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UnderGround Forums >> John Cholish blasts UFC fighter pay


5/30/13 9:32 PM
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Lynchman
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Thacommish - 
Lynchman - 
Thacommish - fact is none of us know how much ufc makes in profits every year, how inflated the salaries are for dana and co, how much extra income there is to spread around to fighters. My question is, why stand in the way of people who are looking or asking for it? why try to belittle them? call them hobbyists or replaceable parts? Why not come out with financial statements that show how its just not possible as a company to remain profitable and distribute any more money to the fighters. If the money doesnt exist so be it, but if there are profits that are growing exponentially at the same time fighters salaries are not, i question that, and i applaud anyone else who does so. I dont applaud the people who try to belittle what it is these guys do though, and claim they arent even worth what they were paid when its shit pay.

I have to disagree with the statement that fighter pay is not going up.

We have gotten glimpses into the deals of the more recent high profile signings, all of them include PPV money. The bottom side is now starting at 8k and 9k, while it was only a few years ago that it was 4+4.

UFC 160 had 24 fighters. Of them, 2 had a disclosed pay of less than 10k. 5 were 10-20k. 6 were 20-30k. 4 were 40-60k. 8 made over 60k in disclosed pay. If you were to compare that to a few years ago, the breakdown would be totally different.

how can the bottom side be at 8k or 9k when cholish just got 4k/4k?

Take a look at recent starting pay, last PPV saw the bottom pay at 8k. If you look at the fighter pay for 2013...for events that saw the pay released, the lowest was for UFC 157 in which a fighter, still on his SF contract, made 6,600. Cholish signed his deal a while back.
5/30/13 10:01 PM
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CindyO
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Financials that the sports teams release for various purposes. . .many claim losing money. 

Baseball recently had an "audit" of sorts--the one that claimed 2/3rd's lost money. . .

Yeah deadspin.com showed that those financials were bullshit. Then they went and published the actual ones that showed how profitable even the last place teams really were. Phone Post

Yup.


So you're referring to financials that you know are bullshit as your example???

 

Cindy

5/30/13 10:06 PM
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CindyO
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Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.
How much should the 74th ranked lightweight with a 1-2 record in the UFC be paid per fight? Phone Post

Not a dayum thing- he shoud be cut, IMO. LOL@ fighters thinking a shot in the UFC represents Easy St. from that point forward like they've "made it" or something! It's much harder to stay on the roster than it is to make it.

 

Cindy

5/30/13 10:14 PM
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CindyO
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Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy

5/30/13 11:18 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy
5/30/13 11:20 PM
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CindyO
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HexRei - 
dubate - 
Thacommish -
dubate - 
Thacommish -
dubate - 
epwar -
MMALOGIC - "I don't know the exact numbers, but it's pretty obscene when you look at the revenue that the UFC is taking in, compared to the portion that they're giving back to the fighters. Last I checked, the fans are buying the PPV to see the guys inside the cage, not the owners sitting outside of it." John Cholish

You see this is where he becomes a retard. Besides his mother, who's paying to watch John Cholish? do you think zuffa sells 6k dollars worth of tickets and ppv buys because john cholish is on the card?

The reality is zuffa is losing money short term by paying a guy like cholish 6k because zuffa isnt selling anywhere close to 6k dollars worth of tickets or ppv buys because john cholish is on the card.

This why the country is going down. We have spawned a bunch of retards who think they are entitled to stuff... just because.

Cholish's last fight aired live on the prelims on Fuel.  That in itself brings ad revenue.

