in any Mastermind to stay in or leave

Here is something for you to study...who knows maybe that seed will grow
4/27/13 12:30 AM
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dhughes
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Snapple - 

When I removed Lloyd out of the marketing facebook it was to share with others the scandals going on.  Lloyd wanted to keep that hidden obviously.    After I found out my friend (the girl Jordon was talking about) was victimized by Lloyd, and researched more into the other past rape scandals I couldn't support him.  Later I find out as well boht with talking with his mastermind member, and another mastermind member, and DVD producter and event speaker of his about the shady stuff going on Besides what I learned from my own experience.

I like how you spin the questions about me saying he's a bad marketer. 

 

1. He is a bad markter.  There a difference between effective marketing and bad marketing.  Effective Marketing (which he's good at) is spreading the word, creating interest in what ever you're selling. 

I am not denying Lloyd's good at that   Bad marketing because as I said when I talked with the other people.  He markets at the events that school owners need the DVD's ect... They say they will get the DVD's in a few days and make all thier money back with in that month .  Some of those school owners are broke and barrowing money, or worse using their rent money.  Fuzzy already attested to that.    It's sad to find out the DVD's weren't even made yet and time goes by they don't get them because they are rushing to get them made up.   In essesnse they were marekteing at the intent to deceive because they knew they weren't ready and they couldn't make any reasonable time to get them.   That is bad marketing as you're product doesn't match the over all hype.  That is different then effective marketing.  

 

2. You mention that I should just get another group.The point is to reach out to those connected with Lloyd and share with them the scandals that are going on in hopes they don't get victimized or support a person who is preys on others  It's sad to see some people in there who just want to avoid the rape scanals of Lloyd Irvin  and instead just want to focus on making money and to keep learning from Lloyd in that group.   One of the victims used to be in that group too and in his other one too.  Yet someone people just want to look the other way. 

3.  You said you only attended one of his events right? I thought I saw you in the picture of the Real Player Life Style event last month in a black hat and black shirt.  I guess I was worng.  The backs of every one were towards the camera so I could have gotten you confused with someone else. Or where you there?

4. Good luck on you're affiliate program but if you're going to attempt to make money off the site by getting a percentage of profits off the dvd sales of people who go through the links you post to purchase them.  You should get a business member account.


Wow. Voted up and Zapruder voted up as well for posting a Bill Hicks video.
4/27/13 12:44 AM
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BullyKiller
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No. Phone Post 3.0
4/27/13 1:02 AM
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David Bollea
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Snapple - 

I am going to edit that later and clean it up.  I wrote it fast and it is pretty bad.   Over all I hope the point was made despite my terrible writing ability


Can you proof read mine too? Thanks.
4/27/13 1:13 AM
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Zapruder
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David Bollea - 
Snapple - 

I am going to edit that later and clean it up.  I wrote it fast and it is pretty bad.   Over all I hope the point was made despite my terrible writing ability


Can you proof read mine too? Thanks.

Cant polish a turd
4/27/13 1:15 AM
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therubberbandit
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David Bollea -
Snapple - 

I am going to edit that later and clean it up.  I wrote it fast and it is pretty bad.   Over all I hope the point was made despite my terrible writing ability


Can you proof read mine too? Thanks.
We're you at the real players event or not? Phone Post 3.0
4/27/13 1:15 AM
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therubberbandit
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Were* Phone Post 3.0
4/27/13 2:15 AM
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David Bollea
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therubberbandit - 
David Bollea -
Snapple - 

I am going to edit that later and clean it up.  I wrote it fast and it is pretty bad.   Over all I hope the point was made despite my terrible writing ability


Can you proof read mine too? Thanks.
We're you at the real players event or not? Phone Post 3.0

You wouldn't believe me if I told you anyway would you?

I'm trying to be open ..transparent and reasonable here with everyone..

Even when getting called names etc.. which is fine I get that happens on the internet

There's been a lot of cool people who are openminded that have responded and I appreciate the dialogue ..

But when someone says why dont you donate to rape victims.. and I show that I posted 2 threads about the same subject..

Then in the same breath they're telling me to be a victims advocate they condemn me already doing so

It begins to get pointless..

I've got nothing good to say about the dude who took over the Facebook group so I'd rather not say anything at all..

In fact I caught myself responding to him in that group back when I was a member and deleted it almost immediately

Im not here to criticize anybody and I hope he has good intentions and I really want to believe that he feels he's doing the right thing

But some of you aren't trying to be open to the fact that maybe im not a complete dick.. which is fine.. no one here owes me anything.. but in order for there to be an exchange of ideas and openness to others view points we have to be able to accept that while we may disagree there may be at least some sort of assuming the best and giving each other the benefit of the doubt in order to move the discussion forward in a productive manner

I say I've never had a negative experience with TLI past or present and it's implied that Im defending a rapist.

I say the marketing has worked well for me and Im ridiculed for formerly being homeless living on my friends couch..

So if there's no way for me to be believed or at least heard or respected in some way then why continue a convo?

Again I appreciate those of you who are and were open to hearing me out and those of your who ask honest open questions to gain understanding instead of judgement

And to those of you who assume the worst Im sure you have good intentions and are just trying to protect yourselves and this community of ours.
4/27/13 1:06 PM
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Zapruder
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David Bollea - 
therubberbandit - 
David Bollea -
Snapple - 

I am going to edit that later and clean it up.  I wrote it fast and it is pretty bad.   Over all I hope the point was made despite my terrible writing ability


Can you proof read mine too? Thanks.
We're you at the real players event or not? Phone Post 3.0

You wouldn't believe me if I told you anyway would you?

