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UnderGround Forums >> Ben Askren vs these UFC Welterweights


8/2/13 9:38 AM
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IGOTBELCHED
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Demian Maia-W
Johnny Hendricks-L
Josh Koscheck-L
Nick Diaz-W
Carlos Condit-W
Jake Ellenberger-W
George St Pierre-L
Gunnar Nelson-W
Jake Shields-W
Tyron Woodley-W
8/2/13 9:39 AM
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IGOTBELCHED
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Jo'donnell-Davies - Vu. I think gunni would beat askeren comfortably. I only see askeren beating kos and woodley Phone Post 3.0

I think this would be an easy one for askren, gunnar would be on his back the whole fight.
8/2/13 9:39 AM
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Big Pookie
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buddie - Some of you guys are pretty unrealistic. I don't think he'd beat GSP, but he'd have a decent shot at embarrassing anyone else on the list with how dominant his wrestling is.


Yes, his wrestling has looked dominant, but who has he faced with a wrestling background? Jay Hieron is the only one and that was a really close fight. Hieron even swept him a couple times.
8/2/13 9:48 AM
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RPBJJ
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He decisions Gunnar Nelson, Jake Shields and Tyron Woodley. In 3 of the most boring fights ever seen by human eyes. Then gets his stool pushed in by the rest.
8/2/13 9:48 AM
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Lynchman
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Big Pookie - 
buddie - Some of you guys are pretty unrealistic. I don't think he'd beat GSP, but he'd have a decent shot at embarrassing anyone else on the list with how dominant his wrestling is.


Yes, his wrestling has looked dominant, but who has he faced with a wrestling background? Jay Hieron is the only one and that was a really close fight. Hieron even swept him a couple times.

Jake Shields was dominating everyone prior to coming to the UFC. He is now 2-2, in the WW division, with both wins being split decisions. And then there is Hector Lombard.

As you said, Ben has not faced anyone with really good wrestling. Most of the top UFC WWs are good wrestlers, with far better striking.

Best bet, Ben goes 5-5. Condit, GSP, Hendricks, Ellenberger and Maia all beat him.
8/2/13 9:52 AM
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buddie
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I understand that he hasn't fought a lot of good wrestlers, but he's an Olympic Gold medalist who set NCAA records. If they want to wrestle with him, I'm not sure it would work well in their favor, unless of course they use it to defend and open up opportunities for offense.

It is also very possible that he may not be as sharp as the fellows fighting top comp consistently. I think that has contributed to his being so one dimensional to some degree. Although watching him fight, I'm not sure he has a real mean streak in him. He pulls a lot of his strikes. Kind of reminds me of Dan Severn in that respect.
8/2/13 10:36 AM
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Jetster
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Lol...he gets owned, one trick poney fighting secong teir players...lmao at some people still not understanding this about one trick ponies and yet we are at UFC 163.
8/2/13 11:01 AM
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snobordr
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Demian Maia - L (Maia's size and BJJ are too much for Askren's wrestling)
Johnny Hendricks - L (Can't get Johnny down, eats a hammer)
Josh Koscheck - ? (Toss up IMO.  Kos can hit, and has the wrestling, but also has the mileage...)
Nick Diaz - ? (Nick gives him trouble on the ground, but if Askren stays out of the subs...)
Carlos Condit - L (I think Condit's striking and TDD are too much for Askren)
Jake Ellenberger - W (I think Askren outwrestles Jake, and one shot bombs don't work from your back)
George St Pierre - L (Askren looks like a fish out of water)
Gunnar Nelson - ? (Wildcard - I'm not sure which way I'd go.  A few more fights and maybe Nelson wins)
Jake Shields - W (Askren doesn't worry about striking (except eye pokes) and escapes the BJJ)
Tyron Woodley - W (Askren gets the LnP decision)

 

So I have him at somewhere between 3-7 and 6-4.  He probably doesn't win all 3 of my "?" though, so I'd go with 4-6.

8/2/13 11:07 AM
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SickEyeDiaz
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Jetster - Lol...he gets owned, one trick poney fighting secong teir players...lmao at some people still not understanding this about one trick ponies and yet we are at UFC 163.
When your one trick is wrestling and you're that good at it, you stand a very good chance dumbass. How long have you been watching this sport? Phone Post 3.0
8/2/13 11:52 AM
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REDRUM_NYC
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I think GSP, Gunnar, Maia and Hendricks matchup well vs him and are a problem

 

but I can see him getting the W vs all others.

