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HolyGround >> QUESTION.


7/17/13 11:47 AM
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MEOWticket
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Serious question. I know a lot of you on here are very intelligent and investigate scripture, historical documentation, ect. But if Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, are known as the Patriarchs of Judaism.

What about Adam, Noah, and everyone before Abraham. What were they? I haven't had the chance to investigate this myself and was wanting to see what some of you think on here.

Please excuse my ignorance and thank you. Phone Post
7/17/13 3:46 PM
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Kung Fu Joe
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As I understand it, since the Covenant began with Abraham, he is considered the first Patriarch. Phone Post
7/17/13 4:26 PM
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MEOWticket
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Kung Fu Joe - As I understand it, since the Covenant began with Abraham, he is considered the first Patriarch. Phone Post
So does that mean Adam, Noah, Enoch, ect. Were just 'pegans' who listen to God when he spoke? Since they were not 'Jewish'? Phone Post
7/17/13 9:09 PM
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gord96
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MEOWticket -
Kung Fu Joe - As I understand it, since the Covenant began with Abraham, he is considered the first Patriarch. Phone Post
So does that mean Adam, Noah, Enoch, ect. Were just 'pegans' who listen to God when he spoke? Since they were not 'Jewish'? Phone Post
Pagan simply means rustic or country dwellers. You are wondering if they were rustic? Phone Post 3.0
7/17/13 9:21 PM
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gord96
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JK!

I have no idea. Are you a literalist? If so then I can understand your question. If you think Adam and Noah are just myth, does it matter? Phone Post 3.0
7/18/13 10:13 AM
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770mdm
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Adam wasn't able to prevent fratricide.  When God confronted Noah with annihilation he only saved his family and whom God told him to safe.  When God confronted Abraham with annihilating the city of Sodom he argued with God to spare them.  Although God didn't listen he did argue on their behalf.  Abraham is our first patriarch because he his tent was open on all sides and he argued with God on behalf of humanity. 

Jacob "Wrestled with God and man and prevailed".  So in Abraham and Jacob there is this dynamic of confronting and arguing and wrestling with God. 

Isaac - Doesn't wander doesn't have his name changed like Abram to Abraham or Jacob to Israel.  He marries one woman Rebekah.  There is a deffinitive reasoning but I forget. 

All were shepards which contrasted farming socieities. 

7/24/13 12:17 PM
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MEOWticket
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770mdm -

Adam wasn't able to prevent fratricide.  When God confronted Noah with annihilation he only saved his family and whom God told him to safe.  When God confronted Abraham with annihilating the city of Sodom he argued with God to spare them.  Although God didn't listen he did argue on their behalf.  Abraham is our first patriarch because he his tent was open on all sides and he argued with God on behalf of humanity. 

Jacob "Wrestled with God and man and prevailed".  So in Abraham and Jacob there is this dynamic of confronting and arguing and wrestling with God. 

Isaac - Doesn't wander doesn't have his name changed like Abram to Abraham or Jacob to Israel.  He marries one woman Rebekah.  There is a deffinitive reasoning but I forget. 

All were shepards which contrasted farming socieities. 

Thank you for the info! Phone Post
8/15/13 11:39 AM
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reverend john
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770mdm - 

Adam wasn't able to prevent fratricide.  When God confronted Noah with annihilation he only saved his family and whom God told him to safe.  When God confronted Abraham with annihilating the city of Sodom he argued with God to spare them.  Although God didn't listen he did argue on their behalf.  Abraham is our first patriarch because he his tent was open on all sides and he argued with God on behalf of humanity. 

Jacob "Wrestled with God and man and prevailed".  So in Abraham and Jacob there is this dynamic of confronting and arguing and wrestling with God. 

Isaac - Doesn't wander doesn't have his name changed like Abram to Abraham or Jacob to Israel.  He marries one woman Rebekah.  There is a deffinitive reasoning but I forget. 

All were shepards which contrasted farming socieities. 


10/16/13 4:44 PM
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770mdm
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  • Adam denies personal responsibility. Cain denies moral responsibility. Noah fails the test of collective responsibility. Babel was a rejection of ontological responsibility. Abraham represents the turning point, offering a counterpoint to previous failures. Unlike Adam, Abraham accepts personal responsibility, heeding the word of God and setting out on a journey in obedience to the divine call. Adam is exiled from Eden against his will. Abraham undergoes a kind of voluntary exile. Unlike Cain, he accepts moral responsibility, rescuing his nephew Lot from war. He is his brother's - his brother's son's keeper - the very principle Cain denied. In contrast to Noah he accepts collective responsibility. He prays for the inhabitants of Sodom, even though he knows they are sinful. In contrast to the builders of Babel, he understands ontological responsibility, the duty of human beings to respond to the otherness, and the command, of God.

 

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