UnderGround Forums
 

UnderGround Forums >> Is Cormier a real threat to Jon Jones?


10/21/13 10:58 PM
Ignore | Vote Down | Vote Up
Underground Blog
1278 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/3/08
Posts: 13087
MixedMartialArts.com
 

Daniel Cormier's UFC 166 bout with Roy Nelson was his last at heavyweight, opting to move to the light heavyweight division to avoid a bout with teammate Cain Velasquez. Cormier is likely to be put into a title contender bout in his first bout in the weight class, but is he an actual threat to champion Jon Jones? BleacherReport.com's James MacDonald breaks it down:

Many fans think Cormier possesses the requisite tools to unseat Jones, but very few column inches have been dedicated to how the pair match up physically.

With the former Strikeforce Grand Prix champion coming down from heavyweight, the assumption seems to be that size and weight won’t be a major factor in the outcome of any eventual fight.

In reality, Cormier fights at heavyweight because he carries around a significant amount of extra body fat. His frame is more naturally suited to the light heavyweight division.

Additionally, the discrepancy in both size and reach appears almost insurmountable on paper, with Jones enjoying a five-inch height advantage and an astonishing reach advantage of almost a foot.

read entire article...


10/21/13 11:00 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
BJ Penn Forever
254 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 7912
Is Cormier a real threat to Jon Jones?

Yes

End thread.
10/21/13 11:01 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
BJ Penn Forever
254 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 7913
Is Cormier a real threat to Jon Jones?

Yes

End thread.
10/21/13 11:50 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
aka_rtotheoh
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/25/12
Posts: 1385
no Phone Post
10/21/13 11:53 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
IAmNotImpressedbyYourStocktonSlap
412 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 10/16/12
Posts: 5583
Absolutely. Phone Post
10/21/13 11:54 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Lobo8
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 10/21/13 11:58 PM
Member Since: 5/22/12
Posts: 1716
Yea most definetly he has good speed, strength, excellent wrestling abilility, excellent clinch. Hes trouble for any fighter. I can totally see him man handling jones. Jones's only weapon would be to fight at a distance and try to pick cormier apart with his strikes. But cormier wouldnt bother trading. He would work his way in and use anything to gain control. He could shoot for takedowns, engage in clinches to just smother jones and deal close range damage whenever he can.
10/22/13 12:00 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Tony Naemi
3 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 6
Before Sat's fight with Nelson I would have said yes to this but after seeing how much trouble Cormier was having taking Nelson down in the later rounds I think Jones will take this.

Jones will use his reach to keep Cormier at a distance.
10/22/13 12:03 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Lobo8
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 5/22/12
Posts: 1717
why would cormier stay on the outside and get picked apart? The reason other fighters had trouble with jones was not only because of the distance. Theirs ways to deal with that. But in the case of jones, once you close the distance you still had to deal with his good clinch, knees, elbows and wrestling. It was risky for them to come in and fight him at a close range. So they all took their chances on fighting him outside. But that of course is difficult to. Gus had the striking, size and some solid tdd to match up well with jones. Cormier is a good matchup. He may be small but his wrestling, power, and solid striking is plenty to really wreck jones.
10/22/13 12:04 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
ender852
138 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 9/10/10
Posts: 4207
Do you think Cain is a threat to Jones? Cause Cormier is a better version of Cain. Phone Post
10/22/13 12:48 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Dmoney35
62 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/14/11
Posts: 5478
he has zero chance Phone Post 3.0
10/22/13 12:51 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Mrfrosty
5 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/1/13
Posts: 10
I would love to see DC throw Jones over his head like he did to Barnett
10/22/13 1:05 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
MMA6053
19 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/9/12
Posts: 113
Of course he has a 'fighters chance' but other than that, he's definitely second best to Jones IMO.
10/22/13 1:06 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
MMA6053
19 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/9/12
Posts: 114
ender852 -  Do you think Cain is a threat to Jones? Cause Cormier is a better version of Cain. Phone Post

funny.
10/22/13 1:32 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Il Duce
105 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/1/12
Posts: 1797
ReesetheBeast -
The Legendary One - 
circa305 - As long as he does not lose his strength with the cut hes most def a threat to Jon.

