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6/19/13 3:31 PM
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knuckleballs
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Mezger vs a tired Kimo or Remco would have been interesting.

He never had the best Cardio, but i think that he would have had better cardio than the rest of the guys in this. Oh, and skill, too.
6/19/13 4:33 PM
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CharlesLewis
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LOL, I am no fan of Smith to be sure... partially because he gets way overhyped for a guy who crushed smaller cans and quit in every hard fight he ever had, partially because of the rape charge, and partially because I think the guy was just a d-bag. 

 

It's a pet peeve.

6/19/13 4:41 PM
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indianrob
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ill say Guy Mezger, dude was solid.
6/19/13 6:37 PM
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MrColdCock
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UGCTT_zackthewop - Since mezger fought at UFC 4 why not just sub him in for one of the other fighters that were in the tournament. Phone Post 3.0
Mezger's running away with this. He wasn't a MMA fighter at the time. I don't see him any different then the rest of the field. Traditional martial artist who was hard as fuck.

The fact that he would go on to become a solid fighter should be countered by the fact that he was the only rookie in the field. IMO.

I don't think there was another guy in UFC 4 (aside from Severn) who would be competitive with these guys. Melton Bowan? Joe Son? Although Macias vs Weit could have been cool. Phone Post
6/19/13 8:24 PM
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D241
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CharlesLewis - 

 

I think a lot of people forget about this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIARm1NLPUo

 

sorry can't seem to embed it


Thank you for posting that.

 

This really was a great thread, lots of great debates.

 

However, Pat Smith didn't have to worry about a grappler as his bracket was filled with stand up fighters.

Kimo is a ground fighter which is why he won in that bout.

 

Again, the match up I'm least confident in was Smith/Hackney, but in terms of how he advances, he didn't have to face any ground fighters.

6/19/13 8:35 PM
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CharlesLewis
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If it's a photo of Pat after he got his ass kicked in that elevator, maybe.

6/19/13 8:44 PM
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TheBearStare
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i say kimo or remco. kimo would win just by being bigger and stronger than everyone. if remco gets thru him hed probably win just because he would have(at least in theory) better grappling skills over the others that he would exploit.
6/19/13 8:50 PM
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D241
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CLINTK9 - 
MrColdCock - 
UGCTT_zackthewop - Since mezger fought at UFC 4 why not just sub him in for one of the other fighters that were in the tournament. Phone Post 3.0
Mezger's running away with this. He wasn't a MMA fighter at the time. I don't see him any different then the rest of the field. Traditional martial artist who was hard as fuck.

The fact that he would go on to become a solid fighter should be countered by the fact that he was the only rookie in the field. IMO.

I don't think there was another guy in UFC 4 (aside from Severn) who would be competitive with these guys. Melton Bowan? Joe Son? Although Macias vs Weit could have been cool. Phone Post

I thinks its too many remembering Mezger from ufc13 not ufc4. NO WAY he wins this tourney at that time.

That was 3 years before 1994. I wouldn't put too much substance in considering Guy Mezger a "rookie" 3 years after displaying that type of stand up skill.

6/19/13 10:20 PM
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MrColdCock
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TheBearStare - i say kimo or remco. kimo would win just by being bigger and stronger than everyone. if remco gets thru him hed probably win just because he would have(at least in theory) better grappling skills over the others that he would exploit.

^Nice video. Voted Up.

Does anyone know when Mezger started training at the lions den? His ground game looked pretty good in the Fairn fight.

I don't think Mezger wins the standup vs Gordeau or Smith and maybe not against Howard or Hackney, no matter how many jump kicks he lands in a karate tournament. Can he get those guys to the ground and can he beat them there, even if he does? I'm not so sure.
6/19/13 10:28 PM
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MrColdCock
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JOESONDO - As a great man once said "If you're coming on, COME ON!" Of course Howard wins, how could it be any other way?

Just VTFU the whole thread and saw this gem I missed.

I watched the Smith/Kimo fight for the first time. Was a pretty good fight!! LOL at Joe Son's antics ringside.
6/19/13 11:42 PM
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Funaki Masakatsu #1
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MrColdCock -
TheBearStare - i say kimo or remco. kimo would win just by being bigger and stronger than everyone. if remco gets thru him hed probably win just because he would have(at least in theory) better grappling skills over the others that he would exploit.

^Nice video. Voted Up.

Does anyone know when Mezger started training at the lions den? His ground game looked pretty good in the Fairn fight.

I don't think Mezger wins the standup vs Gordeau or Smith and maybe not against Howard or Hackney, no matter how many jump kicks he lands in a karate tournament. Can he get those guys to the ground and can he beat them there, even if he does? I'm not so sure.
Mezger started at the Lion's Den I think late in 1994. Phone Post 3.0
6/20/13 9:04 PM
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D241
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Lol, although it's a legit point, I think it was funny to bring up the hair angle. Justified though.

