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5/31/13 8:31 PM
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gord96
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Saint Stevo -
gord96 - 
Saint Stevo - 
gord96 - 
Saint Stevo - 
JitsuGuy - What would a world without God look like?


Thanks.

Don't get me wrong. Your question is not a bad question. It's a good question. I just don't believe in the term atheist.

In atheist is in atheist until he's on his death bed.

I have a question. We understand how a car fires up. A person is the source that puts the Gasoline in the car. Without it. The car sits.

What puts the very breath in your lungs to breathe in and out for no reason?

We can understand a human being has to add gasoline to a car but what adds the breathe to your body?

The divine spark in all humans adds the breathe.

Scripture please. Show me the divine spark in scripture

What will scripture prove? I always like how the Kalama Sutta spoke about scripture.

'Do not go upon what has been acquired by repeated hearing; nor upon tradition; nor upon rumor; nor upon what is in a scripture; but when you yourselves know: 'These things are good; these things are not blamable; these things are praised by the wise; undertaken and observed, these things lead to benefit and happiness,' enter on and abide in them.'

2Timothy 3:16

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That letter was written before the Bible was even really an idea. So what scripture is it referring to? Just the Old Testament? Gnostic texts too? It can't just mean what's in the bible. Phone Post 3.0
5/31/13 8:48 PM
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Saint Stevo
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When you die. Your lungs stop. So no. The lungs do not put the breath (air) in on it's own. Again, an engine on a car does not fire on it's own. Someone starts it.

Now onto you being an atheist. You mean to tell me you've been trolling all this time. You've debated with me comparing scripture about who Jesus is with the bible and now you say it's not true. I'm sorry but that's plain stupid.

5/31/13 9:16 PM
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Kung Fu Joe
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Saint Stevo - When you die. Your lungs stop. So no. The lungs do not put the breath (air) in on it's own. Again, an engine on a car does not fire on it's own. Someone starts it.

Now onto you being an atheist. You mean to tell me you've been trolling all this time. You've debated with me comparing scripture about who Jesus is with the bible and now you say it's not true. I'm sorry but that's plain stupid.

I was debating theology. One doesn't need to believe a particular theology in order to understand it.

I've never encountered Oneness Pentecostals before, so I took to defending orthodox Trinity doctrine. Now I have a better understanding of the Oneness perspective.

I wasn't trolling. I've been honest about my beliefs whenever asked. I even posted about my atheism recently in the "What would convince you God exists?" thread.

Believe it or not, despite my atheism, I love the Bible and I thoroughly enjoy discussing theology. I also correct other atheists when they make false claims about the Bible. Phone Post
6/1/13 8:46 AM
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Saint Stevo
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Aww. Theology. Study of a belief in a deity. I have no problem with you studying theology. Excuse me for jumping to conclusion in our other debates that you believed in Jesus.

Here lies the problem. You're an atheist. An atheist believes there is no deity at all. The problem with what you do is argue with me on topics on who Jesus is. You've stated the words that Jesus is the authority of "God". You're speaking God into existences. All religious theology is a belief in God but you're an atheist. Therefore you cannot speak God into existence in your conversation. Now. If you don't claim to a certain god. This would make more sense in your discussion. If you believe there is a deity. Then this gives you full right to speak god into existence.

As an atheist. You have 2 options. State there is no god or don't even talk about god at all. This is a true atheist when done.

You have full right to do what you want. What I'm pointing out is if you want to be relevant in matters discussing god. Then state that you're not an atheist. An atheist cannot acknowledge God.
6/1/13 10:28 AM
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Kung Fu Joe
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Saint Stevo - Aww. Theology. Study of a belief in a deity. I have no problem with you studying theology. Excuse me for jumping to conclusion in our other debates that you believed in Jesus.

Here lies the problem. You're an atheist. An atheist believes there is no deity at all. The problem with what you do is argue with me on topics on who Jesus is. You've stated the words that Jesus is the authority of "God". You're speaking God into existences. All religious theology is a belief in God but you're an atheist. Therefore you cannot speak God into existence in your conversation. Now. If you don't claim to a certain god. This would make more sense in your discussion. If you believe there is a deity. Then this gives you full right to speak god into existence.

As an atheist. You have 2 options. State there is no god or don't even talk about god at all. This is a true atheist when done.

You have full right to do what you want. What I'm pointing out is if you want to be relevant in matters discussing god. Then state that you're not an atheist. An atheist cannot acknowledge God.

In our discussion about the Trinity, I was very careful to keep my argumentation to being about Paul's views on Jesus and "the name," not my own. Paul believed in God, and had definite and deliberate intentions in the words he wrote. I was only discussing what he, himself, believed; I tried to not bring in my own understanding of the cosmos.