Jons in trouble anytime he fights someone that he cant take down. Which so far Gus was the only guy thats been able to stuff his takedowns.
Your an idiot, Jones beat Rampage, Rashad, Machida, Belfort, Shogun standing. The difference with Gus is that he has the reach to match Jones.
Cormier might have the wrestling to stuff jones takedowns but Jones will just pick him apart standing. Cormier has been using his speed to outstrike bigger slower
Heavyweights like Barnett, Mir, Nelson,
Bigfoot. Jones is way faster than all of
Them, he's a better striker, and has more
Reach as well. Comier will get lit up standing and won't be able to get close enough to shoot on Jones. Jones via decision 50-45 Phone Post 3.0

You're*. I agree with your point, but spell check before calling someone an idiot.
It was spelled correctly. Grammatically it's incorrect. Phone Post 3.0
10/22/13 1:34 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Il Duce
105 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/1/12
Posts: 1798
Il Duce -
ReesetheBeast -
The Legendary One - 
circa305 - As long as he does not lose his strength with the cut hes most def a threat to Jon.

Jons in trouble anytime he fights someone that he cant take down. Which so far Gus was the only guy thats been able to stuff his takedowns.
Your an idiot, Jones beat Rampage, Rashad, Machida, Belfort, Shogun standing. The difference with Gus is that he has the reach to match Jones.
Cormier might have the wrestling to stuff jones takedowns but Jones will just pick him apart standing. Cormier has been using his speed to outstrike bigger slower
Heavyweights like Barnett, Mir, Nelson,
Bigfoot. Jones is way faster than all of
Them, he's a better striker, and has more
Reach as well. Comier will get lit up standing and won't be able to get close enough to shoot on Jones. Jones via decision 50-45 Phone Post 3.0

You're*. I agree with your point, but spell check before calling someone an idiot.
It was spelled correctly. Grammatically it's incorrect. Phone Post 3.0
But yes, it's retarded to call somebody an idiot and use shitty grammar. Phone Post 3.0
10/22/13 1:36 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Il Duce
105 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/1/12
Posts: 1799
I think what's most interesting about DC and JJ matching up will be seeing how the threat of DC's wrestling effects Jon's kicking game. Phone Post 3.0
10/22/13 3:08 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
rIKmAN
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/27/11
Posts: 299
Il Duce -
ReesetheBeast -
The Legendary One - 
circa305 - As long as he does not lose his strength with the cut hes most def a threat to Jon.

Jons in trouble anytime he fights someone that he cant take down. Which so far Gus was the only guy thats been able to stuff his takedowns.
Your an idiot, Jones beat Rampage, Rashad, Machida, Belfort, Shogun standing. The difference with Gus is that he has the reach to match Jones.
Cormier might have the wrestling to stuff jones takedowns but Jones will just pick him apart standing. Cormier has been using his speed to outstrike bigger slower
Heavyweights like Barnett, Mir, Nelson,
Bigfoot. Jones is way faster than all of
Them, he's a better striker, and has more
Reach as well. Comier will get lit up standing and won't be able to get close enough to shoot on Jones. Jones via decision 50-45 Phone Post 3.0

You're*. I agree with your point, but spell check before calling someone an idiot.
It was spelled correctly. Grammatically it's incorrect. Phone Post 3.0
Beat me to it lol! Phone Post 3.0
10/22/13 5:13 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
ender852
138 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 9/10/10
Posts: 4209
CapnKindBud - 
ender852 -  Do you think Cain is a threat to Jones? Cause Cormier is a better version of Cain. Phone Post

Dude, that is some bullshit. If there is a better fighter, he will fight him. Cain is the champ.Stop throwing this "DC is better than Cain" shit around. It's just disrespectful to the champ right after he fought his damn heart out!
Get off it. DC is a 205 fighter now.

they are the same fighter but Cormier has better wrestling.

was Jones or Cain captain of the usa olympic wrestling team?

10/22/13 5:49 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
ufc98newb
108 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 9/26/10
Posts: 2870
Lobo8 - why would cormier stay on the outside and get picked apart? The reason other fighters had trouble with jones was not only because of the distance. Theirs ways to deal with that. But in the case of jones, once you close the distance you still had to deal with his good clinch, knees, elbows and wrestling. It was risky for them to come in and fight him at a close range. So they all took their chances on fighting him outside. But that of course is difficult to. Gus had the striking, size and some solid tdd to match up well with jones. Cormier is a good matchup. He may be small but his wrestling, power, and solid striking is plenty to really wreck jones.

This right here. Jones picks guys apart at range because they don't want to close the distance and deal with his wrestling. Cormier is not gonna be worried about that. I am very interested in seeing how these guys match up with each other. What does Jones look like on bottom, who will have the advantage against the cage..this is huge, imo. Much of this fight will probably be spent against the cage with the two of them jostling to control for takedowns. 

This is a fight that probably ends up way more technical than exciting, but with two guys at that skill level, that is still very worth watching to see who comes out on top. 