8/2/13 11:53 AM
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Malvert the Janitor
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12SixElbow -
CapnKindBud - 1-9. I think that he is fighting in a minor league . The Bellator WW division is full of second tier mma fighters, the UFC is stacked with WWs....I was thinking as I watched his last fight that he isn't top 10 in the UFC. A one trick pony can't win in the UFC anymore . Phone Post 3.0

 

Your logic just doesn't make sense.

 

(Think WEC!)

 

His opponents are no joke...

Andrey is an Olympic gold medalist who was 13 - 0 (Askren's 12th pro fight)

Karl was 16 - 4 on a 5 fight win streak, (Askren's 11th pro fight)

Lima was 21 - 4 on a 9 fight win streak, (Askren's 10th pro fight)

Hieron was 22 - 4 on a 10 fight win streak,  (Askren's 9th pro fight)

Lyman Good was 10 - 0 on a 10 fight win streak,  (Askrens 7th pro fight)

Hornbuckle was 21 - 2 on a 6 fight win streak, (Askren's 6th fucking fight)

 

I know you drink the UFC kool aid, and I do too....

But Askren has done nothing (Ok, Nick Thompson was squeezed in there) but fight guys with more experience, on win streaks, and beat them all. Even if you dislike his style, thats pretty fucking impressive.

 

Hmmm...

I learned something, there. Thanks! Phone Post 3.0
8/2/13 12:11 PM
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jimbonice
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12SixElbow -
CapnKindBud - 1-9. I think that he is fighting in a minor league . The Bellator WW division is full of second tier mma fighters, the UFC is stacked with WWs....I was thinking as I watched his last fight that he isn't top 10 in the UFC. A one trick pony can't win in the UFC anymore . Phone Post 3.0

 

Your logic just doesn't make sense.

 

(Think WEC!)

 

His opponents are no joke...

Andrey is an Olympic gold medalist who was 13 - 0 (Askren's 12th pro fight)

Karl was 16 - 4 on a 5 fight win streak, (Askren's 11th pro fight)

Lima was 21 - 4 on a 9 fight win streak, (Askren's 10th pro fight)

Hieron was 22 - 4 on a 10 fight win streak,  (Askren's 9th pro fight)

Lyman Good was 10 - 0 on a 10 fight win streak,  (Askrens 7th pro fight)

Hornbuckle was 21 - 2 on a 6 fight win streak, (Askren's 6th fucking fight)

 

I know you drink the UFC kool aid, and I do too....

But Askren has done nothing (Ok, Nick Thompson was squeezed in there) but fight guys with more experience, on win streaks, and beat them all. Even if you dislike his style, thats pretty fucking impressive.

 

This. Great comparison. Askren had one of the most active top games I've seen recently. Phone Post
8/2/13 12:21 PM
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OGT
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Demian Maia (Gets destroyed Fitch style, Loss)

Johnny Hendricks (Loss one way or another, winning not out of the question)

Josh Koscheck (similar to Hendricks)

Nick Diaz (wrestlefucks to a decision win, Nick retires afterward)

Carlos Condit (Condit by some sort of finish, loss)

Jake Ellenberger (wrestlefucks to a decision win)

George St Pierre (No)

Gunnar Nelson (wrestlefucks to a decision win)

Jake Shields (either subbed by Jake or wins for surviving and being on top (gay))

Tyron Woodley (wrestlefucks to a decision win)


Got him going 5-2 with 3 that could be a toss up (I think Hendricks and Kos win somehow but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.) Phone Post
8/2/13 12:47 PM
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Ryan Black
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I was thoroughly impressed by his fight the other night. An absolutely dominant wrestling clinic. These are all very intriguing match-ups, and I would love to see any one of them. I really hope we get to see him in the UFC's Welterweight Division one day- sooner rather than later, preferably. I believe the guy is top-level at what he does and belongs in the UFC, and I'd be surprised to be proven otherwise. Phone Post
8/2/13 12:51 PM
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MaliceX
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Aaron Becker - Demian Maia 1-0
Johnny Hendricks 1-1
Josh Koscheck 1 -2
Nick Diaz 2-2
Carlos Condit 2-3
Jake Ellenberger 2-4
George St Pierre 2-5
Gunnar Nelson 3-5
Jake Shields 4-5
Tyron Woodley 5-5

This is exactly how I see it...5-5.
8/2/13 12:58 PM
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Lebronfloppedhisnutsonmyface
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0= number of fights Askren will have in the UFC

DFW would sooner resign Fitch to a best of 5 series vs Koscheck than keep the human Roofie from continuing to suck in Bellator title fights. Phone Post 3.0
8/2/13 1:12 PM
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tdunning
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Dammit, I chose 7-3 when I meant 3-7

