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UnderGround Forums >> Bellator Flops on Spike... only 450k viewers.


6/21/13 11:19 AM
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Soup and Beer
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The ratings after the main event would have been higher but Greg Jackson's strategy was to slow down the pace and go for a Nielson ratings decision.

6/21/13 11:23 AM
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goocher
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You guys act like the casuals pay attention to all the Bellator drama and for that reason decide not to watch. I'm sure a ton of people were watching hockey.
6/21/13 12:28 PM
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Chris27
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Reed Rothchild - 
MMALOGIC - John Morgan ?@MMAjunkieJohn 11m

"Should have exact numbers shortly, but it sounds like both live Bellator shows pulled around 450,000 viewers each last night."

Make room for the tombstone because that's a major disaster.

The reality show will most certainly be cancelled. But the more important question is what this means for the live events...

if you can only pull 450k viewers on the best weeknight for mma programming, what on earth will happen when they move to friday nights?

We're talking 350k to 375k viewers. that's not gonna last very long on spike. even 450k wont work on friday primetime.

The fat lady has begun her song.
Still much better than the last UFC on Fuel which was on a prime Saturday night slot Phone Post 3.0

Really?  The last Fuel event did 313k, the one before it did 485k.

They are also on a network in 63 million less homes than Spike.  

6/21/13 12:46 PM
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Yussarian
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big_roy_fan - is zuffa shill a synonym for realist?

Agreed sir. Call it alarmist or excessive, still good questions are raised in the opening post.
6/21/13 12:56 PM
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smth416
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Steve4192 - 
dermotfix - 

what a shill-storm!


It's like a battle royal between the Zuffa shills and the Bellator shills. The Zuffa shills claiming the ratings foreshadow the imminent death of Bellator (the same death they have been predicting for five years) and the Bellator shills trying to put a positive spin on what are pretty obviously bad ratings. The truth is, both sides are right to a certain degree. They are shitty ratings, but it's only one fucking night and doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things.

Bellator is CHEAP programming for Spike. That is why Viacom bought it. To fill up Spike's schedule on the cheap and maintain their position as the cable network that delivers the male 18-35 demographic. As long as it remains cheap, they are probably safe. The time to start worrying is if Viacom starts dumping money into them. Once real money starts getting thrown around, expectations suddenly become a lot higher and the consequences of failing to meet expectations become a lot more dire.

How are they cheap?

I'm thinking less than 500K viewers gives them about the lowest return on investment of any of their programming.

These ratings are pathetic.
6/21/13 1:04 PM
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bjws
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Let's get real for a minute. There is a major league in MMA and it's called the UFC. Any other promotion trying to compete in that space is doomed. At least that is my guess based on what I've seen with all the other promotions that have tried. Any other opinion is pretty much wishful thinking or people who like to see the world burn or have an axe to grind for some reason.

Think about if for a minute...everyone one in the industry wants to work with the UFC. That's from the athletes, to the coaches, to the managers, to the sponsors. The same can't be said for the other leagues out there. Sure they may be happy to start there, but that certainly isn't their goal.

If Bellator had a system where they were feeding people into the UFC they may have a shot just like WSOF does. But if they really think they can copy the formula (president out there talking to media all the time, reality show, etc) they are destined to fail and do so in fairly epic fashion. Sure they are almost at 100 events. But they are running these things weekly and even the fans have a hard time following anyone beyond the champs and the "stars" that we are familiar with from other promotions.

I watch a lot of MMA and have for years. I have accepted that the UFC is the big leagues for better or for worse. The sooner the fans become wise to this, the faster we can push the sport forward and realize the dream of seeing the best fighting the best 3-4 times a year.
6/21/13 1:32 PM
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ViciousCesar
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this has probably been mentioned. but it did go up against game 4 of the stanley cup finals, which has been a very competitive series this year.
6/21/13 1:45 PM
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Bisping=Gatekeeper4Life
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Bellator Fan - "Every time BellatorMMA has an event you can expect a MMALogic thread the next day saying why these numbers suck and when they will be cancelled."

And he never gets frozen Phone Post 3.0
I remember logic made a claim about something before, Kirik called him out on it and then logic pm'd Kirik. Nothing was ever done. Posterboy also called logic out on some stuff as well and nothing was ever done. The guys bulletproof, he can say and do whatever and nothing will happen to him. Phone Post 3.0
6/21/13 1:50 PM
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TheKidAintMine
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Bisping=Gatekeeper4Life - 
Bellator Fan - "Every time BellatorMMA has an event you can expect a MMALogic thread the next day saying why these numbers suck and when they will be cancelled."

