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UnderGround Forums >> Fedor versus Anderson: Who is the GOAT?


1/6/14 11:48 PM
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onepunchJD
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CaptainAhab - 
TampabayMMA - Looking back, the Goodridge fight WAS impressive. It was so one sided and quick that its taken for granted, but Goodridge was a beast on the feet and Fedor just calmly swarm-mauled him. I do remember Goodridge claiming that he had never been hit harder than by Fedor.

I think it will be remembered that Fedor switched to a heavy KO style in the twilight of his career, and it makes sense as power seems to be the last thing to go.

Its pretty clear he was the absolute all time and pnp GOAT and the three losses in a row Fedor was a shell of the cold killing machine that was prime Fedor.

He knocked down both Henderson and Werdum and was in excellent position to win both of those fights early. He lost both of those fights by being too aggressive in the followup.

I am going to play armchair psychologist here for a minute and say that the biggest difference between prime Fedor and late Fedor was that by the end, he literally believed that God had everything planned out ahead of time, and he fought like that... like someone who didn't give a solitary fuck for strategy or even self preservation.

I think his physical skills had already started to decline somewhat by the time he entered Affliction.

Good point.

This equates to Fedor not being "hungry" anymore.

Him falling in love with his hands could be viewed as a harbinger to his eventual decline. We have seen this before with other fighters, Rampage being a recent example. It is the mark of a lazy, overconfident fighter; or of one who has stopped caring as much.

Fedor fought for a long time in MMA, which has evolved very quickly as it is a young combat sport. At the top level of heavyweight MMA, where fighters continue to get bigger and better, any little edge a fighter can get is significant. No matter how tough and talented a fighter is, when he loses that hunger, it is the beginning of the end. Fighting the most dangerous men on the planet, you cannot afford to have that guy across the ring from you "want it" more. This is what I believe happened to Fedor more than anything. Sure he had some hand injuries, and was not getting younger. But I believe his physical decline was more a result of that lack of hunger manifesting itself in lazy training habits. In the end, Fedor didn't feel he had anything left to prove to himself or anyone else. He simply didn't care about his legacy as viewed by the fans, and wasn't much bothered by the idea of losing.

Of course this is all speculation based on my observations. I do not know Fedor personally. That's just the way I see it.

A fighter's "prime" is determined by more than just his age. There are many different variables, many of which the average fan is probably not aware of.

Prime Fedor was a wrecking machine at HW the likes of which we had yet to see. Watching his career unfold from the beginning was a once in a lifetime treat.

sorry for the rant :)
1/6/14 11:49 PM
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onepunchJD
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Edited: 01/06/14 11:49 PM
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1/6/14 11:56 PM
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gokudamus stole my name iv
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SevenLeggedSpider - 

Whether you agree with orcus, or disagree with orcus.....you can be right, depending on the timeframes :)


lol @ this idiot saying that like it's unusual.

Tell me, genius, if I said Fedor was the best heavyweight in the world in 2003, and then I said Fedor is the best heavyweight in the world today, would I be right both times?

Anderson was the best MW last year. Is he now?

DURRRRRRRRR
1/7/14 12:00 AM
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SevenLeggedSpider
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orcus gets so frustrated when he has to argue with himself lol

1/7/14 12:01 AM
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gokudamus stole my name iv
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"Meaning would you make the difference maker be the promotion in which they competed in instead of comparing who they beat?"

Do you think the only difference between the UFC and Pride is how they are marketed and who pockets the money?
1/7/14 12:01 AM
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Captfireeyes
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gokudamus stole my name iv -
SevenLeggedSpider - 

Whether you agree with orcus, or disagree with orcus.....you can be right, depending on the timeframes :)


lol @ this idiot saying that like it's unusual.

Tell me, genius, if I said Fedor was the best heavyweight in the world in 2003, and then I said Fedor is the best heavyweight in the world today, would I be right both times?

Anderson was the best MW last year. Is he now?

DURRRRRRRRR
This discussion isn't about the best at the moment. Its the greatest of all time. The GOAT of any sport can change with time, but to go from praising Fedor as the GOAT to discrediting him is silly. Joe Montana is considered the best QB of all time, but if Peyton wins another two superbowls he will probably be considered the GOAT. And I highly doubt people will feel the need to shit all over Montana to prove that point such as you do with Fedor. Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 12:15 AM
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UGPTT__IeatCOCKSforBreakfastAwYeah
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I will agree with Orcus, Fedor is the GOAT.
1/7/14 12:22 AM
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onepunchJD
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Captfireeyes - 
gokudamus stole my name iv -
SevenLeggedSpider - 

Whether you agree with orcus, or disagree with orcus.....you can be right, depending on the timeframes :)


lol @ this idiot saying that like it's unusual.

