UnderGround Forums
 

UnderGround Forums >> Best Mma boxer of all time?


5/9/13 9:44 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Doc T
47 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 4/11/10
Posts: 3064
Nexuscrawlers -

i think it depends heavily on how you think of technique vs effectiveness.

the best MMA Boxer technique-wise, may not be the most effective MMA boxer.

This. Absolutely. Phone Post 3.0
5/9/13 9:46 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
DEZBOT
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 6/6/11
Posts: 838
Diaz silva jds penn Phone Post
5/9/13 11:02 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Goblowyourself
25 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/27/11
Posts: 165
Wow...I'm happy to add a decent thread to the site. I've been a member since '11 by have not started posting until recently. Thanks to all you guys for the input/debate.
Oh yeah I still say JDS Penn and Silva are all debatable with a few other names as well. Phone Post 3.0
5/9/13 11:42 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
EdTheGreat
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/14/08
Posts: 505
James Toney
5/10/13 12:11 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
JSF1984
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 4/14/11
Posts: 132
Gabe Sacchetti -
slamming -
Gabe Sacchetti - Nick Diaz is the best boxer in mma today... I am a penn fan as well but Diaz out boxed BJ when they fought Phone Post 3.0
Then why has he been dropped more times an egg in a paraplegic egg and spoon race? Phone Post 3.0
True he's been knocked down a lot but what I was saying I see everyone saying BJ is the best boxer in mma but then why was he out boxed by Diaz??? Phone Post 3.0
Did you miss round 1? Phone Post
5/10/13 2:22 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Wasa-B
286 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 44632
Doc T - 
Nexuscrawlers -

i think it depends heavily on how you think of technique vs effectiveness.

the best MMA Boxer technique-wise, may not be the most effective MMA boxer.

This. Absolutely. Phone Post 3.0

I think technique is nice but the bottom line is sport to determine best whatever is effectiveness. Even if its not clean form, it works where the cleaner form guy fails, who's "better" at said thing?

So that said, who is the most effective boxer or fighter with the most effective hands in MMA? I think we still have the same candidates.

Now, i also believe tdd counts for being an effective MMA boxer because you have to adjust your boxing to be able to box while not getting taken down - ie, the footwork, etc. JDS was great at this prior to the Cain rematch. Same with CC and Chuck as well as now Aldo. Those guys are perhaps the 3 best strikers with tdd.

I also think Anderson is underated at tdd. Chael just happens to be one of the best wrestlers in MMA and he still stuffed more td attempts than most remember (yes, Andy cheated a bit in the rematch but still was stuffing him legit too iirc.

Also, lets keep in mind that Okami has never failed to take down one of his UFC opponents except for Chael and Anderson. That has to count for something if we talk Andy's tdd. But in terms of boxing, Andy's hands are great but he also mixes it up too much perhaps to just isolate his hand effectivness alone. Much like JDS having to always be weary of Cain's tds and thus opening up Cain's striking opportunities, im sure Andy's opponents are all weary of his kicks and knees too which opens up his hands and vice versa.

I would put guys like Diaz and Frankie and BJ up there but we saw them out struck or at least nullified in standup from either counter striking or wrestling. The only time that's happened to Andy was when he was injured vs Chael (yes, i think the rematch made it absolutely clear). Its fair criticism that Andy hasnt faced that many great strikers but i couldnt see the equivalent of a Condit or Frankie doing what those guys did to Diaz and BJ to Andy.

Frankie also got outsruck by Aldo but Aldo is clearly one of the top strikers in MMA too (just not on hands alone).
5/10/13 2:23 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Wasa-B
286 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 44633
I cant see any discussions of the "boxing" between BJ and Diaz without the obvious mention of size difference.
5/10/13 2:28 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Silva vs Fedor
9 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/29/12
Posts: 53
Silva.

Footwork, range, timing, accuracy and head movement is way above anyone else in the history of MMA.
5/10/13 2:30 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Anderson P. Sonnen
680 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 6/15/12
Posts: 2902
Silva hands down.

I also think Edgar has great boxing/head movement.
Diaz has great punching accuracy and velocity.

JDS is up there. GSP as well...

All in all it's Anderson who I think is the best MMA boxer. Phone Post
5/10/13 2:49 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Wasa-B
286 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 44640
Anderson P. Sonnen -  Silva hands down.

I also think Edgar has great boxing/head movement.
Diaz has great punching accuracy and velocity.

JDS is up there. GSP as well...

All in all it's Anderson who I think is the best MMA boxer. Phone Post

Well, again, imo its hard to isolate Andy's hands imo because he's so complete but all of the others have been outstruck, nullified or in GSP's case, is aided by his td threat and simply does not engage enoug.