And he never gets frozen Phone Post 3.0
I remember logic made a claim about something before, Kirik called him out on it and then logic pm'd Kirik. Nothing was ever done. Posterboy also called logic out on some stuff as well and nothing was ever done. The guys bulletproof, he can say and do whatever and nothing will happen to him. Phone Post 3.0

Why would anyone get frozen over shit talking a promotion???

People shit talk the UFC. People shit talk Bellator. People shit talk WSOF. This is a MMA board - that's what fans do.
6/21/13 1:53 PM
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RicGillespie
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Bisping=Gatekeeper4Life - 
Bellator Fan - "Every time BellatorMMA has an event you can expect a MMALogic thread the next day saying why these numbers suck and when they will be cancelled."

And he never gets frozen Phone Post 3.0
I remember logic made a claim about something before, Kirik called him out on it and then logic pm'd Kirik. Nothing was ever done. Posterboy also called logic out on some stuff as well and nothing was ever done. The guys bulletproof, he can say and do whatever and nothing will happen to him. Phone Post 3.0

How/why would anyone but a mod know if he'd been frozen before or not? Not like it's public information and only the sad little whiners like that d241 dude make posts complaining about their vote ups/downs and consequences associated with them.
6/21/13 2:14 PM
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romadant
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I finally watched this from DVR.

Other than the fights, which seemed like mismatches, the broadcast was terrible. 1,000,000 commercials. Awkward commentary from Couture, Warren, Shamrock, etc. Looked like they were just trying to parade famous faces like "look who we have.. see.. we're legit". Can't put my finger on it, but it just didn't work. I couldn't get into it and was hoping I could. If that's the way all the broadcasts will be I'll never watch it live and will fast forward to watch only the fights I'm interested in. Even then, maybe I'll just wait for the results and GIFs to show up here... the broadcast was that bad.
6/21/13 2:16 PM
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DaleSonnen
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Bellator got smashed last night because of the NBA Finals.. no other reason.. Spike TV and Bellator can thank Labron James for the shitty ratings, Him and the Heat should have won that shit sooner. Im not sure if Bellator is doing another event next thurs or not but if they do it should be fine. As far as that Fight Master show, I myself don't have any interest.
6/21/13 2:30 PM
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Nexuscrawlers
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romadant - I finally watched this from DVR.

Other than the fights, which seemed like mismatches, the broadcast was terrible. 1,000,000 commercials. Awkward commentary from Couture, Warren, Shamrock, etc. Looked like they were just trying to parade famous faces like "look who we have.. see.. we're legit". Can't put my finger on it, but it just didn't work. I couldn't get into it and was hoping I could. If that's the way all the broadcasts will be I'll never watch it live and will fast forward to watch only the fights I'm interested in. Even then, maybe I'll just wait for the results and GIFs to show up here... the broadcast was that bad.

There were so many commercials because they had so many first round finishes. they still managed to show 5-6 fights on a 2 hour card.

the couture/warren/shamrock/jackson commentary thing was to plug their new reality show that had its premere right after the fight card.

whenever i DVR MMA, i always jsut fast forward to the fights, even the UFC PPVs have tons of ads and promos and BS between fights. that is more of an issue with TV in general being too heavily advertised more than a specific issue with bellator.

6/21/13 2:33 PM
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Nexuscrawlers
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DaleSonnen - Bellator got smashed last night because of the NBA Finals.. no other reason.. Spike TV and Bellator can thank Labron James for the shitty ratings, Him and the Heat should have won that shit sooner. Im not sure if Bellator is doing another event next thurs or not but if they do it should be fine. As far as that Fight Master show, I myself don't have any interest.

there were NHL finals too i think.

also, the next bellator is july 30th i think. The summer series is usually 3-4 events 1 month apart. the weekly shows start up again in september for Bellator 99.

to me, (ive been watching bellator since season 2 i think) the summer series is always kind of just a let-down/ build up for the next season. its nice, but i really just want the weekly events and all that comes with the regular bellator seasons.

6/21/13 2:45 PM
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DeuceDroppin
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Fuck Bellator! I hope they go down hard. I'm not one of these haters either. The more promotions the better and I really would like for Zuffa to have some competition, but fuck these guys. The way they shit on fighters by fucking with their livelihood/s, they deserve anything bad coming their way. Phone Post 3.0
6/21/13 2:49 PM
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Nexuscrawlers
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Rambo John J - I though it was going to fridays.
wednesdays is rough IMO.
for fights at least IMO

wednesday for the next 2, then friday in the fall.

