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UnderGround Forums >> Stop training gi


7/13/13 3:48 PM
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BubblesNS
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Im not being mean here but do you know what you are talking about? Gi bjj is very effective for learning fundamentals that can really improve your no gi bjj. Its not so simple as you make it out to be. Phone Post 3.0
7/13/13 3:57 PM
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MARC BULGER
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Beefy Wellington - Because most fights occur in a bar or night club where all the fellas are just wearing board shorts right??? Phone Post 3.0
Don't compare a collared shirt to a thick ass gi. Most shirts tear in any grappling especially ones with buttons. Besides what idiot is going to try to bjj in a night club where your likely to get stomped by the guys friends. Boxing is all you need in a night club. Phone Post
7/13/13 4:01 PM
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MARC BULGER
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BubblesNS - Im not being mean here but do you know what you are talking about? Gi bjj is very effective for learning fundamentals that can really improve your no gi bjj. Its not so simple as you make it out to be. Phone Post 3.0
Gi bjj is basically riding a bike with training wheels as an adult. Phone Post
7/14/13 10:23 PM
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Foos
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Animal Mother - 
Foos - 
Pugilist82 - I personally prefer nogi. That being said, I don't know what high level guys ONLY go nogi. Even in MMA, the top guys train both. OP, what fighters that are strictly nogi prove your point?

Rory MacDonald, Jake Shields, Cain Valasquez, Team Alpha Male, Jon Jones, Dan Henderson...


Wrong

Who am I wrong about?
7/14/13 10:36 PM
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Unseen
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AlexanderTheGOAT -
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uniquetechnique -
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Bellator Fan - "Again, a trained GI grappler is a better NoGi grappler than an untrained opponent which is what you will most likely run into on the street."

You will be in a FIGHT at that time and GI grappling doesn't prepare you for that. Phone Post 3.0

I live in San Diego where tere are BJJ schools all over.  The reason SD has so many MMA gyms is due to so many BJJ schols being here early on.  I've been involved in the MMA and grappling scene since 2000.

 I train for free at at least ten differet schools here due to my writing for magazines, being involved with Total Combat and now involved with Grappling-X.  

I've also been in and scene street fights involving Gi students, no gi students and MMA fighters.  Probably over a hundred since 2000.  They all handled everyone they fought except for one instance where a fightr was hit from behind with brass knuckles.

I'm not trying to sound like a tough guy I'm just 42 and have been around.  A decent Gi guy will handle a your typically downtown ahole no problem as long as the ahole isn't 100pounds heavier or trained himself.  

I'v known Dean Lister since before he started training MMA and was just wearing the Gi under Fabio Santos.  He post here.  Ask him what happens in a street fight with a decent Gi guy.


I'll have to disagree. I have also been around BJJ & No-Gi since 1995. I have known Dean since he was at Fabios as well and helped train him for some of his No-Gi,Gi and NHB.
Dean is more versed in No-gi and wanted Fabio to understand that No-gi training was essential but I would disagree that he would tell everyone to do just No-gi. In fact, he started his school teaching Gi in eastlake back in 99 I believe. Mixed in No-Gi and Gi. He also helped me choose the school I went to back in 2000 when I moved to Las Vegas..was very hard because of BJJ politics but he picked his Rival "Marc Laimon" because there wasn't many shcools then and he said, "if your comfortable there, then you should train there..don't let anyone tell you what to do..do what you feel is best for you" .."Marc Laimon is really good and I think if you feel good there, then you should train there". I trained at all 3 BJJ schools that was here back then and felt best with John Lewis school where Laimon was. I trained mostly No-gi there.
It really depends on the individual as I stated..If you like the Gi and feel it helps you more in your game..then stick with it. For me, like I said..it helps exercise your mind. For example: In No-Gi..You have 10x times as much moves/submissions from all positions..practically. So, now you have to think 2-3 steps ahead of your opponent. So..to me..I am playing at an advance chess game..more advanced than No-Gi.
Handles: I handle a lot of No-Gi in the same situation as gi. For Example: Holding handles on the sleeves, I would use more wrist control, Collar..I would cup the neck, vice versa. Of course you'll never pull a clock choke in No-Gi..but when you are cross training between both it is keeping your mind more aware. So now when you are training No-Gi....your mind is more open and I am able to think faster and mover from transition to transition even faster because I don't have as much arsenal than I have with the Gi.
Hard to tell it but I am sure a lot that have cross trained do understand where I am coming from.
Yeah I was there when Dean started his own school inside Just Fir Kicks. I actually trained with him for awhile there.

When Dean first fought Liamon Brian C had me goto Fabios. This was the first Grapplers Quest in Vegas and Brian wanted the west coast represented. My point being he went straight from GI to NoGi without issue. He lost to Liamon on points but Liamon ran out if bounds when Dean had and Achilles lock sunk.

My training is both GI and NoGi. I actually started NoGi at Roy Harris when it was still PFS. We learned leg locks at white belt as well as a lot if other cool stuff like Savate and knife and stick fighting.

I think like you said the GI makes you think more moves ahead. Also I think it's good for escapes because your opponent can hold you with so many different grips and on parts if your body that you couldn't grip in NoGi.

I don't think either is better, but to say that Gi training has no applications in a street fight just is not true. Phone Post 3.0
It does have applications but there's a lot of false security that can be gained in the reliance in a gi. You want to know body parts grips that are learned and developed in wrestling an no gi because those are ALWAYS there no matter what someone has on. Phone Post 3.0
I don't know any Gi school here in San Diego (and there's probably a hundred) that do not teach pummeling, over and under hooks and head, hand/wrist and waist control.