Tell me, genius, if I said Fedor was the best heavyweight in the world in 2003, and then I said Fedor is the best heavyweight in the world today, would I be right both times?

Anderson was the best MW last year. Is he now?

DURRRRRRRRR
This discussion isn't about the best at the moment. Its the greatest of all time. The GOAT of any sport can change with time, but to go from praising Fedor as the GOAT to discrediting him is silly. Joe Montana is considered the best QB of all time, but if Peyton wins another two superbowls he will probably be considered the GOAT. And I highly doubt people will feel the need to shit all over Montana to prove that point such as you do with Fedor. Phone Post 3.0

Good point -

Although I think Montana is still the greatest QB ever, even if Manning wins 2-3 more rings.

:)
1/7/14 3:12 AM
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MrColdCock
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SevenLeggedSpider -

Whether you agree with orcus, or disagree with orcus.....you can be right, depending on the timeframes :)

It literally happened over night.

"Todd and MrColdCock are right on" that's the orcus that still knew his shit.

After Nog/Fedor 2 was ruled a DQ, Fedor went on the mic to talk to the crowd. During his speech, one fan, pissed that they were robbed of a great fight was yelling " you suck, go home, you suck". The video is out there. It was accepted here that was orcus and that was the moment he turned. Truth or Internet legend, who knows. Too crazy to be true, but it was spoken as fact on this site. Orcus disappeared from every thread that video was played in. Phone Post
1/7/14 3:21 AM
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sparkuri
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How could a non UFC fighter get so much consideration?
On a Zuffa-charged site to boot!

Because Fyodor. Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 9:13 AM
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gokudamus stole my name iv
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Captfireeyes - 
gokudamus stole my name iv -
SevenLeggedSpider - 

Whether you agree with orcus, or disagree with orcus.....you can be right, depending on the timeframes :)


lol @ this idiot saying that like it's unusual.

Tell me, genius, if I said Fedor was the best heavyweight in the world in 2003, and then I said Fedor is the best heavyweight in the world today, would I be right both times?

Anderson was the best MW last year. Is he now?

DURRRRRRRRR
This discussion isn't about the best at the moment. Its the greatest of all time. The GOAT of any sport can change with time, but to go from praising Fedor as the GOAT to discrediting him is silly. Joe Montana is considered the best QB of all time, but if Peyton wins another two superbowls he will probably be considered the GOAT. And I highly doubt people will feel the need to shit all over Montana to prove that point such as you do with Fedor. Phone Post 3.0

Is to go from believing Fedor is the GOAT to believing someone else is the GOAT silly? What a stupid thing to say.

Presumably, before Fedor beat Nog and Crocop etc, you felt someone else was the GOAT. Why did you change your mind?
1/7/14 9:15 AM
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gokudamus stole my name iv
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MrColdCock - 
SevenLeggedSpider -

Whether you agree with orcus, or disagree with orcus.....you can be right, depending on the timeframes :)

It literally happened over night.

"Todd and MrColdCock are right on" that's the orcus that still knew his shit.

After Nog/Fedor 2 was ruled a DQ, Fedor went on the mic to talk to the crowd. During his speech, one fan, pissed that they were robbed of a great fight was yelling " you suck, go home, you suck". The video is out there. It was accepted here that was orcus and that was the moment he turned. Truth or Internet legend, who knows. Too crazy to be true, but it was spoken as fact on this site. Orcus disappeared from every thread that video was played in. Phone Post

lol...that was Helwig being a typical Christian -- always quick to tell everyone else why what they're doing is wrong, how morally bankrupt everyone else is, but then turning around and "bearing false witness", i.e., lying about me. An actual violation of the ten commandments.

lol @ those who can say with a straight face and no hint of self-awareness "he still knew his shit back when he said something I agree with; now that I disagree with him, he clearly doesn't know his shit."
1/7/14 12:21 PM
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Captfireeyes
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gokudamus stole my name iv -
Captfireeyes - 
gokudamus stole my name iv -
SevenLeggedSpider - 

Whether you agree with orcus, or disagree with orcus.....you can be right, depending on the timeframes :)


lol @ this idiot saying that like it's unusual.