6/21/13 2:59 PM
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JimmersonzGlove
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I hope they survive. Like I said in another thread...getting so much MMA on TV (Fox family/Spike/AXS) is awesome. Beats the days of ordering tapes or buying KOTC/IFC videos at the store to get your fix.

6/21/13 3:05 PM
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dabigchet
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didnt read the whole thread, but it looks like the last episode of TUF on spike did 1.5M for its debut

http://mmapayout.com/2011/09/the-ultimate-fighter-14-ep-1-1-5-million-viewers/

ouch
6/21/13 3:12 PM
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romadant
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Nexuscrawlers - 
romadant - I finally watched this from DVR.

Other than the fights, which seemed like mismatches, the broadcast was terrible. 1,000,000 commercials. Awkward commentary from Couture, Warren, Shamrock, etc. Looked like they were just trying to parade famous faces like "look who we have.. see.. we're legit". Can't put my finger on it, but it just didn't work. I couldn't get into it and was hoping I could. If that's the way all the broadcasts will be I'll never watch it live and will fast forward to watch only the fights I'm interested in. Even then, maybe I'll just wait for the results and GIFs to show up here... the broadcast was that bad.

There were so many commercials because they had so many first round finishes. they still managed to show 5-6 fights on a 2 hour card.

the couture/warren/shamrock/jackson commentary thing was to plug their new reality show that had its premere right after the fight card.

whenever i DVR MMA, i always jsut fast forward to the fights, even the UFC PPVs have tons of ads and promos and BS between fights. that is more of an issue with TV in general being too heavily advertised more than a specific issue with bellator.


I get the show tie in for courture and them... it just seemed weird to me. The didn't seem to be pushing the show as much as showing off their mma cred.

BS on the commercials... they were pumping commercials from the beginning. Even during the walkout for the first fight... walking out... cut to commercial. They didn't show the fighter introductions/etc - just commercials.
6/21/13 3:41 PM
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lookoutawhale
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This dude has to work for Zuffa or something..

 
6/21/13 4:54 PM
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Macedawgg
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willienugget - 
Macedawgg - 

Let's not kid ourselves on the contracts either--Zuffa's and Bellator's do virtually the same exact things.

Bellator, as the minnow to Zuffa's whale, has utilized their oppressive contracts recently. . .

Zuffa, however, has done similar things as well. 


It's pretty seldom a fighter wants to leave UFC but when it happens, I haven't noticed UFC stand in their way. Diaz wanted to fight for Gracie. Rampage wanted 'greener pastures'. Henderson to Strikeforce. All I remember hearing was "Good Luck". He could be full of shit, but Dana has said that every UFC fighter has a matching clause.

Can you elaborate please?

You haven't seen it? 

Sure you have. Silva wanted to box Roy Jones, Couture wanted to fight Fedor--both  of which were blocked by Zuffa.  The argument that they "had fights remaining on the contract" isn't persuasive for a variety of reasons.  Further, as drafted, the champion's clause is circular--and the contract would never be satisfied. . . Lawrence Epstein admits this clause too is of questionable enforceability--yet, they don't change it.   

Another thing you have seen, but which you probably don't notice, the "see you next year" treatment referred to as "benching" or "icing."  Zuffa has done this with regularity. 

As to not standing in fighters way--this is only partially true.  Zuffa admits they have the same matching rights as Bellator in the contract--even after release.  Why is this in Zuffa's contract? 

They just haven't had to utilize that provision yet. 

6/21/13 4:55 PM
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DeuceDroppin
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Reed Rothchild -
DeuceDroppin - Fuck Bellator! I hope they go down hard. I'm not one of these haters either. The more promotions the better and I really would like for Zuffa to have some competition, but fuck these guys. The way they shit on fighters by fucking with their livelihood/s, they deserve anything bad coming their way. Phone Post 3.0
VTFD, for being a dumb Fuck Phone Post 3.0
Lol at a mud that's in the red with a VTFD threat. Get in line dickwad! I'll gladly return the favor. I hope the day comes where some rich dick head does his best to deprive you of your livelihood based on a fucking pissing match! That's a life experience that sucks big time and you probably aren't able to empathize with from mommies basement. Phone Post 3.0
6/21/13 4:56 PM
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FixedPartialArts
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I don't really buy the NHL competition excuse. Maybe they do. They were scared of NFL Network games on Thursday which is why they decided to move. I don't think that should be a factor either. A lot of people don't have NFL Net, and most sports fans who do aren't going to care about a general regular season game where they don't have a rooting interest. Similarly, most sports fans aren't going to care about a hockey game where they don't have a rooting interest, period. Regardless if it's a finals' match. Bellator is always going to have to deal with competition at about this level in other sports. It only should influence their decision making if the competition is coming from the UFC where there would be a ton of overlap w/ prospective viewers. The only time you're going to get that with other sports is one-offs like Super Bowl, NCAA Tourney, Game 7 of the NBA Finals, the World Cup, etc. They'll adversely effect you on an individual night, but they'll come and go.