6/21/13 2:13 AM
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bobby boulders
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buddie - I think Pat Smith would destroy Gordeau honestly.
This. Phone Post 3.0
6/21/13 8:31 AM
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bobby boulders
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CLINTK9 -
D241 - 

Lol, although it's a legit point, I think it was funny to bring up the hair angle. Justified though.


lol, Well I just dont see Gordeau, Pat Smith, Kimo or Harold Howard agreeing to a gentlemans agreement to not pull hair.
I agree. In the Smith/Kimo fight that was posted Kimo pulls on that weird knot Smith had his hair in. You could throw Hackney into that list as well. If he has no problem with nut shots, I doubt he has one with pulling some hair. Phone Post 3.0
6/21/13 3:50 PM
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Pro Ice
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CharlesLewis - 

LOL, I am no fan of Smith to be sure... partially because he gets way overhyped for a guy who crushed smaller cans and quit in every hard fight he ever had, partially because of the rape charge, and partially because I think the guy was just a d-bag. 

 

It's a pet peeve.


I agree Smith had some skills but no heart

Don't think any fighter quit more than Smith,.......well maybe Sapp

6/21/13 3:56 PM
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Pro Ice
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Edited: 06/21/13 4:14 PM
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Jennum > Hackney = Tough fight - Hackney lands some before eventually being taken down - Jennun controls top poss sub or dec 

Gordeau > Smith = Tough fight to call - Smith hit harder Gourdeau more technical - Smith folds Gordeau wins

Kimo > Remco = After some ground fighting Kimo gets to top - Kimo GnP Tko 

Mezger > Howard = Trade a few till Harlold gasses - Mezger Tko 

DeLucia > Weit = Delucia quick sub 

 

Hard to say how much damage each would've taken in first fights of tourny, so just picked as if each were fresh

 

Jennun > Gourdeau - Jennum gets fight to mat - sub or dec

Kimo > Mezger - Both still relatively green - imo Mezger didn't have sub to finsh Kimo at that point - Kimo gets top Gnp TKO 

 

Kimo > Jennum - Uses strength gets top - headbutts Gnp TKO

6/21/13 3:56 PM
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CharlesLewis
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bobby boulders - 
CLINTK9 -
D241 - 

Lol, although it's a legit point, I think it was funny to bring up the hair angle. Justified though.


lol, Well I just dont see Gordeau, Pat Smith, Kimo or Harold Howard agreeing to a gentlemans agreement to not pull hair.
I agree. In the Smith/Kimo fight that was posted Kimo pulls on that weird knot Smith had his hair in. You could throw Hackney into that list as well. If he has no problem with nut shots, I doubt he has one with pulling some hair. Phone Post 3.0

Can you blame Kimo? After what Royce did to his hair?

6/21/13 4:12 PM
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sparkuri
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MrColdCock -  Hypothetical UFC 4 tournament. All fighters are returning vets:

Left bracket:
Keith Hackney
Vs
Steve Jennum

Pat Smith
Vs
Gerard Gourdeau

Right bracket:
Kimo Leopaldo
Vs
Remco Parduel

Harold Howard
Vs
Guy Mezger (making UFC debut w/ long hair)


Alternate fight:
Jason DeLucia
Vs
Orlando Weit

Who wins it? Phone Post

Jennum by toughness, Smith by KO, Remco by outsmarting:-(, Mullet Mezger outlasts mullet Howard.

I'd pick Delucia over Weit.

Then Smith sneaks in the KO over a tough Jennum, mullet Mezger catches a late sub on Remco.

In the final, Smith is tired, and Mezger broke his mullet, so Delucia comes in and puts up a fantastic fight and catches the weary Smith with the "Screaming monkey fists" TKO.

Then Kimo rages into the octagon dragging voodoo dolls with crosses jabbed in them declaring himself King whichever city he's currently training in.

VU

6/21/13 4:16 PM
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ranier wolfcastle
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mezger wins it all

6/21/13 4:44 PM
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Pro Ice
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Remco Pardoel vs Carl Franks  - Shooto  (1995)

6/21/13 4:45 PM
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Pro Ice
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Steve Jennum vs Marcos Ruas - WVC  (1996)

6/21/13 4:47 PM
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Pro Ice
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Steve Jennum vs Jason Godsey  -  Extreme Challenge  (1997)

6/22/13 2:19 AM
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MrColdCock
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Pro Ice is the man. I remember reading about these fights, but never watching them. Phone Post
6/22/13 11:12 AM
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Pro Ice
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Couple other vids relevant to thread

6/22/13 11:12 AM
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Pro Ice
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Harold Howard vs Hugo Duarte  - UVF 3  (1996)


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