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UnderGround Forums >> Rogan still believe UFC is "Swallowing" Boxing ?


9/20/13 6:31 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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George Foreman fought until 50 so does Bernard Hopkins. Mayweather ain't slowing down anytime soon.
9/20/13 6:40 AM
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stonepony
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Jons Forsberg - George Foreman fought until 50 so does Bernard Hopkins. Mayweather ain't slowing down anytime soon.

Mayweather would be able to box professionally at 65. He would be doing it on youtube though. And all of the people in denial would argue "yeah, but, the fight did great numbers in Siberia and Madagascar!".

The boxing champions were household names throughout America, up until the last couple decades. They're all anonymous today. Ask the average under-40 today, who the current champions are. Almost none would be able to name the HW champ.
9/20/13 6:50 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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it's the UFC that is desperately going after overseas markets. Floyd has 3x the drawing power of any MMA athlete domestically.
9/20/13 6:59 AM
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stonepony
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Jons Forsberg - it's the UFC that is desperately going after overseas markets. Floyd has 3x the drawing power of any MMA athlete domestically.

And, as the sport continues to dwindle, as he stands out more and more as a singular attraction, his numbers will continue to grow. Doesn't mean the sport is growing. It means the remaining attention is concentrated on the one remaining relevant participant.

There are 1, or 2 relevant boxing matches a year. People tune in to watch one fight, and none of the undercard fights.

Kids aren't in the gym learning to box so that they can be like Floyd buddy. They're taking BJJ classes and learning to kick box. Someone would have to be pretty far removed from reality to be able to deny that. Wouldn't they?

Nostalgia is keeping boxing going. Nostalgia and culture lag in places like Russia where it's 1995 with people wearing Run DMC clothes and listening to Ace Of Base on cassette tape.

You miss disco? Move to Russia buddy.
9/20/13 7:04 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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Edited: 09/20/13 7:07 AM
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" It means the remaining attention is concentrated on the one remaining relevant participant."

one relevant participant means it's one more than the UFC. There are zero stars in MMA in the US right now.
9/20/13 7:05 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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basically Floyd's last 3 PPV outsell a full year of UFC PPVs:




08/11/2012 UFC 150 Henderson v. Edgar II 190,000
09/01/2012 UFC 151 Jones vs. Henderson Canceled
09/22/2012 UFC 152 Jones vs. Belfort 450,000
10/13/2012 UFC 153 Silva vs. Bonnar 410,000
11/17/2012 UFC 154 GSP vs. Condit 700,000
12/29/2012 UFC 155 JDS vs. Velasquez II 590,000
02/02/2013 UFC 156 Aldo vs Edgar 330,000
02/23/2013 UFC 157 Rousey vs Carmouche 450,000
03/16/2013 UFC 158 GSP vs Diaz 950,000
04/27/2013 UFC 159 Jones vs Sonnen 550,000
05/25/2013 UFC 160 Velasquez vs Bigfoot II 380,000
06/15/2013 UFC 161 Henderson vs Evans 150,000
07/06/2013 UFC 162 Silva vs Weidman 550,000
08/03/2013 UFC 163 Aldo vs Jung 170,000
9/20/13 7:10 AM
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Standup29
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EB, can people disagree with you without you resorting to childish name calling?

Boxing will never die but come on, year vs year PPV buys show the MMA does better. Year vs Year gate shows MMA does better. Year vs Year TV views (non ppv) shows MMA does better. You can even just use UFC and they do better.

There are only 2-4 boxers who are a draw. Someone will replace them for sure but lets stop acting like Boxing as a sport is thriving. Its certainly not. A couple are doing well and 1 is doing amazing. And most of the demo buying boxing ppv are Latinos. If there is a breakout Mexican born and raised to become champion in the UFC, you will see big growth in viewers and ppv. Phone Post
9/20/13 7:13 AM
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stonepony
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Jons Forsberg - basically Floyd's last 3 PPV outsell a full year of UFC PPVs:




08/11/2012 UFC 150 Henderson v. Edgar II 190,000
09/01/2012 UFC 151 Jones vs. Henderson Canceled
09/22/2012 UFC 152 Jones vs. Belfort 450,000
10/13/2012 UFC 153 Silva vs. Bonnar 410,000
11/17/2012 UFC 154 GSP vs. Condit 700,000
12/29/2012 UFC 155 JDS vs. Velasquez II 590,000
02/02/2013 UFC 156 Aldo vs Edgar 330,000
02/23/2013 UFC 157 Rousey vs Carmouche 450,000
03/16/2013 UFC 158 GSP vs Diaz 950,000
04/27/2013 UFC 159 Jones vs Sonnen 550,000
05/25/2013 UFC 160 Velasquez vs Bigfoot II 380,000
06/15/2013 UFC 161 Henderson vs Evans 150,000
07/06/2013 UFC 162 Silva vs Weidman 550,000
08/03/2013 UFC 163 Aldo vs Jung 170,000

And the reason you're forced to point at Floyd and only Floyd, is because there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing, and gets no attention. The average pro boxer makes far less money than the average pro MMA fighter. But, the last guy in the sport with a name is making money, so you hold him and pretend he represents the sport as a whole.

There will be more relevant fights this Saturday, on one card, than there will be in all of 2014 for boxing.

But... Kudos for not lying and claiming that kids are in the gyms to become pro boxers. Ignoring the question shows integrity at least.

10 of the top 15 PPVs last year were UFC. 4 were boxing. If there were as many major boxing cards a year, as there are UFC cards, they wouldn't even pull Bellator numbers.
9/20/13 7:20 AM
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Standup29
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Somebody name 2 boxers drawing over 500k ppv buys not named Floyd or Manny in 2012 or 2013. Phone Post
9/20/13 7:21 AM
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MarkRobinson
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HULC - Boxing isn't dead, and i've never understood why some people need to swing dicks and scream about one being better than the other. I watch both and have no problem with that.
This is really all I have to say about it. Phone Post 3.0
9/20/13 7:23 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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" there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing"

Canelo, Marquez, Pacquiao, Klitschos, Floyd, all bigger draws and making more than their Mexican/Asian/European/American counterparts in the UFC.
9/20/13 7:24 AM
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stonepony
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Standup29 -  Somebody name 2 boxers drawing over 500k ppv buys not named Floyd or Manny in 2012 or 2013. Phone Post

Ask 100 high-school seniors that question. I'm trying to think what some of the responses might be...

Tyson, Lennox Lewis, Roy, Oscar. Not only can they not name the few remaining earners in the sport, they can't even name the HW champ.
9/20/13 7:28 AM
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stonepony
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Jons Forsberg - " there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing"

Canelo, Marquez, Pacquiao, Klitschos, Floyd, all bigger draws and making more than their Mexican/Asian/European/American counterparts in the UFC.

Sorry, I should have said almost everybody.
9/20/13 7:31 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - " there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing"

Canelo, Marquez, Pacquiao, Klitschos, Floyd, all bigger draws and making more than their Mexican/Asian/European/American counterparts in the UFC.

Sorry, I should have said almost everybody.

the UFC is no different. couple guys making big, but not nearly as big money as boxing while everybody else makes nothing.
9/20/13 7:33 AM
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A big UFC ppv this weekend and there is hardly any hype around it. More threads on TUF thanJones vs Gus. UFC is doing something wrong.
9/20/13 7:34 AM
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stonepony
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Twelvers hav superior genetics - 
stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - basically Floyd's last 3 PPV outsell a full year of UFC PPVs:




08/11/2012 UFC 150 Henderson v. Edgar II 190,000
09/01/2012 UFC 151 Jones vs. Henderson Canceled
09/22/2012 UFC 152 Jones vs. Belfort 450,000
10/13/2012 UFC 153 Silva vs. Bonnar 410,000
11/17/2012 UFC 154 GSP vs. Condit 700,000
12/29/2012 UFC 155 JDS vs. Velasquez II 590,000
02/02/2013 UFC 156 Aldo vs Edgar 330,000
02/23/2013 UFC 157 Rousey vs Carmouche 450,000
03/16/2013 UFC 158 GSP vs Diaz 950,000
04/27/2013 UFC 159 Jones vs Sonnen 550,000
05/25/2013 UFC 160 Velasquez vs Bigfoot II 380,000
06/15/2013 UFC 161 Henderson vs Evans 150,000
07/06/2013 UFC 162 Silva vs Weidman 550,000
08/03/2013 UFC 163 Aldo vs Jung 170,000

And the reason you're forced to point at Floyd and only Floyd, is because there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing, and gets no attention. The average pro boxer makes far less money than the average pro MMA fighter. But, the last guy in the sport with a name is making money, so you hold him and pretend he represents the sport as a whole.