He holds down Nick Diaz & outwrestles Sheilds & Woodley. The rest of the guys beat him
8/2/13 1:15 PM
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Silverball
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Demian Maia - Loses due to lack of ground and pound, and probably gets submitted at some point. Maia is a very big welterweight.
Johnny Hendricks - Loses when he can't take Hendricks down immediately and is forced to be on the receiving end of Hendricks' punching power. If he gets Hendricks down, then Askren wrestle fucks him all day in spite of Hendricks' grappling pedigree.
Josh Koscheck - Same as above.
Nick Diaz - I could see Askren winning this one by decision. It would be round one of GSP vs Diaz for three rounds.
Carlos Condit - A repeat of the GSP fight, almost. I see Condit winning this one.
Jake Ellenberger - Similar to the Hendricks scenario.
George St Pierre - GSP would box him all day, and is too athletic to get taken down as easily as Askren's past opponents. Would look a lot like the Shields fight, minus the eye pokes.
Gunnar Nelson - Askren by decision.
Jake Shields - This would be a very ugly fight, especially if Jake could keep it standing. Between the two, Shields is the elite striker.
Tyron Woodley - Askren by decision.
8/2/13 1:21 PM
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ThatKickDidntHuroooohhhhhhhh
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He would beat Nick, Condit, Gunnar, Shields, and Woodley.

8/2/13 1:32 PM
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JolietJake
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CapnKindBud - 1-9. I think that he is fighting in a minor league . The Bellator WW division is full of second tier mma fighters, the UFC is stacked with WWs....I was thinking as I watched his last fight that he isn't top 10 in the UFC. A one trick pony can't win in the UFC anymore . Phone Post 3.0

Ronda is pretty good at it.
8/2/13 1:35 PM
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Big Pookie
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buddie - I understand that he hasn't fought a lot of good wrestlers, but he's an Olympic Gold medalist who set NCAA records. If they want to wrestle with him, I'm not sure it would work well in their favor, unless of course they use it to defend and open up opportunities for offense.

It is also very possible that he may not be as sharp as the fellows fighting top comp consistently. I think that has contributed to his being so one dimensional to some degree. Although watching him fight, I'm not sure he has a real mean streak in him. He pulls a lot of his strikes. Kind of reminds me of Dan Severn in that respect.


Ben Askren DID NOT win an olympic gold medal. In fact he did not place at all.
8/2/13 1:38 PM
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BJ Penn Forever
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Poptarts - 6-4, 5-5, 4-6.

Somewhere right around there.

8/2/13 1:42 PM
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BJ Penn Forever
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Demian Maia- Could tap him.
Johnny Hendricks- Could KO him.
Josh Koscheck- Could KO him or get wrestlfucked
Nick Diaz- Would get wrestlfucked
Carlos Condit- Would get wrestlfucked
Jake Ellenberger- Could KO him.
George St Pierre- Could stuff his shots and win a decision.
Gunnar Nelson- Could tap him or get wrestlfucked.
Jake Shields- Could tap him or get wrestlfucked.
Tyron Woodley- Would get wrestlfucked.
8/2/13 2:19 PM
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Jetster
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SickEyeDiaz - 
Jetster - Lol...he gets owned, one trick poney fighting secong teir players...lmao at some people still not understanding this about one trick ponies and yet we are at UFC 163.
When your one trick is wrestling and you're that good at it, you stand a very good chance dumbass. How long have you been watching this sport? Phone Post 3.0

Lmao....i enjoy coming back on here and seeing the likes of your ignorance being put in thier place ....u amuse me but your ignorance on this board is a dime a dozen.
8/2/13 3:24 PM
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D241
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When you realize the competition Askren has faced, his opponents haven't had a wrestling background to stop Ben's strength in wrestling.

 

Watching that video, it raised a BUNCH of questions for me regarding Askren's mma abilities. There's no question Askren is a great wrestler, but Askren hasn't faced any wrestlers the level of guys like Koscheck/Ellenberger/GSP, he hasn't faced jiu jitsu guys like Nick Diaz/Carlos Condit/Gunnar/Shields.

 

In a 5 round fight, there is plenty of times for guys like Koscheck/Hendricks to land a big shot in the stand up after stopping a takedown or getting back to their feet. In a 5 round fight, there is plenty of opportunities to throw up a submission.

 

Based on what I've seen in his mma fights and the level of skill his opponents had, the BEST I can have Askren going against those 10 UFC WW's, is 3-7.

 

I could see Askren wrestling Jake Ellenberger and winning 3 or 4 rounds of a 5 round fight.

I can see Askren using his wrestling to control T-Wood, and perhaps doing the same for Gunnar, although both Gunnar and T-Wood's sub game could cause problems for Askren.

 

Thanks for everyone's participation, i really like how you guys were specific on the win's/losses.


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