I'm the director of media for Grappling-X so I've witnessed thousands of grappling matches and have trained at many schools. If I showed you a high white belt or blue belt vs. an untrained opponent I would bet you could not tell if the trained guy was GI or NoGi. Phone Post 3.0
7/14/13 11:36 PM
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The Sultan
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Don't feed the trolls. Phone Post
7/14/13 11:59 PM
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MachineCode
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uniquetechnique - I think people should do what they want and go with Gi or No Gi.
I have trained both since 1995.
My opinion is that with a Gi, it helps exercise my mind more because there are many more options for submissions (Chokes especially), holds, transitions and many more. I know a lot of people who have transitioned into gi after months or even years of NO gi...really hate it. I can understand because..it is more harder to transition to gi that to no gi. They hate the "handles", they feel weaker and vulnerable. A good example is watching Diego Sanchez putting a Gi on for his first time at or even Joe Daddy Stevenson at Cobra kai. As advanced as they are..they felt like white belts when they but the Gi on. Where as I have seen Wrestlers like Dean Lister go into Gi first then take the Abu Dhabi World Championships. I train both because when you have more into your arsenal..especially a sharper mind set and higher experience..you will for sure win in a street fight.
I'm surprised a guy like you who has been posting here so long would be responding to a troll thread. Phone Post 3.0
7/15/13 12:05 AM
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AlexanderTheGOAT
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Ugh, I've done this argument do many times it's not fun anymore and people are emotionally attached to one style. Truth is, no gi will make you an expert at controlling your opponent using on his body and yours. Gi will make you an expert at using a heavy jacket to do so but will also sharpen you defense for that same reason but mainly for sports jiu jitsu (as opposed to self defense or MMA). Phone Post 3.0
7/15/13 12:16 AM
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uniquetechnique
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MachineCode - 
uniquetechnique - I think people should do what they want and go with Gi or No Gi.
I have trained both since 1995.
My opinion is that with a Gi, it helps exercise my mind more because there are many more options for submissions (Chokes especially), holds, transitions and many more. I know a lot of people who have transitioned into gi after months or even years of NO gi...really hate it. I can understand because..it is more harder to transition to gi that to no gi. They hate the "handles", they feel weaker and vulnerable. A good example is watching Diego Sanchez putting a Gi on for his first time at or even Joe Daddy Stevenson at Cobra kai. As advanced as they are..they felt like white belts when they but the Gi on. Where as I have seen Wrestlers like Dean Lister go into Gi first then take the Abu Dhabi World Championships. I train both because when you have more into your arsenal..especially a sharper mind set and higher experience..you will for sure win in a street fight.
I'm surprised a guy like you who has been posting here so long would be responding to a troll thread. Phone Post 3.0

lol, Yea...I'm a sucker
7/15/13 12:34 AM
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MARC BULGER
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So what I get from this thread is no gi bjj is practical for a real fight and gi bjj is useful for if somebody tried to attack you wearing a snuggie. Phone Post
7/15/13 7:21 AM
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Animal Mother
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Foos -
Animal Mother - 
Foos - 
Pugilist82 - I personally prefer nogi. That being said, I don't know what high level guys ONLY go nogi. Even in MMA, the top guys train both. OP, what fighters that are strictly nogi prove your point?

Rory MacDonald, Jake Shields, Cain Valasquez, Team Alpha Male, Jon Jones, Dan Henderson...


Wrong

Who am I wrong about?
Jake Sheilds was at Marcelo's training in a gi for GSP, John Jones joined a Gracie Barra Phone Post 3.0
7/15/13 12:54 PM
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Foos
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To Animal Mother: Interesting. How often are those guys wearing the Gi?

I know Rory MacDonald put the Gi on a couple times at Renzo's, but I don't think that counts as him being a Gi practitioner.
7/15/13 12:55 PM
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Weidman_wild_each_it
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its so obvious yet we have fish on the line in masses.
7/15/13 1:01 PM
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AlexanderTheGOAT
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Bellator Fan - The best FIGHTERS in the world are not GI nerds. The majority are wrestlers that have never put on a GI in their life. Phone Post 3.0
This is true and becoming more true as time goes on. Gi BJJ still has a place but mainly for those who want to compete in Gi BJJ. Even the guy who claims jake shields trained in a gi for GSP it wasn't much. Even he'll tell you 95% of his training is nogi. Phone Post 3.0
7/15/13 1:12 PM
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Muggler
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Why not just train whatever you enjoy?

The single biggest factor in self defense is self confidence. Training anything can give you that confidence.

If you're a douche and get over confident ,you reap what you sow. Phone Post 3.0
7/15/13 1:53 PM
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MARC BULGER
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Muggler - Why not just train whatever you enjoy?

The single biggest factor in self defense is self confidence. Training anything can give you that confidence.

If you're a douche and get over confident ,you reap what you sow. Phone Post 3.0
Because we know what actually works now. Let's not act oblivious to facts. Usually only the older people roll with gi's. Phone Post
7/15/13 1:58 PM
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Muggler
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MARC BULGER -
Muggler - Why not just train whatever you enjoy?

The single biggest factor in self defense is self confidence. Training anything can give you that confidence.

If you're a douche and get over confident ,you reap what you sow. Phone Post 3.0
Because we know what actually works now. Let's not act oblivious to facts. Usually only the older people roll with gi's. Phone Post
So, your answer to my question about doing what you enjoy is "because we know what works know"?

That's about the most asinine answer I could have imagined. Phone Post 3.0

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