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UnderGround Forums >> All about leglocks.


6/7/13 12:42 PM
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Alex Bruner
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Share some of the best techniques, fighters who use them(specialists), and what the current MMA META is regarding taking the risk of slapping these bad boys on. 

I get a little excited every time I see someone go for one because they can be a complete game changer, OR they can cost the attacking fighter the match due to giving up position, 

 

Who are your favorite fighters that love these subs?

What are your thoughts surrounding the risk reward on them?

 

6/7/13 12:46 PM
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RearNakedToke
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I love leg locks but I won't do them in training unless its agreed upon beforehand. I have gotten my meniscus ripped apart by someone thinking they were Imanari.

I got my ass completely handed to me by David Marshall the other night. He just went off on me and landed leglocks from everywhere on me. It was great because he showed me what he was doing earlier and opened my eyes to a few details he uses.

Scott Adams from the WEC was a leglock beast IIRC.

Is Limp really "King of Leglocks"??? Phone Post 3.0
6/7/13 12:47 PM
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RearNakedToke
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Specialists I know are - Masakazu Imanari, Satoru Kitaoka, Aoki, Palhares and Dean Lister Phone Post 3.0
6/7/13 12:49 PM
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RearNakedToke
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Lots of amazing Sambo guys too, but I don't really know names. Phone Post 3.0
6/7/13 12:51 PM
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Alex Bruner
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RearNakedToke - Specialists I know are - Masakazu Imanari, Satoru Kitaoka, Aoki, Palhares and Dean Lister Phone Post 3.0

Great list thanks!

 

Youtube here I go.

6/7/13 12:52 PM
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MoustacheRider69
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In Phone Post
6/7/13 12:57 PM
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OneGloveJimmerson
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If ya want to include calf cranks and slicers, look up some of Mir's talks and check out OSP's one from the turtle position in his XFC days
6/7/13 12:59 PM
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Alex Bruner
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OneGloveJimmerson - If ya want to include calf cranks and slicers, look up some of Mir's talks and check out OSP's one from the turtle position in his XFC days

Will do, and Ill repost them. 

 

Thanks for the tips,Im learning this stuff as I watch, fascinating seemingky high risk stuff, but soo cool. 

6/7/13 1:03 PM
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Domingo
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The main ones you have to be careful of in training are twisting locks. The straight ones tend to be relatively safe unless someone is literally trying to pry your foot off with all of their might.

One variation I always used to use that I rarely see anyone in MMA try is to actually drive forward instead of sitting backward. If the guy on top actually starts to roll overtop of the bottom man, it's very disorienting and tough to stop before the hold is solidly locked in.

I used to just hop forward and try to go belly-down while folding the bottom guy.
6/7/13 1:06 PM
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YVES JOCKSTRAP
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Edited: 06/07/13 1:13 PM
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Great thread!

I am not in the same league as Aoki, Imanari, Palhares or Lister, but would love to contribute. I have won 2 of my 3 pro fights with leglocks in the first round, one by an Imanari diving toehold and one by a heelhook from the bottom after my opponent took me down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcP6xy6vb9Y

Above link is to footage of second fight.

In my opinion, leglocks have to be approached with a sense of urgency, especially in MMA. Palhares and Imanari are the best examples of this principle being used to near perfection. Their opponents are safe one second, screaming in pain the next. When you see a fighter telegraph a leglock attempt, the opponent is able to defend and usually land some heavy ground and pound to deter you from going for that move again.

When going for a leglock in MMA you have to realize both of your hands are attacking, your ability to protect against blows to the face is almost non existent, hence the sense of urgency.

A difference between going for leglocks in grappling and going for them in MMA is that in MMA it is VERY important to extend your hips and get your opponent as far away as possible from you as to nullify their attacks and ability to escape.
6/7/13 1:11 PM
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YVES JOCKSTRAP
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Also, I read something really cool once, it was a blogger writing about the Japanese MMA fan's admiration of leglocks. Since leglocks are all offense, zero defense, you are risking it all for the chance of a sudden victory or finish. There is something thrilling about a guy rolling for a kneebar or diving for a footlock, it is different than seing a Minotauro set up a triangle. I don't know what it is, can't quite put my finger on it, but there is something about leglocks that makes them exciting imo. Remember Joe Lauzon's minute attempt on Jim Miller?

BUSHIDO! haha
6/7/13 1:12 PM
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Alex Bruner
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YVES JOCKSTRAP - Great thread!

I am not in the same league as Aoki, Imanari, Palhares or Lister, but would love to contribute. I have won 2 of my 3 pro fights with leglocks in the foirst round, one by an Imanari diving toehold and one by a heelhook from the bottom after my opponent took me down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcP6xy6vb9Y

Above link is to footage of second fight.

In my opinion, leglocks have to be approached with a sense of urgency, especially in MMA. Palhares and Imanari are the best examples of this principle being used to near perfection. Their opponents are safe one second, screaming in pain the next. When you see a fighter telegraph a leglock attempt, the opponent is able to defend and usually land some heavy ground and pound to deter you from going for that move again.

When going for a leglock in MMA you have to realize both of your hands are attacking, your ability to protect against blows to the face is almost non existent, hence the sense of urgency.