Not when you are an interchangeable part. When I work on the factory line building Honda's, only in the broadest sense am I bringing revenue to the company.
To put it another way, if you swapped him out with a different fighter from the roster would anyone outside of his immediate circle have complained? Phone Post

What exactly do the interchangeable parts at honda make per year? Also would you say the skill required to do that is less than what is required to make it to the ufc, even if you go 1-2?
As a worker you are the interchangeable part. Meaning that the job gets done regardless if it is you or someone else doing the work. Now you want them to be paid based on their skill? Does that mean a BJJ black belt should get paid more for his first fight then an average striker or a run of the mill D1 wrestler? Phone Post

How much do they make though? do you really think its as easy to find an assembly line worker as it is a professional fighter to compete in the ufc?
I think there are a lot of fighters out there that can go 1&2 in the UFC. Or more to the point not be able to beat people ranked in the top 30. The other organizations are littered with them.
A lot of people feel that once you make it into UFC you have "made it" and you are somehow better than other fighters just because of who signs your checks. I just don't feel that is the case anymore. They have a lot of people that aren't even ranked in the top 25. Cholish was no different then any other fighter in the WSOF or Bellator except that he had been given the opportunity to win and make a lot more money than those other guys. I guess what I'm saying is that I am waiting for a fighter who wins fights (he doesn't have to be a champion) and is legitimately unhappy with his money. Phone Post

I'd like to point out that of course they have fighters who aren't in the top 25. If they had a policy of not retaining any fighters not in the top 25 they could only have 25 fighters in each division at any one time, lol.

VTFU!!!

 

Cindy

5/30/13 11:28 PM
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CindyO
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Jesus Quintana - 
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy

GB promotes MMA fights? Focus please.

 

Cindy

5/30/13 11:29 PM
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dubate
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Jesus Quintana -
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy
Both of those fighters are already paid a percentage of the gross. I'm assuming that their contracts have more favorable PPV terms than Eddie Alvarez's. Both those guys would clear well over 6 million dollars if that fight happened. Phone Post
5/30/13 11:29 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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Cindy, Could you remind me again if top ranked UFC fighters are allowed to go to other promotions or arrange their own fights? Can they do things like Floyd or other top boxers do? Or are they only allowed to fight inside the UFC?

Please let me know! I am dreadfully forgetful!

Cindy
5/30/13 11:31 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy

GB promotes MMA fights? Focus please.

 

Cindy


If GSP and Anderson wanted to get their market value and sell a fight directly to consumers without the UFC and brought in Golden Boy to promote it would they be allowed to?
5/30/13 11:32 PM
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Thacommish
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CindyO - 
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Jesus Quintana -
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.
How much should the 74th ranked lightweight with a 1-2 record in the UFC be paid per fight? Phone Post

Not a dayum thing- he shoud be cut, IMO. LOL@ fighters thinking a shot in the UFC represents Easy St. from that point forward like they've "made it" or something! It's much harder to stay on the roster than it is to make it.

 

Cindy


since when is asking for a living wage representing "Easy St." or shows that he "made it" ?
5/30/13 11:32 PM
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canuck34
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Jesus Quintana -
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy

GB promotes MMA fights? Focus please.

 

Cindy


If GSP and Anderson wanted to get their market value and sell a fight directly to consumers without the UFC and brought in Golden Boy to promote it would they be allowed to?
No. But if they did they would be lucky to make $500k each. Phone Post
5/30/13 11:33 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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dubate - 
Jesus Quintana -
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy
Both of those fighters are already paid a percentage of the gross. I'm assuming that their contracts have more favorable PPV terms than Eddie Alvarez's. Both those guys would clear well over 6 million dollars if that fight happened. Phone Post

What % of the gross do they get paid? What percentage of the gross of PPVs do top boxers get paid?
5/30/13 11:37 PM
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dubate
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Jesus Quintana -
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy
Hopefully Golden Boy Prod would be a little more generous than Floyd's Money Promotions. Floyd kept 90 percent of the purse from the last fight for himself. Phone Post
5/30/13 11:45 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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Jesus Quintana -
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy
Hopefully Golden Boy Prod would be a little more generous than Floyd's Money Promotions. Floyd kept 90 percent of the purse from the last fight for himself. Phone Post

Golden Boy promoted that fight and Floyd's opponent got paid $3million dollards...which UFC fighters make that per fight?
5/30/13 11:53 PM
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dubate
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Jesus Quintana -
dubate - 
Jesus Quintana -
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy
Hopefully Golden Boy Prod would be a little more generous than Floyd's Money Promotions. Floyd kept 90 percent of the purse from the last fight for himself. Phone Post

Golden Boy promoted that fight and Floyd's opponent got paid $3million dollards...which UFC fighters make that per fight?
They co-promoted that with Money Productions. As for the fighters that make that now GSP, Jones, Silva, maybe Cain. Phone Post
5/30/13 11:57 PM
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MT11
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BTT-RyannVonDoom -
JetSetter - When you start at a firm on Wall St you start in the mail room making 25k per year while your boss is making $50 million per year.
People act like the UFC is so out of line with the rest of society but its all relative.