There will be more relevant fights this Saturday, on one card, than there will be in all of 2014 for boxing.

But... Kudos for not lying and claiming that kids are in the gyms to become pro boxers. Ignoring the question shows integrity at least.

10 of the top 15 PPVs last year were UFC. 4 were boxing. If there were as many major boxing cards a year, as there are UFC cards, they wouldn't even pull Bellator numbers.

You are either shilling for Zuffa or you are one of the most fucking dumb human beings on the planet.

Boxing is most certainly thriving in Europe where it is bigger then ever. Just one recent example in the UK Carl Froch vs George Groves sold out 18000 tickets in just 11 minutes. The numbers the Klitschkos do in Europe are huge and Haye vs Vladimir did numbers in Europe and worldwide that the UFC could only ever dream of you fool. Plenty of stars too many to name since 2008.

Any decline in Boxing in the USA has been more then made up for elsewhere in the world. It's never been so popular in Europe and puts on more shows around the world now then it did 10 years ago you fool.

The UFC cashed in on a WWE star with a penis tattooed on his chest and since he left it's been slowly fading ever since. Unless serious changes are made it will carry on going downhill while Boxing will continue to rise worldwide.

According to the guy desperately arguing in favor of boxing on an MMA website.

Europe is just behind the curve. But they will adopt wrestling in their schools, and they'll catch up in MMA. It takes some powerful suspension of disbelief to be able to pretend that boxing is healthier than ever or on an upward trend.
9/20/13 7:36 AM
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man meets fate
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thatcpjguy - I would say besides the two big boxing headliners UFC trumps boxing buys. Boxing has two guys that are massive draws that boxing fans and casuals pays to see and they pay about two to three times per year.

UFC pays their fighters dramatically less and the majority of the time does as well if not better than most boxing cards. Floyd got paid exponentially more than GSP and Diaz yet they drew virtually the same amount of ppv buys. UFC can put up quite a few cards per year that will break the 500k buys mark while boxing can't hit that mark without Floyd or manny.

It remains to be seen if manny will even be much of a draw after his recent losses and manny and Floyd are both exiting their primes. UFC is a brand that has been very smart with fighter pay and have developed a business model that builds more consistent draws than boxing's two to three star system.

Looking at both situations, I would bet on UFC's long term success over boxing's long term success. The foundation created by the UFC is simply better and the fact that there is even an argument about UFC doing better considering they've only been drawing well for a decade or a little less is an achievement in itself. Phone Post 3.0
Virtually same buys? What the fuck are you smoking?

You obviously dont know how boxing works. They always believed in quality over quantity. You only see ppvs that they know would sell well, last boxing ppv without paq or floyd was jcc vs jm and it did 485k buys.

They also make money being on premium tv where last year and this year, they been getting huge numbers and better than ufc on free tv so far this year.


And boxing is way better world wide than in the states. Klitschkos are like gods in russia and sell out major 40-50k arenas with ease everytime.

David haye, carl froch and all of boxing will always be bigger in uk than mma will ever be.

30k shows up to a Ricky hatton weigh in, reported 15, 000 fans traveled from uk to Germany to see haye vs klitschko., and carl froch vs george groves just sold out 19k tickets in 11 minutes. Basically all of europe belongs to boxing. Phone Post
9/20/13 7:36 AM
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stonepony
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Jons Forsberg - 
stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - " there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing"

Canelo, Marquez, Pacquiao, Klitschos, Floyd, all bigger draws and making more than their Mexican/Asian/European/American counterparts in the UFC.

Sorry, I should have said almost everybody.

the UFC is no different. couple guys making big, but not nearly as big money as boxing while everybody else makes nothing.

It's no different, as long as you ignore the fact that the average UFC fighter makes far more than the average boxer.

As long as we ignore all of the relevant facts, there's no difference.
9/20/13 7:41 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - 
stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - " there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing"

Canelo, Marquez, Pacquiao, Klitschos, Floyd, all bigger draws and making more than their Mexican/Asian/European/American counterparts in the UFC.

Sorry, I should have said almost everybody.

the UFC is no different. couple guys making big, but not nearly as big money as boxing while everybody else makes nothing.