I, personally, do not believe in the existence of any sort of deity. But that does nothing to affect Paul's understanding of theology when he wrote his letters.
6/1/13 10:28 AM
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gord96
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Why do you put weird limitations on what he can do and say while being an atheist? If he wants to discuss God and be an atheist then he can. I know several atheists who like to discuss God and theology.

He's not acknowledging God either. He is discussing the idea of God and the Bible. We can discuss Greek mythology without believing in Zeus and Ares right? He is doing the same thing.
6/1/13 11:05 AM
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Kung Fu Joe
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gord96 - Why do you put weird limitations on what he can do and say while being an atheist? If he wants to discuss God and be an atheist then he can. I know several atheists who like to discuss God and theology.

He's not acknowledging God either. He is discussing the idea of God and the Bible. We can discuss Greek mythology without believing in Zeus and Ares right? He is doing the same thing.

Gord, he actually had a legitimate concern. I was discussing some finer points of Trinity doctrine in another thread in which we had been conversing, and it could have very easily been misunderstood as my voicing my own opinions on the matter, rather than my attempting to voice Paul's. And if I were voicing my own opinions on how Jesus' divinity should be understood, I would necessarily be asserting that Jesus was divine.

It was an innocent and honest question on his part.
6/1/13 11:16 AM
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Saint Stevo
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Kung Fu Joe - 
Saint Stevo - Aww. Theology. Study of a belief in a deity. I have no problem with you studying theology. Excuse me for jumping to conclusion in our other debates that you believed in Jesus.

Here lies the problem. You're an atheist. An atheist believes there is no deity at all. The problem with what you do is argue with me on topics on who Jesus is. You've stated the words that Jesus is the authority of "God". You're speaking God into existences. All religious theology is a belief in God but you're an atheist. Therefore you cannot speak God into existence in your conversation. Now. If you don't claim to a certain god. This would make more sense in your discussion. If you believe there is a deity. Then this gives you full right to speak god into existence.

As an atheist. You have 2 options. State there is no god or don't even talk about god at all. This is a true atheist when done.

You have full right to do what you want. What I'm pointing out is if you want to be relevant in matters discussing god. Then state that you're not an atheist. An atheist cannot acknowledge God.

In our discussion about the Trinity, I was very careful to keep my argumentation to being about Paul's views on Jesus and "the name," not my own. Paul believed in God, and had definite and deliberate intentions in the words he wrote. I was only discussing what he, himself, believed; I tried to not bring in my own understanding of the cosmos.

I, personally, do not believe in the existence of any sort of deity. But that does nothing to affect Paul's understanding of theology when he wrote his letters.

I believe that's fair to state. Sorry if I misreprented your part. I'd just assumed by the way you wrote that you was Christian
6/1/13 12:13 PM
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gord96
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Kung Fu Joe - 
gord96 - Why do you put weird limitations on what he can do and say while being an atheist? If he wants to discuss God and be an atheist then he can. I know several atheists who like to discuss God and theology.

He's not acknowledging God either. He is discussing the idea of God and the Bible. We can discuss Greek mythology without believing in Zeus and Ares right? He is doing the same thing.

Gord, he actually had a legitimate concern. I was discussing some finer points of Trinity doctrine in another thread in which we had been conversing, and it could have very easily been misunderstood as my voicing my own opinions on the matter, rather than my attempting to voice Paul's. And if I were voicing my own opinions on how Jesus' divinity should be understood, I would necessarily be asserting that Jesus was divine.

It was an innocent and honest question on his part.

Apologies. I didn't see the other thread.

Sorry Stephen. :)
6/1/13 7:40 PM
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Saint Stevo
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gord96 - 
Kung Fu Joe - 
gord96 - Why do you put weird limitations on what he can do and say while being an atheist? If he wants to discuss God and be an atheist then he can. I know several atheists who like to discuss God and theology.

He's not acknowledging God either. He is discussing the idea of God and the Bible. We can discuss Greek mythology without believing in Zeus and Ares right? He is doing the same thing.

Gord, he actually had a legitimate concern. I was discussing some finer points of Trinity doctrine in another thread in which we had been conversing, and it could have very easily been misunderstood as my voicing my own opinions on the matter, rather than my attempting to voice Paul's. And if I were voicing my own opinions on how Jesus' divinity should be understood, I would necessarily be asserting that Jesus was divine.

It was an innocent and honest question on his part.

Apologies. I didn't see the other thread.

Sorry Stephen. :)

No biggie Gord. God bless
6/2/13 9:38 AM
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zealot66
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JitsuGuy - 
770mdm - Ha, I get it - Your an atheist looking to pick on Christians for some reason. Why just Christians? Phone Post 3.0

I'm a recent deconvert from Christianity after being a believer for nearly 3 decades, like Seth Andrews (The Thinking Atheist) and many more who are found on www.ex-christian.net.