The reality in life is Be the best and get the best pay or change professions Phone Post 3.0

When you make it to the UFC, you've proven to be the best according to them. They state they have all the best fighters.. and yet the monicker of U FIGHT CHEAP is stated by many behind the scenes. 

You fat nerds have no clue. What is the difference between 2k at the Atlantic City show or 4k in the UFC. Either way you make no $ when all is said and done. Makes no sense for guys to pursue long term careers if you have education or another skill set. Phone Post 3.0
5/31/13 12:08 AM
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CindyO
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Jesus Quintana - Cindy, Could you remind me again if top ranked UFC fighters are allowed to go to other promotions or arrange their own fights? Can they do things like Floyd or other top boxers do? Or are they only allowed to fight inside the UFC?

Please let me know! I am dreadfully forgetful!

Cindy

They cannot do that because unlike Floyd and other top boxers, they signed a multi-fight contract with an MMA promoter who has a different business model than the sport of boxing. Top UFC fighters choose to be exclusive to the UFC and are the envy of combat athletes worldwide:)

 

Cindy

5/31/13 12:11 AM
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Jesus Quintana
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dubate - 
Jesus Quintana -
dubate - 
Jesus Quintana -
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy
Hopefully Golden Boy Prod would be a little more generous than Floyd's Money Promotions. Floyd kept 90 percent of the purse from the last fight for himself. Phone Post

Golden Boy promoted that fight and Floyd's opponent got paid $3million dollards...which UFC fighters make that per fight?
They co-promoted that with Money Productions. As for the fighters that make that now GSP, Jones, Silva, maybe Cain. Phone Post

Not really sure what your point was/is. My point is that GSP fighting Anderson on PPV would pay both fighters more than they currently get paid. They currently get paid about what Robert Guerrero got paid to fight Floyd when their market value is definitely above that.
5/31/13 12:13 AM
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Jesus Quintana
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CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - Cindy, Could you remind me again if top ranked UFC fighters are allowed to go to other promotions or arrange their own fights? Can they do things like Floyd or other top boxers do? Or are they only allowed to fight inside the UFC?

Please let me know! I am dreadfully forgetful!

Cindy

They cannot do that because unlike Floyd and other top boxers, they signed a multi-fight contract with an MMA promoter who has a different business model than the sport of boxing. Top UFC fighters choose to be exclusive to the UFC and are the envy of combat athletes worldwide:)

 

Cindy


Yes, their business model involves not letting fighters get paid their market value. If fighters couldn't get paid more by leaving the UFC the UFC wouldn't need to lock them into contracts that don't allow them to fight elsewhere.

cindy
5/31/13 12:39 AM
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dubate
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dubate - 
Jesus Quintana -
dubate - 
Jesus Quintana -
CindyO - 
Jesus Quintana - 
Jei -  The economic knowledge of the UG is hilarious. Phone Post

This thread isn't about economics it's about morals. You can operate a business and still do it in a moral manner and compensate your employees fairly. Tons of companies choose to do this. The UFC refuses to, so it is up to fighters to bargain collectively to get what they deserve.

Hey guys, this fellow is on to something! That's not fair! They should go elsewhere and get paid what they're worth! Which fighters are we talking about, where should they go and how much will they be paid by the other promotion?

 

Cindy


GSP should fight Anderson Silva on PPV in a fight promoted by Golden Boy and should be paid a % of the gross.