Anderson, save for the Chael fight in which i think he clearly proved he was injured because of the night/day difference in the rematch, has never been matched in striking (in the UFC...Chonan was quite competitive with him striking in Pride).
5/10/13 3:37 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Anderson P. Sonnen
680 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 6/15/12
Posts: 2907
Wasa-B -
Anderson P. Sonnen -  Silva hands down.

I also think Edgar has great boxing/head movement.
Diaz has great punching accuracy and velocity.

JDS is up there. GSP as well...

All in all it's Anderson who I think is the best MMA boxer. Phone Post

Well, again, imo its hard to isolate Andy's hands imo because he's so complete but all of the others have been outstruck, nullified or in GSP's case, is aided by his td threat and simply does not engage enoug.

Anderson, save for the Chael fight in which i think he clearly proved he was injured because of the night/day difference in the rematch, has never been matched in striking (in the UFC...Chonan was quite competitive with him striking in Pride).
Yes indeed, I was just mentioning the others as who has the better mma boxing under Anderson. Phone Post
5/10/13 4:07 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
3rdLion
224 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/20/11
Posts: 4819
I'd love to see a straight boxing match between Ross Pearson and BJ Phone Post 3.0
5/10/13 5:18 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
ANT_P1989
56 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/14/10
Posts: 1715
Anderson Silva.

He'd smoke Diaz, Penn, Cigano, etc. just pure Boxing.

None of them would land anything clean and when they miss, there WILL be something coming back at them. Phone Post
5/10/13 5:38 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Silva vs Fedor
9 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/29/12
Posts: 67
ANT_P1989 -  Anderson Silva.

He'd smoke Diaz, Penn, Cigano, etc. just pure Boxing.

None of them would land anything clean and when they miss, there WILL be something coming back at them. Phone Post

Agreed. It's so much a fact over opinion given what Silva's accomplished with his striking. I believe even Freddie Roach sang him praises.
5/10/13 6:03 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Diazed And Confused
70 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 10/16/12
Posts: 806
"Boxing" doesn't exist in MMA, it's just "Striking/Striking Defence"- Too many different dynamics and nuances here. Phone Post 3.0
5/10/13 7:00 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Bobby Lupo
60 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/12/05
Posts: 41812
3rdLion - I'd love to see a straight boxing match between Ross Pearson and BJ Phone Post 3.0

I like Pearson in that matchup. He gets out of the way of punches, BJ has a sick chin and unbreakable skin. 

5/10/13 7:03 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Bobby Lupo
60 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/12/05
Posts: 41813
GARRYD - 
Bobby Lupo - 

It's Anderson Silva, followed by Juanito trained Rampage, for me. He was a brilliant counter puncher, who actually kept his hands up and, ya know, defended himself, not playing the barroom brawler game.

There isn't a single MMA fighter with pro boxing experience (even my homie Sakara) that was any good at boxing. If they were, they wouldn't be fighting MMA. At best, some MMA guys beat some lesser ham and eggers in boxing matches.

There are MMA guys with nice offensive boxing (Diaz, Sakara, Pearson, Pickett, Corberry, Noons, Pulver, Penn, Daley, Gomi, Edgar, Nogs, JDS, etc.) but they get hit too much, way too much


Bobby come on mate , JDSs long range boxing is fantastic to watch ,he lands then is in an out with the best footwork i have ever seen in a cage .
JDS has to be up there .

He should be on the list. His technique is sound and he uses his boxing to control the other variables that can put a stop to a boxing-fist MMA gameplan. He should be given more credit for that alone. Like you said: his use of range is brilliant. I think the Cain rematch was a one off and JDS will KO Cain again.

5/10/13 7:29 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Chappie
84 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 3877
Jeremy Williams who only had a few mma matches definitely deserves mention (former national golden glove champion who went 168-4 as an amatuer and 44-5 as a pro). Igor V in his prime showed good boxing skills in using only punches to destroy the bulk of the mma elite who existed during his era. Personally, I still have some hope that kermit cintron come over and tries to compete
.. Phone Post
5/10/13 7:30 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
KoreanJesusLives2210
5 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/2/13
Posts: 26
john joe - nobody mentioned Brad Pickett yet? wow. Pickett's boxing is really nice.
A lot of British fighters have good boxing, but that's mainly because a lot of gyms in the UK are striking heavy because there's little emphasis on stuff like wrestling Phone Post 3.0
5/10/13 7:48 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Bobby Lupo
60 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/12/05
Posts: 41817

If Jeremy Williams qualifies as an MMA fighter, then it's him, easily.