Tell me, genius, if I said Fedor was the best heavyweight in the world in 2003, and then I said Fedor is the best heavyweight in the world today, would I be right both times?

Anderson was the best MW last year. Is he now?

DURRRRRRRRR
This discussion isn't about the best at the moment. Its the greatest of all time. The GOAT of any sport can change with time, but to go from praising Fedor as the GOAT to discrediting him is silly. Joe Montana is considered the best QB of all time, but if Peyton wins another two superbowls he will probably be considered the GOAT. And I highly doubt people will feel the need to shit all over Montana to prove that point such as you do with Fedor. Phone Post 3.0

Is to go from believing Fedor is the GOAT to believing someone else is the GOAT silly? What a stupid thing to say.

Presumably, before Fedor beat Nog and Crocop etc, you felt someone else was the GOAT. Why did you change your mind?
I've said in this very thread that if Anderson beats Jones I would consider him the GOAT. And I wouldn't feel the need to jump in every thread that mentions Fedor to discredit him to hold that opinion, like you do. Give credit were credit is due.

"I believe Anderson is the GOAT due to his impressive wins, and long reign as champion, etc." = acceptable and a respectable opinion

"I believe Anderson is GOAT because Fedor sucks, fought cans and never competed against the best in the UFC, etc." = retarded Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 12:35 PM
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AwaisTheBass
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That Staredown would be EPIC!!
1/7/14 1:54 PM
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SevenLeggedSpider
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It's funny how orcus tries to derail what he is guilty of.

 

Do I make mma fans are fickle threads about everyone who I disagree with? No.

Are there forum members who say Anderson is the Goat that I am friends with and have zero problems with? Yes

 

The DIFFERENCE, is no one on this site is as dedicated at discrediting Fedor every chance they get, as orcus is. THAT, is the difference.

There isn't even a close 2nd place. Not even a close 2nd place using another fighter as an example.

 

You won't find someone who was a BJ Penn fan and had hundreds of positive things to say about him, but then all of a sudden hates BJ Penn and tries to discredit him at every turn.

You won't find someone who was a Lyoto Machida fan and had hundreds of positive things to say about him, but once they found out he's a pee drinker, they try to discredit him at every turn.

 

It's not about having Anderson over Fedor as the goat. It's about not being able to let an opportunity to discredit Fedor pass.

 

No one on this site is guilty of what orcus is guilty of.   Keep pretending like this isn't about your obsession with discrediting a legend every chance.

1/7/14 2:02 PM
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gokudamus stole my name iv
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The problem with your nonsense is that I don't hate Fedor or think he sucks.

If you MORONS are going to insist on making threads on a daily basis on how great Fedor was, and you back up your claim with inaccurate, misleading, or irrelevant points, you can expect to have me point out how stupid you are. Get over it.

You tards are apparently incapable of making a case for Fedor based on legit points like his demonstrated skills and record. You always, ALWAYS resort to nonsense like "he beat [x] UFC champions!" or "he spent his career beating up guys way bigger than himself" as your deciding factors.
1/7/14 2:16 PM
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SevenLeggedSpider
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gokudamus stole my name iv - The problem with your nonsense is that I don't hate Fedor or think he sucks.

If you MORONS are going to insist on making threads on a daily basis on how great Fedor was, and you back up your claim with inaccurate, misleading, or irrelevant points, you can expect to have me point out how stupid you are. Get over it.
#1. Jack Slack is anything but a moron. I think you are out of place saying what you said in this thread.
#2.This is how clouded your head is. You think this thread is a thread on how great Fedor was. It isn't. It was a thread on how great Anderson and Fedor are, but orcus is gonna orcus, and when he sees the word Fedor, he has to discredit him regardless of the premise of the thread(which you obviously don't understand).
#3. When you are the ONLY one to consistently try to discredit Fedor at EVERY Fedor thread, you will have multiple people pointing out how silly you are. Get over it.
 
 
 
gokudamus stole my name iv -You tards are apparently incapable of making a case for Fedor based on legit points like his demonstrated skills and record. You always, ALWAYS resort to nonsense like "he beat [x] UFC champions!" or "he spent his career beating up guys way bigger than himself" as your deciding factors.
 
Yet you continuously hear the same points, and you continously use your own same points. The cycle doesn't end with you.  It has ended with me a long time ago. It is the EXACT reason I created my "mma fans are fickle" thread. Because I KNEW from past experience, you are someone who is not right in the head, and again, are the ONLY one who discredits Fedor at every chance you get.
Instead of recycling the same arguments to you and vice versa, I hit to the core of the issue, which is how you are insanely OBSESSED with discrediting Fedor, therefor all I have to do is link my mma fans are fickle thread or pull some quotes from there, and your bullshit becomes transparent for all to see.
 