I'm trying to be open ..transparent and reasonable here with everyone..

Even when getting called names etc.. which is fine I get that happens on the internet

There's been a lot of cool people who are openminded that have responded and I appreciate the dialogue ..

But when someone says why dont you donate to rape victims.. and I show that I posted 2 threads about the same subject..

Then in the same breath they're telling me to be a victims advocate they condemn me already doing so

It begins to get pointless..

I've got nothing good to say about the dude who took over the Facebook group so I'd rather not say anything at all..

In fact I caught myself responding to him in that group back when I was a member and deleted it almost immediately

Im not here to criticize anybody and I hope he has good intentions and I really want to believe that he feels he's doing the right thing

But some of you aren't trying to be open to the fact that maybe im not a complete dick.. which is fine.. no one here owes me anything.. but in order for there to be an exchange of ideas and openness to others view points we have to be able to accept that while we may disagree there may be at least some sort of assuming the best and giving each other the benefit of the doubt in order to move the discussion forward in a productive manner

I say I've never had a negative experience with TLI past or present and it's implied that Im defending a rapist.

I say the marketing has worked well for me and Im ridiculed for formerly being homeless living on my friends couch..

So if there's no way for me to be believed or at least heard or respected in some way then why continue a convo?

Again I appreciate those of you who are and were open to hearing me out and those of your who ask honest open questions to gain understanding instead of judgement

And to those of you who assume the worst Im sure you have good intentions and are just trying to protect yourselves and this community of ours.

So, you are saying you did in fact attend?
4/27/13 1:17 PM
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thebigblastula
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David Bollea - 
2JupitersTooMany - Does it ever occur to these guys that typing in the trademark style of Lloyd Irvin will create an association between the two in the minds of potential buyers? Do you think the MMA/grappling community isn't thoroughly aware of the controversy? Why would you encourage that association? I personally wouldn't touch a product with a loose connection to that filthy community. For all the supposedly brilliant marketing insights of the Master, it's ironic that they engage in reputation suicide that could easily be avoided. Phone Post 3.0

I've thought about that a lot actually

There's pluses and minuses to everything

Here's where Im at with it

The marketing helps a lot of people make more sales and helps a lot of customers get access to info they wouldn't have had other wise. So if a DVD I promote helps one person.. and helps a fellow martial artist make a sale to me thats a win/win

BUT there's also the counter point which is .. does this marketing turn off people who these products could potentially help?

The issue isn't if its a good product or not.. we can all see it clearly is..

The issue is with the marketing and or who introduced us to this marketing

So if 1000 people who wouldn't have heard about it do hear about it .. and 10 of them buy.. then we got a good product in the hands of 10 people who wouldn't have heard about it other wise

But lets say 3 people of that 1000 would buy the product but refuse to because of the way it was marketed or who introed us to this of marketing.. but those people would have never heard about it anyway..

So at the same time you want to tell the 10 people who want to hear about it.. you have to deal with the 3 that dont

The thing is the 3 that dont are usually the vocal minority

And while there are a few negative responses to the email frequency there's also hundreds of people who have bought already and the 1000 copies will sell out.. not to mention the tens if not hundreds of thousands of people who are enjoying the free videos and either enjoy the emails or kind of think the emails are a bit silly but over look that cuz the content is good

What it really comes down to is if you learned BJJ from a guy who was involved in a murder trial.. does that make BJJ bad?

BJJ works. It helps people. So does direct response marketing.

I'd be open to learning from anyone who has a way of getting good products in the hands of people who want them and the products will help

I've even thought about reaching out to Tom Callos since lots of people speak highly of him but honestly I don't know him like that and from what I've seen he's not selling 500 dvds in a day.. which is fine it's not for everybody..

There's two ends of the spectrum to look at it to... "OMG you guys sold 500 dvd courses in a day you guys are evil marketers ewww"

Or "Wow that's impressive Id like to learn how to share what I've learned with 500 people across the world and help spread the artform I love and make a profit while helping people avoid the mistakes Ive made"

Both are fine.. theyre just opinions.. and theres all sorts of variations in between

I guess the marketing thing is kind of like fighting.. when I decided to fight I knew that a lot of people would like me and a lot wouldn't..

As far as who introed me into all of it.. should I lie?

No. Master Lloyd introduced me to something that changed my life.

That's the truth and I figure you can't go wrong with the truth..

What else are you going to do besides be yourself be cool to people ya know?

simply put: do you still support lloyd irvin, convicted rapist and horrible man?


everyone understands that lloyd may have financially helped people out and no one cares. people care about those lloyd supporters making an official statement that they not only no longer support lloyd irvin, but at least issue a statement of condemnation for his actions.


until then, you're just a creepy weirdo guy who dickrides a rapist.
4/27/13 1:36 PM
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mikerobmma
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Penetration Skills - man, not since the days of marcos have we seen lloyd style spam emails as threads. this looks like a job for Underground News!
Haha, vote up for you, fren. Phone Post 3.0
4/27/13 1:59 PM
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Zapruder
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You just cant make this shit up!!!!!!

4/28/13 2:40 AM
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Zapruder
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Awe, Davie...Where'd ya go baller?
4/29/13 9:50 AM
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zazen br
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zazen br - Somewhere, Thunder Okami is laughing at these...

For the record I want Belcher to win but really I expect a boring point fight thanks to Bisping. Phone Post 3.0

After watching UFC 159 drunk in some karaoke in Japan, Thunder Okami is still laughing at this thread.

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