10/22/13 6:08 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Strykr619
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 10/14/07
Posts: 3476
ender852 - 
CapnKindBud - 
ender852 -  Do you think Cain is a threat to Jones? Cause Cormier is a better version of Cain. Phone Post

Dude, that is some bullshit. If there is a better fighter, he will fight him. Cain is the champ.Stop throwing this "DC is better than Cain" shit around. It's just disrespectful to the champ right after he fought his damn heart out!
Get off it. DC is a 205 fighter now.

they are the same fighter but Cormier has better wrestling.

was Jones or Cain captain of the usa olympic wrestling team?


This is MMA that Olympic wrestling captain don't mean shit. Was GSP a wrestler before MMA? No he learned it training for MMA.

Cormier is 5'10 - 5'11 Freestyle wrestler

JBJ is 6'4. Greco and Freestyle.

Length = leverage for a Greco Wrestler Like JBJ is pretty huge.

JBJ also has a 12.5 in reach advantage and also KNOWS how to use his length and reach. Cormier is use to being the faster guy, not so much at LHW.

Cormier has not earned a title shot at 205 either, have him earn it. Plenty of people for him to fight at 205. Davis,Machida,Rashad, Glover and Gus for starters.

Use some common sense people. Cormier is not a lock.
10/22/13 8:54 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
MisterHawkeMMA
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 8/11/11
Posts: 219
Jones will DESTROY Cormier. It wont even be close. Styles make fights. Gus has long arms and great boxing technique, Cormier possesses neither. Jones reach advantage will negate Cormier's wrestling and he will be picked apart at range.

All of this is only if he even earns the title shot.
10/22/13 8:58 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
FightToLive
35 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 5/31/06
Posts: 1125
Never!
10/22/13 9:11 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
JStrongMMA
47 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 4/24/13
Posts: 2069
Cormier is very athletic with solid, fluid striking and better wrestling. He will also be stronger than Jones at 205. There is no doubt he will be a big challenge to Jones. Feel free to watch the DC vs. Barnett fight and tell me otherwise. Phone Post
10/22/13 9:22 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Billyz
31 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 12/2/05
Posts: 5831
In all honesty I just dont see this going well for Cormier simply due to the size difference.
Looking at the main factors
Wrestling- Jones's MMA wrestling in itself can possibly negate Cormiers. Saying "possibly" because of course Cormiers wrestling pedigree can hardly ever be ignored, however in MMA with striking and submissions it has been proven time and again that better pedigree on paper does not always transfer to performance once fists start flying.
I actually believe Jones will have the advantage here with striking opening up TD's
Scrambles - I will actually go with Cormier due to his compact size vs Jones long limbs I think it actually favors DC who can maneuver quicker in tight spaces. Unless of course one is injured then the fresher guy will of course have the advantage
Chin - well we know the champ has a heck of a chin and has survived some strong shots from Lyoto and of course his war with Gustofson. Cant recall Cormier getting tagged to be honest but if he training with Cain and those animals at AKA my guess is he is no pushover
Striking- Logic dictates that the insane reach advantage will favor Jones heavily. He has gotten if nothing better at utilizing it while staying out of range. while everyone has gustofsons fight in mind Cormier is NOT Gustofson, I dont mean that as a knock at all its just completely different physiques reaches heights etc. Cormiers body type is on paper tailor made for the champ to be able to damage.
Jiu Jitsu- I don't see it being a factor unless one is stunned meaning i dont see cormier getting an arm bar from the bottom nor jones catching DC in something. Then again when one is stunned anything can happen A La Lyoto getting rocked then chocked out standing.

My guess is that this is a very long night for Cormier unless he can utilize the GSP VS Bj 2 or Cain vs JDS 3 strategy of smothering against the cage and making it a grinding fight while landing effectively from the clinch. Porblem I see with that is getting in on Jones is hardly easy.

Would love to see Jack Slacks striking breakdown of how Cormiers style would do vs Jones style
10/22/13 9:55 AM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Bucephalus
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 10/22/12
Posts: 5460
It's interesting how all of the armchair analysts are quick to brush off Cormier's wrestling and over emphasize Jones' reach.

Cormier is the #2 heavyweight in the world and has wins over guys who imo would beat Jones. After watching what Gustafson did to Jones what do you think a much larger Barnett would do him? He would maul and finish Jones inside of 3 rounds. I think Bigfoot would do the same. Those guys have legit HW power... Jones does not.

imo, Cormier has the speed, power, striking accuracy and takedown skills to put Jones on his back and hurt him. And he is no stranger to taller opponents...





Reply Post

You must log in to post a reply. Click here to login.