It's just a subject I'm interested in. Nothing more. I just like to engage in conversation on the matter. Not because I'm a believer or want to be a believer but because it's a discussion that I love having. Not much more, really.

Jitsguy, I Totally get it. I have felt this way for years on this board. Im a bit more Agnostic than an non believer though.

6/3/13 9:29 AM
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JitsuGuy
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Saint Stevo - 
Kung Fu Joe - 
Saint Stevo -
JitsuGuy - What would a world without God look like?


Thanks.

Don't get me wrong. Your question is not a bad question. It's a good question. I just don't believe in the term atheist.

In atheist is in atheist until he's on his death bed.

I have a question. We understand how a car fires up. A person is the source that puts the Gasoline in the car. Without it. The car sits.

What puts the very breath in your lungs to breathe in and out for no reason?

We can understand a human being has to add gasoline to a car but what adds the breathe to your body?
You realize, of course, that your statement is unfalsifiable, and therefore absurd, right?

A Muslim could just as easily say, "There's no such thing as a Christian. They're only Christian until they are on their death bed and realize the truth of Allah."

An Asatruar could say, "There's no such thing as a monotheist. They're only monotheist until they are on their death bed waiting for the Valkyr to steal them from Hela and deliver them to Odin."

Et cetera.

As for the question about breathing, that would be caused by expanding and contracting lungs. Phone Post

I wouldn't mind if he said Allah. The statement was a entity period. A God. I didn't state it had to be the bible.

As for your explanation. You've just explained breathing. I said what adds the breath to your body. Lungs do the work. Just like an engine does the work of firing gasoline. What adds the breath of air to your body?

My statement of what I believe bout a atheist is because I believe in scripture

Psalm 14:1
The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.

Which is it with you KFJ? Are you a fool with atheist or do you despise me so much that you're willing to go against God just to prove me wrong?


If you want to defend atheist then this makes you foolish according to the bible, correct?



Ahh, there's that compassionate god of yours calling people fools because they don't believe something. How precious.

Go call anyone a fool that disagrees with you. See how far that gets you on your mission to help them believe.

It should also be noted that belief is involuntary. It's not like I can tell you all about smurfs today and tomorrow you believe in them. Because you tomorrow you'll still know - based on your life's experiences that smurfs are bullshit.

"The fool hath said in his heart, there is no smurf."

So fuck you, you fool.
6/3/13 9:32 AM
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JitsuGuy
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Saint Stevo - 
JitsuGuy - 
Saint Stevo - 
JitsuGuy - What would a world without God look like?


Thanks.

Don't get me wrong. Your question is not a bad question. It's a good question. I just don't believe in the term atheist.

In atheist is in atheist until he's on his death bed.

I have a question. We understand how a car fires up. A person is the source that puts the Gasoline in the car. Without it. The car sits.

What puts the very breath in your lungs to breathe in and out for no reason?

We can understand a human being has to add gasoline to a car but what adds the breathe to your body?

You're going to have to do a lot better than that...

Atheists. Many exist because the biblical god is such a bad one. Out of spite, in a sense... If that's the best we got, then send me to hell. That mother fucker straight up sucks.

The problem with your statement of calling yourself an atheist is you're acknowledging he exist by saying he's bad and the curse word sucks toward the God that put the breath in you.

Now you acknowledge there's a God. You're not an atheist. You just hate the God that spoke you into existence.

My question is to you. When you did use to follow him. Did you receive the Holy Ghost when you believed?

Don't play that game with me. Talking about a make-believe personality such as the Joker from the Dark Knight makes them no more real than those smurfs I just mentioned in my previous post.

And to get to the crux of your question. I was just as Christian as every other devoted believer. I believed it all, lived it, sacrificed for it and gave for it.
6/3/13 9:36 AM
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JitsuGuy
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BTW Saint Stevo, you might gain a little more insight into where I'm coming from from one of the biggest threads on the Holy Ground I started just over a year ago.

http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/mma.cfm?go=forum_framed.posts&forum=71&thread=1957941&page=1&pc=201
6/18/13 8:34 PM
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mongrel 911
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JitsuGuy - What would a world without God look like?


Thanks.

What the world looks like right now. Happiness and love mixed with parts of disease and death. We live in a natural world. No Gods or unicorns.
6/19/14 1:27 PM
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DBmma
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It wouldnt exist because it would never have been created. God is the creator and source of everything, not an old bearded man who lives in the sky and keeps himself occupied by helping people out with trivial matters.

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