A difference between going for leglocks in grappling and going for them in MMA is that in MMA it is VERY important to extend your hips and get your opponent as far away as possible from you as to nullify their attacks and ability to escape.

Here is the video for Yves

 

 

6/7/13 1:16 PM
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RearNakedToke
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YVES JOCKSTRAP - Also, I read something really cool once, it was a blogger writing about the Japanese MMA fan's admiration of leglocks. Since leglocks are all offense, zero defense, you are risking it all for the chance of a sudden victory or finish. There is something thrilling about a guy rolling for a kneebar or diving for a footlock, it is different than seing a Minotauro set up a triangle. I don't know what it is, can't quite put my finger on it, but there is something about leglocks that makes them exciting imo. Remember Joe Lauzon's minute attempt on Jim Miller?

BUSHIDO! haha
I hear ya. Diving for a leglock is a ballsy move all the time, and can look really bad when you fail and get your back taken or leglocked yourself. (See:Carina Damm vs Tara LaRosa). But when you go for it and land that crazy kneebar or heelhook its a the feeling ever. Especially when you switch from one attack to another as they defend. Phone Post 3.0
6/7/13 1:23 PM
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Alex Bruner
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6/7/13 1:32 PM
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Domingo
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I was always drawn to them after growing up with professional wrestling.

Moves like the figure four, Indian deathlock, and the various Boston crab variations were huge dramatic moments. In MMA, that carries over. They're very sudden, dramatic, and damaging/painful.

There's something more compelling about a very sudden submission where someone's face is twisted in agony vs. someone calmly tapping out to a hold that was being set-up for 45 seconds.
6/7/13 1:39 PM
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USMC Blackhearts
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I feel that alot of fighters just don't know how to apply leglocks in a way that prevents their opponent's from doing very basic defenses/ escapes/ counters to them.  Because of that many of them won't even go for them for fear of losing position.  There is a big difference between how the best leglockers in the world apply their techniques and how the average pro NHBer does.

Of course Imanari is exciting to watch.  I wish we saw more guys go for them.

Some of the best leglock instructors are Gokor and Erik Paulson, imho.

 

Vincent Fields

6/7/13 1:39 PM
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Alex Bruner
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Domingo - I was always drawn to them after growing up with professional wrestling.

Moves like the figure four, Indian deathlock, and the various Boston crab variations were huge dramatic moments. In MMA, that carries over. They're very sudden, dramatic, and damaging/painful.

There's something more compelling about a very sudden submission where someone's face is twisted in agony vs. someone calmly tapping out to a hold that was being set-up for 45 seconds.

This, hahahaha, I remember trying the sharpshooter on friends when I was like 7.

6/7/13 1:40 PM
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Alex Bruner
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Ramy Daoud, 

 

What was that fight we watched where the guy you trained with fought out of a pretty serious leglock attempt a few months back? 

 

I think it was a bellator fight.

 

Was pretty epci, looked like he was caught but fought out?

6/7/13 1:44 PM
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Ramy Daoud
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Alex,

Are you talking about Will Brooks VS Satoru Kitaoka in DREAM?

Will Brooks used to train with me at Midwest Training Center, I was pleasantly surprised to see how well he was able to escape Kitaoka's submission attempts, although his cornerman told me after the bout Brooks was in pain and limping from the attempts.

Domingo-

Very well said! Great post.
6/7/13 1:48 PM
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Alex Bruner
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Ramy Daoud - Alex,

Are you talking about Will Brooks VS Satoru Kitaoka in DREAM?

Will Brooks used to train with me at Midwest Training Center, I was pleasantly surprised to see how well he was able to escape Kitaoka's submission attempts, although his cornerman told me after the bout Brooks was in pain and limping from the attempts.

Domingo-

Very well said! Great post.

Yes thanks, I remember thinking he was caught, but watching that epic battle where he landed tons of nasty shots to Kitaokas head and face. Was a cool sequence, almost like watching a person fight off a giant contstrictor lol.

6/7/13 2:33 PM
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RearNakedToke
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Hanai Takefumi is another leglock savant Phone Post 3.0
6/7/13 3:16 PM
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MrMead
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Robert Ferguson : )
6/7/13 4:23 PM
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Bull_in_chinashop
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USMC Blackhearts - 

I feel that alot of fighters just don't know how to apply leglocks in a way that prevents their opponent's from doing very basic defenses/ escapes/ counters to them.  Because of that many of them won't even go for them for fear of losing position.  There is a big difference between how the best leglockers in the world apply their techniques and how the average pro NHBer does.

Of course Imanari is exciting to watch.  I wish we saw more guys go for them.

Some of the best leglock instructors are Gokor and Erik Paulson, imho.

 

Vincent Fields


You're no slouch yourself Vince.

6/7/13 5:42 PM
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e. kaye
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Kopylov's rolling knee bar was a thing of beauty.

 

And USMC is correct.  Most guys feel like they are giving up control or a superior position if the go for a leg lock.   That is from insecurity about finishing them.

6/7/13 8:13 PM
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nogidavid
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8NhBZkpu60&feature=youtube_gdata_player


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