Notice how everytime you start orcusing, I bring up this shit? Notice how people only mock you for your
obsession?  
 
#4.GET USED TO IT.
1/7/14 2:22 PM
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gokudamus stole my name iv
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" I think you are out of place saying what you said in this thread."

This is your thing, you read one part of what I said and ignore the actual meaning. Did Jack Slack back up his argument with inaccurate, misleading, or irrelevant points? If not, then my comment does not apply to him.

"orcus is gonna orcus, and when he sees the word Fedor, he has to discredit him regardless of the premise of the thread"

I responded to specific posts, as always; here's the one that brought me into this thread: "Fedor Easily. He fought Giants, Olympic Medalists, and Numerous Champions."

"Instead of recycling the same arguments to you and vice versa, I hit to the core of the issue,"

lol...you have never even attempted to argue any point with me iirc. You routinely avoid any attempt at backing up your arguments or countering mine, because you know you can't. Instead, you creepily stalked every post I ever made here over years. NEVER can you say why my "discrediting" is inaccurate.

"Notice how people only mock you for your
obsession? "

Yeah, the same small handful of Fedor/Pride obsessed dorks who can't back up an opinion to save their lives and have to resort to imagining motives for those who disagree with them.
1/7/14 2:34 PM
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SevenLeggedSpider
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orcus -  Prime Fedor would have beaten anyone on the planet in any weightclass and nothing that can ever happen and nothing anyone can ever say will change my mind!
 
 
July 2011
1/7/14 3:51 PM
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THERE WAS A GLITCH IN THE MATRiX
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THERE WAS A GLITCH IN THE MATRiX - they are both pretty close IMO.

both have losses and both dominated in the most impressive fashion possible.

but one dominated the 85%+ finishing rate HW division for 10 yrs and one dominated the weakest MW division for 7 yrs.

and for the 100th time, to those mentioning the "cans" Fedor fought. those were EXTRA fights! he fought 3-5 times a year while Andy/GSP fight 1-2 times a yr. SOOOOOOOOOOO Fedor fought his 1-3 top 5 contenders, PLUS a couple EXTRA Freak show fights on top. THAT should give him EXTRA points, not hurt his legacy.

during their primes, GSP fought ONE time a yr TWICE. Fedor fought (& finished most) FIVE times a year FOUR Times.

you can say GSP had tougher comp, but not really. Fedor was fighting his top comp JUST as much as GSP, but with EXTRA Freak show fights in there.

if GSP fought a couple giants/freaks in between his top contender fights, the TUF Noobs would swing on his nuts SOOOOOOOOO Hard it would be unbearable on here. but somehow Fedor gets no credit for it.

1/7/14 3:57 PM
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SevenLeggedSpider
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THERE WAS A GLITCH IN THE MATRiX

 

I did a breakdown of Fedor vs Zulu fight and how when you look at everyone else in the hw division at the time, zulu made as much sense as anyone.  

 

That's the thing, people mock Fedor for taking the Zulu fight, but they don't realize he'd already met his fight quota compared to how often top fighters fight. 

People conveniently never say, "he should've fought so and so" instead of Zulu. If they did, it would put more substance, but they can't, so they won't.

1/7/14 4:52 PM
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Porkchop
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Jack Slack -

This one didn't inspire as much discussion as I anticipated :P

Because there are a million threads just like it. You break things down pretty well but this question gets asked on the UG 47282847 times every week. Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 5:05 PM
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Baxi
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1. GSP
2.silva
3.cain valasquez
4.fedor or jones Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 5:07 PM
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FETT_GayFerPayNINJA
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Baxi - 1. GSP
2.silva
3.cain valasquez
4.fedor or jones Phone Post 3.0
Huh what? Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 5:20 PM
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lockon
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"If you MORONS are going to insist on making threads on a daily basis on how great Fedor was, and you back up your claim with inaccurate, misleading, or irrelevant points, you can expect to have me point out how stupid you are. Get over it"

Yes, and everyone will continue to not take you seriously like they have for the past several years. You've had good debate with guys like Whistleblower and others in separate threads before. You're not always right despite how often you think you are and you've been proven wrong in a lot of those discussions. This thread really takes me back.

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