It's no different, as long as you ignore the fact that the average UFC fighter makes far more than the average boxer.

As long as we ignore all of the relevant facts, there's no difference.

the average UFC fighter makes less than a Walmart assistant manager. there's no source for how much a boxer makes so it isn't a fact.
9/20/13 7:43 AM
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stonepony
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Twelvers hav superior genetics - Haye and Fury are also said to be earning close to 5 million each this weekend. Some more fighters in Boxing that make 'nothing' apart from Floyd according to stonepony! What a fucking joke!

I corrected that, so you can stop using it to obfuscate. The few exceptions, are still exceptions.

The average UFC fighter makes far more money. And kids aren't in the gyms dreaming of becoming boxers.

Reality buddy. Corruption killed boxing. They just haven't gotten the news in Russia yet.
9/20/13 7:50 AM
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stonepony
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Jons Forsberg - 
stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - 
stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - " there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing"

Canelo, Marquez, Pacquiao, Klitschos, Floyd, all bigger draws and making more than their Mexican/Asian/European/American counterparts in the UFC.

Sorry, I should have said almost everybody.

the UFC is no different. couple guys making big, but not nearly as big money as boxing while everybody else makes nothing.

It's no different, as long as you ignore the fact that the average UFC fighter makes far more than the average boxer.

As long as we ignore all of the relevant facts, there's no difference.

the average UFC fighter makes less than a Walmart assistant manager. there's no source for how much a boxer makes so it isn't a fact.

You've got a tight grip on those delusions friend. You go ahead and pretend the average boxer makes more though. Everybody knows it isn't close. Your cognitive dissonance is just bullet proof.

There are amateurs fighting in bars in unsanctioned MMA matches who make more than the average pro-boxer in an under card fight.

9/20/13 7:51 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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Twelvers hav superior genetics - 
stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - " there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing"

Canelo, Marquez, Pacquiao, Klitschos, Floyd, all bigger draws and making more than their Mexican/Asian/European/American counterparts in the UFC.

Sorry, I should have said almost everybody.

Also what about David Haye and Amir Khan? So how many is that now that make 'nothing' except Floyd?

You don't have a clue and lol if you think anyone can take you seriously on this topic after that latest little embarrassment!

Right. UK boxing has Haye and Tyson Fury versus middle of the pack fighter like Bisping in UK MMA.

The UFC's attempts to get into overseas marketat laughable. Making US born Velasquez wear the Mexico mouth piece lol. Still can't hold a candle to Canelo and Marquez.

Boxing has the biggest stars in every country on the planet except Brazil and Canada. The UFC only wishes it was the global sport it dreams to be.
9/20/13 7:54 AM
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Jons Forsberg
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" You go ahead and pretend the average boxer makes more though. Everybody knows it isn't close. "

as I said earlier, you still have no source for what the avg boxer makes. "Everbody knows" or whatever tard logic you dreamed up doesn't count as source.
9/20/13 7:55 AM
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stonepony
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Jons Forsberg - 
Twelvers hav superior genetics - 
stonepony - 
Jons Forsberg - " there is only Floyd to use as an example. Everybody else makes nothing"

Canelo, Marquez, Pacquiao, Klitschos, Floyd, all bigger draws and making more than their Mexican/Asian/European/American counterparts in the UFC.

Sorry, I should have said almost everybody.

Also what about David Haye and Amir Khan? So how many is that now that make 'nothing' except Floyd?

You don't have a clue and lol if you think anyone can take you seriously on this topic after that latest little embarrassment!

Right. UK boxing has Haye and Tyson Fury versus middle of the pack fighter like Bisping in UK MMA.

The UFC's attempts to get into overseas marketat laughable. Making US born Velasquez wear the Mexico mouth piece lol. Still can't hold a candle to Canelo and Marquez.

Boxing has the biggest stars in every country on the planet except Brazil and Canada. The UFC only wishes it was the global sport it dreams to be.

That's the advantage of having a century of head-start, nothing more. The trends are clear.

You're the guy who kept all of his old bell bottoms, because he's convinced they're still the height of fashion.
9/20/13 7:56 AM
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Have fun watching your horribly corrupt sport.

114-114 draw. Hahaha.

MMA judging is bad at times, but at least we can take solace in the fact that it's just dumb judging and not paid-off judging. Phone Post 3.0

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