What's most important for Bellator is that they pick a night and time slot that's most conducive to viewership in general, and they stick with it. Thursdays was the perfect night for them right now, IMO. It's a great night for TV, which is why networks choose to put so many quality programs on then, but none individually are going adversely effect their ratings much. The only issues were the time slot and lack of flexibility being on the same night as TNA gave them. It would be ideal if they were on Thursdays by themselves, and could be on earlier as a result, and maybe put the prelims of quality on a lesser network within the Viacom family. But staying on Thursdays late night at least would have provided them continuity. People were conditioned to check for Bellator on Thursdays at that time. Leading up to this event they lost conditioning by changing nights, times, and having such a huge gap between events. You see a bunch of people in this thread acknowledging the reason they didn't watch is they didn't know what night and/or time Bellator were on this week, if they even were aware it was on at all. Speaking for myself, I follow Bellator as much as anybody, yet I kept having to remind myself it wasn't on the 4th day of the work week, and I thought the TV portion started at 7 EST only to discover it was 8 while I was watching the prelims. They changed nights, and twice switched times, for this event alone. Therein lies the primary reason for the ratings' drop. It's not like this one night's ratings indicate people have lost interest in Bellator for good. Their previous event drew in the 900 thousands, which was one of their biggest ratings. They need to have the regular events again, and get in the groove on a favorable night and time for them. Fridays are not it. Maybe this rating is a blessing in disguise because they'll change their mind now. It's better to have this one-night ratings' disaster now than during a season where they have 12 events committed. They could decide that while it not may not be ideal for TNA's ratings, it's best for the station's ratings if Bellator is back on Thursdays with them. Incidentally, TNA's ratings weren't alarming until Bellator's season ended.
6/21/13 5:19 PM
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FixedPartialArts
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Nexuscrawlers - 
romadant - I finally watched this from DVR.

Other than the fights, which seemed like mismatches, the broadcast was terrible. 1,000,000 commercials. Awkward commentary from Couture, Warren, Shamrock, etc. Looked like they were just trying to parade famous faces like "look who we have.. see.. we're legit". Can't put my finger on it, but it just didn't work. I couldn't get into it and was hoping I could. If that's the way all the broadcasts will be I'll never watch it live and will fast forward to watch only the fights I'm interested in. Even then, maybe I'll just wait for the results and GIFs to show up here... the broadcast was that bad.

There were so many commercials because they had so many first round finishes. they still managed to show 5-6 fights on a 2 hour card.

the couture/warren/shamrock/jackson commentary thing was to plug their new reality show that had its premere right after the fight card.

whenever i DVR MMA, i always jsut fast forward to the fights, even the UFC PPVs have tons of ads and promos and BS between fights. that is more of an issue with TV in general being too heavily advertised more than a specific issue with bellator.


There were so many quick finishes, because there were so many mismatches. There were so many mismatches because they wanted to contrive stars, instead of letting them form naturally from good fights, which have a greater appeal in and of themselves too.

Either way it was their fault.

And you can't say all the commercials were out of necessity after the event was already taking place. A few times they came back from a full set of commercials only to tell viewers during the walk in that they were coming back in a minute. That practice is going to alienate anybody who isn't fully invested in watching a program.

They need to plan to bring the fans more action to draw them in initially, and keep them there. Like they used to do on a much smaller scale during their early days on MTV2, before big bad Viacom bought the company.

The mismatches/commercials were probably the second biggest reason the ratings bombed.

They have to be honest about their mistakes and change them or they'll never reach their potential as an org. They were going in the right direction until Viacom bought them and started sinking their hooks in. They don't know much about MMA, and mostly just helped facilitate the UFC's rise. If they truly believe otherwise, and weren't just trolling Zuffa publicly, well then Bellator will stagnate at best.
6/21/13 5:22 PM
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FixedPartialArts
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lookoutawhale - 

This dude has to work for Zuffa or something..

 

It was obvious to me from the beginning. I called him ZuffaLogic a long time ago. His user-name, in conjunction with his one-sidedness, was a dead giveaway. Me thinks he doth protest too much.

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