I always wanted Shannon Briggs to cross over. He was supposedly a Liborio purple belt, great ammy, rocked Lennox, and held a piece of the HW title and would be in the shallowest division in MMA.

What can MMA offer him when he's getting $2.5M to be a Vitali punching bag? Although, there was some talk about purse stiffing going on in that one. 

5/10/13 7:55 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Lazer MMA
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 4/24/12
Posts: 7742
Wasa-B - 
Lazer MMA - 
Wasa-B - 
Lazer MMA - 
InspiritMick - Gomi

JDS

Penn Phone Post 3.0


Rewatch: Gomi X Diaz, JDS X Cain and BJ X Nick

I recall BJ beating Nick in R1 though Nick is like Mayweather and always adusts later on but it ws quite evident that size was a huge factor in that fight, just as it was vs Rory.

Gomi was a brawler, not a great boxer at all though also outsized by Diaz.

Cain, while showing holes in JDS's game, didnt beat JDS in a boxing match, he beat him with boxing and wrestling.


BJ did win RD.1 but it was more about the TD, ground play and control. Overall Diaz landed over 2X as many shots in the fight than Penn.

I named AS here as an easy pick saying again his defensive boxing putting him way on top. Looking at JDS VS Cain, he failed to circle, create any angles at all or even seek to counter. The man moved straight TF backwards. I was dumbfounded but that shit happened (to the chagrin of me and my wallet). I had praised JDS and argued that he'd keep PRIMe Fedor off him by circling and using his superior boxing with 1ers. I had to retract....

Are you saying BJ didnt outbox Nick in R1?

I think we'll need to see if JDS comes back strong and if that one fight was an anomolie or if those holes are real. I guess a rubber match with Cain would be the most telling.


I'm saying it's moot if BJ had an advantage in RD.1 or in the last minute of RD.1 as he was outboxed in that fight by Nick in whole soundly.
5/10/13 7:57 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Claude Patrick
16 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2316
just started watching connor mcgregor... the guys legit
5/10/13 8:01 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Sequoyah Sandford
64 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 5/29/11
Posts: 659
Marcus davis has a spot in here. Phone Post
5/10/13 8:27 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Onlyonemichaelbisping
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/5/11
Posts: 90
myjawhurts - Technically it's James Toney.
He was crap at mma but a world champ in boxing(and talking).
If Tyson fury has signed, then a 20-0 pro boxer is obviously the best boxer.
Marcus Davis, Chris Lytle all boxed pro so they deserve an honourable mention. Phone Post 3.0
Lol really? Tyson fury is nowhere near the boxer prime James toney was Phone Post
5/10/13 7:38 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Wasa-B
286 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 44661
Lazer MMA - 
Wasa-B - 
Lazer MMA - 
Wasa-B - 
Lazer MMA - 
InspiritMick - Gomi

JDS

Penn Phone Post 3.0


Rewatch: Gomi X Diaz, JDS X Cain and BJ X Nick

I recall BJ beating Nick in R1 though Nick is like Mayweather and always adusts later on but it ws quite evident that size was a huge factor in that fight, just as it was vs Rory.

Gomi was a brawler, not a great boxer at all though also outsized by Diaz.

Cain, while showing holes in JDS's game, didnt beat JDS in a boxing match, he beat him with boxing and wrestling.


BJ did win RD.1 but it was more about the TD, ground play and control. Overall Diaz landed over 2X as many shots in the fight than Penn.

I named AS here as an easy pick saying again his defensive boxing putting him way on top. Looking at JDS VS Cain, he failed to circle, create any angles at all or even seek to counter. The man moved straight TF backwards. I was dumbfounded but that shit happened (to the chagrin of me and my wallet). I had praised JDS and argued that he'd keep PRIMe Fedor off him by circling and using his superior boxing with 1ers. I had to retract....

Are you saying BJ didnt outbox Nick in R1?

I think we'll need to see if JDS comes back strong and if that one fight was an anomolie or if those holes are real. I guess a rubber match with Cain would be the most telling.


I'm saying it's moot if BJ had an advantage in RD.1 or in the last minute of RD.1 as he was outboxed in that fight by Nick in whole soundly.

And im saying its not because both are considered top boxers in their divisions but that they belong in different divisions so if the lighter guy outboxed the heavier guy in a round, I think that is worth mention. Would it not be if Nick outstruck/boxed Anderson in R1 of a fight between them that Anderson eventually went on to dominate but still got outboxed by the smaller Nick in R1?

Reply Post

You must log in to post a reply. Click here to login.