Cindy
Hopefully Golden Boy Prod would be a little more generous than Floyd's Money Promotions. Floyd kept 90 percent of the purse from the last fight for himself. Phone Post

Golden Boy promoted that fight and Floyd's opponent got paid $3million dollards...which UFC fighters make that per fight?
They co-promoted that with Money Productions. As for the fighters that make that now GSP, Jones, Silva, maybe Cain. Phone Post

Not really sure what your point was/is. My point is that GSP fighting Anderson on PPV would pay both fighters more than they currently get paid. They currently get paid about what Robert Guerrero got paid to fight Floyd when their market value is definitely above that.
Silva just re signed his contract with UFC at the end of April. Why would you assume he's getting anything less than market value now? Phone Post
5/31/13 3:33 AM
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Macedawgg
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Financials that the sports teams release for various purposes. . .many claim losing money. 

Baseball recently had an "audit" of sorts--the one that claimed 2/3rd's lost money. . .

Yeah deadspin.com showed that those financials were bullshit. Then they went and published the actual ones that showed how profitable even the last place teams really were. Phone Post

Yup.


So you're referring to financials that you know are bullshit as your example???

 

Cindy


I'm referring to the financials the owners themselves present as official. 

Aside from that--do you think the Dodgers owners make more than $300 million in cash per year?  I don't.

Do you think they make more than $30 million cash?  Maybe. . . and that would put them on par with the top paid individual players--let alone the entire team.

5/31/13 3:34 AM
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Macedawgg
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Jesus Quintana - Cindy, Could you remind me again if top ranked UFC fighters are allowed to go to other promotions or arrange their own fights? Can they do things like Floyd or other top boxers do? Or are they only allowed to fight inside the UFC?

Please let me know! I am dreadfully forgetful!

Cindy

They cannot do that because unlike Floyd and other top boxers, they signed a multi-fight contract with an MMA promoter who has a different business model than the sport of boxing. Top UFC fighters choose to be exclusive to the UFC and are the envy of combat athletes worldwide:)

 

Cindy


LOL!

Comedy. 

Also, the average UFC fighter (exclusive) fights 1.67 times per year--not 3 times, not 2 times, 1.67 times per year. 

 

Source?  Lorenzo Fertitta, ESPN Outside the Lines.

5/31/13 4:52 AM
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CindyO
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Jesus Quintana - Cindy, Could you remind me again if top ranked UFC fighters are allowed to go to other promotions or arrange their own fights? Can they do things like Floyd or other top boxers do? Or are they only allowed to fight inside the UFC?

Please let me know! I am dreadfully forgetful!

Cindy

They cannot do that because unlike Floyd and other top boxers, they signed a multi-fight contract with an MMA promoter who has a different business model than the sport of boxing. Top UFC fighters choose to be exclusive to the UFC and are the envy of combat athletes worldwide:)

 

Cindy


LOL!

Comedy. 

Also, the average UFC fighter (exclusive) fights 1.67 times per year--not 3 times, not 2 times, 1.67 times per year. 

 

Source?  Lorenzo Fertitta, ESPN Outside the Lines.


I Googled your article and found it but when I hit edit-find (1.67) it came back as phrase not found. Is it in another article?

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/page/UFCpay/ufc-fighters-say-low-pay-most-painful-hit-all

 

Cindy

5/31/13 4:56 AM
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CindyO
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Financials that the sports teams release for various purposes. . .many claim losing money. 

Baseball recently had an "audit" of sorts--the one that claimed 2/3rd's lost money. . .

Yeah deadspin.com showed that those financials were bullshit. Then they went and published the actual ones that showed how profitable even the last place teams really were. Phone Post

Yup.


So you're referring to financials that you know are bullshit as your example???

 

Cindy


I'm referring to the financials the owners themselves present as official. 

Aside from that--do you think the Dodgers owners make more than $300 million in cash per year?  I don't.

Do you think they make more than $30 million cash?  Maybe. . . and that would put them on par with the top paid individual players--let alone the entire team.


So you're point wasn't that if those teams can pay mmmmillions and they're losing money then how come the UFC doesn't pay their fighters mmmmmore since they seems to me mmmaking mmmmoney? If not then I misunderstood and please accept my apologies... and what exactly was your point then?

 

Cindy


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